After failing the Nightfall "Hidden City of Ardashim" quest several times lately, I tried using a party of henchmen instead of heroes (not counting Margrid) and was surprised; they seemed to cut through the genies with no problem. I guess it shows that I need to continue to build up my heroes.
Have you noticed when soloing in the games that it's sometimes better to use henchmen instead of an all-hero party after all? I don't think this will always work, but I'm glad I tried a different tack.
Tried henchmen instead of heroes, surprised at results
syronj
Dzjudz
Maybe you use bad builds on heroes and/or don't have them equipped properly?
syronj
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Originally Posted by Dzjudz
Maybe you use bad builds on heroes and/or don't have them equipped properly?
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Aba
its a common misconception.
yes, true heros will always be better then henchies....
but the henchies are not bad, its the player and how they go about using and controlling them. YA know we always didn't have heros and players managed
yes, true heros will always be better then henchies....
but the henchies are not bad, its the player and how they go about using and controlling them. YA know we always didn't have heros and players managed
Iuris
Henchmen, after their builds got updated, got quite useful. They have solid, non-abusive builds. Not the extreme ones that we all carry around these days on 7 heroes, but still solid.
Before 7 hero parties, I sometimes got asked to help some friend/guildie, and it was kinda hard to get them too understand that I'd rather use the henchmen for the 5-7 slots than their heroes who often had quite abysmal builds.
Before 7 hero parties, I sometimes got asked to help some friend/guildie, and it was kinda hard to get them too understand that I'd rather use the henchmen for the 5-7 slots than their heroes who often had quite abysmal builds.
Destrudo
Henchmen generally are disliked by the playerbase. This isn't a matter of them being bad however, it's just that a decked out team of heroes outclasses them with ease since you have the ability to edit your heroes and their builds however you want. Their builds are solid enough to get the job done regardless of one's skill level, it's just a matter of dealing with their shortcomings by picking the right henchmen and aggroing carefully.
Before you can get the over the top, abusive builds (and equipment to go along with them) that everyone knows and loves for their power and stability, henchmen are certainly an option, one that I've used occasionally before 7 heroes became available on any of my newer characters. When playing with randoms it also applies, I've found that a balanced team of henchmen works wonders over the uncommon (for good reason, usually) builds people sometimes end up selecting for their heroes.
Before you can get the over the top, abusive builds (and equipment to go along with them) that everyone knows and loves for their power and stability, henchmen are certainly an option, one that I've used occasionally before 7 heroes became available on any of my newer characters. When playing with randoms it also applies, I've found that a balanced team of henchmen works wonders over the uncommon (for good reason, usually) builds people sometimes end up selecting for their heroes.
Verene
Yeah, henchmen really aren't that bad, especially if you don't have your heroes set up well and equipped and everything.
Only a few of my characters have heroes that are all kitted out with runed armor and stuff, and a few that I don't play too much don't even have enough level 20 heroes to fill out a full party. So I still use henchmen with them. They work fine.
Only a few of my characters have heroes that are all kitted out with runed armor and stuff, and a few that I don't play too much don't even have enough level 20 heroes to fill out a full party. So I still use henchmen with them. They work fine.
IronSheik
Humans>Heroes>Henchmen>PuGs
Kojima
Yes, henchmen are not that bad. Now that I am better at builds I do not usually bring henchies but before that henchmen saved my butt more than once.
And I rather miss them at times. I like the Fractions archers like Aidan and Zho and the nerco Su, Silverwing and Sister Tai. Usually I would bring that same group of hencies in all my missions before the heroes update. I sometimes miss them...
And I rather miss them at times. I like the Fractions archers like Aidan and Zho and the nerco Su, Silverwing and Sister Tai. Usually I would bring that same group of hencies in all my missions before the heroes update. I sometimes miss them...
cosyfiep
if I dont have a good build or (with my mule accounts) enough skills unlocked, yeah henchies are better (I need to unlock a few more elites). My mule accounts usually use some of the henchies, and sometimes it fun to watch mehnlo et al run around like dead chickens!
Amy Awien
henchmen > poorly equipped heroes
As long as you don't have your seven heroes fully equipped with decent builds, weapons and runes it's probably better to focus on just a few with builds that can not be filled by henchmen.
As long as you don't have your seven heroes fully equipped with decent builds, weapons and runes it's probably better to focus on just a few with builds that can not be filled by henchmen.
jensyea
since the henchmen got updated they've got pretty useful builds, better then most pugs in non 8 man areas for sure and surely better then heroes with bad equips/their default skill bar.
Improvavel
Henchmen are much better now than they used to be - their skill bars have been updated a few times.
But for a player that understands the game/area he is doing, the ability to create synergies and exploit the mobs is incomparable.
But for a player that understands the game/area he is doing, the ability to create synergies and exploit the mobs is incomparable.
DolyakJockey
Raisu Palace is also a good place to use henchmen (celestial skills) over questionable heroes.
Spiritz
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Originally Posted by Iuris
Henchmen, after their builds got updated, got quite useful. They have solid, non-abusive builds. Not the extreme ones that we all carry around these days on 7 heroes, but still solid.
Before 7 hero parties, I sometimes got asked to help some friend/guildie, and it was kinda hard to get them too understand that I'd rather use the henchmen for the 5-7 slots than their heroes who often had quite abysmal builds. |
Could be a slight variation in hench ai and hero ai but was interesting none the less.
Times i feel hench act better than heros at times and i cant really think of any hench glitches in last 2 years but i can think of livia and olias having ai issues in last 2 yrs.
Lest121
Henchmen aren't bad i completed all but 4 dungeons in HM before 7 heroes update..
FoxBat
Some of the nightfall henchmen are far better than average. I wished I had a VoR and SF ele in other continents. And those factions monks can still go die in a fire.
syronj
Thanks for the comments, everyone. Some good points made.
Lasai
True, but success with endgame NF or EoTN hench does not equate to success with Proph or Factions hench particularly in the early stages.
Something like Crystal desert with just lower level hench can be quite painful.
I finished proph pre hench upgrade with just Hench, it is not something I ever want to do again.
Something like Crystal desert with just lower level hench can be quite painful.
I finished proph pre hench upgrade with just Hench, it is not something I ever want to do again.
TheRaven
Hey, I played for years with 7 henchmen in tow then switched to 3 heroes and 4 hench. I didn't have a problem finishing most stuff, including most vanquishing and HM missions. Those hench really aren't that bad, especially in NF and EotN. I've even finished tombs with my heroes and 4 Zaishen buddies.
The only time hench weren't up to the task was when they simply weren't allowed on the missions (fow, uw, etc). Those are the areas where 7 heroes shine. Otherwise, I still will occasionally bring along a hench if I just don't feel like setting up a hero for a specific build that a hench has available. Earth Ele for example. "Hey Herta, you busy? I gotta job for ya!"
The only time hench weren't up to the task was when they simply weren't allowed on the missions (fow, uw, etc). Those are the areas where 7 heroes shine. Otherwise, I still will occasionally bring along a hench if I just don't feel like setting up a hero for a specific build that a hench has available. Earth Ele for example. "Hey Herta, you busy? I gotta job for ya!"
gremlin
Henchmen are just fine I use them as a poor mans merc pack
LifeInfusion
henches top at 12/12. So if you have runes, a decent build, and half decent equipment don't use them.
If you're going to run healing breeze, heal other, glimmering light, and reversal of fortune on your monk for example... it's not much improvement over hench.
If you're going to run healing breeze, heal other, glimmering light, and reversal of fortune on your monk for example... it's not much improvement over hench.
End
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Originally Posted by IronSheik
Humans>Heroes>Henchmen>PuGs
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Humans>Heroes developed by exp players>Henchmen>other heros>PuGs
majoho
Basically if you don't have a lot of skills unlocked henchmen will usually be better than heroes.
Xenomortis
Henchmen are bad, but heroes with terrible bars and health less than 480 are worse.
I can't think of a PvE henchmen that has a good bar; some are merely not bad.
I can't think of a PvE henchmen that has a good bar; some are merely not bad.
Chthon
Heroes are only as good or as bad as the person picking their builds and equipment.
LexTalionis
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Originally Posted by Xenomortis
Henchmen are bad, but heroes with terrible bars and health less than 480 are worse.
I can't think of a PvE henchmen that has a good bar; some are merely not bad. |
Dzjudz
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Originally Posted by LexTalionis
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. Healing Breeze is bad, and with Heal Other at lower levels (both 10 energy) and 0 energy management, it is bad. Also, there is no condition or hex removal, which is usually what a monk brings. Furthermore, she has 3 spot heals, each with a 3 second or less recharge... talk about overkill and choosing bad heals over Word of Healing.Usually, the Evaluation section of the henchman pages show the pros and cons of their bars accurately.
Silmar Alech
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Originally Posted by syronj
Have you noticed when soloing in the games that it's sometimes better to use henchmen instead of an all-hero party after all?
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I made great efforts to equip my heroes with decent builds and equipment. I chose builds and equipment that fit together. Not only one hero alone, but also in synergy between heroes and my own build.
You may have not optimized your heroes that way - it takes time and money. There are whole evenings I spend solely with outfitting my heroes. Optimizing their builds. Looking which hero works good together with other heroes.
If you don't cared for your heroes this way, for example if you have only a limited selection of skills for them, or if you don't give them runes, especially energy-, attribute- and health-increasing ones, and appropriate weapons, then you may better get along with henchmen. Henchmen are equipped with somewhat medium-quality builds and equipment. They are better than badly outfitted heroes.
IronSheik
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Originally Posted by Dzjudz
Also, there is no condition or hex removal, which is usually what a monk brings.
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keithmcm
Herta is a star henchess. However Alessia and that silly touch res still gives me nightmares. The one thing about the hench skill update that irked me is that the one and only reason I used warrior henches (other than to kill Shiro at the end of Factions) was to charge me to chest runs. Devona is betetr looking thay Koss (though he is pimptastic) or Goren, and you can never hear charge too much (unless the mastercard is over limit).
Dzjudz
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Originally Posted by IronSheik
What. Conditions and hexes in pve are reapplied too fast to warrant any hex/condition removal that doesn't deal damage
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Malla13
Henchies work just fine, especially NF and EotN ones. I like playing with my heroes since I've outfitted them all already and I like having the control over my team, but for my characters who don't have well-put-together heroes henchmen are great.
The Hidden City was a b**** the first few times I tried it when I first started playing 3 years ago. I had no idea what I was doing and my guild finally took pity on me and dragged me through it. I didn't even have any elite skills yet! XD So lame...
The Hidden City was a b**** the first few times I tried it when I first started playing 3 years ago. I had no idea what I was doing and my guild finally took pity on me and dragged me through it. I didn't even have any elite skills yet! XD So lame...
Skyy High
Henchmen don't have any runes, nor do they have anything beyond max white weapons as far as I know, so if you're seeing a difference between your heroes and the henchies, it must all be about your builds.
The Mountain
Of course, proper equipage will always make heroes better, but fresh out-of-the-box heroes (without any runes, incorrect wep classifications, or ANY changes except lvl 20) with the right builds will rip through areas much more easily than hench.
GWfan#1
Henchmen are great and they have gotten me through so many missions but Heroes are oh so much better and just have that "umph."
chilly willy
if henchmen work better for you compared to heroes then you cant make builds if your life depended on it. if im on another character besides my main ill use henchmen till i get heroes but once i get heroes its on. i never equip my heroes on alts and have gotten through damn near all of the campaigns with them. my 2 alts are farming characters rit and sin. main is war. henchmen are placeholders or fillers in my opinion most of them have zero energy management and lack in proper stat point adjustments. the only henchmen i think are useful are chiyo(sos resto rit), cynn in eotn(does ok), sogolon(ok for resto backup), and mhenlo and lina in eotn only because they have a tad bit more energy management. with 7 heroes i never need to use them anymore but i can do ok with them if i have to use them for some reason but heros are much much better.
shanaya
Back in the pre-heroes days Thunderhead Keep mission was an infamous bottleneck. I tried and tried to complete that mission using 7 henchies, and never succeeded. Came close a couple of times but always wiped. Once heroes became available it became very easy, even in HM. I'm going to go back and see if I can now do the mission with henchies - this is something I've been meaning to try for a while.
ensoriki
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Originally Posted by Aba
its a common misconception.
yes, true heros will always be better then henchies.... but the henchies are not bad, its the player and how they go about using and controlling them. YA know we always didn't have heros and players managed |
If you dont have the builds use the henchmen, henchmen can deal with the main game just fine.
chilly willy
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Originally Posted by shanaya
Back in the pre-heroes days Thunderhead Keep mission was an infamous bottleneck. I tried and tried to complete that mission using 7 henchies, and never succeeded. Came close a couple of times but always wiped. Once heroes became available it became very easy, even in HM. I'm going to go back and see if I can now do the mission with henchies - this is something I've been meaning to try for a while.
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