i enjoy this game, it allows me to use heros and henchies to do stuff that makes me enjoy the game rather then spend weeks and months a mission. However i just don't understand why do elite missions limit one to only 3 heros so i cant do say fow, or the deep on my own.
Every time i try looking for a group say fow, i must be either a t1,t2 or mt. Almost no one does it the norm way anymore, and when i finally found a group after spending days looking around, people quit in 15-20 mins( and thats assuming if the group didnt fall apart after 10 mins),comparing it to a fowsc, claiming it takes "too long", crazy wammos rushing off to solo some parts of uw seeing that ectos drop there and asking for res at some god knows where place after getting himself killed. So why shouldn't elite missions be H/H able? prices of ectos/shards not going to drop anyway with all the sc going on and it gives other a platform to enjoy the game without being grouped with idiots for once.
Should elite missions (UW, FoW, etc) allow H/H?
harpharp
Bristlebane
And here I read the title as 'should elite missions disallow H/H' when in fact you mean the total opposite :P
More than 3 hench/heroes in elite areas:
/notsigned
Disallow H/H completely in Slavers/Deep/Urgoz only:
/signed
More than 3 hench/heroes in elite areas:
/notsigned
Disallow H/H completely in Slavers/Deep/Urgoz only:
/signed
Bryant Again
I see little problem with it.
Sword Hammer Axe
Yes. Yes it should. And so should DoA, Urgoz and Kanaxai. Especially Urgoz and Kanaxai since it's impossible to do that without having made arrangements a few days before >.<
Cuilan
I think elite areas should be treated special and left to humans. Lead groups better.
the Puppeteer
since there's very little pugs playing those heros are essential
I would vote for allowing henchies too
I would vote for allowing henchies too
rkubik
I think for now it is fine but I have stated previosuly that I believe for the longesvity of the game it needs to be implemented at some point just due to the fact that player numbers will drop and by implementing the H/H it will allow people to still play those areas. Will it be as enjoyable I don't know but at least it will get people playing rather than not. I also think it is rather silly to have all the heroes and only be able to use a maximum of six of them.
Bug John
Kanaxai zquest yesterday, and no guildies around, so I decided to pug the deep.
I really wished I had a few friends online to do it with their heroes, because it was really hard. Not that the deep is hard by itself, people make it hard because even if they don't know anything about the area, they won't listen to experienced players.
Anyway, completed it in two hours, and had to play a build I hate (perma sf is the most boring build ever), I really wish there were more options to play without pugging in those areas.
I really wished I had a few friends online to do it with their heroes, because it was really hard. Not that the deep is hard by itself, people make it hard because even if they don't know anything about the area, they won't listen to experienced players.
Anyway, completed it in two hours, and had to play a build I hate (perma sf is the most boring build ever), I really wish there were more options to play without pugging in those areas.
Fay Vert
I see no harm in it. Hench were put in the game for a reason, I see no valid reason for excluding them. May as well remove them from the whole game if that was the game design, but it wasn't so yeah, stick them in, let casual players in.
Teysar kitait
/signed
i agree, i see urgoz' warren and the deep empty whenever it's not a zquest because it doesn't seem to be worth the time and effort, compared to something like FoW or UW which can be solo farmed or completed with a couple of people and heroes. because of this i've never seen urgoz' warren past the first room.
I also agree that it could be necessary as the player numbers decrease, particularly when GW2 comes out.
i agree, i see urgoz' warren and the deep empty whenever it's not a zquest because it doesn't seem to be worth the time and effort, compared to something like FoW or UW which can be solo farmed or completed with a couple of people and heroes. because of this i've never seen urgoz' warren past the first room.
I also agree that it could be necessary as the player numbers decrease, particularly when GW2 comes out.
BenjZee
Heroes aren't ascended and worthy of FOW!
Aeon221
Yeah, it's pretty irritating not being able to use henchies in these places. Meanwhile, you can h/h Slavers.
Elephantaliste
There is no reason not to allow henchies or more heroes there.
It is not like we would use solo SF hero farming uw on their own...
It is not like we would use solo SF hero farming uw on their own...
pamelf
/signed. If i see even one more MUST BE t1,t2 or mt!!! spam i will scream...
Arduin
Quote:
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Originally Posted by SmithyBen
Heroes aren't ascended and worthy of FOW!
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I wouldn't mind asking Mhenlo and Co. along for a FoW clear, they are elite enough.
BenjZee
That's what imeant... 
oops
I reckon eventually such as when gw2 comes out they should allow more henchman accessible areas.
oopsI reckon eventually such as when gw2 comes out they should allow more henchman accessible areas.
Simath
Quote:
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Originally Posted by harpharp
So why shouldn't elite missions be H/H able?
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BlackSephir
So their ELITENESS right now comes from the fact that it's hard to find people willing to do them?
LOGIC :DDDDD
LOGIC :DDDDD
Arduin
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Simath
Because they are elite areas and have been damaged enough by UB, SF, consumables, and PvE only skills. Also, FoW and UW can be done with hero's as long as you have two humans.
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If anything, allowing henchies would enable casual players to give it shot at those areas. Which is a good thing in my opinion.
Danax
still need to do the deep on ranger..
Simath
Quote:
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Originally Posted by BlackSephir
So their ELITENESS right now comes from the fact that it's hard to find people willing to do them?
LOGIC |
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Arduinna
I fail to see
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own age myname
/signed
I could actually stop and look at the scenary in the FoW/UW. SC it's all about doing it fast, no stopping.
Like you said it wouldn't really effect the ecto/shard prices.
I could actually stop and look at the scenary in the FoW/UW. SC it's all about doing it fast, no stopping.
Like you said it wouldn't really effect the ecto/shard prices.
Painbringer
Its been asked before and I agree H/H teams should be allowed anywhere. But others will say NO since they have a nich on the area for special drops etc...
Some people have the time to wait and some people do not.
Some people have the time to wait and some people do not.
payne
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bristlebane
And here I read the title as 'should elite missions disallow H/H' when in fact you mean the total opposite :P
More than 3 hench/heroes in elite areas: /notsigned Disallow H/H completely in Slavers/Deep/Urgoz only: /signed |
need to be able to keep heroes in deep / slavers / urgoz...(!)
this is due to players with less popular professions....dervishes for instance - not a popular choice from experience in slavers - if you can't use h/h you are reliant on getting a good guild to play with....and you cant get a good guild like [SCAR] or [IcU] without prior experience (same conundrum as HA)
don't need hench in UW / FoW - easy to do both with just you and 3 heroes - regardless of your profession with enough experience of how the quests work
HawkofStorms
/signed
It makes little sense not to allow them since every other area of the game does, especially since many areas of the game are now harder then FoW and UW.
The only "problem" I see with this is people who H/H may want to enter FoW/UW somewhere besides in Tyria in order to get the Factions (which there are a ton in Zen Coridoor) or NF henchmen instead. Which isn't really a "problem" it just dilutes the crowd a little bit.
It makes little sense not to allow them since every other area of the game does, especially since many areas of the game are now harder then FoW and UW.
The only "problem" I see with this is people who H/H may want to enter FoW/UW somewhere besides in Tyria in order to get the Factions (which there are a ton in Zen Coridoor) or NF henchmen instead. Which isn't really a "problem" it just dilutes the crowd a little bit.
Gun Pierson
/signed
For reasons already mentionned in this thread.
For reasons already mentionned in this thread.
Feminist Terrorist
I don't play these areas because I have to wait for a PUG, or hope against hope that someone's setting up a general group. I just don't have that kind of time anymore, to wait around for a group to form, and people to get their character in order. If I could take heroes and henchies, great. I can get them sorted out in 20 seconds and get right to playing, and never worry about someone leaving for whatever reason, or doing something incredibly stupid, or drawing genitalia on the map incessantly.
zelgadissan
I can't count the number of times I was interested in doing a Urgoz or FoW run, but nobody was on to go with me. I understand why they were left out initially, but with the retarded number of easy-mode buttons there are now in full parties (re: PvE-only skills, PvE versions of skills, consumables, etc.), I don't see why henchmen should be excluded anymore.
Zahr Dalsk
I say they should be allowed.
Better yet, 7-hero parties.
Better yet, 7-hero parties.
Burst Cancel
H/H should be allowed everywhere. It solves the problem of not being able to form groups without directly affecting the difficulty of the area. Furthermore, it would kill the remaining excuse for stupid bullshit like SF.
refer
No H/H for elite areas IMO.
MMSDome
Seeing as most people want to do the cut of the mill speed clears and already believe that for what zone you are entering one build should be used I do not think they should takes heros/henchies out of these areas.
Can you imagine someone looking for a balanced group advertising in ToA? Most of it is speed clear groups and wouldn't be accepting of whatever the person that wants to have fun wants to do.
Can you imagine someone looking for a balanced group advertising in ToA? Most of it is speed clear groups and wouldn't be accepting of whatever the person that wants to have fun wants to do.
Separ
I support allowing a single player to fill out the balance of their party with heroes and/or henches in any combination in all areas of the game.
I have not seen the inside of an elite area since my guild became mostly inactive.
I have not seen the inside of an elite area since my guild became mostly inactive.
Gennadios
I didn't support 7 hero parties until the realization hit me that once (if ever) GW2 is out, all the die hard PUGers will likely leave for greener pastures (if they don't leave before.) The same people that want 7 hero parties will be the only ones that are left.
Sooner or later GW will end up going the way of a single player game and at the very least H/Hing will be necessary in order for those areas to be at all viable.
On that note. How the hell are people going to do The Deep/Urgoz warren? The party splitting and other headaches aren't very conducive to H/Hing.
Sooner or later GW will end up going the way of a single player game and at the very least H/Hing will be necessary in order for those areas to be at all viable.
On that note. How the hell are people going to do The Deep/Urgoz warren? The party splitting and other headaches aren't very conducive to H/Hing.
QueenofDeath
/signed
Always agreed that all players should be able to enter all areas with heroes and henchies.
Always agreed that all players should be able to enter all areas with heroes and henchies.
the_jos
I would not mind H&H team in FoW/UW.
That is, since people have been able to SCs in those areas for a long time now, which is more or less single-play in a full human team I don't see why people should not be able to taken 4 hench.
I don't consider the 'go PUG' argument valid anymore, the only PUGs that are easily entered are specific farming teams.
Besides this there is a huge advantage for 2 human/6 hero (or even better 3 human 5 hero) teams that you can't gain with H&H.
I'm not sure a H&H team will be up to defeating the four horsemen quest in UW without dramatically decreasing the teams capacity for other areas and I think there is some serious additional time involved at the A Gift of Griffons quest in FoW.
Deep/Urgoz's/DoA? I don't know, I don't consider them areas that 1 player + H&H could beat. I might be wrong on this but except some very determined players I'd doubt many will even attempt this.
That is, since people have been able to SCs in those areas for a long time now, which is more or less single-play in a full human team I don't see why people should not be able to taken 4 hench.
I don't consider the 'go PUG' argument valid anymore, the only PUGs that are easily entered are specific farming teams.
Besides this there is a huge advantage for 2 human/6 hero (or even better 3 human 5 hero) teams that you can't gain with H&H.
I'm not sure a H&H team will be up to defeating the four horsemen quest in UW without dramatically decreasing the teams capacity for other areas and I think there is some serious additional time involved at the A Gift of Griffons quest in FoW.
Deep/Urgoz's/DoA? I don't know, I don't consider them areas that 1 player + H&H could beat. I might be wrong on this but except some very determined players I'd doubt many will even attempt this.
refer
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Gennadios
I didn't support 7 hero parties until the realization hit me that once (if ever) GW2 is out, all the die hard PUGers will likely leave for greener pastures (if they don't leave before.) The same people that want 7 hero parties will be the only ones that are left.
Sooner or later GW will end up going the way of a single player game and at the very least H/Hing will be necessary in order for those areas to be at all viable. |
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Separ
I have not seen the inside of an elite area since my guild became mostly inactive.
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Sword Hammer Axe
Quote:
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Originally Posted by refer
That is probably because of hero/henchmen lol.
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You need at least 1 more party member (2 in Urgoz and Deep) to be able to finish an elite area, so while it doesn't make your hero point invalid, it shoots a hole in it.
Another hole comes from the fact that DoA was an extremely played place even though it came out after the introduction of heroes. Same with Slaver's Exile, yet these places have still seen a drop in the amount of people playing it, so that can't really be the heroes fault.
Urgoz and Kanaxai became almost wastelands after heroes were introduced, but if you think about it, blaming it on heroes and henchies isn't suitable enough, seeing as there would probably be even MORE people playing those areas since it takes less time and planning to actually enter and clear out those areas.
But fact is that the value of the items in those places dropped dramatically after the introduction of Nightfall, where you could easily get weapons with the same stats as Kanaxai's and Urgoz's endchest weapons and inscriptions made it easier to mod a weapon to perfection. 2 weeks before NF I saw Kanaxai's blade being sold for 100k+ while a month after NF came out the same sword was 30k.
You may say "the items lost value because it was easier to get them". But is that a fact? Yes theoretically it would be easier to get them, but there wasn't being farmed more of these weapons after NF. On the contrary, people utterly lost interest in that area and played NF instead.
Teysar kitait
In reference to a previous post, h/h wouldn't be too useful in places like the deep or urgoz. the deep requires you to split into 4 teams immediately and so h/h couldn't do that, not without you microing everything.
another possible way to resolve this is presumably to make them worth doing (though i wouldn't know how - the weapons there are worth nothing now and there are much faster ways to gain faction)
another possible way to resolve this is presumably to make them worth doing (though i wouldn't know how - the weapons there are worth nothing now and there are much faster ways to gain faction)
refer
I was talking about people getting used to getting H/H ready extremely fast and specific to what they want, so when it comes time to do Elite Areas, most cannot find groups since others patience is thin... unless they REALLY care, they just skip it, or do it once and forget about the experience. When the normal is fast H/H teams, people get used to that and don't like to wait.