Would using Kinect with Guild Wars be considered cheating and gets you banned?

I noticed this article on the web where Creative Technologies have created a solution to enable Kinect to work with PC computer games like WoW. Presumably this could be made to work for games like Guild War also, but then wouldn't that get you banned as well since they are emulating keyboard and mouse?

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The Kinect game controller may have been created to play Xbox 360 titles only, but a group of university researchers are working on software that lets gamers use the motion sensing device to play computer games like "World of Warcraft."

The folks at USC's Institute for Creative Techologies are working on software called FAAST — Flexible Action and Articulated Skeleton Toolkit — which intigrates full-body controls into off-the-shelf computer games (the kind of games you usually control with a keyboard and mouse).

"Since these games would not normally support motion sensing devices, FAAST emulates keyboard input triggered by body posture and specific gestures," the researchers write. "These controls can be dynamically configured for different applications and games." (In addition to a Kinect sensor, players can also use a PrimeSensor camera, according to the researchers.)

The researchers go on to say that this tool could be used not only for entertainment purposes, but to help injured people ... and to help overweight "WoW" players.

"This opens up the doorway for building rehabilitation exercises for people after a stroke or traumatic brain injury and in an area that's getting a lot of attention — the area of childhood obesity and diabetes," says the institute's Skip Rizzo. "You've got a kid who's interacting with 'World of Warcraft' for six hours a day, perhaps a parent could step in and say, 'Hey, for one hour of that time you're gonna do it with the Kinect or the PrimeSense camera, and you gotta exercise while you're doing it.'

"Instead of using a thumb controller to move your character you've got to run in place, you've got to use arm gestures and you actually build into the application a way for a kid to physically engage with digital content."

http://ingame.msnbc.msn.com/_news/20...ld-of-warcraft

A guildie has got his working with GW and says it's ok for some messing about but is not really viable atm as an alternative to keyboard and mouse.

Only Anet can indicate if their bot code will pick up the simulated key presses but since it involves way more interaction than normal It can't be considered botting. My gut feel says you'd be ok as the bot code would typically look for regular, repeated and streamed inputs. Since kinect does'nt produce the first two(at least it doesn't when I play it -lol).

Best thing to do if you are still not sure is to fire the same question at support/Gaile's wiki page

I wouldn't think so, this is not botting, as botting is using a program/or w/e to do things for you? I think it also would be a good idea to let players use Kinect for GW/GW2. It's always better with more physical activity for people who play games :P

But yeah, ask on Gaile's wiki page.

Technically you could just create a bluetooth interface for your Android mobile, using the accelerometer in mobile as a controller ^^
Yes, it was OT, now returning to your question: No, it's not considered botting and it's perfectly legal to use external keyboards/keypads/joysticks etc, even programmable mecro keys. Now what's not legal is programming macros that will do things for you while you're afk.

Read the EULA it says ANY 3rd party program/tools. Is Kinect a 3rd party program/tool? Yes it is therefore YES you will get BANNED for using it when caught so don't come crying on the forum when it happens.

EULA: Getting banned is not just about BOTTING. It involves anything that violates the EULA and in the soul discretion of Anet/Ncsoft at the time they discover the infraction. They can ban or not ban by choice it is THEIR choice btw not what you THINK should be their choice.

I use a DualShock 2 with 3rd party mouse and keyboard emulation software to play Guild Wars. When I contacted NCSoft Support asking if this was allowed, they said yes, so long as it does not automate play or give any unfair advantage. Don't take my word for it, though. Ask them directly.

That's the full quote, in context. You've interpreted it incorrectly.

You really should quote the whole sentence before interpreting anything Basma. The way you wrote it people will get banned for using PSc, any old Keyboard or any Mouse. Anet has not made a single PC, Monitor or Mouse (excluding branding for the Guildwars Razer mouse in the store) which means that anything remotely hardware related would get you banned as per your interpretation.

No u wont get banned.

Shit. I have a keyboard and mouse...I is gonna get banned. lolz.



No it won't get you banned, however, I think it may be a bit to awkward without a whole lot of work.

You know what the EULA means and I do as well and you all know the keyboard and mouse are not 3rd party programs. They are part of the PC needed to play the game. So quit being trolls about it.

You both also didn't include the part where I said and they said "It is THEIR SOUL DISCRETION about who gets banned and why. They can ban you because you smell if they want to.

Both are third party forms of hardware. The kinect would be acting as an input device as any keyboard or mouse would. You are thereby saying that people should be banned from using keyboards and mice because they are third party hardware.

You need to learn how to comprehend what you read.

If you feel that you are actually correct, contact support. I promise they won't actually laugh at you in the response. However, they may pass your e-mail around the office for a good snicker fest.

Umm. I wasnt trolling. I made a post commenting directly regarding your first post explaining politely without insulting how you were wrong. If everyone who proves you wrong is a Troll... then I have the bad news for you... nearly the whole world is full of trolls .

This part of your first post is not very hard to understand and very hard to mis-interprate;

My post said Keyboards, PCs and Mice are not produced by Anet. Therefore by deffinition they are 3rd party tools. You wrote that ANY 3rd party tool will get you banned which means you wrote that using a Keyboard will get you banned.

Your problem in your first post is you quoted half a sentence and formed your theory on incomplete data.

MisterB quoted the full passage which shows that your theory is not true;

I have highlited the important part of the full EULA passage which you missed while forming your theory. That part also allows you to use PCs, Mice and Keyboards without specifically naming them. The Kinetict would also be covered by that (Even though it will deffinitely not be particularly good for controlling an MMO setup like GW or WoW), but it would be best to ask Support if you are still not 100% Sure. We can of course not give you a deffinite answer as none of us work at or for Anet.

They allow people to use Texmod and that's 3rd party. Chances are, Kinect will be just the same so they'll let it pass.

Last I read keyboards and mouse aren't 3rd parties to a computer which you need to play the game so now you are still being a troll. You know what I meant you are just being antagonizing now which is what trolls do.

Let's put it this way it's their call if they want to ban you and you nor anyone else on this board knows 100% for sure they won't ban for using the 3rd party kinect. So use it. I said don't come crying if/when you get banned for using it. But, don't tell someone they won't ban when you don't know if you don't expect other to tell them they will ban if they don't know. You're wrong and everyone else because you don't know.

I'm pretty sure the OP wanted feedback from Anet from their online PR person anyway when he/she posted this thread. But, of course all the trolls jump in acting like they know everything Anet does or will do.

You accusing people of being a troll? That's a laugh. And no, he's correcting your errors. That's not trolling.

Using Kinect may or may not get you banned from GW - it depends on whether or not Anet thinks that it could give you an unfair advantage. We don't know yet.

The bigger issue I'd think would be Microsoft's EULA on using the Kinect, what they'd deem is improper use of it, and if they can tell that it's being used for something other than 360 Kinect games.

Im not a kinect expert and have never used it tbh, but to me, using kinect for GW doesnt sound to me like it would give you any advantage over keyboard + mouse.

You really do not know waht 3rd party means do you? Or you are being an incredibly dense troll.

Let me explain to you that 3rd parties are by law so that you might have an idea of just how dumb your posts are;

3rd party is anyone who is not part of a 2 way contract.

The 2 parties in the contract (EULA) you agreed to before being able to play GW are:

1. Yourself
2. Arenanet/NCSoft

No other person (with the exception of a legal guardian if you are under 18 at the time of the contract) or company.

As neither you nor Arenanet/NCSoft actually produce PC Systemy or PC parts, any other company which does is by LAW (not only EULA) considered a 3rd party; be it Microsoft (which made Windows you need to play Guild Wars on), Dell/HP/Logitech/ATI/Nvidia/etc. (which makes PC parts you need to run the system you use to play GW on).

You said clearly and unmistakeably that the use of ANY 3rd party PROGRAM (Windows) or TOOL (PC systems and all their individual components be they inside or outside of the computer) will casue you to be banned because YOU ONLY QUOTED AND INTERRETED HALF A DAMN SENTENCE FROM A PARAGRAPH OF THE EULA.

If you had Quoted the whole damn sentence, then you would have figured out, as not only I am writing to explain this simple fact to you, that the EULA does not allow any 3rd party programms or tools that GIVE YOU AN UNFAIR ADVANTAGE.

As PCs, Keyboards and Mice do not give an unfair advantage they are permitted 3rd party programms and tools in the contract. As the Kinect does not give an unfair advantage it is also a permitted 3rd party tool exactly like the Keyboard and mouse because it does nothing without human input through mechanical movement of the body.

I read something about that before.. depending on how its being used, i dont think Anet would have a big problem with it.. its not like yer hacking the game itself with it - but i WOULD be more concerned about Microsuck.. they were questioning the legality of hacking the Kinect.

I would kinda of liken it to a person using voice command.. and just for kicks and giggles, i did in fact successfully play it with Dragon Naturally Speaking lol <insert nerdout here>.

thought about putting up a vid of it on youtube for proof of concept but never really got around to it. maybe someday.

advice tho: dont ever try voice command with GW on HM or even in high ranking areas.. lol.. you wouldnt stand a chance.. but just for farting around its okay.

Wow, a bunch of pedantic nonsense in this thread.

If I heard of anyone getting banned over something like this, I would never buy one of their products ever again as it would clearly demonstrate that they are just purposely trying to ban people to reduce server load or something like that.

Regarding the use of the Kinect, it would really just be a novelty. I can't imagine the game being at all playable like that unless you are just running a very basic skill bar where you just want to spam a few skills on command.

1. I'd assume it's viewed by a-net the same as a keyboard macro -- OK so long as a human is manning it; not OK if it runs on its own.

2. About the EULA... Just don't. For one thing, whether it's even a valid contract varies by jurisdiction. For another, you probably lack the training to interpret legalese definitively. For a third thing, Support definitely lacks the training to interpret legalese definitively; what they're really enforcing is a set of internal policy guidelines. For a fourth thing, we've had this conversation many times before, and it's never been fruitful.

3. I'm guessing this would probably be undetectable from a-net's end, thus it probably doesn't matter what a-net thinks about it.

4. Like Voodoo, I'm also guessing that the game would be borderline unplayable.

Aw dang it, I use fraps and foobar while playing GW.
Take my account ANet, you've got me. Law "experts" won this one for you, taking lawful stupid perk over common sense.

ArenaNet makes a determination on a case by case basis. If you ask them today if TexMod is ok, they will say it's not currently a problem, but they reserve the right to change their minds if a version becomes available that gives you a gameplay advantage or attempts to affect things serverside.

If you ask them today about using Kinect, they will most likely say it's not currently a problem (and ask if you are having fun trying to get things done), but will, again, reserve the right to change their minds if the interface in the future begins to give a user an advantage over other players.

I've gone a week on my computer without a mouse and another week without a keyboard (much harder since I like to use a ton of key combos for stuff. Sooo your point about them being needed both is invalid. So they're just going to ban people who use both right?

Bassma, End is right. There's no distinction between mouse/keyboard and Kinect. Both are hardware which require drivers and software.

My Razer mice use Razer's interface software which allows me to customize all sorts of mouse settings.

edit: reading through this thread, pretty much everyone has a level head about this beside Bassma.

lol i asked in a thread a looooooong time ago but instead i wanted to know if this
http://www.theperegrine.com/
gaming glove was appropriate and against EULA...it was approved so...yeah as long as no unfair advantage its cool

I can't find the full interview I saw where Steve Ballmer Microsoft CEO said he was surprised how fast kinect was hacked for a PC but that he was happy with it (through gritted teeth I think)and he hints at kinect being plugged into PC in the future here about 1.28 in I think

Curiously enough, they've also refused to offer any kind of input on whether TexMod textures that provide actual advantages are still legal.

The entire policy of withholding announcements regarding the legality of third-party aides just reeks of laziness, insufficient manpower, or at the very least, apathy on the parts of support.

Getting banned? Probably not since I believe Kinect would be considered a peripheral and really doesn't give any advantage to gameplay. Just like I don't think anybody has ever gotten banned for using the Logitech G19 which allows simple macros. I personally think ANet should embrace the Kinect. I would love to see some fat chubby kid that plays Guild Wars using it. At least then they would be getting exercise while they hack and slash or see they physically running while doing some speed clear. Hilarious to see? Of course!! It sure would beat them just sitting at a keyboard and mouse in a vegetative state doing the same thing.

Although, I would admit that doing 9 Rings with the Kinect WOULD be pretty boring!!

/12 characters

It will be fine with ANet until it starts to actually become useful. Then their legal types will pen a deal and they will have a GW authorized version. At that point any other version will become against EULA.

disclaimer: This is my OPINION. Do not get all flamey with me.