Not only that, but then the rit's other spirit spells ([armor of unfeeling][spiritleech aura]) can no longer apply, as the spirits are no longer his...
of course it wouldn't spirits belong to those who summon them, if a guy overwrites your spirit with his, yours dies, his lives.
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As to the wall/body block, I can have 3-4 necro summoners, and they aren't limited...
Used to be you had a "minion Factory" in PvP with a necro who would intentinally bip to death, get a minion raised off him, and resed by a FC mesmer, doing this you could have about 80 minions in the party by the time the timer started and just swarm your foe to death with barbs or MoP. And in PvE you could have 100s
They capped minions with death magic to stop this, sometime after the spirit nerf.
10 Aug 2009 at 01:07 - 11
I hate to say this, but in all the other well-designed MMORPG games I've played, if you tried to replace a higher level *WHATEVER* with a gimped lower level one, it failed to cast. For example, a lot of times, this was same-team griefing...
In this situation, sure, once the 16 channeling 13 spawn spirits are *DEAD*, it makes sense to allow anything to replace them (as they no longer exist). Or if it's the elite 3-spirit signet - spawn those spirits that are *DEAD*. It's just poor game design, *PERIOD*. And this I'm sure isn't the only place it happens in GW, where high level skills are overwritten by crappy ones (enchants/weapon spell/etc).
FWIW, I'm talking casting same-spirits in-range of existing more powerful ones.
10 Aug 2009 at 09:29 - 12
It's not bad game design, the game just didn't check for you if it is advantageous to use a skill or not, you have to do it yourself.
10 Aug 2009 at 18:13 - 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coney
I hate to say this, but in all the other well-designed MMORPG games I've played, if you tried to replace a higher level *WHATEVER* with a gimped lower level one, it failed to cast. For example, a lot of times, this was same-team griefing...
In this situation, sure, once the 16 channeling 13 spawn spirits are *DEAD*, it makes sense to allow anything to replace them (as they no longer exist). Or if it's the elite 3-spirit signet - spawn those spirits that are *DEAD*. It's just poor game design, *PERIOD*. And this I'm sure isn't the only place it happens in GW, where high level skills are overwritten by crappy ones (enchants/weapon spell/etc).
FWIW, I'm talking casting same-spirits in-range of existing more powerful ones.
It's not poor game design, you just don't get how advantageous this is.
For instance, if you take the SoS example, let's say there's 5 seconds left to the current 16 channeling spirits there. You have 10 channeling. Rather then having to wait, and have a break in the damage/Bodyblocking/etc, you can cast it with 5 seconds remaining, not having the skill fail, and not having to wait 20 seconds for it to recharge.
Instead of blaming the game, why not just watch what skills you use when you use them. If you want to call this bad design, you might as well call the max level of 20 bad game design, or the max of 8 skills bad design.
And "Same Team Greifing"? I don't see why someone would do that, there's no benefit to it. I've been playing this game for 3 years now, and I've never been with someone who's purposefully greif'd me. (Idiots who don't know what "Save <Personhere>" means don't really count)
Heroes seem to grasp this concept, and their AI is mocked over and over in this site. Seems pretty simple to me.
10 Aug 2009 at 19:28 - 14
ITT: Some people too lazy to keep an eye on the battlefield.
If you're so bad you can't even keep track of which spirits are up when you're running a spirit build, stay out of PvP. Actually, nevermind, do play PvP because then we get to hear incredibly butthurt whining as you realize this isn't checkers.
10 Aug 2009 at 21:28 - 15
You know, it does point this out right on the wiki page.
Really not all that difficult to keep track of what's going on around you...
10 Aug 2009 at 22:03 - 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by Killamus
For instance, if you take the SoS example, let's say there's 5 seconds left to the current 16 channeling spirits there. You have 10 channeling. Rather then having to wait, and have a break in the damage/Bodyblocking/etc, you can cast it with 5 seconds remaining, not having the skill fail, and not having to wait 20 seconds for it to recharge.
Interesting argument, except for the fact that the 16 channeling 13 spawning rit will most definitely have SoS recharged, as it takes 20 seconds, and the 3 spirits last 60.
FWIW, more unusual behavior today. I cast my spirits, move about 1.2 aggro radii away, then recast [vampirism][bloodsong] as they became available (MOBs were 1.5 aggro radii away). They both appeared by me, but with health bars of like 15% and 30%. WTF?
I suspect a queuing issue with server-side command processing, and could see how just as I cast each spirit, the old ones 1.2 radii away just got attacked, so the game applied the new health value after damage to my new ones (thus resetting their health ultra low). This didn't happen very often, but 2 different times I noticed it in about 30 minutes gameplay.
It might also be related to the old spirits 1.2 aggro radii away attacking just as the new spirits were created, so their projectiles were still in-transit to the MOB - and the lifesteal applied to old spirit life was overwritten on the new spirits...
FWIW, it's amazing how many GW boot-lickers there are, who apparently don't want to reason, but merely blindly assert that things ARE THE WAY THEY ARE, so I must be retarded to have not noticed this yet ('sif I didn't know - LOL I pointed it out). Fine, I've pointed this fact out previously in other critiques of gameplay issues that are illogical and inconsistent with expectations.
10 Aug 2009 at 22:50 - 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coney
Interesting argument, except for the fact that the 16 channeling 13 spawning rit will most definitely have SoS recharged, as it takes 20 seconds, and the 3 spirits last 60.
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What I said applies to any spirits, it wasn't meant to be taken literally.
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FWIW, it's amazing how many GW boot-lickers there are, who apparently don't want to reason, but merely blindly assert that things ARE THE WAY THEY ARE, so I must be retarded to have not noticed this yet ('sif I didn't know - LOL I pointed it out). Fine, I've pointed this fact out previously in other critiques of gameplay issues that are illogical and inconsistent with expectations.
Alright.
(1) Things are the way they are because of the dev team. We don't have any control, we can suggest things, but as it is, GW1 is pretty much dead - the entire team (Except for about 10 programmers, iirc) has moved onto GW2. Bitch and complain all you want, it's not going to do any good, especially because...
(2) Expectations differ between people. You might expect different things then someone else. As it stands, this is probably the best way to deal with an issue, because of what I stated above. Let's see you come up with a better idea that doesn't allow walls of spirits, failed skills (When a skill fails in this game, remember, it recharges too!) and multiple copies of the same spirits.
(3) SOME things DO act the way you think they do. For instance, conditions. If I put a 20s blindness on a melee, and a hero goes over that two seconds later with a 10s blindness, nothing will happen. Of course, if that hero waited 15 seconds, then the hero's blindness would apply.
(4) Don't dismiss an idea just because on the top it looks stupid. If you'd actually thought about some of the comments here, you'd notice that they do make sense, more then having a skill fail just because you want to re-cast early and aren't observant enough to notice there's another set out there.
Heroes won't overcast your spells, unless there's a real reason to do so (I.E. you ordering them). Hell, they're too stupid to over cast their OWN spells, like the new Machosism, aura of the lich, or double dragon, where it would be beneficial to them to do so.
10 Aug 2009 at 23:16 - 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by Killamus
What I said applies to any spirits, it wasn't meant to be taken literally.
Yep, but of all the spirits I use (6), SoS has the shortest life span. It also costs 0 energy (so can't argue rit is OOM). The 3 other spirits I use have 30 second recasts, but last 100 seconds or much longer...
Arguing that GW1 is dead is not valid. They still fix bugs - hell, they're adding new content almost monthly, as well as new skill descriptions.
I can read - but telling me I'd a retard for not watching spirits in the field before I cast a lesser spirit is kinda nonsensical, as I did a quick 5 minute experiment and noticed the "overcast others with lesser attributes" issue. As I mentioned in the initial post, this 5 minute experiment let me know NOT to dupe spirit skills.
FWIW, again I noticed the low health spirit spawn BUG (recasting [vampirism][bloodsong] 1.2 aggro radii away from old spirits). I can't be the only one to have noticed this alternate issue?
EDIT: If a skill fails as you suggest (trying to apply over more powerful buff/hex/condition), it obviously shouldn't recharge. That seems like a bug too (I assume you agree, given your EXCLAMATION!). It should act like [lightbringer's gaze] does, when you try to cast it on a non-abaddon minion (and not cost any mana either)...
11 Aug 2009 at 00:22 - 19
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10393491
^I just realized... you're that guy... so who's spirits are your crappy ranger's overwriting... lawlpwn many level 10 scales lately...
11 Aug 2009 at 01:33 - 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh Manatee
11 Aug 2009 at 06:00 - 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coney
I don't understand - are you suggesting my spirit spam build doesn't work in HM? Or that the lvl 10 scales are an issue? As I mentioned in that thread, 2 skills (communing/restoration) are essential for *BEEFY* opponents.
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WTS sarcasm detector 100k +10 zkeys... I'm sure it does work, but so would a Mo/R with 5 burst heals mending, heal breeze and charm animal... it's a matter of degrees... I just thought it was funny if you ever did pair with a real rit he'd get pissed at you for "same team griefing" by overwriting his stuff like a noob and likely rage quit leaving you to solo said scales for epic profit....
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You seem to lack the skill of reading comprehension. I ran a 5 minute test to determine the initial issue. Obviously I determined NOT to dupe spirit skills.
But to clarify it for you, the TOTAL MORON, I will. My ranger is overwriting the spirits of a 16 CHANNELING 13 SPAWNING rit. Can't you read?!?
Now, you determined that when you overwrote an old spirit with a new one it was a bug... not a well known balancing feature that's existed since the koreans used to choke the entire HA map with spirit clones, and one that is described on the wiki pages(reading ftw!)... Also to finally put to rest the "spirits should fail if you're still in range" thing, what if I need or want brand new spirits in a new location that's not yet out of the range of the previous set, or what if I get hit with weakness and need to activate spirits gift or what if I have another guy with SoS and neither of us care about the spirits level or HP, just that they exist to activate skills and he has a minor rune and I have a major or sup? The current system of new overwriting old regardles of strength is pretty much perfect, it prevents spam abuse, punishes foolishness(like taking a R/Rt NPC spammer...) yet allows flexibility with a logical sacrifice/cost/benefit in case you do have to cast weaker stuff over older stronger stuff.
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But you seem to have flame on your mind - so what flame you? I can farm Java Bluffs in HM solo (NO HEROS) in ~35 minutes. Is this just more LOL for you?
yeah sorta... I can do a Jahai bluffs run from kondur to the boss in the fortress in about 15-20... lol
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EDIT: I get it, you suggest there's no issue with respawning spirits 1.2 radii away, that *OCCASIONALLY* have very low health. I get it now!
screens? I haven't had this issue ever, and I've been running rit spirits since day 1... If this is true you may actually have found a bug, but that other thing, is working as intended.
BTW want to pick up your sarcasm detector in GToB ID1?
11 Aug 2009 at 07:32 - 22
And it might be a good idea to check builds before going out into an explorable. You can ping builds these days. When you see a Rit with the same spirits, it might be a good idea to substitute yours to avoid duping them if you can't be bothered to monitor which spirits are up...
Anyway, nothing wrong with spirits replacing same type spirits, even if they are lower level. Seems you're one of the few that has a problem with it, so I suggest changing your playstyle a bit, as it is possible obviously to not be affected by that 'bug'. But people in this thread already pointed that out to you.
11 Aug 2009 at 13:11 - 23
With the system you are requesting, a Rit would be unable to recast SOS, or any other spirit, while under the effects of Weakness. You could just effectively shut down, not just hinder, a spirit spammer with one easily applied condition.
11 Aug 2009 at 16:35 - 25
Out of curiosity, Coney...what new content has been added 'almost monthly'?
12 Aug 2009 at 00:37 - 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh Manatee
WTS sarcasm detector 100k +10 zkeys...
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BTW want to pick up your sarcasm detector in GToB ID1?
My fault, blame it on me. I should have realized it was an obvious troll. W/E.
I still don't get why you quoted the other thread, tho. I just got my behemoth hides in HM, in about 20 minutes, solo (no hero/hench). Certainly not stellar, but I liked the 3 chests and 3 golds that dropped from them.
At this point, without access to *code inspection*, I'm reluctant to even bother pointing out issues anymore. The spirits with lifesteal definitely have an INTERMITTENT problem with spawn health not 100%, but it's pretty much impossible to prove with a screen shot. I mean really, "Is there any knowledge in the world which is so certain, that no reasonable man could doubt it?"!?
And I'm not going to become some freebee test crewe member. Salaried employees should be able to do such basic things - but then I assume they have at least a basic BS degree in computer science/software engineering...
Oh, and is your <grin> run HM solo, or the OP 600/smite that does all GW content, with a hero bonder or two almost off-radar...
12 Aug 2009 at 02:26 - 28
What run? Jaya Bluffs? You can do that entire run in about 10 minutes with an elementalist. Here, there's even a youtube of it (It's 2x speed though)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H90qVTUgFls
Pretty good one, I use it myself on occasion (Although I like my own shockwave farm, it's slower, but you don't miss out on those occasional stubborn necros)
Or the dust farm? Yea, same build as above (Slight modifications to it), mine gets about half a stack (Full run) in about 15 minutes, depending on how much attention I'm paying, or if there's a boss in the way.
I honestly can't think of a farm that a R/Rt or Rt spirit spammer could do faster then say, an ele or assassin. They're great in a party, but as a stand-alone, spirits are generally too fragile to stand up to much, and their attack speed is rather pathetic, really.
However, if you were to say, add in a wall of minions or humans, then they're a great asset. As seen with the ever-so-popular SoS rit currently in it's 15 minutes of fame.
12 Aug 2009 at 03:29 - 29
Wait.... I forgot... There's a jaya bluffs on the factions noob isle... I only pass through there like once on the way to the mission, and never go back so I forgot about it... I was talkin about the Jahai Bluffs with the fort in kourna that has all the elite kournan soldiers and the ele boss... get crud ton of gold runes up in there and firey gladius and tomes and stuff. Actually it may not work anymore with the derv buff, GD armor of sanctity... Used to be you couldn't wand at them now they'd AoE weakness you...
If I want feathers I go to nahpui or NKP.
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