Not funny, lvl20 instead of lvl16 White Mantle in Kryta - Guild Wars Guru archive powered by Guild Wars Legacy

dagrdagaz

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2010

NL

E/N

22 Jun 2010 at 18:09 - 1

I don't care much about all this WiK stuff yet.

I wanted to explore all of Twin Serpent Lakes for Cartho title, NM.
And apparantly all or most lvl16 White Mantle r replaced with lvl20's

At the same time i have to make due with a party size of 6 and crappy lvl15 Henchman.
(I see little improvement in starting from ToA with 4 crappy lvl15 Henchman, against those lvl20 White Mantle)
I tried only with only lvl20 me and 3 lvl20 Heroes, AND i party wiped !
Excuse me, I party wiped at lvl20 in Kryta doing non WiK stuff ?!!!!!

I know there have been threads and complaints and suggestions about doing WiK stuff with party size of 6 or 8 and crappy lvl15 Hencman.
My complaint is now about game disadvantage doing non WiK stuff in Kryta.

The suggestion.
lvl 20 Henchman, larger party size.
But i prefer some kind of option to disable/enable this WiK stuff entirely.

Or, do NOT replace lvl16 White Mantle with lvl20 White Mantle by default in expl areas, but ONLY when u have WiK quests active.

Ghost Dog

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2008

W/

22 Jun 2010 at 19:10 - 2

They are not hard to kill.

Bob Slydell

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jan 2007

22 Jun 2010 at 19:14 - 3

I haven't played in a while, but I can see how this can be really annoying and frustrating, I agree they should disable WiK if you don't have the quests or want nothing to do with it.

Nubarus

Academy Page

Join Date: Mar 2007

PxKs

22 Jun 2010 at 19:16 - 4

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghost Dog

They are not hard to kill.

I agree, even in HM they are not that hard to kill, I actually enjoy having them around, otherwise Kryta is rather boring.

Benderama

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jul 2008

UK

[Rage]

Rt/

22 Jun 2010 at 20:43 - 5

Quote:

I tried only with only lvl20 me and 3 lvl20 Heroes, AND i party wiped !
Excuse me, I party wiped at lvl20 in Kryta doing non WiK stuff ?!!!!!

you are doing WiK content by entering a zone in kryta and meeting the requirements for WiK. seriousely the monster AI isn't that good, and if you hav 3 lvl 20 heroes and you doing it against small groups of NM AI it shouldn't be too hard. not to be mean or anything but try another strategy if you wiped (or possibly it was just one enemy using splinter weapon/enemy ele?) one enemy doesn't represent all enemies. ;D

not sure on this but i think there are still some random normal mantle mobs roaming around in some areas (might not be right). know the WiK stuff can be annoying but it really isn't that bad.

Uriel_Wolfblood

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Oct 2009

The House of Wolfblood

R/

22 Jun 2010 at 20:52 - 6

If you are using 3 heroes and wiping then there is something wrong on your end not Anet's. Heroes are like you, and need to be spoiled as such. They will only perform as well as their build/equipment allows them to. Look up some hero/team builds on pvx and have some fun. Nothing in the game is SO hard that it needs to be "fixed"

Lord Dagon

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jul 2009

Inside the Oblivion Gate

The Imperial Guards of Istan[TIGE]

E/Me

22 Jun 2010 at 21:17 - 7

eh i do agree that they need to get rid of thi stuff for people that arent interested. maybe add.. oh idk.. QUESTS. that would help this out alot. i agree w/ the others tho that they arent hard to kill.. i just think they need queststo trigger to decide wether or not i feel like fighting them.

Smith23

Guest

Join Date: May 2010

E/

22 Jun 2010 at 21:33 - 8

The one thing that really gets on my nerves about the WiK are the new White Mantle enemies. Like others have said they aren't hard to kill but it's really annoying how more than just one in a party has some kind of hard resurrect skill. I have fought groups where there could be 5 or more enemies that have that kind of skill. It's really frustrating when you think your about to win to find out all the enemies have been brought back

MrGuildBoi

Desert Nomad

Join Date: May 2006

A/

22 Jun 2010 at 21:34 - 9

uhm they are level 20 if you finished prophecies/eotn. im pretty sure by the time you finished either one, you should be able to handle a group of level 20's.... just pull and be careful

Amy Awien

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2006

R/

22 Jun 2010 at 22:02 - 10

Can imagine that while carto-mapping yo can do without the extra challenge. As a practical suggestion, you could try doing it In hard mode and starting from ToA, you'd have a party of 8 and the henchmen would be level 20 as well, with better skills bars then they have at level 15.

dasmitchies

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Nov 2007

Sacred Forge Knights

W/P

22 Jun 2010 at 23:31 - 11

Umm the larger point please? The issue is the game isnt balanced as well as it was before. Such is the challenge when adding new content to old maps. Have you also noticed they introduced other campaign skills, second classes, and almost exclusively used the skills they buffed in the last few updates? To the OP, don't expect Anet to do any hard thinking on Wik. This is just filler to keep whatever players are hangin' on till GW2.

dagrdagaz

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2010

NL

E/N

22 Jun 2010 at 23:48 - 12

I dont have Prophecies HM yet.
Never liked the Prophecies story much.
I finished EotN.

Prolly it might go better if i look into better strategies....sure.
But i shoudnt have to.
Kryta, imo, never should be a lvl20+ area difficulty wise, in NM.

Wich brings me to another suggestion, disable this WiK cr*p....uhm...."unwanted extra challenge" for NM.
If HM junkies like it so much, let them do it in HM.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dasmitchies

To the OP, don't expect Anet to do any hard thinking on Wik.

Yes, thats painfully obvious apparently.

Puebert

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Oct 2005

Mo/

23 Jun 2010 at 00:20 - 13

I know what you're going through. Yesterday, I did Aurora Glade and was unable to finish it. Yes, that's right the ever dreaded Root Behemoth was in my way. Now, he may not be level 20 like all the white mantle, but he was a bulky level 19. Since I was H/Hing, I had myself (HB monk with Banish), 3 heroes (all HB monks with Banish for damage), Alesia, and Stefan.

Unfortunately, because NM PvE is so hard, Stefan died in the first few mobs and we ended up using all our res sigs on him, so when I reached this behemoth, we had no damage.

But being as good at GW as I am, I knew I'd be able to rise to the occasion! I set up hotkeys for all my heroes' Banish skill slot so I would be able to take a page out of HA and use Banish Spike. After the first spike, I was sure we had him. But then to my horror, at the last second, not one but two Life Pods appeared and healed that bastard right up.

Shortly afterwards, my heroes and I drained all our energy on spamming Infuse Life on each other trying to out-heal the behemoth's Wild Blow and the pods' Holy Wrath. Eventually, I was unable to keep my party alive and we met a gruesome end.

Oh, and /notsigned.

majoho

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2006

Denmark

23 Jun 2010 at 00:22 - 14

If you finished EotN you should be able to deal with level 20 mantles as well.

Grape Bird

Academy Page

Join Date: Jan 2010

E/

23 Jun 2010 at 00:52 - 15

puebert, umad? @_@

yeah, but /notsigned. By taking the measure to undergo the WiK event (ex. watching all the dialogues, etc) , then you should be aware of what you're instigating. If you don't want the WiK npc's, then you shouldn't have had that character do all the prerequisites.

Steps_Descending

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2007

IN my pocket plane. Obviously!

Little Tom's Pocket Plane [THom]

Me/Mo

23 Jun 2010 at 02:08 - 16

Quote:

Originally Posted by dagrdagaz

Prolly it might go better if i look into better strategies....sure.
But i shoudnt have to.
Kryta, imo, never should be a lvl20+ area difficulty wise, in NM.

Wich brings me to another suggestion, disable this WiK cr*p....uhm...."unwanted extra challenge" for NM.
If HM junkies like it so much, let them do it in HM.

Making it HM-only would be more restrictive, but maybe better concidering henchies level. There might be some value in that suggestion.

About kryta, as it is not in the mandatory parts of the game (that means the missions, you don't see much of kryta beyond this), I say go for the elegant solution and keep it static. Put another way : you don't need to be in WiK areas unless you have the level/experience to face them. Deep-Kryta became a high level area!
Am I the only one wo get a "parrallel dimension" feeling with the way a single part of the game can work in 2 or 3 different ways?

/notsigned

dagrdagaz

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2010

NL

E/N

23 Jun 2010 at 13:17 - 17

Quote:

Originally Posted by majoho

If you finished EotN you should be able to deal with level 20 mantles as well.

In EotN i have lvl20 Henchman with an Elite.
And always a party size of 8

@Ghost Dog, good for u!
But for those who havent played HM at all, these lvl20 White Mantle in NM r a pain.

And this is Anets fault for replacing easy lvl16 WM with annoying lvl20 WM in NM Kryta and not giving us anything, or to little, to compensate.

Just my luck Twin Serpent Lakes is crawling with these lvl20 White Mantle
Well, i apparently must suck cos i keep party wiping.

[sarcasm]Yeah right.[/sarcasm]

ok, i am done ranting/complaining.

Burning Freebies

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jan 2008

The wonderful land of gift giving

[FoW]

E/Mo

23 Jun 2010 at 22:09 - 18

I didn't find this too much of a problem, until I got to Hard Mode. I started taking up some of the bounty quests, then realised I could vanquish the place pretty easily. The only problem-a White Mantle boss. But wait-he was a monk, with another monk in his mob, and a few peacekeepers. I also find the Jade Cloaks (the jade eles) too hard to get on my own with a discordway build (makes sense a bit, as the other jade aren't exploitable). I do feel the War in Kryta is taking a bit too long-I really want to get back into exploring areas and beginning to vanquish areas of kryta, but i can't with these stronger mantle (level 26 in HM) and peacekeepers (lvl 26-30 in HM). So, im with you here.

dagrdagaz

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2010

NL

E/N

24 Jun 2010 at 11:34 - 19

I do have to add that the (smaller) WM/Peacekeeper mobs i encountered in NM North Kryta Province and Black Curtain were not a problem.

The WM/Peacekeeper mobs in NM Twin Serpent Lakes r atm to much for me.
But then, that part of Kryta is supposed to be more difficult.

Bassplayer15

Pre-Searing Cadet

Join Date: Jun 2010

Homeslice Crew

W/

24 Jun 2010 at 12:33 - 20

Quote:

Originally Posted by dagrdagaz

And this is Anets fault for replacing easy lvl16 WM with annoying lvl20 WM in NM Kryta and not giving us anything, or to little, to compensate.

I'm confused on how this is Anets fault, you did the WiK quests knowing that things were going to be changed. If you wanted to have easy lvl 16s to fight, well then you shouldn't have done the quests for WiK.

Covah

Forge Runner

Join Date: Aug 2006

Ontario, Canada

Catching Jellyfish With [소N트T ]

Me/Rt

24 Jun 2010 at 14:01 - 21

I would say map while you vanquish but you havent finished tyria because you "don't like the story". Why map if you are not going to get vanquisher or guardian?

Steps_Descending

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2007

IN my pocket plane. Obviously!

Little Tom's Pocket Plane [THom]

Me/Mo

24 Jun 2010 at 14:47 - 22

Op has a point though, if kryta is considered end-game content. Having HM or lv20 henchmen would make sense. The only areas where H/H are hindered are actual elite areas, I don't think kryta fits as such.

Btw OP, you said you wiped doing non WiK content. Doesn't that mean you wiped against non-WM mobs? If that's so, your problem may be deeper.

dagrdagaz

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2010

NL

E/N

24 Jun 2010 at 14:53 - 23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bassplayer15

I'm confused on how this is Anets fault, you did the WiK quests knowing that things were going to be changed. If you wanted to have easy lvl 16s to fight, well then you shouldn't have done the quests for WiK.

Not really, i didnt pay much attention to it.
I did the EotN WiK thingy cos i was there anyway, trying to do as much as possible EotN stuff.
The Shining Blade Camp dialogues i did cos i was there anyway when cartho'ing Talmark.

I am not interested in Vanquishing, in HM, I am prolly never gonna be interested in HM.

Now i wanted to catch up on cartho'ing to where i am story wise in Prophecies, wich is Ember Light Camp.
And then do all that can be done in NM, and then finally do finish Prophecies, in NM.

Now i am trying to get Protector and Cartho title.

btw, i still need to ask an ingame friend if having only finished Prophecies or EotN is already enough for these lvl20 WM to spawn.
If so, then there is even less choice avoiding this WiK stuff, if u wanted to.

@Stop Descending, i only wiped against lvl20 WM in Twin Serpent Lakes, when cartho'ing.
Not having any WiK quests active atm.
I started from Riverside outpost.
I can try again from ToA with 4 crappy lvl15 Henchman, when i am in the mood to also travel the larger distance to TSL

Amy Awien

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2006

R/

24 Jun 2010 at 16:01 - 24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bassplayer15

I'm confused on how this is Anets fault, you did the WiK quests knowing that things were going to be changed. If you wanted to have easy lvl 16s to fight, well then you shouldn't have done the quests for WiK.

You don't have a choice, once you've finished Prophecies or Eye of the North you will step right into the WiK whenever you leave town - in Kryta.

I haven't done much WiK, just a couple of vanquishes but I am going to give a few tips/thought anyway:

Level 12 henchment fighting level 24 foes are a burden rather then an asset, they're not even usefull as canonfodder, or minion material because they'll eat your healer's energy in no time (even if it's an ER guy).
=> If you are going out in normal mode, leave the henchmen at home.

In hardmode the henchmen gain more levels and their skillbars are much better then in Normal Mode, making them more usefull. Therfore, if you can, go out in Hardmode.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dagrdagaz

I can try again from ToA with 4 crappy lvl15 Henchman, when i am in the mood to also travel the larger distance to TSL

Finish Prophecies first, do carto in hardmode, a party of 8 is able to handle the WiK stuff - and probably with relative ease.

Skyy High

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: May 2006

R/

24 Jun 2010 at 17:48 - 25

We need a sticky: "If you're dying in Kryta, click here," to just collect all these threads in one place.

Quote:

Just my luck Twin Serpent Lakes is crawling with these lvl20 White Mantle
Well, i apparently must suck cos i keep party wiping.

[sarcasm]Yeah right.[/sarcasm]

Yes. Yes, you do. Cut the sarcasm and take some of the advice that you're being given. Everyone has access to the same heroes, everyone is at the same level. The only things different between you and those who are having no trouble with this content are your builds and your skill.

I'm sorry you were looking forward to being able to sleepwalk through content, but...too bad. 4 lvl20s and 2 lvl15s should be more than sufficient to handle mobs of up to 5 lvl20 WM. It is for pretty much everyone here, so what does that say about you?

dagrdagaz

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2010

NL

E/N

24 Jun 2010 at 17:55 - 26

Well, yes i was hoping to sleepwalk through cartho'ing Twin Serpent Lakes, in NM.

Interesting though, 2 changes in strategy seem to work!
Starting from Riverside, taking lvl15 Alesia and Little Thom works better then not taking them. Alesia still dies alot, but its better with them.
And, the 8-10 lvl20 WM mobs i wiped against appear to be 2 mobs of 4-5 together.
So, pulling them apart and fighting them seperately then works.
I also kill the Monk first, that may help to.

Bassplayer15

Pre-Searing Cadet

Join Date: Jun 2010

Homeslice Crew

W/

25 Jun 2010 at 00:13 - 27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amy Awien

You don't have a choice, once you've finished Prophecies or Eye of the North you will step right into the WiK whenever you leave town - in Kryta.

I apologize, i was incorrect.

Terrible Surgeon

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Oct 2009

hopper

A/

25 Jun 2010 at 08:56 - 28

"Make the game easier so I can get a title with less effort," is all I am getting from your complaint. Please understand that the game is boring for a lt of people after 5 years of playing it and new challenging content is needed. As far as being able to toggle WIK on and off so you have a choice to experience it or not, I'm not in favor of that . That is like suggesting you want to see the armor dude in FOW but don't want to clear FoW missions or fight baddies on the way to the armor guy. If you want something, learn to fight for it and earn it.

Morphy

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Nov 2009

The Netherlands

Not going to keep up with that anymore

R/

25 Jun 2010 at 09:53 - 29

If you lose in PvE, urdoinitrong.

dagrdagaz

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2010

NL

E/N

25 Jun 2010 at 10:37 - 30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terrible Surgeon

"Make the game easier so I can get a title with less effort," is all I am getting from your complaint.

Then u got it wrong.
I was ranting about Twin Serpent Lakes being more difficult due to WiK.
And in the end i managed, yes, cartho'ing TSL.

Skyy High

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: May 2006

R/

25 Jun 2010 at 18:51 - 31

Quote:

Originally Posted by dagrdagaz

And, the 8-10 lvl20 WM mobs i wiped against appear to be 2 mobs of 4-5 together.
So, pulling them apart and fighting them seperately then works.

Gee, really?

Burning Freebies

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jan 2008

The wonderful land of gift giving

[FoW]

E/Mo

25 Jun 2010 at 21:58 - 32

Quote:

Originally Posted by dagrdagaz

Well, yes i was hoping to sleepwalk through cartho'ing Twin Serpent Lakes, in NM.

Interesting though, 2 changes in strategy seem to work!
Starting from Riverside, taking lvl15 Alesia and Little Thom works better then not taking them. Alesia still dies alot, but its better with them.
And, the 8-10 lvl20 WM mobs i wiped against appear to be 2 mobs of 4-5 together.
So, pulling them apart and fighting them seperately then works.
I also kill the Monk first, that may help to.

Yes, that's definetely the most annoying thing about the Mantle mobs-they merge a lot, and they often stay into your party's aggro range in the middle of a tough fight-I know I have experienced that a lot. I think the res on most party members makes it worse-but luckily they are res signet of death pact signet, so its easier to kill the party. I have also found that the best order to kill the party in is Monk first, followed by Ritualists, then mesmers, then elementalists, followed by anyone you can. This is because the ritualists are not too bad at healing as well, and mesmers carry a monk res skill. The eles also use AoE skills, which can be a nuisance.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terrible Surgeon

"Make the game easier so I can get a title with less effort," is all I am getting from your complaint. Please understand that the game is boring for a lt of people after 5 years of playing it and new challenging content is needed. As far as being able to toggle WIK on and off so you have a choice to experience it or not, I'm not in favor of that . That is like suggesting you want to see the armor dude in FOW but don't want to clear FoW missions or fight baddies on the way to the armor guy. If you want something, learn to fight for it and earn it.

Its not at all like suggesting the FoW armour guy appears as soon as you enter. People chose to do FoW for their own reasons-as soon as people complete prophecies or EOTN, which they may have done before WiK, they are instantly plunged into the WiK altered world, meaning your example is an incorrect comparison. Besides, people got the title before WiK, with an easier explorable area, so are you saying they are rubbish because they couldn't do it in WiK. The OP is not suggesting that at all-the OP is suggesting we revert back to the old explorable areas when we don't want the more challenging WiK ones-its not making the game easier. Making it easier would be changing all the foes in the old explorable area to smaller levels or less armour, which is something you are hinting.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morphy

If you lose in PvE, urdoinitrong.

That's just like saying if you do during farming, you fail at farming. You might just have not used the right skill at the right time, forgot to equip a weapon or had a bad spawn, as examples.

lishi

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2005

26 Jun 2010 at 00:23 - 33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Puebert

I know what you're going through. Yesterday, I did Aurora Glade and was unable to finish it. Yes, that's right the ever dreaded Root Behemoth was in my way. Now, he may not be level 20 like all the white mantle, but he was a bulky level 19. Since I was H/Hing, I had myself (HB monk with Banish), 3 heroes (all HB monks with Banish for damage), Alesia, and Stefan.

Unfortunately, because NM PvE is so hard, Stefan died in the first few mobs and we ended up using all our res sigs on him, so when I reached this behemoth, we had no damage.

But being as good at GW as I am, I knew I'd be able to rise to the occasion! I set up hotkeys for all my heroes' Banish skill slot so I would be able to take a page out of HA and use Banish Spike. After the first spike, I was sure we had him. But then to my horror, at the last second, not one but two Life Pods appeared and healed that bastard right up.

Shortly afterwards, my heroes and I drained all our energy on spamming Infuse Life on each other trying to out-heal the behemoth's Wild Blow and the pods' Holy Wrath. Eventually, I was unable to keep my party alive and we met a gruesome end.

Oh, and /notsigned.

wat i dont even

Xiaquin

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jun 2010

[aRIN]

R/

26 Jun 2010 at 01:13 - 34

OP, I know you already got through the area, but, I took notes anyway.

If you are willing to, post up your profession, build and your hero layout. I guarantee you that is 99% of the problem, and we could help you improve them. I honestly had never gone into TSL since WiK, so I took a trip out just now and found it very manageable. The threats you face can stand up to attacks but with teamwork and a strong enough backline, it's nothing like what you find outside ToA.

These were some of my observations:

Henchmen really suck in this area, so quite a few are not worth taking. I recommend Stefan for one of his party shouts, Claude for a battery (Blood Ritual), or Dunham who is generally ok. If you took Alesia, that's one of your problems, she has a terrible build and won't keep your party alive.

As for heroes, I recommend some caster hate. Bring Gwen and go domination magic, a little something for everyone. I also noticed the casters in the mob can group up, so Vekk could help out, perhaps with earth magic (you could add some wards that way, for your party). Lastly I would rely on a strong healer to round it out. Oh, and don't forget some self-heals on everyone, including you.

dagrdagaz

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2010

NL

E/N

26 Jun 2010 at 10:44 - 35

I took Little Thom and Alesia AND i managed with those 2

Go figure...

I didnt take Stefan cos i read in other WiK threads here, his AI is/was not good. Dunno if Little Thoms AI is better though.
I take Alesia mainly cos she has a reusable res skill, in case my healer hero gets killed.
There may be one positive thing to taking Alesia though, she pretty much is the priority target in your group cos she has lowest health and armour.
Meaning, yer other party members take less damage initially, so they may live longer to do more damage.
The downside is indeed if yer healer hero can keep up or not.

Hmm, my build and my Heroes' builds i used werent the biggest issue.
But if u wanna know. We all also use 1 or 2 Attribute runes.

My Twin Serpent Lake build, i now use this for below-lvl20-foes-areas;
OgRDcjyMT/CjV0N3g4MID4C0CA

For lv20+ foes areas i use 8 Curses, 2 less Energy Storage and use Weaken Armor instead of Lava Arrows

Ogden;
OwAT043A5xS7PsHXkuYFploTAA

Gwen;
OQBDAooDPRgcwFQD4TzAEBUA

Melonni;
OgSkcUp8KymEAmAG3H01FY5l4lmA

aspi

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2010

eeew

N/Rt

26 Jun 2010 at 12:18 - 36

You finished EOTN, so bring Livia and equip her with one of these:
http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/Build:N/any_Minion_Bomber
If you have olias and/or master of whispers you should not be having any problems there ever again unless you aggro 3 mobs with muliple monks and bosses or something.

If not you could start by using a WoH monk with powerdrain for some nrg.

Your problems are over.