Make a REAL Assassin

Lariv

Lariv

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Mar 2009

Me/

The entire point of the Assassin profession is to be able to go in, get a kill, and get out. It seems to me that this has failed completely. What I'm proposing is making a build suitable for PvE. It doesn't have to be the best, however; it does need to get the job of an Assassin accomplished.

1) Must be able to rush into a group

2) Secure a target

3) Remove that target from existence

4.1) Get out quickly in case of danger

4.2) Be able to quickly dispatch another target if not in danger

5) Repeat the process with as little downtime as possible

PS: If I knew how to post builds, I'd post mine. . .

PSS: This isn't asking for a build, it's a challenge. I saw something of the like on the Dervish and the Mesmer forums a while back. This thread is fine, asking for builds is not allowed when theres a big flashy thread that says 'all answers to your stupid generic questions are here' or when search/PvX is sufficient. Not ALL threads get closed - Marty .

Tenebrae

Tenebrae

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2007

Spain

LHV

R/N

Quote:
Originally Posted by yamazaru View Post
The entire point of the Assassin profession is to be able to go in, get a kill, and get out. It seems to me that this has failed completely. Well , i think you are wrong. At least in PvE , AP allows you to do that but on the other hand , i agree that shadow steps in pve are hella BS ..... along with its recharges.

RadaArashi

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2007

A/

Quote:
Originally Posted by yamazaru View Post
1) Must be able to rush into a group
4.1) Get out quickly in case of danger
Accomplished by Shadow Fang

Quote: Originally Posted by yamazaru View Post
4.2) Be able to quickly dispatch another target if not in danger
5) Repeat the process with as little downtime as possible Assassin's promise lets you do this.

Quote: That's the problem, mark of instability screams to the monk he's about to get spiked. And if they have half a brain, they would either remove the hex just in time to waste your wastrel's collapse, or hit the panic button (balanced stance/shield bash). Either way you will be mostly useless for another 20 seconds. That would work better on targets other than a monk.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yamazaru View Post
3) Remove that target from existence You have your remaining 6 slots: 2 Slots for IAS/damage buffs, namely Asuran Scan and Critical Agility and 4 Slots for your damage chain. There's your challenge.

Rhamia Darigaz

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Apr 2008

1)forget about shadowsteps because they're terribad in pve. with crit agility you have armor comparable to a hammer war anyway, without running armor insigs.
2)get in there and spam DB.
3)???
4)PROFIT

Xsiriss

Xsiriss

Jungle Guide

Join Date: May 2008

He's right. Need low recharge (nothing over 10) dagger skills with tons of combo options, short recharge shadowsteps/stances for movement purposes. Only problem is balancing it for pvp.

Bobby2

Bobby2

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2007

Delayed in order to meet ANet's high standards

[MaSS]

W/E

AP
Shadow Fang
YMLAD
Falling Lotus
Trampling Ox
Falling Spider
Blades of Steel
Scan

Be the snowflake

The Cake Archer

Academy Page

Join Date: Jun 2009

Mo/A

http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/Build:A/an...Promise_Spiker

RadaArashi

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2007

A/

My only beef with that build is the lack of an IAS

Bobby2

Bobby2

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2007

Delayed in order to meet ANet's high standards

[MaSS]

W/E

Quote:
Originally Posted by RadaArashi View Post
My only beef with that build is the lack of an IAS Rock candy.

EDIT: also, between YMLAD and Trampling you actually need to not be too fast.

Yuna Matsumarui

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Mar 2009

Me/

http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/User:That_Unknown_guy/Sandbox

found this a while ago on youtube.. decided to put on my userpage on pvxwiki during schooltime.

besides the hex, it's virtually impossible for the monk to see the spike coming, and unless he got some stance (or shield bash) to dave itself, it's pretty much done for.


1) Must be able to rush into a group (Wastrels)

2) Secure a target (Knocklocks)

3) Remove that target from existence (Twisting Fangs + Blades of Steel = L33T

4.1) Get out quickly in case of danger (optional, dash - Heart of Shadow, Return etc.)

4.2) Be able to quickly dispatch another target if not in danger (got 20 seconds downtime, )

5) Repeat the process with as little downtime as possible (20 seconds downtime)


made it for pvp anyways, could work in pve as well.

but for the assassin, you'll mostly get cookiecutter Assassin's Promise Spike builds, as AP recharges the skills, and thus makes almost all skills good/usable.

AngeliqueSynner

AngeliqueSynner

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Aug 2008

Florida, USA

Sacred Storm [Strm]

N/

Let's see... What was that one I had a while back....
It's total shat in hindsight, but it worked when I needed it to. :]
I blitzed Tihark Orchard wih this build.
I did fairly well minimal stopping between the three groups.
I wouldn't use this outside low population areas or in PvP at all though. >__o

Dark Prison
Black Mantis Thrust
Golden Fox Strike
Horns of the Ox
Aftershock
Shockwave
Viper's Defense
Way of the Lotus

Perfected Shadow

Perfected Shadow

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jun 2006

Zul'Aman

Umes Uranger U[bot]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuna Matsumarui
besides the hex, it's virtually impossible for the monk to see the spike coming
made it for pvp anyways, could work in pve as well.

but for the assassin, you'll mostly get cookiecutter Assassin's Promise Spike builds, as AP recharges the skills, and thus makes almost all skills good/usable. Your 20 second recharge chain is way too long for pve, which is why AP is much better.

Yuna Matsumarui

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Mar 2009

Me/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Perfected Shadow View Post
That's the problem, mark of instability screams to the monk he's about to get spiked. And if they have half a brain, they would either remove the hex just in time to waste your wastrel's collapse, or hit the panic button (balanced stance/shield bash). Either way you will be mostly useless for another 20 seconds. That would work better on targets other than a monk.


Your 20 second recharge chain is way too long for pve, which is why AP is much better. lol funny, this build works quite good @ RA :P many monks try to indeed remove the hex, but I quarter lock and then they're dead :P try it out.

edit: btw, almost any assassin build screams, hey you! I'm about to spike you..

http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/Build:A/W_YAA_Assassin (when it kites you, when it used YAA)
http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/Build:A/W_Backbreaker_Sin (as soon as it doesnt spear you anymore.. )
http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/Build:A/W_...ck_Palm_Spiker (yeah, cripple isnt removable. )

Perfected Shadow

Perfected Shadow

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jun 2006

Zul'Aman

Umes Uranger U[bot]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuna Matsumarui
lol funny, this build works quite good @ RA :P many monks try to indeed remove the hex What I meant was that competent monks will remove the hex as soon as it lands on them (3/4 second aftercast to react and cancel veil, cast cure hex, etc.). Oh and did I mention balanced stance? But hey it's RA and you could get necros/mesmers stacking hexes on the monk.

BB can fake out guardians and balanced stance simply by switching to a hammer and walking next to a target, then unloading on a different target. Palm strike has a 7 second recharge (to restart if cripple is removed). With YAA, weakness covers the cripple, and even if both are removed, you can still execute the full chain, on a target of your choosing as well. Mark of instability limits you to whatever you hexed with it every 20 seconds which is just not reliable enough imo.

Tenebrae

Tenebrae

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2007

Spain

LHV

R/N

Agree with Perfect Shadow , if you consider those builds to "scream" a spike , the one with mark of instability is like sending a postcard with Subject : spike shortly .

Yuna Matsumarui

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Mar 2009

Me/

guardian can be maintained, if he balanced stances you on BB then your still useless for like 15-18 seconds. the YAA assassin works just as bad in RA as a horns of th Ox assassin, most monks will see your spike after your first try to kill them ( or after their first res) and then try to stay with allies.
Palm Strike has a 7 second recharge, Dismiss Condition has a recharge of 3 seconds.

Shield Bash > BB sin. as soon as your on the floor, pop it, and it breaks the chain. (well you could still go falling lotus -> Twisting Fangs, but that's a lame spike tbh.

I know that the build has a huge counter to it, the mark of instability, however..

without the mark you lose your Twisting Fangs + BoS combo to a Horns of the Ox + Twisting Fangs combo, which deals less damage

(BoS @ full damage = 2x +60 damage )

also, cooldown sucks on my build, however, because most builds use Twisting Fangs it's downtime is only 5 seconds longer than the other spike builds.

I'll end this post by saying that a well time Balanced Stance > All Assassin builds, and that Shield Bash > all assassin builds


the most common at least, rigor mortis sins have come and gone but never really did the trick.

Allamorph

Allamorph

Academy Page

Join Date: Oct 2009

The Basement

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

E/Me

@ All You "____ skill screams spike damage" Guys:

This is a PvE bar. Ain't no monk enemies going to think "oh crud, I'm going to die" in PvE because they're AI. They have an algorithm that dictates what skill to use when based on whatever input they receive, and can't extrapolate beyond that. Sure, the info's useful for people who want to end up PvPing effectively, but that's not the point of the thread.

Soon as I get my assassin off of Shing Jea I'll be testing some of these builds myself. Lookin' forward to it, actually. =P

Perfected Shadow

Perfected Shadow

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jun 2006

Zul'Aman

Umes Uranger U[bot]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Allamorph
This is a PvE bar.
If you're referring to yuna's bar, then you're wrong it's a pvp bar.

Quote:
@ All You "____ skill screams spike damage" Guys: We were discussing the pvp bar in guess what context? pvp.

However, yes you can argue that we were digressing from the point of this thread.

Allamorph

Allamorph

Academy Page

Join Date: Oct 2009

The Basement

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

E/Me

Quote:
Originally Posted by Perfected Shadow
If you're referring to yuna's bar, then you're wrong it's a pvp bar.
No, I'm referring to the OP's request, which, last time I checked....
Quote:
Originally Posted by yamazaru
What I'm proposing is making a build suitable for PvE.
Quote:
Originally Posted by yamazaru
This is all for PvE. ...was pretty specific. Yuna's bar was just where you guys got sidetracked.


@ yamarazu: Is the primary focus for you huge spike damage to a single target only, or would collateral damage be a bonus to make follow-up kills a quicker done deal?

Thenameless Wonder

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2009

W/

Here you go:

Way of perfection - self heal
Golden phoenix strike - aoe nice spike
Critical strike- dual attack (2x dmg + energy gain)
Moebis strike- instant recharge + spammable
Deaths blossom- very nice aoe + low recharge
Twisting fangs- finisher
Critical Agility- IAS and increased armor
Critical defenses- 75% to block

BAM!!

Lariv

Lariv

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Mar 2009

Me/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Allamorph View Post
@ yamarazu: Is the primary focus for you huge spike damage to a single target only, or would collateral damage be a bonus to make follow-up kills a quicker done deal? My goal would be to be a real Assassin. To jump in, get a target, jump out. If you can get some damage on others, all the better! They have to die eventually anyway.