Just a little survey I'm gathering, but do you think Snares are underrated in PvE?
While a good bang to the head is enough to kill most enemies, it seems like a Snare shines in hard mode areas where warriors that score 300 damage run amongst, such as Aatxes in UW since it completely disables them from hurting your ranged attackers.
Furthermore, Snares bunch up enemies, there for making them more susceptible to AoEs.
Anyways, I just want to hear your opinion for this survey. Are Snares underrated in PvE?
Are Snares underrated in PvE?
Lishy
Life Bringing
Snares are only good to use in tank and spank teams where the ball has to stay together or you're screwed, and even then it's limited to Deep Freeze and the occasional meteor shower. Snaring in general pve is a complete waste when aegis, weakness, etc do the same job but better.
FoxBat
There's also a very small handful of healer types that kite like all hell (kournan priest, I'm looking at you) but again, that's only certain specific areas.
awry
why have one henchmen focused on snaring when you can bring "you move like a dwarf" and insta snare
zwei2stein
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Lishy
Just a little survey I'm gathering, but do you think Snares are underrated in PvE?
While a good bang to the head is enough to kill most enemies, it seems like a Snare shines in hard mode areas where warriors that score 300 damage run amongst, such as Aatxes in UW since it completely disables them from hurting your ranged attackers. Furthermore, Snares bunch up enemies, there for making them more susceptible to AoEs. |
Ranged attackers will work just fine and it is much more sensible to bring weakness/prots. Weakness works even against caster to degree (50 damage wanding is not something you want to ignore.) and prots work againts even more damage.
I have to also note that HM enemies have 33% increased movement speed bonus so snare effectiveness is fairly low.
If you want to disable foes, knockdown is much better.
Marth Reynolds
Alot of people seem to think it won't matter.
And in theory if your defense is good enough it won't matter, however it can't really hurt and can really save your life if you take one.
and best snare for pve = summon ice imp, he casts several snares
And in theory if your defense is good enough it won't matter, however it can't really hurt and can really save your life if you take one.
and best snare for pve = summon ice imp, he casts several snares
capashen
snares are useless if ur team dont kite
Regulus X
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Originally Posted by capashen
snares are useless if ur team dont kite
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upier
Gill Halendt
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Lishy
Just a little survey I'm gathering, but do you think Snares are underrated in PvE?
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Useful? Of course!
Necessary? Not at all.
Personally, I'd take a Water Ele with me over a Fire Ele any day, but I can also do without snares (and Elementalists) completely.
EDIT - Oh, just noticed this:
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Originally Posted by upier
Death is the ultimate snare.
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Amy Awien
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Originally Posted by Lishy
Anyways, I just want to hear your opinion for this survey. Are Snares underrated in PvE?
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4thVariety
There are some bonus goal situations, where preventing enemies from going from A to B is necessary. Therefore you use a snare on missiions such as Moddock Crevice. But for most part PvE structure consists of the imperative to kill everything you encounter while being able to absorb the damage thrown at you. Such a structure does not require snares.
Reflect
If you kill enemies faster, than you can snare them, which in GW is fact, snaring is prety useless.
Marty Silverblade
Defensively, I don't think they're of too much use. There's simply too much other defence such as SY and protspam from ER's to justify snaring as a primary defensive technique.
Offensively, they're not of too much use either. YMLAD is there if you need a one off snare for tricky targets (Kournan Priests ftl), and Tryptophan Signet is there if you need an AoE snare. For the most part, I don't see the point in putting any attribute points to snaring.
However, if snares help you ball everything for HB/MoP, then they can be useful, but that's only as a balling technique, not so much for the snare itself.
Offensively, they're not of too much use either. YMLAD is there if you need a one off snare for tricky targets (Kournan Priests ftl), and Tryptophan Signet is there if you need an AoE snare. For the most part, I don't see the point in putting any attribute points to snaring.
However, if snares help you ball everything for HB/MoP, then they can be useful, but that's only as a balling technique, not so much for the snare itself.
Gift3d
not at all. there are much better, much more gimmicky options. aside from that one nightfall mission, i'd say they're preeeeetty worthless in pve.
just like mesmers, it's something that is only great in pvp.
just like mesmers, it's something that is only great in pvp.
Iron Smerf
I agree. By killing the monster, it truely will be the ultimate snare. Yes I do agree they are underated a little bit, but much? No.
Shayne Hawke
I've never found group snares to be useful for PvE, save maybe Moddok Crevice. Single-target snares, however, like Pin Down or "YMLaD!", have been helpful on occasion when trying to tackle a single target. The amount of times that you're actually going to fight just one foe is not very often though, so it's not great overall.
This does not mean that snares should be buffed for PvE. Snares are great for what they do. It's just that what they do isn't needed in PvE.
This does not mean that snares should be buffed for PvE. Snares are great for what they do. It's just that what they do isn't needed in PvE.
Elephantaliste
as said above
- either deep freeze for specific areas, but slowing ennemies is generally just pointless bcse of inherent ims and if you spend whole time to kite, you kinda shutdown urself, and contrary to pvp, it is not a moment you regen energy, you do that between battles.
- either KD, and it is not underrated, lots of players bring kd to shutdown foes, and not only melee.
conclusion in general pve :
- against melee -> blocking (bcse it is usefull against ranged attacks aswell), kd (YMLAD!/UG/ES), blind (gogo eruption), spirit/minions tanking, tanking/bodyblocking against walls/corners
- aoe snare/kd for dot spikes
- against high damage -> prot spirit
for lol-way like summon ways, bring Ice Imp.
In areas with lots of touchers like Moss Scarab or dangerous popers like Thorn Wolves you probably want to bring snares.
If they were touchers only in game, you would probably see much more snare sources in team builds.
Generally (apart kd) snares are not needed, it doesn't mean it is underrated, it means you can choose to bring other damage or utilities skills.
If you like snares in general pve, bring one to support aoe skills, otherwise stick with YMLAD!. For Aatxes in UW you are talking about -> YMLAD! for kd and cripple.
- either deep freeze for specific areas, but slowing ennemies is generally just pointless bcse of inherent ims and if you spend whole time to kite, you kinda shutdown urself, and contrary to pvp, it is not a moment you regen energy, you do that between battles.
- either KD, and it is not underrated, lots of players bring kd to shutdown foes, and not only melee.
conclusion in general pve :
- against melee -> blocking (bcse it is usefull against ranged attacks aswell), kd (YMLAD!/UG/ES), blind (gogo eruption), spirit/minions tanking, tanking/bodyblocking against walls/corners
- aoe snare/kd for dot spikes
- against high damage -> prot spirit
for lol-way like summon ways, bring Ice Imp.
In areas with lots of touchers like Moss Scarab or dangerous popers like Thorn Wolves you probably want to bring snares.
If they were touchers only in game, you would probably see much more snare sources in team builds.
Generally (apart kd) snares are not needed, it doesn't mean it is underrated, it means you can choose to bring other damage or utilities skills.
If you like snares in general pve, bring one to support aoe skills, otherwise stick with YMLAD!. For Aatxes in UW you are talking about -> YMLAD! for kd and cripple.
Eragon Zarroc
for the most part, yeah. primarily used in the hardest areas where some tactical skill is actually required ;-)
Martin Alvito
If you're in an elite area or dungeon with 8/12 real people and you aggro properly, your team's damage should drop all of the monsters before the snare is needed.
If you're not in an elite area, your H/H or group should have more than enough defense and offense to be able to stay alive long enough to kill things. That will be true whether you snare melee or not. KD-lock on healers can speed up the process, and a snare like Deep Freeze can be helpful if your H/H revolves around AoE damage.
Long story short, snares are good if you're playing with bad people that don't optimize. If you need them in your H/H and you're not running AoE or doing something odd like Moddok, you should work on being less bad. If your team needs them, and you value your time, then you should fix your teammates' bars or find another group of players that are less bad.
If you're not in an elite area, your H/H or group should have more than enough defense and offense to be able to stay alive long enough to kill things. That will be true whether you snare melee or not. KD-lock on healers can speed up the process, and a snare like Deep Freeze can be helpful if your H/H revolves around AoE damage.
Long story short, snares are good if you're playing with bad people that don't optimize. If you need them in your H/H and you're not running AoE or doing something odd like Moddok, you should work on being less bad. If your team needs them, and you value your time, then you should fix your teammates' bars or find another group of players that are less bad.
Winterclaw
I would think that the times where a snare would help are greatly outnumbered by the times you would be benefited by a purely offensive or defensive skill.
Vulturion
I'd have to vote "not useful".
Scenery plus a Warrior (/any tank build) provides an extremely reliable, uncounterable, no cost defense in the majority of situations.
In an open pitched PvE battle, I'd rather have a sea of minions & spirits to draw all of the enemies' attention while simultaneously killing them.
If both those options were somehow removed, playing 95% of my PvE as a Curses Necromancer I'd rather just put Weakness on melee monsters and watch them destroy themselves with Insidious Parasite, Spiteful Spirit and/or Pain Inverter.
Scenery plus a Warrior (/any tank build) provides an extremely reliable, uncounterable, no cost defense in the majority of situations.
In an open pitched PvE battle, I'd rather have a sea of minions & spirits to draw all of the enemies' attention while simultaneously killing them.
If both those options were somehow removed, playing 95% of my PvE as a Curses Necromancer I'd rather just put Weakness on melee monsters and watch them destroy themselves with Insidious Parasite, Spiteful Spirit and/or Pain Inverter.
lehua768
I've never found group snares to be useful for PvE, save maybe Moddok Crevice. Single-target snares, however, like Pin Down or "YMLaD!", have been helpful on occasion when trying to tackle a single target. The amount of times that you're actually going to fight just one foe is not very often though, so it's not great overall.
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Bryant Again
Snares aren't underrated at all. It's just that the way PvE scales and the general stupidity of the enemy doesn't really make them required. Those two things put together require you to have to output as much damage as possible.
Sigh, PvE.
Sigh, PvE.
Chthon
OP has a point that snares do provide some increased leverage on your AoE damage and some damage mitigation against melee foes at least. The problem is that most snares don't provide enough benefit in these categories to be worth the skillslot, energy, or cast time. Why use Pin Down when you could use Enfeebling Blood? The strongest snare in PvE is probably Fevered Dreams+YMLAD, and even that I'll only use because Fevered Dreams is good for a number of other things too.
robmdq
Uhm, i don't know if are they really underrated, but one thing i am sure: they are fun to play with and not fun to deal with.
JDRyder
Imo their only useful with a good team that play well together, and you're all using builds that work well together (eg a melee way in HM). That being said, such teams are rare or next to non-existent in pve because unlike GvG, you don't have a "core team" in Pve, and (in most guilds I've been in anyway) you're WAYYYY, way way wayyy more likely to end up doing Byob because its Pve.
Could they be useful, sure. Are they needed, 99% of the time no. This of course coming from someone who is known for having a Gvg mindset all the time lol... meaning they're probably not even useful in other players mindsets
Could they be useful, sure. Are they needed, 99% of the time no. This of course coming from someone who is known for having a Gvg mindset all the time lol... meaning they're probably not even useful in other players mindsets
dancing gnome
I don't think snares are underrated. I think, like any skill, if you look at a random players bar you often won't see some of the considered PvE staples like Protective Spirit, that's just how people play.
Snares have been used in end game PvE for a very long time. Warriors used Grasping Earth, Meteor Shower is a pseudo snare and a few builds run Deep Freeze.
Snares are even found on the PvX general builds section. I remember not long ago the PvX wiki variant of Savannah Heat had Deep Freeze on its bar and the current PvX wiki Earth Ele build runs Ward Against Foes. Anyone who has had their backline slaughtered by melee in PvE should bring this build to see how amazing it is.
On top of that, Devonna can be found in every campaign and with all the buffs to hammer knockdowns she is an incredible NPC with plenty of snares.
Snares have been used in end game PvE for a very long time. Warriors used Grasping Earth, Meteor Shower is a pseudo snare and a few builds run Deep Freeze.
Snares are even found on the PvX general builds section. I remember not long ago the PvX wiki variant of Savannah Heat had Deep Freeze on its bar and the current PvX wiki Earth Ele build runs Ward Against Foes. Anyone who has had their backline slaughtered by melee in PvE should bring this build to see how amazing it is.
On top of that, Devonna can be found in every campaign and with all the buffs to hammer knockdowns she is an incredible NPC with plenty of snares.
Morphy
If you want to do stuff and want to do it fast, there are better things. Deep Freeze is the only snare worth taking because it has gazillion range and requires no spec and that's only in tanking teams.
Yelling @ Cats
Knockdowns =/= Snares
Knockdowns do have a snaring mechanic, but acting like snaring is useful in PvE because people use knockdowns is like saying energy draining is useful in PvE because people use Ether Nightmare.
Knockdowns do have a snaring mechanic, but acting like snaring is useful in PvE because people use knockdowns is like saying energy draining is useful in PvE because people use Ether Nightmare.
Skyy High
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Originally Posted by Yelling @ Cats
Knockdowns =/= Snares
Knockdowns do have a snaring mechanic, but acting like snaring is useful in PvE because people use knockdowns is like saying energy draining is useful in PvE because people use Ether Nightmare. |
Rikimaru
I love the game, but the AI is godawful trash, and you typically don't have to worry about things like snares. 90% of the time the enemy will just bend over and take it.
It's really not a secret either, it's the reason they cheesed the PvE fights by giving monsters things like semi-infinite energy.
It's really not a secret either, it's the reason they cheesed the PvE fights by giving monsters things like semi-infinite energy.
robmdq
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Originally Posted by Rikimaru
I love the game, but the AI is godawful trash, and you typically don't have to worry about things like snares. 90% of the time the enemy will just bend over and take it.
It's really not a secret either, it's the reason they cheesed the PvE fights by giving monsters things like semi-infinite energy. |
For me, snare was always more focused into crippling than to knock down, oints of view i guess.
Amy Awien
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Originally Posted by Martin Alvito
... you should work on being less bad.
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Reverend Dr
perma KD's are pretty good snares
Chthon
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Originally Posted by robmdq
SEMI-infinite!? I still have to see one single mob running out of energy, specially Monk mobs.
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HawkofStorms
AoE blind/weakness beats snares. Easier to apply and maintain.
It's not that snares aren't useful. It's that there are so many more efficient ways to reduce damage in PvE instead.
It's not that snares aren't useful. It's that there are so many more efficient ways to reduce damage in PvE instead.
Neo Atomisk
The only time I ever see snares used in PvE is the moddok crevice mission (the corsair runners), and DoA Caster Spike teams. I personally think that minions to a good enough job of clogging up and body blocking enemy melees.