Heroes > Humans? At least they run this skillz I tell them :P

Any assumptions I had made in that regard were very much put to rest when you posted that sentence. Thank you for showing me the light- there truly are intellectual midgets in the world, after all .

4/10 for troll thread. :-P

N/W

MM with a sword is pretty epic.

E/R

Firestorm+blackwidow and a bow...

I've PUG'd with these types and it's pretty damn funny.

I am really stoked about this. I LOVE playing with alliance mates and it is pretty much the only way I PvE anymore BUT I am so stked at all the possibilities of running certain builds I have had in my mind for a while that I have never been able to test because people didn't have the skills or their heroes weren't set up right etc.

It all depends on which people you are talking about and for what purpose.... i haven't found anything non-H/H-able except for DoA....Even WiK was h/h able in hard mode given the correct builds.... As for 7 heroes... i don't see it as a huge problem heroes already exist... and people will still have to group to get more than 2-3 of a certain profession.

The irony of this post is that Ritualists are also better at using Splinter Barrage than Rangers.

Funnily enough, I primarily H/H in order to avoid elitist ego maniacs Bring on the 7 hero parties!

H enchmen > Humans

Its not the skills that make the difference.

yup, thats why I H/H too. So excited for 7 hero teams.

I reeeally want this to happen. So much that I have started to get all my heroes geared/adorned.

I can only play this game casually, and when I do play now I often have to take long AFKs while playing. I can't do this with guildies/pugs and can only do missions/VQ/etc with H/H.

I realize this isn't the case for eveyone, but I would totally love this change.

Just did a ZB today and I ran
Savannah Heat
Searing Heat
Breath of Fire
Fire Attunement
Dark Escape
Dash
Shadow Sanctuary
Feigned Neutrality

16 Energy Storage
12 Shadow Arts

Leader zoned while I was changing from Shadow form runner to Nuker...
We did just fine and no one noticed.

Pugging = If I manage to team up with friendly and tolerant people who don't rage quit at the first sign of trouble, it's still a lot of fun. Though, there's always a risk of someone ruining the group.
H/H = When I want to seriously get something done, or try something for the first time, I choose A.I., so I can test the waters, tread carefully without being a hassle for anybody who has done this task a hundred times.

I have nothing against playing with real people, I like it most of the time, it's just that you can't be sure if you draw a blank in terms of tolerance or capability, with intolerant whining being a far more common reason for /resigns than anything else. A laid back team can carry a noob monk through a difficult mission if they work together, but one player constantly bitching about how to do things right(their way) can destroy the team's fragile spirit and cause it to disband before Rebirth finishes casting.

I play with h/h mostly because I have a family that requires my attention.

So I pop on for maybe 30 mins at a time. Or sometimes I like to VQ or do a long mission I leave my team standing waiting for long periods when I have to do RL things in the middle of it.

A human group would not tolerate me.

I have never been in DOA or UW because I can not dedicate that much uninterrupted time to it.

With a full heroe group I will be able to experience this content that is otherwise impossible for me.

Meh, threads like these don't really bug me. Yeah the OP is pretty much being an asshole but welcome to the internet.

Besides, the majority of us have probably at one point in time or another, laughed at someone's terribad build.

Anywho, I'm posting from my phone so no saved builds on here, but my favorite is to see someone completely base all of their skills on their secondary class. (Not in a useful way).

Bad builds are bad when skills don't sync well. An ER infuse spamming GDW around while your barrage ranger overrides it with Splinter... wtf? Seems some people can't put 2 and 2 together and figure things out on their own.

Bad builds are bad when other classes out rank their build. Any class except Rit shouldn't run SoS. I don't care who you are, if your running SoS because of damage then freaking switch professions.

Bad builds are bad when your own skills don't sync well. No one should have 2 lead attacks, no one should bring AoE damage without some snare. So one should bring a speed boost skill.

Bad builds are bad if you can't play it well. Fail ER infusers go into energy problems because they fail to understand the concept of spam everything on yourself then spam on everyone. I consider myself one of the few GOOD ER infusers in all of Guild Wars because so many people simply play the build badly. Hell, just for shit's and giggles I run Minderbender and Elemental Lord in Urgoz HM. We finished in 45 minutes or so. Those 'bad' skills helped because I could use them well as covers, even though they are bad.
Are they outclassed? Yes. Will I do it again? No.

It's Build Wars, an easy put 2 and 2 together concept. Players bring bad skills because they don't understand that Flare, is crap, because it can't go well with anything else. Skills syncing well > pure damage.

It's the artificial intelligence - better than none!

No, there are no bad builds. That's what ursan taught carebears.

In GW there is no 'best' and no 'worse'.
There's only 'best for X' and 'worse for Y'.

Even a build with a single skill has its uses. Ask the Doppelganger if you don't believe me.


Regardless of the build, what counts is what you can do with any build they give you. And no machine can do it better than a human that does it right...

..for now.

Unless you are a dervish, in which case you are the worst, no matter what your build.

And this is coming from someone with a dervish as their main... and it makes me sad. We are not needed for ANYTHING. So i'm super glad they are being heavily fixed and remade.

I feel your pain. However, just wait untill our rework, every sin noob will be Alt Q+Q'ing and rolling a derv because they cant use a scythe anymore.

If you have no rits in your group, then it is fine to have a necro, elly, mes, derv, or sin go as an SoS build instead. The reason for why it is better is because Rit heroes cant use sumon spirits.

My elly uses SoS in UW when I go in with heroway to farm ectos and when I capped my black widow. Even with 12 channeling and no spawning, if it is good in UW, then I am very confident that it can work throughout most of the game.

The OP also mentioned DWG warriors, but I've completed two DoA full runs with a DWG W/Rt in my group, and he didnt have any energy problems.

A build isnt bad just because you dont know what it is used for. A build is bad if it has poor synergy, doesnt fit the required role well, has poor energy management, or just isnt useful in anyway to your group.

There was a time, and it probably still is the case that if I tried to join a pug with my Ether Renewal E/Mo prot build, they would think its a crap build and kick me, but I just easily H/Hed Eternal Grove on HM with it and none of my H/H died.

Delete your dervish and make your main character an Elly, Necro, or Rit. Problem solved

True. Another reason for having a non Rit primary go as SoS in a group with a primary rit would be so that the rit can run Soul Twisting instead.

Soul Twisting with Rejuvenation, Displacement and Union is far far better for a primary rit to be running if a secondary can take SoS instead. But I'm pretty sure that most people will think that soul twisting rits are noob builds compared to SoS lol.

Since I tried soul twisting on my rit, I havnt had any reason to go back to the vastly inferior SoS.

Have you tried using Shelter in place of Rejuvenation? While you won't see the numbers, in HM Shelter is really worth taking.

I tried Soul Twisting with Rejuvenation, Displacement, Union, Shelter, and Recuperation.

I found that shelter also worked, but it dropped dead far too past and I would had to recast it too much. Although that means it is working so I'll keep it.

Displacement Shelter and Union probably do help the most.

On a side note, while I think the OP is a jerk. I think the "good build or GTFO" might have helped to make people bring better build if most people had that attitude since the early game. I'm thinking about games like wow where pretty much every one who is raiding(old term perhaps) has key skills/talents.
Then again, I don't mean simply kickin gwith out feedback or imposign a specific build. But just saying "hmm advice : cap SoS/Twisting/SY/dragonslash/..." ans asking for a build that works might have been better.

Indeed, if heros became self aware I think that he wouldn't get any help from them either.

Tbh, with the current 3 hero parties we have now, there is no reason to run ST while h/hing. Arguably it's a decent option in a full human party in areas of higher difficulty, but if you're planning on efficient h/hing and your bar has a purely defensive purpose, urdoingitwrong.

I'm as far from elitist as you can get but I have to admit I've gotten really annoyed at critiquing people's builds that they ping in our alliance chat. I've played the game for several years now and usually I can take a look at a build and identify obvious improvements but it just bugs me how many people just get all defensive with you when you try to improve their build. And I'm not talking about "PVX only please" stuff, I'm talking about ridiculous builds with underspec'd skills, random melee skill on casters, you name it. I can see that you would reach a point with PUG's where you have quit being a build coach and just move on.