What Class do you think could use a buff in PVE?

Nothing needs a buff.

For all the people who say mesmers need a buff.....are nuts.

I ran through HM pve with my own "mesmerway." Mesmers are the one char that you can use several bars to shutdown any class coming at you. Armor ingnoring damage in HM....and yet they need a buff? Pfff

Most people want to rely on one skill CoP???? Sad. Make some bars, that no one wants to run that works. I DID. Stop looking at what everyone else runs and build your own. I DID. And my bars work extremely well.



I think some people have the right idea. Its based of the meta, when people start getting into what needs a buff. If your bar/proffesion isnt wanted, then make your own group using what you think will work. Tweak if needed.

It seems to me that few people can see the potential of paragons. This is one class that for sure doesn't need any changes IMO. A few alliance buddies and I run FoW with a team of 8 paras regularly, takes us a leisurely hour but it's no trouble at all.

I think people need to just be more open minded about using other classes in their party make-ups.

dervish=unused in pug teams everywhere

Enough said.

[/endthread]

lol... I am completely aware of this. Maybe you should read the thread title. In case you can't find it, let me copy and paste it. In bold. And underlined. And in italic.


What Class do you think could use a buff in PVE?


In case you missed that, let me be more specific:

What Class do you think could use a buff in PVE?

Paragon the co-dependency profession. No wonder they run around shouting with their pants off like a drunk person - they are probably drunk from lack of self-esteem and value.

There is One vetted general PvE build for Paragons in the Great Category and it is fully dependent on a high faction rank to run A Warrior Skill efficiently. It leaves the Para wide open to degen, and with the lowest AC in party, the focus of enemy attention. They have One vetted running PvE build in the great category, which is also dependent on a PvE only skill. They have One vetted farming build in the Great Category - which is useful perhaps if you want a dead sword. They have One hero build vetted in the Great Category. The most efficient a Para ever could have been was still dependent on a Faction skill (Ursan) and would have used Zealous Daggers with High Leadership and Dagger as a ParaSin, (Nerfed). They have the least prominence in number of builds that are useful, and no PvE straight paragon builds that can function as a pure Paragon and hold value to a party. Paragons are undesirable for party participation in all elite areas: FoW, UW, DoA, Urgoz, and the Deep - and almost useless without Faction based skills to augment them.

While the mesmer comes a close second for interest to players because their effects can't easily be seen by other players, they are still considered critical for interrupts and degen. Dervs may or may not be dependent upon Avatar builds, but have many more opportunities to be effective and can even DPS large mobs using spell damage and never hitting with a weapon (Avatar of Lyssa with PBoA and high energy enhancements/weapons).

No other class is as useless across the board as the Paragon, and I say this with my paragon having well over 20 titles. Almost all of it attained with HH or the assist of a fellow player with heroes, because Para's are undesirable for most game play.

Yeah, this bother me. I have dervish as a main character. I do lot of z-quests or at least I try. Nobody just want to take derv in their party qq
Good guild would help but I haven't found one yet..

Those aren't necessarily problems with the Paragon profession. They are more often than not a case of the GW population having a problem with understanding what a Paragon can do. If you are trying to solo farm with a Paragon, you don't understand the profession all that well. The Paragon is limited in number of skills available, along with the Dervish, as they were the last professions introduced. It follows that fewer pure builds are available with fewer skill choices to select from.

Running on a Paragon or any profession isn't that hard. Running isn't how the game was intended to be played anyhow. Who cares what PvX has vetted? Make your own build.

I do have my own builds. What you fail to understand is that they do not matter. The only build that parties are ever interested in at all is Imbagon, and it is not something for which they ask or look. Paragons are not sought after in any elite areas. Specific clearing teams comprised of Assassins, Monks, Mesmers, Rangers/Trappers, Nukers, and Necros dominate. Nothing else need apply. Melee types are tolerated as the token Meat Shield Bait Punk to be gang banged by the mob while the rest take care of it.

No, I do understand that. Read the second quoted sentence again. Our opinions differ on the validity of a PuG's opinion on what I run. I don't need their help, and if they refuse to allow me in the party, I'll happily H/H without them.

Again, PuG mentality is the problem: If it's not on PvX with a Great rating, it doesn't exist.

Melee is far more valuable than just a dumb tank role. I'm even less interested in joining a party that sees no value beyond tanking for a melee profession.

I never team with anyone but my brother any more, but from the hefty dose of PvE that we do together I can contribute:

- Our characters -
* He plays Warrior, Ranger, Monk, Assassin and Dervish.
* I also play Elementalist, Necromancer, Ritualist and Paragon.
* Neither of us plays (or currently has a PvE) Mesmer.

- Our heroes -
* Sometimes all Necromancers.
* Sometimes Elementalists and Monks instead or as well.
* Occasionally a Ranger if we want Broadhead Arrow for a specific boss.
* Maybe a Warrior if neither us is playing melee.
* Never take Elementalist, Mesmers, Assassins, Ritualists, Dervishes or Paragons.

You cannot HH elite areas. You will not with HH complete FoW, UW, Urgoz, the Deep, and DoA with a Paragon - especially in HM. You will not complete a HM Dungeon book in the Eye completely HH. And Paragons remain useless in Pure Para builds without augmentation by a Faction skill (usually from another profession or not para related) or co-dependency on other classes.

This man speaks the truth and has good taste.

I agree with the Mesmer bit and I agree with making your own group bit.

No classes in PvE needs buffing, and the guy who OP was referring to needs to chill out and just H/H the game, screw GW players.

Agreed. Nerf SY and give us other options. Better yet just give us other options

Schyte assassin makes more than [100 damage each hit]x3 enemies + 80% critical chance+faster attack speed+armor+deep wound+bleeding+faster movement speed: all of this in a SIGLE bar
how about shadow form? and daggers + asura scan?
please DON'T buff assassins, nerf them! -.-

however, mesmers really need a buff

By the way, Healing Prayers need to be toned down, Protection Prayers need to be revised, and Smiting Prayers need to be made something useful. I've been playing Monk lately and I've noticed that HB / UA is one of the reasons the game's so laughably easy.

On the subject of support classes not getting credit in groups, it'd probably help if their skills had more visible animations in PvE. For example, it's hard to tell when a Mesmer did an interrupt, but easy to see an Elementalist's Savannah Heat. However, if a Mesmer interrupt caused, say, a large blast of purple chain lightning at the target foe on a successful interrupt, it would be far more visible and teams would be more likely to identify the Mesmer's contributions or at least remember that the Mesmer is there contributing.

So..........you can't tell a Mesmer interrupted already by seeing your foe's skill stop in mid activation while the foe kinda falls down and up in a split sec at the same time? Of course..along with that infamous interrupted spell sound?

Dervishes, because they are the only class currently not accepted in both PvE and PvP (excluding codex).

Just roll back all the stupid nerfs done to fiddle with the PvP meta.

Re-introduce Evade

None its a well balance finly tuned machine.

But if I had to pick mesmer (core skills mind you not basing decision on the highbreed Pve manipulator)

I stopped playing my paragon because of sy
Also mesmers.

Increase the relevancy of Warriors and Dervs. I don't play those classes myself but the only melee class I generally see in any serious group is Assassin.

Its hard to say what needs buffing or nerfing. GW reminds me of Magic the Gathering in that respect. The vast majority of cards are unplayable and at times certain strategies are retardedly good because their counter strategy is weak. Power creep gets worse and not better as the game goes on because people demand more power at their disposal without understanding that there is more than one format in the game. The game company is then confused at the negative reaction to the powerup and proceeds to do whatever the RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO they want until the QQing gets too loud.

Oh, I can tell, but the issue is that groups aren't recognizing when the Mesmer does stuff. Something flashy and visible is what a PUG needs to understand something happened.

What really needs a buff in PvE the most is... the mobs. They simply cannot compete with all the imba going around and they can't adapt. Just imagine, what if some enemy groups contained 2 insanely good monks, that having a mesmer or daze/interrupt ranger or even a sin that can do repeated kd's

Better balance makes a better game overall, but to make a better balance first nerf the most obvious imba stuff, not only SF or ER but also many EotN PvE skills that allow classes to do things they shouldn't be able to, and do that even more efficiently than normal skills of that class can. Then buff a bunch of stuff to make all classes able to contribute enough to a full team to be worth it's slot.

Mesmers

I'd be perfectly happy if they would cut the recharge for most of the domination hexes+ esurge in half (20sec and greater); energy problems would balance it out. It's sad when I can only put empathy/backfire on monster and wait until my team mops up the mob to have it recharged.

Nothing needs buffed. In fact, a lot needs nerfed. One thing that would help a lot is if PvE skills were to magically disappear.

No, that's rangers.


Bars exist, PM me. They do need comparison to wars and sins though.


Also:

• Massively buff all ranger IAS durations.
• Rework bow (and spear) attacks to end when the projectile leaves the player, not when they arrive at target.
• Deep Wounds bow attack
• Critical bow preparation
• Triple-shot, Dual-shot @ 5e 4s recharge

Intensity:
Make it a larger percentage increase, like 50% ish
Elementalist skills only or tie to ES
Greatly increase duration (easily maintainable)




The change would have to be PvE specific, as monk-energy limitations are pretty much the foundation of PvP balance.

Divine Favor maybe reduce costs of monk spells (ala Expertise) while also continuing it's current bonus?

There isn't anymore power creep in Magic anymore. Have you seen the latest sets? The idea of cards that require cards to come into play is pretty low end. Magic's Standard is far softer than it was years ago.

I don't want power creep in Guild Wars, but I do want all professions to be seen as equal. Mesmers are great at smashing face in PvE, but their recharge times, huge massive lack of useful PvE skills, and Inspiration nerfs are annoying.

Pure mesmer bar really require inspiration skills for energy management or recharge reduction.just like rit spirit skills before the buff.Tone those need down and we might see mesmer doing more stuff in PvE.Also mermer play style is like wait and see game so HM doesnt open much option for them.

I dunno about softer so much as lacking in tier 1 control decks. All the top decks are aggro. Have YOU seen the latest sets? Baneslayer Angel, Sphinx of Jwar Isle, Bloodghast, Bloodbraid Elf, planeswalkers, etc have made Standard nuts. Heck, I'd say that today's Standard, which is dominated by Jund Aggro/Mid-range, is the closest we've come to Affinity's Standard in years.

I simply can't see all professions being equal. There's always something one profession does better than another. Mesmers are better at one shoting guys than Necros but Necros have the ability to hex a whole group of guys, etc.

Wow, I didn't even have to say anything. He nailed all of it.

I frickin LOL'd at this statement for over 15 mins. Since when does one skill define whether a class does enough damage??

Since when does doing a buttload of damage define the usefulness of a class....IT DOESNT.

Some of this community really needs think about half the crap that is written.

Blows my mind what some of you write. GL to you.

And please whatever you do....dont play a mesmer if you think it needs a buff.......You'll never do the class justice.

Warriors and Assassins run those builds better than dervs do. Trust me. I've done the numbers more times than I care to count. Pretty soon I'll be doing them in my head at this rate. Rangers at least get their Barrage+SY!/Barrage+Splinter/Barrage+Whatever-The-Hell-You-Want-To-Put-It-With.

I'm trying to decide if you're a troll or an idiot. Please try to explain how doing a buttload of damage can be anything other than a central criterion of usefulness in PvE.

I cant believe anyone is still missing it.

Why, party tell?

Today. We took Jadoth down in HM with a Ranger, a Mesmer, a Ritualist, a Monk and a Paragon (we had a monk, ele, and warrior drop along the way. The last because he thought we couldn't finish. HAH!)

On the topic: Dervishes are probably the profession most in need of help (note that "help" could mean nerfing the competition as well as a direct buff). The role they fill does seem to be one that has demand, but that demand is easily filled by W/Ds and A/Ds.

Rangers come up next - I can't think of any really powerful builds for them, although Barrage and Broad Head probably make them better off than Dervishes (they do have builds that aren't beaten by other primaries running them as secondary - they just aren't excessively powerful).

Third is Mesmers - which can be powerful, but this involves using AP and PvE-skill based builds that really aren't very Mesmer-like at all.

Fourth is Paragons - as people have said, they have SY! and not really much else. This is probably best solved by bringing the other options up until SY! can be dropped.

Fifth is the Elementalists - they have the ER monking build, but that's an implicit acceptance that their primary role is missing a bit in HM. I think this is a little exaggerated as a problem - EBSoH allows them to get their damage back up, and a Blinding Surge ele can disrupt melees better than anything and have room on the bar for plenty of utility - which is why it's so far down the list.

Sixth is the Assassins. Permasins are clearly TOO powerful. There are viable builds without it, however (largely DB based) and it does strike me that it is possible to make a decently durable assassin without SF, but that's why it's in the sixth place.

The Assassin I'm not sure about, but IMO the remaining professions are all pretty much in the right place at the moment - although many have an attribute that could use some help, the profession as a whole is fine. For the sake of argument, though, I'll keep listing:

The Warrior comes seventh, purely because with the amount of expendable melee that can be created (minions, EVAS), the Warrior can tend to be the most vulnerable character becuase they're in closer proximity to the minion swarm, and thus more likely to be caught in area effects if not directly targetted.

Monk comes in eightth, but only because of the ER elementalist issue - and we all know they can still find groups easily enough regardless.

Finally, we have the Ritualist and Necromancer, which each have a variety of builds which bring them into demand and that actually behave like the profession they're supposed to be (Rits can spirit spam and heal, Necros can curse or MM, among others). If push came to shove, I'd probably put the Ritualist in ninth and the Necromancer in tenth.

Some ppl cant just see beyond 2 things : Damage or Heal.

Well Mesmers need a PvE Buff in terms of AoE hexes/effects and skills recharge not in damage but its my opinion.

Mesmers just need their primary attribute, fast casting, to be fixed so they can be useful in PvE.

With slow skill recharge and energy limitations, fast casting is of extremely limited use in PvE. Mesmers can still work in HM, but mesmers are alot less powerful, in PvE, compared to necros and rits.

My ranger is feeling awfully neglected these days. Sorry but marksmanship needs some help methinks... bows fire too slow and miss too often. Bad. When people start abandoning their professions' primary weapons to use the weapons of another profession then you know something is rlly wrong.

And everyone has already listed the other problems:

mysticism =crap. they should make it take effect when an enchant is cast on you and when it ends.

elemental dmg in HM =crap

the only shit that works in HM is armor ignoring dmg, that's why some skills are so overpowered while the majority are fail.

Call it "fixing Fast casting" or call it "fixing skills recharge and AoE Effects" , almost same thing .... it can be done same way even.

Not a lot less than rits and thats for sure ( cough SP cough ). For the necro , EVERYTHING except SF sins are less powerful in pve than them , they are the most overpowered class in pve hands down. We all agree they dont need a buff.