What am I missing here?
I'm the kind of person that likes to figure out what all my skills do, and every situation they can be used in, no matter how crappy, I like doing this because its fun, and because it lets me adapt quickly to nerfs and changes, as I can combine things before many people even realize those two things can go together.
However I cannot for the life of me find a use for Agony.
Its a super low damage spell that kills itself as it goes, and in a fight against a large group of enemies, it will barely get off more then two ticks before it goes down, even if you try keeping it alive with two heroes using Spirit Boon Strike, and constantly Summon Spirits, you still won't be able to get more then three or four ticks from it.
So what purpose does it serve as a skill? What does Agony work well with, what makes it useful, I REALLY want to use Agony, but...eh.
Agony
Default137
-Makai-
Agony's damage is fine. Bump Spawning Power for more survivability.
Mikkelet
Agony in pve sucks, as the -5 pips for a few secs wont do anything, but it's pure gold in RA and other small arenas!
Kosman
As what Tenebrae said, Agony is just fine...
spirit of defeat
agony has a larger range then destruction. If only that it's quite potent.
BrettM
Agony also works nicely if you're using Spirit's Gift. Summon Agony first, let it get off a tick or two, then start summoning the other spirits. Each summon provides a burst of healing to Agony to help keep it going, not to mention the healing to the rest of the team, including minions.
Agony still won't last forever, particularly against large groups, but I find the damage quite worthwhile. It's also nice to lay in front of the other spirits when setting up a spirit trap on a patrol route or approach to a point defense. You know the trap is sprung when all the yellow -10s start floating up, and Agony attracts the aggro while the other spirits start slamming away. The spirits can often hold an approach by themselves for quite a while as the team works on other groups.
Agony still won't last forever, particularly against large groups, but I find the damage quite worthwhile. It's also nice to lay in front of the other spirits when setting up a spirit trap on a patrol route or approach to a point defense. You know the trap is sprung when all the yellow -10s start floating up, and Agony attracts the aggro while the other spirits start slamming away. The spirits can often hold an approach by themselves for quite a while as the team works on other groups.
Default137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tenebrae
Its 10 armor ignoring damage per second to ALL FOES on Range , a spirit that can be healed with summon spirits and spirit boon strike wich has about 350 hp ( SP @ 12 ) . If you dont see anything good here , you should delete your ritualist , seriously.
Even funnier with Ritual Lord or Soul Twisting or precasting it around 10 sec before the battle. You can say the skill is not the omfgwtfpwn everything but hell , is not bad ..... not bad at all. It also takes ten damage for each enemy in range every second, which kind of negates its potential by a ton.
Maybe I'm missing something here, but if I was going to use Agony, I'd take it out when I was facing more then one enemy, because thats what its supposed to be good at, right? Problem is, if I throw it out when facing, oh lets say 5 enemies, it takes 50 damage per tic, which means even at full Spawning Power ( it only has 300 health at max ), I will get uh, 6 tics.
So in the most optimal situation I can think of for it, it can do 60 damage to everything before dying, which is about the same as 2 hits from Bloodsong, which is nothing in terms of damage. And thats its MOST optimal situation, most groups are 8+, meaning it will actually be taking 80-100 damage per tic itself if you actually try to use it with what its supposed to be taken for, and will barely get off more then 3-4 tics.
I just tested it outside Rata Sum against Raptors, it died after 3 tics, even with me spamming Summon Spirits everytime it came up, as well as slotting Spirit Boon Strike on me, Razah, and Xandra, that does not strike me as useful in any way shape or form, as it means it only managed to put out 30 damage before finally dying itself. No offense, but I should not have to build my entire skillbar around keeping one mediocre damage Spirit alive, and even if I try doing that, it barely does more then 50 damage to everything before going down itself.
I could see if was more of a bomb type Spirit, or could actually be somewhat maintained, but it can't, it has one goal, and that is to die quickly and put out next to nothing in terms of DPS, it can't even be used to bring things down to 90% for various offensive skills based on health percentage, because Ancestors Rage can handle that ten times better, as it is cheaper AND has a faster recharge, as well as doing more AoE damage.
However Mikkelet was somewhat right, it does have a minor place in Arenas, due to the extra damage it puts on Monks, the fact most players have far less HP then mobs, and the smaller enemy group size, however its still a hard fit, and could really use a few changes to make it more viable, as it just doesn't seem that amazing even for that situation.
spirit of defeat
Quote:
Originally Posted by Default137
Maybe I'm missing something here, but if I was going to use Agony, I'd take it out when I was facing more then one enemy, because thats what its supposed to be good at, right? Problem is, if I throw it out when facing, oh lets say 5 enemies, it takes 50 damage per tic, which means even at full Spawning Power ( it only has 300 health at max ), I will get uh, 6 tics.
So in the most optimal situation I can think of for it, it can do 60 damage to everything before dying, which is about the same as 2 hits from Bloodsong, which is nothing in terms of damage. And thats its MOST optimal situation, most groups are 8+, meaning it will actually be taking 80-100 damage per tic itself if you actually try to use it with what its supposed to be taken for, and will barely get off more then 3-4 tics.
I just tested it outside Rata Sum against Raptors, it died after 3 tics, even with me spamming Summon Spirits everytime it came up, as well as slotting Spirit Boon Strike on me, Razah, and Xandra, that does not strike me as useful in any way shape or form, as it means it only managed to put out 30 damage before finally dying itself. No offense, but I should not have to build my entire skillbar around keeping one mediocre damage Spirit alive, and even if I try doing that, it barely does more then 50 damage to everything before going down itself.
I could see if was more of a bomb type Spirit, or could actually be somewhat maintained, but it can't, it has one goal, and that is to die quickly and put out next to nothing in terms of DPS, it can't even be used to bring things down to 90% for various offensive skills based on health percentage, because Ancestors Rage can handle that ten times better, as it is cheaper AND has a faster recharge, as well as doing more AoE damage.
However Mikkelet was somewhat right, it does have a minor place in Arenas, due to the extra damage it puts on Monks, the fact most players have far less HP then mobs, and the smaller enemy group size, however its still a hard fit, and could really use a few changes to make it more viable, as it just doesn't seem that amazing even for that situation. Nobody said it was perfect, I'd rather take agony then destruction if only because of it's range. And nobody is gonna take it as the primary damage, it's support and it's still 300 damage.
I fit it into my bar is I have room left, not building around it...
FoxBat
As above. Since when did degen become good in PvE? We might as well argue that ether nightmare is playable.
MaaKotka
You could consider it as a spell that deals 300ish damage for 10 energy, which isn't that bad, but it isn't anything spectacular either. 30s recharge pretty much kills this skill.
Tenebrae
Quote:
Originally Posted by Default137
Quote: Originally Posted by Default137
Problem is, if I throw it out when facing, oh lets say 5 enemies, it takes 50 damage per tic, which means even at full Spawning Power ( it only has 300 health at max ), I will get uh, 6 tics.
I dont know where did you get that but thats not true, SP 12 Chan 15 = 355hp. With Rit lord at those lvls spirit has 414 HP and recharges in 15 secs. 414+ armor ignoring damage ( yes PLUS because you can heal that spirit with ease ) every 5 secs or less ( with precasting ) .... dude , is not bad at all.Quote: Originally Posted by Default137
So in the most optimal situation I can think of for it, it can do 60 damage to everything before dying, which is about the same as 2 hits from Bloodsong, which is nothing in terms of damage. And thats its MOST optimal situation, most groups are 8+, meaning it will actually be taking 80-100 damage per tic itself if you actually try to use it with what its supposed to be taken for, and will barely get off more then 3-4 tics.
2 Hits from Bloodsong to EVERY foe in the area , bloodsong does that in about 7x or more time than Agony. Also comparing any offensive spirit with the one that has the best , armor ignoring , life stealing damage and survavility is useless .... as you will be taking it too if Chan 15.Quote: Originally Posted by Default137
I just tested it outside Rata Sum against Raptors,
Stop right there . First :Bad option , thats not a regular zone where you can do a test.
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