I think someone have already thought of that long ago, but I was unable to find a thread on that matter so I post my own.
Why not implement a simple algorithm to choose which players should join which team in RA? So that you won't get any 4xW, 3xM etc.
It could be as simple as ('tis just an example):
1. take one typically frontline class
2. take one typically midline class
3. take on typically backline class
4. take one random class
The example kinda forces balanced teams, but I don't see much sense in unbalanced when the people are random anyway.
It will still be an instant action arena, with almost no waiting time, with random team mates, but without all the waiting before you get a decent team, and the overall level of gameplay would increase imo.
So... why not? I doubt we can see such change in GW, but I sure hope that there will be such gametype in GW2.
Take out half the random from random arenas?
Netsu
Chocobo1
Did you even think before you wrote this? You want to take the RANDOM out of RANDOM arenas.
I don't know what to say, seriously.
I don't know what to say, seriously.
Netsu
Only half of it. I don't know about you, but I'm into RA not because of the crappy team composition that I get 90% of the time, but because it's so casual and I can join a game any time.
Chocobo1
Roll a monk, carry everyone else, get 25 wins, repeat. There you go. If you want to roll anything else, be prepared to wait it out till you find someone who isn't a mo20 and knows what they are doing. Aka strap yourself in for 2 hours.
I wouldn't have this any other way tbh.
I wouldn't have this any other way tbh.
Netsu
If you're fine with how things are now then ok, but I won't roll a monk just to win, there are all those classes so I can choose whichever suits me best, and monk doesn't suit me at all.
And the change I mention would mean that people not running monks won't have to wait those 2 hours. The waiting for a team that doesn't make you go /resign is what kills the whole idea of instant action arena, that I thought is the main idea behind RA.
If the game would distribute classes evenly between teams then the arena would get much more skill dependant and less luck dependant (the only luck dependant factor would be the skill level of your team) - and in my book this is always a good thing.
And the change I mention would mean that people not running monks won't have to wait those 2 hours. The waiting for a team that doesn't make you go /resign is what kills the whole idea of instant action arena, that I thought is the main idea behind RA.
If the game would distribute classes evenly between teams then the arena would get much more skill dependant and less luck dependant (the only luck dependant factor would be the skill level of your team) - and in my book this is always a good thing.
Demonlord Matt
Are you kidding me? RA is to keep you prepared for anything, hence the random... IF you want to take that out, I suggest receiving psychological evaluation.
MagmaRed
Typical frontline classes would be Warrior, Dervish, and Assassin? What if I want to play a W/P chucking spears? What if I want to play an A/R shooting a bow? What if I want to play a D/N casting Orders?
You can continue the trend with all the classes. Rt/A with Spirits Strength and daggers, R/N touching, Me/D using IW, etc., etc., etc.
You won't fix the problem, and it isn't even a problem.
You can continue the trend with all the classes. Rt/A with Spirits Strength and daggers, R/N touching, Me/D using IW, etc., etc., etc.
You won't fix the problem, and it isn't even a problem.
Netsu
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Demonlord Matt
Are you kidding me? RA is to keep you prepared for anything, hence the random...
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But if that's exactly what the RA is for, then I'm abviously just longing for yet another kind of arena, which is pointless I guess.
Netsu
Quote:
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Originally Posted by MagmaRed
Typical frontline classes would be Warrior, Dervish, and Assassin? What if I want to play a W/P chucking spears? What if I want to play an A/R shooting a bow? What if I want to play a D/N casting Orders?
You can continue the trend with all the classes. Rt/A with Spirits Strength and daggers, R/N touching, Me/D using IW, etc., etc., etc. You won't fix the problem, and it isn't even a problem. |
Wuhy
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Netsu
But it doesn't. When I get a team of 4 physicals everyone resigns or dies in 2 minutes. What's the point of preparing me for a hopeless situation? Damn, I'm always prepared for it, as in 'I'm always prepared to resign'. There's just no fun in playing when you know you're going to lose, and no fun in waiting 'till you get a team that makes any sense either.
But if that's exactly what the RA is for, then I'm abviously just longing for yet another kind of arena, which is pointless I guess. |
but it certainly needs a more sophisticated system than that.
for example there could be three buttons, "enter as frontline", "enter as midline" and "enter as backline" and teams would be composed of 1 frontliner, 2 midliners and 1 backliner.. it would be good tbh.
IninefingersI
Cool, then they could change the name to "Arenas That Are Supposed To Be Random But Really Aren't, We Just Call It That"
Netsu
Well, players would still be chosen randomly, only team composition won't be. But it's true that the name would be less fitting than it is now.
axe
Quote:
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Originally Posted by IninefingersI
Cool, then they could change the name to "Arenas That Are Supposed To Be Random But Really Aren't, We Just Call It That"
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Basically to the OP, if everyone KNEW they would get a monk on their team, nobody would play a monk, and you would sit there for 45 min before the que shuffled you to the top with a monk.
The whole reason RA "works" is because you push a button and you enter within 10 seconds.
Gift3d
Quote:
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Originally Posted by IninefingersI
Cool, then they could change the name to "Arenas That Are Supposed To Be Random But Really Aren't, We Just Call It That"
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seriously people quit being stupid, adding a few logical and controlled systems to the arena wouldn't "not make it random hurr durrrr", no, random does not always include uncoordinated and unfair grieving filth.
BUT WHO AM I KIDDING I LOVE 8 MINUTE MATCHES WITH 4 MONKS ON MY TEAM OOLOLOLOL!!!
Quote:
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Originally Posted by axe
Basically to the OP, if everyone KNEW they would get a monk on their team, nobody would play a monk, and you would sit there for 45 min before the que shuffled you to the top with a monk.
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RedDog91
make yourself completely self-dependant
relying on the slim chance to get a balanced team means u might as well not play
every proffession/secondary combo has some way of self-management
would u rather get rid of one 50 dmg skill to keep yourself alive or deal that 50 dmg and die becuz u are too narrow focused?
relying on the slim chance to get a balanced team means u might as well not play
every proffession/secondary combo has some way of self-management
would u rather get rid of one 50 dmg skill to keep yourself alive or deal that 50 dmg and die becuz u are too narrow focused?
Saviour of the Good
What your describing is Team Arenas, which is now gone. Also you dont always need a balanced team to win. I've won up to 20 with a spike team and no healer. Just depends on the skill of the players and the build they are running.
Nerf Me Haha
This idea needs alot more work to work then what you offer ;p
Hanma l
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Saviour of the Good
I've won up to 20 with a spike team and no healer. Just depends on the skill of the players and the build they are running.
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I have no problems with the random peeps if anything at all i think it makes it fun. It's just as saviour says getting wins depends on the skill of the players, yesterday i won 8 consecutive with 3 W/E primal axe wars and a spearchucker ranger before we got rolled over by a sync team....Now with syncing i do have a huge problem and i wish they would perma ban all those that do it....thats just my opinion though.
dark3
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Gift3d
it seems you think anet is a bunch of blithering fools. i mean, what? honestly?! either that or you have a lot of trouble thinking logically yourself which is no problem cause i'm about to clarify things for you. OP is CLEARLY talking about adding a form of guidance and regulation to the way teams are matched. not some set in stone class list that you'll be waiting forever to find. if there's no monk you won't get a monk. if there are monks you won't get 3. nor will the other team, you could be a real champ and dazzle me with a reason why not having 3 monks in RA is a bad plan.
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axe
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Gift3d
you could be a real champ and dazzle me with a reason why not having 3 monks in RA is a bad plan.
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Anet screwed up enough arena's so maybe they are not blithering idiots, but from their track records, please leave the arena's alone.
Also the OP was not clear, I should give people the benefit of the doubt when they start a thread, that all the missing details are in fact there, just not for me to read or understand.
MagmaRed
Although I don't see a need for it, the only change I can see them making I would 'support' would be a simple one. Make it max the classes put on a team to 1. This makes it hard to run a Smite Monk and still end up with a healer Monk on the team though. But that is why I don't see a need for it. If your team sucks, then you try again. Part of ANY team sucking is yourself though. As noted, all classes/secondaries have options for self preservation. Sure, they can't sustain heavy fire, but they can stay alive long enough to kill someone else if their team helps.
Take builds that have self defense and healing if not playing a Monk. The Monk's will thank you, and your team will do better. It is RANDOM, so the only part that won't be random is yours. Make your part work, and let the rest be random. If everyone learned how to take a competent build, it would soon become a fun place to play. Matches would be challenging unless you found a 'perfectly balanced' team, and it would rely on player skill as much as luck of the draw.
Take builds that have self defense and healing if not playing a Monk. The Monk's will thank you, and your team will do better. It is RANDOM, so the only part that won't be random is yours. Make your part work, and let the rest be random. If everyone learned how to take a competent build, it would soon become a fun place to play. Matches would be challenging unless you found a 'perfectly balanced' team, and it would rely on player skill as much as luck of the draw.
AndroBubbles
Quote:
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Originally Posted by IninefingersI
Cool, then they could change the name to "Arenas That Are Supposed To Be Random But Really Aren't, We Just Call It That"
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Also, when you start controlling how members of each team are chosen, you limit the creativity of the people who are entering. One of the best things I've come to enjoy after all my time in RA is the ability to make new builds and experiment with them.
Stop trying to turn RA into TA, yeah?
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Gift3d
we get to choose which skills we use in the arena, so that's what we've been calling it for years, you didn't get the memo?
seriously people quit being stupid, adding a few logical and controlled systems to the arena wouldn't "not make it random hurr durrrr", no, random does not always include uncoordinated and unfair grieving filth. BUT WHO AM I KIDDING I LOVE 8 MINUTE MATCHES WITH 4 MONKS ON MY TEAM OOLOLOLOL!!! |
The main point is that you can't limit how people enter without having to remove "random" from the title.
mathiastemplar
No thanks!
I like the randomness... non-healer teams are fun.. so are 4xWarr/4xSin etc...
Nothing is wrong with RA.. It's the best part of GW imo.
I like the randomness... non-healer teams are fun.. so are 4xWarr/4xSin etc...
Nothing is wrong with RA.. It's the best part of GW imo.
IninefingersI
Quote:
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Originally Posted by mathiastemplar
No thanks!
I like the randomness... non-healer teams are fun.. so are 4xWarr/4xSin etc... Nothing is wrong with RA.. It's the best part of GW imo. |
You also have to take into consideration, the less they mess with something, the less chance of them screwing it up.
IMHO, Anet doesn't have a very good track record when they try to 'fix' something.
Netsu
Well, it seems only few people don't like the complete randomness of team composiotion and would like any form of control over it, my bad.
Regulus X
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Netsu
Well, it seems only few people don't like the complete randomness of team composiotion and would like any form of control over it, my bad.
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@ OP:
I've made some similar suggestions in the past concerning these issues, but Anet's never looked into it, nor has anybody brought it up to their attention seemingly because they have yet to take any course of action on the problems in RA.
I think that there should be some measures implemented into RA to make it fun while minimizing annoying 3-4 monk teams that almost ALWAYS choose to stall by running and healing [I see it... all.. the.. time!]
There also needs to be a way to stop bullshit runners/grievers in RA. Too many people become inspired by the negative energies in RA to find ways to shadowstep, block, regenerate and outrun teams for the duration of the matchup, forcing them to choose between wasting time, or mapping out and taking the dishonor hex with them. There's nothing dishonorable in leaving a matchup because you don't want to stay and watch somebody run/stall/grieve for 8+ minutes.
RA's local chat is one step shy of Jerry Springer mixed with total Sadistic and malicious flamers/trolls. Thought I'd also put that out there.
If there were a bit of scripted balance it'd be a good start, the first [and biggest] step towards improving Random Arenas. I'm totally FOR this "balanced" random. It's STILL RANDOM, but with a hint of balance to make fighting each other fair and competitive. It'd help counter all monk teams, and gives players ZERO REASON to grieve. It cuts down on inspired negativity we've seen in RA ever since the Dishonor and /report systems have been fired and forgotten into RA.
Reverend Dr
Take glad points out of Random arenas.
Every.single.complaint about random arenas originates from the fact that the arena has a title attached to it.
-People that don't like the format, but want that title
-People that don't like the atmosphere, but want the title
-People that want to goof around, but too many serious players that want the title
-People that rage the rest of their team, because their team is holding them back from their title
-People that sync, because they want the title
There is not one complaint about RA that ultimately doesn't come from someone wanting the glad title.
Every.single.complaint about random arenas originates from the fact that the arena has a title attached to it.
-People that don't like the format, but want that title
-People that don't like the atmosphere, but want the title
-People that want to goof around, but too many serious players that want the title
-People that rage the rest of their team, because their team is holding them back from their title
-People that sync, because they want the title
There is not one complaint about RA that ultimately doesn't come from someone wanting the glad title.
Regulus X
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Reverend Dr
Take glad points out of Random arenas.
Every.single.complaint about random arenas originates from the fact that the arena has a title attached to it. -People that don't like the format, but want that title -People that don't like the atmosphere, but want the title -People that want to goof around, but too many serious players that want the title -People that rage the rest of their team, because their team is holding them back from their title -People that sync, because they want the title There is not one complaint about RA that ultimately doesn't come from someone wanting the glad title. |
Reverend Dr
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Regulus X
No one's going to play just... to play!
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"Would you like to play this game?"
"No."
"How about if we put a little bar that shows 'progress'"
"Well hot damn! Now you're talking"
Regulus X
Dear Reverend,
It's called competition.
Oh lookey, I has gladiator rank 5! Oh but w8, this guy in front of me has rank 6! Hmmm... nao I will play until get to glad 7! ...oops! I almost forgot.. RA BLOWS BALLS! Maybe if they.. y' know.. made it less shitty? Y' know... if the other three snotty little dirtbags from the ocean of little shits parked in Random Arenas AD#, trolling up the local chatbox [as usual], didn't have the power to [ab]use the /report function with everyone for the slightest little itch while they grieve with runner/tanker builds that stall 'til the very end of the counter/timer anyways. Y' know... maybe if Anet fixed shit instead of just deleting arenas, or replacing an unmanned arena with a terrible joke arena..
It's called competition.
Oh lookey, I has gladiator rank 5! Oh but w8, this guy in front of me has rank 6! Hmmm... nao I will play until get to glad 7! ...oops! I almost forgot.. RA BLOWS BALLS! Maybe if they.. y' know.. made it less shitty? Y' know... if the other three snotty little dirtbags from the ocean of little shits parked in Random Arenas AD#, trolling up the local chatbox [as usual], didn't have the power to [ab]use the /report function with everyone for the slightest little itch while they grieve with runner/tanker builds that stall 'til the very end of the counter/timer anyways. Y' know... maybe if Anet fixed shit instead of just deleting arenas, or replacing an unmanned arena with a terrible joke arena..
Reverend Dr
Take out titles and it won't matter; like I said titles are everything that is wrong with that arena. The best competitive games don't have shitty titles.
CS
Starcraft
Team Fortress
Call of Duty
Street Fighter
etc
Oh I forgot this is a fantasy game so lets put in grind instead of gameplay
CS
Starcraft
Team Fortress
Call of Duty
Street Fighter
etc
Oh I forgot this is a fantasy game so lets put in grind instead of gameplay
Netsu
Well, I don't care that much about the title, it is nice to get some kind reward points but the changes I have in mind are to make the arena more competitive and less 'to goof around', that's what I would like to see, because
1. I like the instant action of RA, the format and the casual atmosphere
2. I don't like unfair matches, I want to win or lose depending on my and my teams' skill
Honestly I'm all for removing titles from PvP, this way we have no more discrimination, and the argument that all the best online games don't have such thing is perfectly sound.
1. I like the instant action of RA, the format and the casual atmosphere
2. I don't like unfair matches, I want to win or lose depending on my and my teams' skill
Honestly I'm all for removing titles from PvP, this way we have no more discrimination, and the argument that all the best online games don't have such thing is perfectly sound.
NoConnection
just make it like that that you wont get 3 monks in your team, ever. 2 to be the maximum, and this ONLY for monks
Regulus X
If the GW1 devs were to cause the players randomly selected in Random Arenas to be balanced, it'd keep it's random nature and just have the upside of viable matches. What's not to like in that? Would ya'll rather knowingly fight through what you know will be a loss because your team has no monks and the opposing team has 1-4 monks that're glad rank 3+? I've seen a team of 3 monks and 1 ranger mercilessly LOL kill my team because my allies were all set to 100% kill/utility and no self-heals.. and had they some self heals, they'd still only stalemate the match anyways [unless their monks just gave up]..
"Balanced" Random Selection would definitely reduce grievers and ragers, and it'd give a fighting chance to both sides. I bet you anything that /report [ab]usages and runners/tankers would become rare because the "balance" system for RA would offer so much more hope and cause less grieve, anguish and despair.
I [along with so many others] rush in to suicide because: a.) WE HAVE NO MONK TO KEEP US ALIVE! and b.) the best damage-dealers in game [melee] always keep having to break through web after web of blind [bsurge], block [/W's entire tactics line], and anti-melee hexes [curse, domination/illusion hexes, and ele's water/air att. lines] to land a single f'ing hit! That's bullshit in my book! Pressing 1-1-1-1-1-1 with BSurge or casting empathy/Faint/etc.. on recharge is utter garbage.
"Balanced" Random Selection would definitely reduce grievers and ragers, and it'd give a fighting chance to both sides. I bet you anything that /report [ab]usages and runners/tankers would become rare because the "balance" system for RA would offer so much more hope and cause less grieve, anguish and despair.
I [along with so many others] rush in to suicide because: a.) WE HAVE NO MONK TO KEEP US ALIVE! and b.) the best damage-dealers in game [melee] always keep having to break through web after web of blind [bsurge], block [/W's entire tactics line], and anti-melee hexes [curse, domination/illusion hexes, and ele's water/air att. lines] to land a single f'ing hit! That's bullshit in my book! Pressing 1-1-1-1-1-1 with BSurge or casting empathy/Faint/etc.. on recharge is utter garbage.
Reverend Dr
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Netsu
Well, I don't care that much about the title, it is nice to get some kind reward points but the changes I have in mind are to make the arena more competitive and less 'to goof around', that's what I would like to see,
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Rhamia Darigaz
the unwarranted hostility of the first few replies made me lol xD
the posters seem to think that the current degree of randomness is less arbitrary than that suggested by the OP, and that anyone who might prefer a different degree of randomness than themselves is worthy of harsh ridicule.
having said that, i too am a fanatical worshiper of the current degree of randomness in Random Arenas and hereby condemn the OP to his well-deserved place in Random Hell.
Amen.
DERP
the posters seem to think that the current degree of randomness is less arbitrary than that suggested by the OP, and that anyone who might prefer a different degree of randomness than themselves is worthy of harsh ridicule.
having said that, i too am a fanatical worshiper of the current degree of randomness in Random Arenas and hereby condemn the OP to his well-deserved place in Random Hell.
Amen.
DERP
Regulus X
No titles, nothing to compete for, RA becomes TA [dead], no1 cares...
..is that what you guys want?
I for one suicide with: vamp + rushing in + miasma + spikes/account-hop/ and ragequit if my team has no monk/too many monks/too many newbs + grievers + runners + tankers. I'm getting so sick of RA that if nothing gets done about it I'm going to wind up not playing, and the game's playerbase is pretty terrible as it is [lemme tell ya].. holy sh...t these truckers come in with the crappiest builds! I swear, I wish builds could be voted into RA just like them PvP henchie's builds were. It'd force players to not play stupid-ass builds [period].
..is that what you guys want?
I for one suicide with: vamp + rushing in + miasma + spikes/account-hop/ and ragequit if my team has no monk/too many monks/too many newbs + grievers + runners + tankers. I'm getting so sick of RA that if nothing gets done about it I'm going to wind up not playing, and the game's playerbase is pretty terrible as it is [lemme tell ya].. holy sh...t these truckers come in with the crappiest builds! I swear, I wish builds could be voted into RA just like them PvP henchie's builds were. It'd force players to not play stupid-ass builds [period].
Zahr Dalsk
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Reverend Dr
The instant action of RA is the only real positive that the arena holds.
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Maker of the fallen
A better suggestion might be like codex.....only one of each prof may be used. (Ex:1 only 1 monk, only 1 war etc.)
Regulus X
Quote:
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Originally Posted by zahr dalsk
this. I'll bet you if they made an ha that was almost identical to current ha (same rewards and end chest, same maps, etc) but used ra's random team formation instead, people would swarm to it and have loads of fun. I'd love something like that. It'd be way better than ha as it stands could ever hope to be.
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