Codex Title - Guild Wars Guru archive powered by Guild Wars Legacy

Vazze

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2006

28 Oct 2009 at 17:04 - 81

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arkantos

Why do bad players deserve to get any rank in the title? Why should bad players be rewarded for poor play? They shouldn't. That's not being elitist, that's using a very simple logic. Good play should be rewarded, not bad play. You are saying dumb down PvP titles, you want them to cater to casual PvE players.

Where have you been in the past few years? Starting from the beginning...a title is a virtual reward that was implemented to increase your ego, give you a false sens of accomplishment and to reinforce the activity of the title. How does a tiny little word can achieve such grand result?

Titles are experience based in pretty much all games, meaning as long as you practice the activity of the title, you will progress the title: great, EVERYONE CAN DO IT. But why would this make you happy? Here comes the trick, if you are good at the activity of the title, you can progress FASTER. So after you look at your title at the end of the day, you can always believe that you DID progress fast. So if you want to talk about the theory of a MMO which does not try to be addictive, start a new thread and go on dreaming but anywhere else: stick to the reality and be grateful that you can select good teammates into your guild/pug/etc.

Why is the Codex title different from other titles? For one thing, a large percentage of players don't progress. And that is problem because we are sorry for those ppl? No, we don't care if they do have a title or not, but we want them to play CA because if the bottom 20% leaves every week (because they have zero accomplishment) you are going to be playing with yourself in 6 months.

BlackSephir

Forge Runner

Join Date: Nov 2006

A/N

28 Oct 2009 at 17:24 - 82

Quote:

elitist

I like how you people managed to dumb down the word. Now it doesn't mean anything. It's just an empty expression saying "WELL I DONT LIKE WHAT YOURE SAYING, IT HAS LOGIC AND SHIT".
Bravo gwg.

Second-Strike

Academy Page

Join Date: Sep 2005

28 Oct 2009 at 20:19 - 83

The whole idea of a title based around accumulation in a random scenario is flawed for the average player. My biggest complaint is running into gold trim groups at 4 or 9 wins and getting maybe 1-2 kills vs their 8. Basicly the only way I can think of to compensate for this is the creation of tiers, where groups can choose a level of tier to play in. Each tier offers faster rewards then the preceeding tier and you are premoted to the next tier after 10 wins(arbitary number) to prevent people from griefing beginners. This way you can practise against people around your skill level so it isn't too boring or too difficult.

drkn

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jan 2009

Wroc??aw, Poland

Midnight Mayhem

Me/

28 Oct 2009 at 20:34 - 84

/signed.
for all the pros on the topic mentioned already, enough said.
and i'm pretty surprised with the cons pointed out - it's all the same over and over you're talking here, going with the same crying while missing several important points. and the one you, 'elitist pvpers' (yes, that word died - because of elitist pvpers themselves), should like is - more (new) people to pvp means more matches and more traffic, what means easier wins on newbies. i get the feeling that you're just afraid of a higher concurrency out there.

doomfodder

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jan 2007

farm

R/

28 Oct 2009 at 21:14 - 85

So titles don't really matter? Try joining a PUG as r0 Glad... The current title scoring reinforces the elitist player base behavior to weed out ANYONE that wants to transition from PvE to PvP. Like ALL video games - incentive draws players to the format. Playing = fun BUT titles = incentive. If you don't want noobs in Codex, by all means weed em out. It's your perogative to make it as elitist as HA. IDC... I'll still go to Codex outpost every time I log in for 15min or so & TRY to get picked up on a PUG. I don't mind wasting my time 15min a day, then go back to gaming. At least theres NO wait in RA

oh yeah & to reply to the inevitable "go join the right guild/alliance" response to this post. TY anyway... DUH!!!

/signed

The Drunkard

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Nov 2007

Still looking

Rt/

29 Oct 2009 at 04:55 - 86

/notsigned

I'd prefer the number of points required for each rank to be lowered than for the title to be dumbed down and farmable.

Darth The Xx

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jul 2008

Sen'jin Village

The Infamous Cake Bandits [cake]

Mo/W

29 Oct 2009 at 08:17 - 87

Make it like HA

/signed

I am yet to get into a PuG that can even make it to 5 wins, don't know how Anet thought this arena would be PuG friendly with such title reqs. To those who say the title doesnt matter or it means nothing, that is irrelevant as soon as you put a reward on something, even something stupid like a line of text under your name people try to gain it.

Atm PuGs are just fuel for the organised groups getting to 100 consec.

Agar

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jul 2009

Angry Marine Fortress

[ZoS]

W/D

29 Oct 2009 at 09:40 - 88

/signed Lets face it, people dont play JUST for fun. They want to achieve/earn something when they play and balthazar faction aint good enough. Especialy when most of the people are 10k capped cause they are too pissed off/bored/dont have time to earn a pvp title with the "point per five wins" system

harpharp

Academy Page

Join Date: Apr 2009

29 Oct 2009 at 09:56 - 89

/unsigned

lol @ op asking me to get some skills cos i cant get points in RA for a shitty format due to grouping with random bads, but ask for points reduction on an organised arena that takes skill and coordination?

NO

Codex is as fine as it is since it does not have the problems of RA - syncers & botters and fairly deserved its point system. People are already posting 100/86 wins in a day. If OP can't get pts in codex arena, i am forced to conclude he must be bad. Get some skill

Yawgmoth

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Apr 2005

29 Oct 2009 at 11:24 - 90

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enon

Op describes it all. Getting steamrolled by a g9 guild is boring and is a big turn off for casual PvP'ers.

Do you realise that even if all titles in game were completely removed, casual PvP'ers would be still getting beaten regularily by the "pro" guild teams? Titles don't change anything.

Titles are only good in that they help PuGs to group with players of THEIR skill level. Titles save time - in most cases a player with good title is a better player than one that has nothing to show.

However some changes to the Codex title would be good, 5 consec is way too hard to get for the random pugs and at that rate even if they keep playing over and over and over they will need to spend months to get a mere rank 1. It's wrong. Players of all levels should be able to get some points, better players should just have higher ranks.

"Cheapening" the title wouldn't hurt anyone here as long as it remains a non-maxable title (which it should). Highest ranks should still seem ridiculous even for the best and most dedicated hardcores after a year of play. But anyone who doesn't suck completely should be able to some points, like they can in HA.

Short

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2009

Protectors of Fate [GoF]

N/Me

29 Oct 2009 at 12:07 - 91

Not signed. As per all reasons above. If you give up straight away because you get steamrolled, then it's quite clear that you're not wanting to get better at this game type, you just want it to be easy and suitable for your level of play. PvP is a challenge and should continue to be.

Shadar

Academy Page

Join Date: Sep 2006

Croatia

[ACID]

Me/

29 Oct 2009 at 12:13 - 92

/signed

I think it's obvious that the long term succes of CA will be determined by how many players it can keep interested. a more accesible title should contribute to that, along with certain skills getting balanced and perhaps adding ATs, ladder etc.

as it is now I see it fast becoming as empty as TA, and that kinda defeats the purpose of deleting TA in the first place.

Short

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2009

Protectors of Fate [GoF]

N/Me

29 Oct 2009 at 12:15 - 93

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadar

/signed

I think it's obvious that the long term succes of CA will be determined by how many players it can keep interested. a more accesible title should contribute to that, along with certain skills getting balanced and perhaps adding ATs, ladder etc.

as it is now I see it fast becoming as empty as TA, and that kinda defeats the purpose of deleting TA in the first place.

Making it easier to get a title will not bring players in swarms. The title will just lose it's "credibility", it'll be like "r6 sunspear lfp to do mission"

Shadar

Academy Page

Join Date: Sep 2006

Croatia

[ACID]

Me/

29 Oct 2009 at 12:41 - 94

Quote:

Originally Posted by Short

Making it easier to get a title will not bring players in swarms. The title will just lose it's "credibility", it'll be like "r6 sunspear lfp to do mission"

Making it easier to progress in a title will appeal to the masses.
I think that the consecutives system was always inferior to the HA progression system, which is part of why HA always had some sort of player base while TA just died a slow death. The other part is the shiny emote and complete lack of TA balancing.

The high-end CA players will get higher ranks and "credibility", whatever that stands for, but the low-end will feel like their time is well spent if they see that bar slowly filling up.

Vazze

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2006

29 Oct 2009 at 13:33 - 95

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yawgmoth

Do you realise that even if all titles in game were completely removed, casual PvP'ers would be still getting beaten regularily by the "pro" guild teams? Titles don't change anything.

Do you realize that by that he meant they should not be playing each other? It is as "turn off" for them as boring for me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yawgmoth

However some changes to the Codex title would be good, 5 consec is way too hard to get for the random pugs and at that rate even if they keep playing over and over and over they will need to spend months to get a mere rank 1. ....But anyone who doesn't suck completely should be able to some points, like they can in HA.

No, forcing them to make consecs is not going to work. Again, the problem is not the title, it is the matchmaking. Make it like HA or come up with something new everyone should be playing their own tier.

untouchable

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Oct 2005

Winnipeg, Mantioba Canada

Terra Noise[Zraw]

Mo/E

29 Oct 2009 at 14:20 - 96

Quote:

Originally Posted by shoyon456

This is why I don't PvP.

Agggrrrrreeeeeeed

Del

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Sep 2009

In a van, down by the river.

RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO if I know, ask Lynette.

R/

29 Oct 2009 at 14:27 - 97

Leave the title as is. The consecutive wins required for the gladiator and codex titles requires people to play more, in the process they become more competent in pvp, and the title is less meaningless. i don't see why anyone's bitching anyways, pvp is more about fun than titles.

drkn

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jan 2009

Wroc??aw, Poland

Midnight Mayhem

Me/

29 Oct 2009 at 16:21 - 98

Quote:

I see PvP as another side of the game, so the amount of all the pvp titles difficulty should equal the difficulty of all the PvE titles.

it's a very intelligent statement, really. as it is how it should be - pvp and pve should be somehow, at some point, comparable.
and we all know how the elitist pvpers call our, the noob pvers, titles 'easy and boring to get'...
but yes, there's too big difference between pve and pvp title progression, whether you want to play for the titles or for fun. pve are way easier to get.

i still do miss something though. you say - 'pvp is about the fun, not the titles'. so why do you care that other people might get them on their accounts? you play for fun, not the titles, so where's that discussion coming from?

Del

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Sep 2009

In a van, down by the river.

RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO if I know, ask Lynette.

R/

29 Oct 2009 at 16:54 - 99

Quote:

Originally Posted by drkn

i still do miss something though. you say - 'pvp is about the fun, not the titles'. so why do you care that other people might get them on their accounts? you play for fun, not the titles, so where's that discussion coming from?

point is, i don't see why the title should be made easier just because someone wants to grind it just to have it. As it is, 5 wins isn't difficult, just time consuming. if you want easy titles just to have them, pve may be more your speed.

drkn

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jan 2009

Wroc??aw, Poland

Midnight Mayhem

Me/

29 Oct 2009 at 16:58 - 100

Quote:

As it is, 5 wins isn't difficult, just time consuming.

i believe you forgot your first steps in the pvp gw world or it was completely different back then than it is now.

Del

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Sep 2009

In a van, down by the river.

RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO if I know, ask Lynette.

R/

29 Oct 2009 at 17:11 - 101

Quote:

Originally Posted by drkn

i believe you forgot your first steps in the pvp gw world or it was completely different back then than it is now.

forgotten my first steps? LOL, I'm still new, I have trouble sometimes, but rather than whine and say it should be easier, I just work hard at it. if you don't want to put forth the effort to improve and become capable of earning the titles, then don't pursue them.

drkn

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jan 2009

Wroc??aw, Poland

Midnight Mayhem

Me/

29 Oct 2009 at 19:03 - 102

i might actually get your point here for codex - it should be hard to obtain, as you can develop there your own professional team, whether it's guildies or friends. but still, i believe it's insane that getting r2-3 gladiator is harder and more time consuming than nearly maxing an allegiance title. and both are account-wide.

@down: thank you for your opinion, we appreciate what children think.

kade

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Oct 2005

Currently residing in ToA dis 1

Mo/

29 Oct 2009 at 20:12 - 103

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSephir

Oh, look, a thread about *titles*.
The only good title threads are the ones that suggest removing titles.

the day arenanet decided having a line of text under your name was a good idea, the game died a bit in my mind.

seriously, a line of text...cool armor or emotes are one thing, but .... a line of text?

I spend all day editing text, the last thing I want is to see more of it. Thats why graphical representations were invented in the first place...MUDs died for a reason.

Vazze

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2006

29 Oct 2009 at 20:29 - 104

If you think about it, money is just paper, these days not even that.

doomfodder

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jan 2007

farm

R/

29 Oct 2009 at 20:49 - 105

I find it ODD that almost all posters to this thread completely ignore the REAL WORLD PRACTICAL UTILITY/VALUE of a PvP title. Read on…

Some posters have noted that titles are for boosting ego. Well that’s probably true, but from a PRATICAL perspective, that’s ancillary at best.

PvP titles CREATE THE SELECTION CRITERIA for PUG party formation. Imagine if you will, just for a moment, that there were no PvP titles at all. What criteria would YOU use to select someone in the party window when forming a PUG? Would you think to yourself: Have I seen this IGN before & do I remember anything about their play style when I either teamed up/against them? OF COURSE NOT!!! The displayed title serves to ENABLE team members/formers in making a decision about whether to accept a player on your PUG team - THAT’S IT!!!!

Titles are here & here to stay. So IF you’re unranked in PvP and want to join a PUG, too bad! You just don’t get the same opportunity to play CODEX to gain CODEX experience to gain CODEX title ranks to make it easier to join CODEX teams to gain more CODEX experience etc…

If ANET wanted to facilitate unranked PvP players with PUG formation in CODEX, they would change the title structure in some way. ANET developed this existing title structure & presumably wants to assist players in PUG formation using the REAL WORLD PRACTICAL UTILITY/VALUE of the PvP title. I suspect that it’s more likely ANET prefers CODEX to be MORE organized via Guild/Alliance participation as opposed to PUGS. So since I’m unranked in PvP & am NOT in a PvP guild/alliance, I’ll accept my PRACTICAL exclusion from the CODEX format (except for the 15min a day I do TRY to get picked up on a PUG) & just play RA when I want to work on my PvP playing skills -to "farm" a PvP title.

Dobermann

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jul 2006

29 Oct 2009 at 22:42 - 106

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pelorin Eshmar

/signed i already gave up on codex cuz of cons wins lol

No need to say anything else

I gave up after day two of Borat and [Dent]'s r12+

harpharp

Academy Page

Join Date: Apr 2009

30 Oct 2009 at 15:51 - 107

wow @ gwguru community. Most of you didn't suggest easy points fix for RA,a stupid format which encourage stupid pvp, but encourage easy points fix for codex arena, which is real pvp that reqs thinking for builds, skill and coordination? and some even threaten to go back to RA as they can't handle codex when there are people getting 100+ wins in codex?

should gw continue to cater to people more interested to moving backwards instead of forward so that we will be better off playing tetris? whats next?
suggest removal of hm? free cons for nm? no henchmans available so that people can get carried?

Revelations

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Feb 2009

Not Dead

W/

30 Oct 2009 at 16:43 - 108

Quote:

Originally Posted by harpharp

wow @ gwguru community. Most of you didn't suggest easy points fix for RA

By it's very nature RA does not have this problem. Please learn to put together coherent thoughts before you hit the 'submit' button.

harpharp

Academy Page

Join Date: Apr 2009

30 Oct 2009 at 16:47 - 109

Quote:

Originally Posted by Revelations

By it's very nature RA does not have this problem. Please learn to put together coherent thoughts before you hit the 'submit' button.

indeed for RA also require u to win 5 times consecutively, no? so why complain abt CA?

Eragon Zarroc

Atra estern?? ono thelduin

Join Date: Jan 2008

Madness Incarnate

[Duo]

W/P

30 Oct 2009 at 16:50 - 110

it's w/e. a title that i will not be working on and i accept that fact. if you don't want to work on getting better at pvp until getting 5 wins in a row doesn't look impossible, then this title isn't for you. either work on improving or accept the fact that you will not get this title. there is no mid-ground, work on the title using slow grind with few wins option here -_-

stanzhao

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Mar 2008

30 Oct 2009 at 16:54 - 111

Quote:

Originally Posted by harpharp

wow @ gwguru community. Most of you didn't suggest easy points fix for RA,a stupid format which encourage stupid pvp, but encourage easy points fix for codex arena, which is real pvp that reqs thinking for builds, skill and coordination? and some even threaten to go back to RA as they can't handle codex when there are people getting 100+ wins in codex?

should gw continue to cater to people more interested to moving backwards instead of forward so that we will be better off playing tetris? whats next?
suggest removal of hm? free cons for nm? no henchmans available so that people can get carried?

1 - your an idiot

2 - your still an idiot

3 - Ra doesnt need the point per win because people still enjoy playing it, because they can jump straight in. people dont need encouragement to go to RA. Codex arena is just TA all over again. people getting stomped who dont have any experience.

if they want people to enjoy RA, or come back to get better, they need to make the teams randomized like RA, or they need to make the games point per win.

otherwise people wont play. simple as. and you'll end up having a dead arena.

harpharp

Academy Page

Join Date: Apr 2009

30 Oct 2009 at 17:27 - 112

Quote:

Originally Posted by stanzhao

1 - your an idiot

2 - your still an idiot

3 - Ra doesnt need the point per win because people still enjoy playing it, because they can jump straight in. people dont need encouragement to go to RA. Codex arena is just TA all over again. people getting stomped who dont have any experience.

if they want people to enjoy RA, or come back to get better, they need to make the teams randomized like RA, or they need to make the games point per win.

otherwise people wont play. simple as. and you'll end up having a dead arena.

People enjoy red resign too, shld anet continue to allow red resigns at the expense of destroying gw economy? just because of RA is popular doesnt mean anet should dumb down other pvp formats to make them as shit as RA, no? if they don't have experience, they shld learn to how to play as a team and understand why they lose instead of hoping to get carried by playing shit builds. This isn't a popularity contest game.

YOu forget that CA and TA are 2 different things. TA gives glad points, codex doesnt, results in lots of syncers going to RA. Its still too early to claim codex will fail. Essentially another "i want to be spoonfed/blackmail" post.

stanzhao

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Mar 2008

30 Oct 2009 at 18:49 - 113

thats not my point. if you read my first post on the first page you'll see what i'm talking about.

you dont have to 'dumb down' the play in any way. just make the rewards for the average player better. if people find it to be too time consuming for too little reward, people wont play it. and the average GW player isnt the above average pvper. so your going to get into a system of a dead arena, because people have other things to invest their time in.

and your argument about being carried doesnt work in codex because of the sealed deck style. you cant carry 1 player through by running meta builds. and your definition of saying CA and TA are different because they give different points is still making me think you dont understand the point... (of the conversation)

Martin Alvito

Older Than God (1)

Join Date: Aug 2006

Clan Dethryche [dth]

01 Nov 2009 at 01:58 - 114

Quote:

Originally Posted by harpharp

Should gw continue to cater to people more interested to moving backwards instead of forward so that we will be better off playing tetris? whats next?

So what you're saying is that you don't want people you can farm in CA? You do realize that getting rid of the bad players makes your life harder, right?

If you enjoy the format, you have every reason in the world to encourage sufficient bad people to play it to keep the format alive. No PvP format other than GvG can survive on the good players alone, because there aren't enough left to go around. The rewards from CA aren't sufficient to get people to work for months at being pro just to be able to string 5.

Further, the effect is a feedback loop because bad is relative. As the worst players drop out, new players become the worst players and the cycle repeats.

Quote:

Originally Posted by harpharp

suggest removal of hm? free cons for nm? no henchmans available so that people can get carried?

Let's see:

Hard mode should be hard rather than tedious. Consumables should be made useless, and traders should be set up to convert them to alternative items. Heroes are good for those that like '90s style RPGs and their heirs, but bad for those that want a game with social components.

But none of that's going to happen, so arguing about it is pointless.