My suggestion is to remove the charm animal requirement for a rangers pet to appear.
If one doesn't desire the aggro a overeager pet may cause, the player can leave the pet to the tamers or to the menagerie keepers.
charm animal would only be used when acquiring a new pet. Like the skill says.
Pet in party without charm animal
Roupe
Konker2020
So you suggest pets without a downside, in other words a possible 16 man party instead of 8 without cost?
Although it would make pets more useful, I disagree with this, it would be too much of a pet buff, I would maybe go with 1 skill to charm a pet, keep the pet in party and revive/heal the pet instead of having to bring 2 skills just to make it useful...
Although it would make pets more useful, I disagree with this, it would be too much of a pet buff, I would maybe go with 1 skill to charm a pet, keep the pet in party and revive/heal the pet instead of having to bring 2 skills just to make it useful...
Roupe
that 8+8 man party would consist of rangers either in primary secondary. So it would be at the expense of other things. I dont think its overpowered, in comparison to other current team builds.
And if it is overpowered, Anet could just have a nerf that makes pet less powered -like they always do.
A Nerf example:
Player Pet considering other pets as prey(enemy)
if Pets in party is larger than owners beastmastery/2.
And if it is overpowered, Anet could just have a nerf that makes pet less powered -like they always do.
A Nerf example:
Player Pet considering other pets as prey(enemy)
if Pets in party is larger than owners beastmastery/2.
Wielder Of Magic
I think that you would mess up balance with that.
Won't there be the danger that all we would be running would be Barrage/Pet builds?
Won't there be the danger that all we would be running would be Barrage/Pet builds?
Roupe
No, no danger at all -since discord, permassins clears and people preferring to play their favorit class (for example wamo)will still exist.
majikmajikmajik
only thing i will agree to is combine Comfort + Charm Animal.
MisterB
I want to have 20 binding rituals, 50 minions, 25 nature rituals by playing as Rt/ or /Rt, N/ or /N, or R/ /R, but I don't want to clutter my skill bar to bring them. Same thing with a pet. If you want to bring your pet, equip the skill.
Ugh
I agree with a pet buff, but not like this. If this were added, there's no reason not to bring a pet. If bar compression is implemented (pleeease 
), I would hope that Charm Animal is made into a weak pet rez. For example, it could rez with lower health and take longer to activate than Comfort Animal, but it would grant an open slot to people who need it.
), I would hope that Charm Animal is made into a weak pet rez. For example, it could rez with lower health and take longer to activate than Comfort Animal, but it would grant an open slot to people who need it.
Konker2020
Exactly what I'm saying. Bar compression is what we should be going for, not a benefit without a downfall... it overpowers, and before anyone comes back with "well there are already other more powerful combinations", consider that maybe adding another isn't such a good idea, like I said opens up for a mass party, lets just bring an 8 R party, with a few with N secondary, all with Barrage and a pet, one can bring Barbs, another can bring OoP (no it doesn't affect the pets, but 8 Rs?) and since it's prolly PvE, why not bring EBSoH and "BUH!", a few Spirits, maybe add a rez or 2 (not like you'll need em for players)...
Anyway, I'm sure most know what I'm getting at... It's not that I think it's a bad idea to make pets useful, I think it's a terrible idea to make pets without downfall.
Anyway, I'm sure most know what I'm getting at... It's not that I think it's a bad idea to make pets useful, I think it's a terrible idea to make pets without downfall.
Zzes Tyan
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Originally Posted by Ugh
I agree with a pet buff, but not like this. If this were added, there's no reason not to bring a pet. If bar compression is implemented (pleeease
), I would hope that Charm Animal is made into a weak pet rez. For example, it could rez with lower health and take longer to activate than Comfort Animal, but it would grant an open slot to people who need it. |
Killamus
What they need to do is change charm animal to this:
That way, if you want a real, in-battle res, you need to take it, but otherwise you don't need to waste a skill to just res your pet after a fight.
Quote:
| Skill. Charm target animal. Once charmed, your animal companion will travel with you whenever you have Charm Animal equipped. You cannot charm an animal that is more than 4 levels above you. If you use this skill while you already have control of a pet, that pet is resurrected with 5% health. |
Expherious
Solution, Must have atleast 4 points into beast mastery to have a pet with you.
draxynnic
Personally, I've considered the possibility of having any skill that requires having a pet mean you have your pet with you. That still requires that you have at least one slot filled, though - but you'd also want a BM investment so it serves as anything other than ablative hitpoints. This would put the pet at about the same level of power, with a single slot invested, as an Asura summon - a level 20 ally with a single skill.
Making Charm Animal an out-of-combat res may be enough, though, with an AI improvement.
Making Charm Animal an out-of-combat res may be enough, though, with an AI improvement.
Pistachio
I don't think you should get a freebie extra on the team, but if the pet could take the place of a hero, I could see that as viable.
Ugh
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Originally Posted by Pistachio
I don't think you should get a freebie extra on the team, but if the pet could take the place of a hero, I could see that as viable.
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Quote:
| Solution, Must have atleast 4 points into beast mastery to have a pet with you. |
Ariena Najea
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Originally Posted by Ugh
Not sure if anyone would ever take that trade.
I like this idea. But, 4 points would be a huge chunk of attributes for low levels. Maybe make it so you need 1 attribute per 5 levels (1 at levels 1-5, 2 at 6-10, etc.). And, if I'm using Beast Mastery for EoE, I'm forced to have a pet (Not that big of a deal. Might be annoying, though). |
Apart from R/P packhunters, pets are terrible, in large part due to the number of skills needed to make them useful. Pets by themselves do pathetic DPS (and can't spike too well compared to other options) and need more bar compression so that function better in hybrid builds.
Hyper.nl
Not signed, a solution would be to merge the finctionality of charm animal and comfort animal into one skill. (As suggested many times before)
crazybanshee
I agree. Although to be fair to the other classes, all elementalists should get their attunements spells without taking up a slot. Monks should get a res without taking up a slot. Warriors should get sprint without taking up a slot. Dervishes should get mystic regen without taking up a slot. OMG I have a great idea! We should have 9 skill slots! That would be leet! But wait, then every class should get one spell that didn't take up one of the 9 precious skill slots! zzz...
Mad Lord of Milk
Unreasonable suggestion - every ranger would have a pet with them. There are better ways to buff PvE Beast Mastery, maybe like Ugh's idea.
draxynnic
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Originally Posted by crazybanshee
I agree. Although to be fair to the other classes, all elementalists should get their attunements spells without taking up a slot. Monks should get a res without taking up a slot. Warriors should get sprint without taking up a slot. Dervishes should get mystic regen without taking up a slot. OMG I have a great idea! We should have 9 skill slots! That would be leet! But wait, then every class should get one spell that didn't take up one of the 9 precious skill slots! zzz...
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I agree that they should require some investment, but they could stand to not cost 25% of the bar to be present after the first time they get themselves killed, with any other pet skills and any owner skills having to be squeezed into the remaining 75%. Making Charm Animal a res, or making the pet appear when any skill that requires a pet is equipped, will still leave it at around the level of an Asura summon at a greater amount of investment.
NeHoMaR
All useful builds with a pet, needs 3 or 4 slots just for the pet, and they are all very limited to (normally overpowered) builds based in another 3 or 4 slots.
Having "Charm Animal" equipped for a pet, is plenty normal and reasonable for me, but the need to also use "Comfort Animal" is the part that reduce the possibilities. I mean "Charm Animal" should be upgraded to at least revive the pet, even without healing.
Having "Charm Animal" equipped for a pet, is plenty normal and reasonable for me, but the need to also use "Comfort Animal" is the part that reduce the possibilities. I mean "Charm Animal" should be upgraded to at least revive the pet, even without healing.
draxynnic
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Originally Posted by NeHoMaR
All useful builds with a pet, needs 3 or 4 slots just for the pet, and they are all very limited to (normally overpowered) builds based in another 3 or 4 slots.
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Arkantos
Charm Animal. While this skill is equipped, you have an animal companion which has up to 80 armor, 420-540 health and does -15%-+15% damage. I dunno, sounds like a pretty fair trade off.
Pets suck in PvE, yes. What is this going to change? They're still going to suck, and it's just going to create gimmicks where there's a bunch of pets running around because they're free.
Pets suck in PvE, yes. What is this going to change? They're still going to suck, and it's just going to create gimmicks where there's a bunch of pets running around because they're free.
DarkGanni
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Originally Posted by Hyper.nl
Not signed, a solution would be to merge the finctionality of charm animal and comfort animal into one skill. (As suggested many times before)
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Maybe keep it tied only to PvE.
![]HM[ Sabre Wolf](/static/static/../Img/avatar102835_2.gif){kind=avatar}
]HM[ Sabre Wolf
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Originally Posted by Killamus
What they need to do is change charm animal to this:
Quote:
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Charm Animal must be used to bring out a pet... if not, every single person in the game would have a pet following them around creating an unblance (not to mention IWAY would be king).
However, a skill change to include a rez inside of the Charm Animal skill, would be a balenced change I think... have a skill for Charm Animal AND a skill to rez the pet takes up a lot of bar space. 5-10% HP on rez sounds about right... Since there are other skills out there that already rez' the pet for more HP, I think that a solid 5-10% is fine as well.
draxynnic
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Arkantos
Charm Animal. While this skill is equipped, you have an animal companion which has up to 80 armor, 420-540 health and does -15%-+15% damage. I dunno, sounds like a pretty fair trade off.
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Now, if you ramp the investment up to 4 skills or so, you start to get something that might actually be a fair trade... except that the AI issues mean it'll rarely actually be where you want it to be.
Or you could spend a single PvE slot and 10 energy every minute for an Asura summon that has up to an estimated 60 armour, 480 health, no AI issues, and a skill that it'll use at no cost to you every 10 seconds or so... and you don't even need to be a Ranger! Sure, if you've only got a moderate rank in the Asura track it'll have a bit less health, armour and damage and will only have 85% or so uptime, but I'll still take that trade over the pet any day.
MithranArkanere
Hehe, add a checkbox next to your health bar and each hero.
Check it, and the pet health bar for that character appears in the bottom.
Now, if you are primary or secondary Ranger, the pet behaves normally. And if you don't, it behaves like a Miniature, always heeling, just following you.
There are so many animals that it's a shame not bringing them when you don't need to be a ranger.
What about that? XD
Check it, and the pet health bar for that character appears in the bottom.
Now, if you are primary or secondary Ranger, the pet behaves normally. And if you don't, it behaves like a Miniature, always heeling, just following you.
There are so many animals that it's a shame not bringing them when you don't need to be a ranger.
What about that? XD
Axwind
It would be nice if pets could be made more useful, and I do agree that bar compression would be a good start. But perhaps there's another way. It just sort of sprung to mind while I was reading through this thread, so I thought I'd throw it out there and see what people think.
Basically, rework the pet so it acts and functions the same as a hero, including having its own skillbar which, like that of a hero, you can customize from the skill panel. However, pet skillbars would only be able to hold four slots, and an interesting twist might be that different pets would be of different professions. You can't choose the primary, like with heroes, and unlike heroes, you can't add a secondary, either.
You would still be required to have Charm Animal on your bar, but the frequently suggested compression of that and Comfort Animal into one skill would also work well here. Other pet skills would function as they currently do, but this way, not as many of them would be needed on your bar to make your pet viable and effective.
The above is just an idea, and any adjustments/suggestions to make it better are welcome. I just hope Anet does something to make pets better, because I know a lot of us (including me) want to be able to bring them along and have them be useful without sacrificing too much of our own utility in the process.
Basically, rework the pet so it acts and functions the same as a hero, including having its own skillbar which, like that of a hero, you can customize from the skill panel. However, pet skillbars would only be able to hold four slots, and an interesting twist might be that different pets would be of different professions. You can't choose the primary, like with heroes, and unlike heroes, you can't add a secondary, either.
You would still be required to have Charm Animal on your bar, but the frequently suggested compression of that and Comfort Animal into one skill would also work well here. Other pet skills would function as they currently do, but this way, not as many of them would be needed on your bar to make your pet viable and effective.
The above is just an idea, and any adjustments/suggestions to make it better are welcome. I just hope Anet does something to make pets better, because I know a lot of us (including me) want to be able to bring them along and have them be useful without sacrificing too much of our own utility in the process.
]HM[ Sabre Wolf
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08/06/09 Update Comfort Animal (PvE): (concise description) skill. Your pet gains 20...87...104 health. Resurrects your pet (10...48...58% health.) if you have comfort animal equipped, your animal companion will travel with you. |
stevedallas
I'm still missing the days when a nec set up as a minion factory could troll through an area with over 25 minions trailing behind. And even that isn't nearly as overpowered as some of the builds that many people are actively using.
Let's look at permasins as the standard. A permasin can waltz through an area alone and take on pretty much most things... alone. And if that example doesn't sit well with you, lets look at 600/Smite two man teams...
Having a pet travel around with you even if you dont have comfort animal should be... well, acceptable. if the pet dies, you still have all your skills reset and you're still bound to using ranger as your secondary. sure you may have 8 players with 8 pets but, is that really any more useful than a two man team with 6 total discordway necromancers? I don't think it is.
and it certainly isnt more overpowered than a 8 player party with an activated summoning stone and two permasins.
or a team of W/M's with skills like echo, asuran scan, signet of strength and I Am the Strongest
i really dont feel this is a big deal.
/SIGNED
Let's look at permasins as the standard. A permasin can waltz through an area alone and take on pretty much most things... alone. And if that example doesn't sit well with you, lets look at 600/Smite two man teams...
Having a pet travel around with you even if you dont have comfort animal should be... well, acceptable. if the pet dies, you still have all your skills reset and you're still bound to using ranger as your secondary. sure you may have 8 players with 8 pets but, is that really any more useful than a two man team with 6 total discordway necromancers? I don't think it is.
and it certainly isnt more overpowered than a 8 player party with an activated summoning stone and two permasins.
or a team of W/M's with skills like echo, asuran scan, signet of strength and I Am the Strongest
i really dont feel this is a big deal.
/SIGNED