I was grouping the other day for a Zaishen mission or Zaishen bounty... so we got a Panic mes (imba at the moment), SS necro (classic), Imbagon and some other things. The paragon made a point that they did not know why they were playing their paragon. Are paragons really that bad? Motivation is pretty mediocre given the updates to all the other classes but is command that bad?
I still run a Paragon hero with "Stand Your Ground!", "Go for the eyes!", "fall back!", empathic removal when I am with someone else and we're running a MM and Spirit spam. The paragon doesn't help that much in terms of damage in Hard mode, but in normal mode you can see the difference quite easily.
Go for the eyes on 14 command gives minions more crits, which doesn't help in HM but in NM it's pretty decent. Either way, "fall back!" makes them get to their destination faster. In a physical heavy team, anthem of envy helps too but I mostly play casters and with other casters. This makes most anthems (attack skill dependent) useless for the most part since heroes don't sync attack skills with things like Anthem of Envy or Anthem of Disruption.
My attributes were split something along the lines of 12+1+1 command, 8+1 leadership, 10+1 spear. (other option is 11+1+1/11+1/8+1 or 12+1+1/6+1/11+1) It's a shame that leadership is 1 energy every 2 ranks.
I did some experimenting running a second paragon with tactics and Defensive Anthem, "To the Limit!" to build adrenaline every battle, "Shields up!" (expensive on a warrior, manageable on a paragon) in replacement of aegis and ward against melee in the midline (since defensive anthem doesn't worry about enchantment stripping or needing to ball up). It didn't seem to have as much of an effect as the command paragon and required a heavy investment in tactics and leadership. Without "Go for the eyes!" spamming, the energy was a bit tight. The last time I tinkered with it, Watch Yourself was still +20 armor at rank 6, so it could be used as an energy engine. Now it is on 4 recharge and doesn't stack with "stand your ground". "Charge" is another option on a P/W but given how incoming got buffed and cripple isn't spammed in PVE I don't see it as a superior choice.
I'm a big fan of shouts in general since they don't pause spear-chucking damage (investing the attributes leaves 10-11 spear mastery). Also unlike the warrior heroes they can switch targets with 1 aggro circle range which puts them in front of casters (1.2 aggro circle).
So is the paragon really pushed into one build? (Go for the eyes, save yourselves, there's nothing to fear, spear of fury, spear of lightning, etc.)
Paragons in the current meta
LifeInfusion
galactic
everything is cookie cutter
twenty ten
twenty ten
Cuilan
They can daggger and scythe spam like an assassin or dervish, but the only advantage you get from doing that is giving your party energy and perhaps TNTF.
Shrimz
basically imba or gtfo. any profession kicks ass in NM, so no one really cares about that.
and in HM, you really just cant beat the defensive power of the imba with anything else the para can do.
and in HM, you really just cant beat the defensive power of the imba with anything else the para can do.
Essence Snow
Running para heros is generally bad mainly b/c there are better options. Yes the main draw for human para is Imbagdon.....there is nothing else that a para can run that is nearly as useful imo although I don't use spear of lightning. If paras didnt have TNtF and were able to take advantage of SY, I dare say they'd be worse than dervs.
MArcSinus
I usually take "Stand Your Ground" and 2 other command skills on another hero usually on a necro as optional skills which works nice.
I do have a Paragon character which I run racway with but I almost always play Imbagon anyway.
I do have a Paragon character which I run racway with but I almost always play Imbagon anyway.
Tender Care
Paragon is not only Imbagon....pls stop talking shit!
Obviously for a normal setup, imbagon is the best choice to play HM, but there are also many others builds you can run.
DMG: in pve you can spam a single combo like "You move like a dwarf", "I am the strongest", "Find their weakness" and Spear of Fury and inflict like 150 dmg in 1 second.
Protection: leadership 14----> Angelic bond, Angelic protection + They are on fire spammable with SF ele or Burning finale on a meele + SY + TNTF-----> Beat me if you can
Plus a para hero with stand your ground.....almost 100% dmg reduction...
Motivation does not suck---> finale of restoration combined with The Power is Yours and SY. Chorus of restoration even triggers itself.
Problem is that ppl only think that paragon can play imbagon. Like assassin can only farm with SF. Ritualist is only SoS. Rangers only Barrage and so on.
You are too close-minded imo!
Obviously for a normal setup, imbagon is the best choice to play HM, but there are also many others builds you can run.
DMG: in pve you can spam a single combo like "You move like a dwarf", "I am the strongest", "Find their weakness" and Spear of Fury and inflict like 150 dmg in 1 second.
Protection: leadership 14----> Angelic bond, Angelic protection + They are on fire spammable with SF ele or Burning finale on a meele + SY + TNTF-----> Beat me if you can
Plus a para hero with stand your ground.....almost 100% dmg reduction...
Motivation does not suck---> finale of restoration combined with The Power is Yours and SY. Chorus of restoration even triggers itself.
Problem is that ppl only think that paragon can play imbagon. Like assassin can only farm with SF. Ritualist is only SoS. Rangers only Barrage and so on.
You are too close-minded imo!
Khomet Si Netjer
oh dear. much has already been said on this topic but I'll summarize.
* paragons cannot deal as much damage as any other physical damage dealer.
* paragons cannot buff other character's damage as well as the necromancer, ritualist, or monk. paragon should be the best at this but he is not.
* paragons cannot heal nearly as well as the monk or ritualist.
* paragons cannot protect their party well without the use of PVE skills.
so although the paragon is versatile and has multiple roles within a group, he isn't very good at any of them. the paragon isn't #1 at anything except the infamous 'imbagon' defensive build which relies on PVE skills. The paragon skills themselves are not that great.
* paragons cannot deal as much damage as any other physical damage dealer.
* paragons cannot buff other character's damage as well as the necromancer, ritualist, or monk. paragon should be the best at this but he is not.
* paragons cannot heal nearly as well as the monk or ritualist.
* paragons cannot protect their party well without the use of PVE skills.
so although the paragon is versatile and has multiple roles within a group, he isn't very good at any of them. the paragon isn't #1 at anything except the infamous 'imbagon' defensive build which relies on PVE skills. The paragon skills themselves are not that great.
Tender Care
Paragons works well with other paragons...combinations that other profession cannot use at 100%. that's their pro!
nomma
you nare right paragons cant deal as much dmg in a spike as some of the other classes abut you are wrong about the buffs... necros monks and rits dont buff. they enchant. this is a major difference from the para. once a paras shout is on its on. there are alot less skills out there to int shouts and chants vs everything thats out there for enchants and spells. another key factor to a para is that any "buff" they cast is applied to everyone within a certain radius. very few enchants have this ability and usually have some draw back. for example and orders necro has to sacrifice health, yes we have over come this, so when people first started playing this people hated it. a necro was to only mm or ss. and on the note of the para cant do anything without pve skills.... well all of gw cant dop anything without pve skills in the build some where.... its stupid. however its PvE not PvP so it doesnt matter use what you have avaliable. be versitile.
and i forgot to add that i love playing para i have 3 of em. and they are actually amazing for a condition spike.
and i forgot to add that i love playing para i have 3 of em. and they are actually amazing for a condition spike.
khezial tahr
I've run around with a triple para team and it was great. We walked through several vanqs like it was nothing. With the right team, paragons just make the game easier.
Essence Snow
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tender Care
Quote: Obviously for a normal setup, imbagon is the best choice to play HM, but there are also many others builds you can run. Ofc you can run other builds, but they are lacking severly.
Quote: DMG: in pve you can spam a single combo like "You move like a dwarf", "I am the strongest", "Find their weakness" and Spear of Fury and inflict like 150 dmg in 1 second. Okay....now spam that, so DPS doesn't stink. 1 chain in 10 secs doesn't make a dmg build good.
Quote:
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Protection: leadership 14----> Angelic bond, Angelic protection + They are on fire spammable with SF ele or Burning finale on a meele + SY + TNTF-----> Beat me if you can Plus a para hero with stand your ground.....almost 100% dmg reduction... Remember the point of Imbagdon is upkeep and fueling SY and TntF. Take away the adrenaline skills and you're not as effective. Taking ToF works well I'll give you that, but the angelics<adren skills. Also SYG isn't really worth taking if someone else is spamming SY b/c they don't stack. Quote:
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