The 4th Bloodstone Theory - Guild Wars Guru archive powered by Guild Wars Legacy

Edge Igneas

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2008

Poland

10 Jul 2009 at 20:17 - 1

Looking from the current points of the known Bloodstones, and dropping the theory that the Bloodstone in Abaddon's Mouth is not the Keystone, I have guessed the location of another Bloodstone.

Maybe there is a reason why Demetra had such value to Saul D'Alessio during the Rise of the White Mantle, perhaps Saul even stumbled upon the Bloodstone there. It would also explain what the Krytan watchtowers around Giants Basin were guarding far before that time.

It's a theory anyway

Ariena Najea

Silence and Motion

Join Date: Jul 2006

Buffalo NY

New Horizon [NH]

10 Jul 2009 at 20:51 - 2

I thought Saul had gone into the Jungle, rather than North of Kryta.

In any case, good catch on the angles there!

smilingscar

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Oct 2007

Frontline Legion

Me/

10 Jul 2009 at 21:17 - 3

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ariena Najea

I thought Saul had gone into the Jungle, rather than North of Kryta.

Well, technically we only know he was in a "dense forest." The area's at least green...forests maybe?

Gmr Leon

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2006

10 Jul 2009 at 23:06 - 4

Definitely an interesting idea, however, remember that we are talking about a volcano, not a cannon, so it has to have some limit to its range. That aside..I think it would be more likely to explain why exactly the Mursaat decided to intervene, rather than why Saul pushed forward. The Charr were being pushed back, so if his network of spies tells him it's all-clear to go forward, then he's going to go forward so that he can gain a foothold in the area before the Charr push forward again and reclaim that area.

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

10 Jul 2009 at 23:28 - 5

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edge Igneas

Looking from the current points of the known Bloodstones, and dropping the theory that the Bloodstone in Abaddon's Mouth is not the Keystone, I have guessed the location of another Bloodstone.

-snip image-

Maybe there is a reason why Demetra had such value to Saul D'Alessio during the Rise of the White Mantle, perhaps Saul even stumbled upon the Bloodstone there. It would also explain what the Krytan watchtowers around Giants Basin were guarding far before that time.

It's a theory anyway

Possible, but I don't think it is likely. Why? Because the volcano erupted which spewed the bloodstones out of it. I'd say that the location of Bloodstone Fen and Bloodstone Caves are as far, or close to as far, as one can go.

I theorize one might have landed in/near Orr (only land aside from the Maguuma and Tarnished Coast that is within the same distance from the volcano as the other two), and the other in the sea.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ariena Najea

I thought Saul had gone into the Jungle, rather than North of Kryta.

Never said jungle. Said "dense forest" which is 2 week carriage ride away from Kryta - which people automatically thought to be the Maguuma Jungle for some obscure reason *cough Ullen River cough*.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GmrLeon

I think it would be more likely to explain why exactly the Mursaat decided to intervene, rather than why Saul pushed forward. The Charr were being pushed back, so if his network of spies tells him it's all-clear to go forward, then he's going to go forward so that he can gain a foothold in the area before the Charr push forward again and reclaim that area.

If a bloodstone is in such an area, then this would be more likely of a reasoning for pushing the Charr back.

Mursaat needed followers - they help Saul start a new faith by pushing the Charr back a bit.

Mursaat needed the bloodstones - they help Saul when he was cornered so that the Charr would not push back once more.

Saul wanted to free Kryta from the threats - he follows the beings, Mursaats, that can give him the strength to do such.

Pony Slaystation

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Nov 2008

Cardboard Box

Guilds are irrelevant. This... is...... BUILD WARS!!!

Rt/

10 Jul 2009 at 23:34 - 6

1. Although very unlikely, it's possible that it resides in the small island in the upper left corner of the map. It seems suspicious, so something cool must be there.

2. As others are saying, since they were spewed from a volcano, it does have limited range. If you look at the distance between the Abaddon's Mouth bloodstone, and the other two known bloodstones, you could also come up with a location that is between the Crystal Desert, and where Orr used to be.

Bob Slydell

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jan 2007

11 Jul 2009 at 00:10 - 7

Could there be any possibility that your guess on the 4th bloodstone might be exact? What is in the dead center of that square?

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

11 Jul 2009 at 00:12 - 8

I doubt there is a bloodstone on that island. Aside from Orr (and no, not the Crystal Desert, it has to be on the Peninsula unless the range is further than that of Fen) the only landmass there could be - aside from in the same area as the other two (highly unlikely) would be to the west of the Maguuma/Tarnished Coast, or if there is a landmass to the south west of the Ring of Fire - which we know of none (Battle Isles, closest but by what we are given, not close enough, though it could be).

So I have to say either Orr, or underwater (that is, both of those, or two underwater), or an unknown landmass off the map.

Edit:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chrisworld

What is in the dead center of that square?

Explorable areas, most likely, or too close to the White Mantle's "base" (The Temple of the Unseen I think it is called) that they would use that bloodstone instead of the one in Bloodstone Fen. Illogical given our facts.

Rick Thene

Academy Page

Join Date: Dec 2005

Confirmed. Sending Supplies.

Big Domage Krewe [DoMe]

A/W

11 Jul 2009 at 05:53 - 9

To all the people saying about the limited range, we're talking about a massive volcano, clogged up by these huge stones. That's some serious pressure build-up, and remember that volcanoes can always erupt sideways!
Still quite a distance though.

It is interesting that the White Mantle temple in Riverside Province is right in the middle too.

Konig raises a good point about why the White Mantle wouldn't just use that suspected Bloodstone if its so close to Kryta. Perhaps they were afraid of potential witnesses so close to Kryta, and so took their business to the other two Bloodstones?

Edge Igneas

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2008

Poland

11 Jul 2009 at 08:41 - 10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ariena Najea

I thought Saul had gone into the Jungle, rather than North of Kryta.

In any case, good catch on the angles there!

Demetra is situated north of Nebo Terrace actually, anyway the landscape there starts to change after Giant's Basin, which is seen from the Tarnished Coast on the other side.

As everyone can see there are a lot of possible connections, it just raises the question where the 5th Bloodstone is, because if it follows the square I posted then it doesn't really have a place.

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

11 Jul 2009 at 09:00 - 11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edge Igneas

Demetra is situated north of Nebo Terrace actually, anyway the landscape there starts to change after Giant's Basin, which is seen from the Tarnished Coast on the other side.

The north of Kryta (aka Verdant Cascades) and the area around Gadd's Encampment are not a part of the Tarnished Coast. The Tarnished Coast is the coastal area of the Maguuma Jungle (not sure if the Tarnished Coast is considered a sub-region of the Maguuma Jungle like the Northern/Southern/Far Shiverpeaks are sub-regions of the Shiverpeak Mountains).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edge Igneas

As everyone can see there are a lot of possible connections, it just raises the question where the 5th Bloodstone is, because if it follows the square I posted then it doesn't really have a place.

Which further disproves your theory - unless the fifth was in the center - which we would have seen if it was (at least most likely).

Carnivorous Cupcake

Academy Page

Join Date: Jul 2009

Lolrus League [lol]

A/E

11 Jul 2009 at 09:56 - 12

Konig

We cant actually se the one near Gadd's Incampment. ^^

Free Runner

Forge Runner

Join Date: Oct 2005

GW2G

Knights Of The Sacred Light [KSL]

11 Jul 2009 at 10:13 - 13

A good theory but you seem to be running off the Bloodstone in Bloodstone Caves being right near the entrance. But its further in and under the Shiverpeaks (the tunnels go futher in).

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

11 Jul 2009 at 22:53 - 14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carnivorous Cupcake

Konig

We cant actually se the one near Gadd's Incampment. ^^

What? Can't see what? The bloodstone? Yes we can. And the comment from myself on Gadd's Encampment had nothing to do with the Bloodstone. I was saying that area with Gadd's Encampment, the bloodstone caves, and bogroots is not a part of the Tarnished Coast. Lore-speaking, it just shares the loading screen and elements that is in the Tarnished Coast.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Free Runner

A good theory but you seem to be running off the Bloodstone in Bloodstone Caves being right near the entrance. But its further in and under the Shiverpeaks (the tunnels go futher in).

Quite true, seeing how Linsey confirmed it to be the shiverpeak bloodstone planned to be where Evennia and Saidra were to be killed.

WhiteAsIce

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2008

R/

13 Jul 2009 at 07:05 - 15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Konig Des Todes

Quite true, seeing how Linsey confirmed it to be the shiverpeak bloodstone planned to be where Evennia and Saidra were to be killed.

If that's the case, then the circle over Bloodstone Caves should be further east, past the outpost for Ice Caves. That changes the shape of the drawn quadrilateral.

Gmr Leon

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2006

13 Jul 2009 at 08:04 - 16

Quote:

Originally Posted by WhiteAsIce

If that's the case, then the circle over Bloodstone Caves should be further east, past the outpost for Ice Caves. That changes the shape of the drawn quadrilateral.

It's not that deep into the Shiverpeaks. There's still green plantlife above the hole in the ceiling of the chamber of the Bloodstone in the Bloodstone Caves.

Free Runner

Forge Runner

Join Date: Oct 2005

GW2G

Knights Of The Sacred Light [KSL]

13 Jul 2009 at 09:35 - 17

Yeah the Bloodstone doesnt need to be exactly near the Ice Caves of Sorrow. Chances are, the Mursaat held Evennia and Saidra hostage their because it was the only viable place at the time rather than it being next to the Bloodstone. Personally i think the bloodstone is further down from the entrance to Bloodstone Caves (around the green parts that are across from the Crystal Desert but still connected to the Shiverpeaks). Unfortunatly i doubt we'll ever get an exact location.

draxynnic

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Nov 2005

[CRFH]

13 Jul 2009 at 11:11 - 18

Maybe in GW2. :P

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

13 Jul 2009 at 19:04 - 19

Quote:

Originally Posted by WhiteAsIce

If that's the case, then the circle over Bloodstone Caves should be further east, past the outpost for Ice Caves. That changes the shape of the drawn quadrilateral.

First of all, the "circle over Bloodstone Caves" cannot have an exact location due to the cave being imperfect - it is at the best known location (the entrance) - though I have tried to use the dungeon maps over the continent map and have tried to find a location, but there is clearly areas between the 3 maps which throw off people doing that (because one time I got it, it was just west of Talus Chute, the other time it was in the water *first time i just placed exists near each other based on the actual map's up/down/etc. The second time I took into account the compass readings, which pushed me into the water). Either way, yes, the OP's little diagram would be off.

Second, as other said, the bloodstone may not be that far into the Shiverpeaks. It is called the "shiverpeak bloodstone" because it is where the Shining Blade were going to be sacrificed (and they were held in the Shiverpeaks) - it was believed for the longest time (read:until Linsey commented) that the bloodstone was closer to Spearhead peak or something, i.e., west and not east.

MBTW

Academy Page

Join Date: Jan 2009

W/

14 Jul 2009 at 04:21 - 20

im not sure if this is useful at all, but i did a approx. radius using the Bloodstone Fen stone as to where the volcano could launch a bloodstone. dont hate

Arghore

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2009

Tyria, Catacomb dweller..

N/

15 Jul 2009 at 17:56 - 21

Nice Pic there MBTW, that was the radius i was thinking about too (based on the first picture)... i have a hunch one of the stones landed in the Swamps south of the Temple of Ages, seeing we get to fight a large army of undead comming from those swamps (makes you wonder what they were doing there...)

Mordakai

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Aug 2005

Kyhlo

W/

15 Jul 2009 at 20:16 - 22

I'm sure everyone realizes this, but it's very possible a piece flew into the middle of the ocean.

Not very exciting, I know, but possible.

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

15 Jul 2009 at 21:42 - 23

I've already said that, Mordakai. Been said for a nice long while. :x

The last two pieces are either on Orr(ian Peninsula), in the ocean, or on an unknown land directly west or southwest (or even directly south) of the Ring of Fire Island Chain. We've been everywhere else they could land, for the most part.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aghore

i have a hunch one of the stones landed in the Swamps south of the Temple of Ages, seeing we get to fight a large army of undead comming from those swamps (makes you wonder what they were doing there...)

Doubt it personally. Mostly because if a bloodstone was in that area, it would be well known, and we'd see an environmental effect like we see in the Maguuma's water (preservation), the Bloodstone Caves (aggression), and the Ring of Fire (though that one is debatable for which it is, Denial, Destruction, or the Keystone). The Swamp area, and more so the Cursed Lands, don't have an unnatural environmental effect (for those who say the water is an environmental effect, consider how much water holds actual healing powers, and how *non-dried up* plant-life only exists there where there is water *aka, the lower lands*).

The last two bloodstones would have to be in an area we have not been around, and the bloodstones' magic would seep into the land and air around it - as said it does in the Manuscripts.

Mordakai

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Aug 2005

Kyhlo

W/

15 Jul 2009 at 22:05 - 24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Konig Des Todes

I've already said that, Mordakai. Been said for a nice long while. :x

Ahh, yes, so you did on your first post of this thread.

Anyway, I agree that's the probable location.

Arghore

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2009

Tyria, Catacomb dweller..

N/

15 Jul 2009 at 22:27 - 25

Well if anything i would guess the stone in the Ring of Fire is the stone of Destruction, the creatures that arise when completing the 'Mouth Of Abaddon' look alot like the Destroyers, and seeing the destroyers are made of Lava, it would make sence that the effect of the 'bloodstone of destruction' is causing this ?!

Are there any bloodstone references on Cantha and Elona ?

draxynnic

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Nov 2005

[CRFH]

16 Jul 2009 at 02:20 - 26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arghore

Well if anything i would guess the stone in the Ring of Fire is the stone of Destruction, the creatures that arise when completing the 'Mouth Of Abaddon' look alot like the Destroyers, and seeing the destroyers are made of Lava, it would make sence that the effect of the 'bloodstone of destruction' is causing this ?!

Apart from appearance and the Charr connection, there is no connection between the Titans and the Destroyers. The latter are essentially the soldier-ants of the hive mind that is the Great Destroyer and, as far as we know, are created wholly within the mortal world, while the former were constructed from twisted souls under Abaddon's auspices within the Realm of Torment and create physical bodies out of whatever materials are at hand.

That both the Destroyers and the first Titans we meet are lava-based is essentially coincidence arising from the fact that the Door of Komalie was in a volcano and that lava was the most convenient available substance - the Titan Quests, however, show that Titans manifesting in other environments can be composed of quite different materials.

Personally, my own theory is that Ritualist power is tied to the Keystone in the same way that the other non-physical professions are tied to one of the four subsidiary Bloodstones, putting the keystone in the position of having power over the mists - which, if it's the keystone in the Ring of Fire, would explain why it's that stone that can open the portal into Torment rather than any of the others (the Mursaat don't seem particularly afraid of anyone opening the Door at Bloodstone Fen, after all...). However, apart from the elegance of explaining how Ritualist magic fits into the general magic system and explaining the significance of the Ring of Fire bloodstone in one theory, there's not much in the way of real evidence for it.

fires element

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2007

none

Mo/

16 Jul 2009 at 21:47 - 27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chrisworld

Could there be any possibility that your guess on the 4th bloodstone might be exact? What is in the dead center of that square?

dead center of that square is approximately where vloxs falls is at

MBTW

Academy Page

Join Date: Jan 2009

W/

18 Jul 2009 at 05:44 - 28

Closer to Sanctum Cay actually.
Cantha could actually be close enough to the volcano launch radius, but Elona is out of the question, its due south of the desert, and the radius barely reaches the Orrian Peninsula. If it landed in Cantha the only place i could think would be Northwest.
Has anyone thought that it landed near the Battle Isles, causing tidal disturbance and uncovering the Isles, or the Battle Isles were possibly built around them?

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

18 Jul 2009 at 07:27 - 29

Cantha is even further away from Tyria than Elona is. And islands don't form around bloodstones (and if you mean the structures, the Zaishen would make some comment on that, I'm sure) - they are formed from underwater volcanoes. Some of them that is.

Gmr Leon

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2006

18 Jul 2009 at 08:09 - 30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Konig Des Todes

And islands don't form around bloodstones they are formed from underwater volcanoes. Some of them that is.

Well, if it weren't for the very likely incredible depth of the ocean, I'd say it would be possible. Although, if it landed in a shallow area, it might be more viable, but it would have to go fairly deep into the ground and probably be in an area with a current carrying sediment, or in other words, in a delta where the sediment begins forming small islands.

Cursed One

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Dec 2008

E/Mo

18 Jul 2009 at 22:18 - 31

Could one of the stones not have landed on one of those islands in the north of the crystal desert? They seem big enough

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

18 Jul 2009 at 23:22 - 32

Those islands north of the Crystal Desert would be what remains of Orr, which we have said a bloodstone could be there.

Gmr Leon

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2006

18 Jul 2009 at 23:31 - 33

Except that, you know, Orr is west of the Crystal Desert.

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

18 Jul 2009 at 23:54 - 34

And technically, there are no islands north of the Crystal Desert - and technically, Orr is northwest of most (note:Not all) of the Crystal Desert.

Gmr Leon

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2006

19 Jul 2009 at 00:01 - 35

That's still dependent on if you classify the Desolation as part of the Crystal Desert though.

MBTW

Academy Page

Join Date: Jan 2009

W/

19 Jul 2009 at 02:58 - 36

i just got to thinking... what if the last bloodstone ended up near orr.... couldn't the orrian dragon be leeching off the blood stones power making it epic powerful...? lol

Fritz Bloodwraith

Pre-Searing Cadet

Join Date: Apr 2009

We Put Epic In Fail [FAIL]

N/

19 Jul 2009 at 20:21 - 37

According to the radius on the map that was shown. The bloodstone could be below Lion's Arch in that bay. But isn't it possible that some unknown life forms or the White Mantle could have carried the missing Bloodstones to unkown locations. Locations that could be far from where they originally landed?

Gmr Leon

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2006

19 Jul 2009 at 21:25 - 38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fritz Bloodwraith

According to the radius on the map that was shown. The bloodstone could be below Lion's Arch in that bay. But isn't it possible that some unknown life forms or the White Mantle could have carried the missing Bloodstones to unkown locations. Locations that could be far from where they originally landed?

If the White Mantle could move the Bloodstones, don't you think they would have moved Bloodstone Fen after the assault by the Shining Blade in the mission of the same name?

draxynnic

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Nov 2005

[CRFH]

20 Jul 2009 at 01:19 - 39

Playing devil's advocate, they may have - storywise, we never go back to look.

I highly doubt it, though.

Gmr Leon

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2006

20 Jul 2009 at 01:41 - 40

Quote:

Originally Posted by draxynnic

Playing devil's advocate, they may have - storywise, we never go back to look.

I highly doubt it, though.

Er..Are you sure? I recall that the quest to recruit Olias as a hero has you revisit it. Ah, here it is.