Virgorous Spirit used during FoWSC

Hymn

Hymn

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2009

Legion of the Golden Aguila [PNOY]

Me/

Is there any possibility to change/remove this skill from a UA, considering the fact that 100b/vos melees hit mobs in just 1 hit. I personally don't see it as an effective anti-pressure skill considering the fact the only time I really use it is when the team is at forest already and casting it only on MT so he would get a heal-per-cast.

Would like to hear your comments and suggestions as well.
Hymn

Atro

Atro

Miss the good ol' days

Join Date: Sep 2009

Where don't I live?

A/

Honestly I find it to be pretty useless, it can easily be subbed in with Dismiss Condition or pretty much anything else. I personally have not ran it in my build since my first few runs as a UA.

TBH Heal Party isn't needed if you're confident enough, I take out Vigorous Spirit and Heal Party out for Selfless Spirit and Heal Other/ Jamei's Gaze, its a good red for bad situations and IMO just better.

Slaphead Monk

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Mar 2008

England

Terra Noise [Zraw]

Mo/

Depending on how good your MT is, the entire UA bar is pretty much redundant. there shouldnt be very much cleanup to do anyway, and Seed Of Life if anything is something you should drop. half of the pug UAs ive seen enjoy putting seed on the tank whilst he's balling, which can pull aggro and whipe you. If you're confident in your tank/team, run Mo/P with 11 heal, 11 divine and 8 in command (cons put this up to the 9 breakpoint). Bring Cant Touch This and Fall Back instead of heal party (healing tanks to over half hp is pointless- they function better at half) and Vigorous Spirit (shouldnt be much cleanup) and then if you want to, finish him! or ymlad instead of seed. you shouldnt need to be redbarring. people either need powerheals from patient + dwaynas, or theyre better off dying + being ressed at max with UA - redbarring someone with heal other/gaze is just a waste of energy. Hope this helps

Tripolityx

Tripolityx

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Nov 2006

+2 GMT

WTB Q9 20/20 Bo Staves

R/

Run your own build you can heal with. AS long you can heal with it no one should have anything to nag about it.

Ok Dont Panic

Ok Dont Panic

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Nov 2010

UK

We Gat Dis [HRUU]

Mo/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slaphead Monk View Post
Depending on how good your MT is, the entire UA bar is pretty much redundant. there shouldnt be very much cleanup to do anyway, and Seed Of Life if anything is something you should drop. half of the pug UAs ive seen enjoy putting seed on the tank whilst he's balling, which can pull aggro and whipe you. If you're confident in your tank/team, run Mo/P with 11 heal, 11 divine and 8 in command (cons put this up to the 9 breakpoint). Bring Cant Touch This and Fall Back instead of heal party (healing tanks to over half hp is pointless- they function better at half) and Vigorous Spirit (shouldnt be much cleanup) and then if you want to, finish him! or ymlad instead of seed. you shouldnt need to be redbarring. people either need powerheals from patient + dwaynas, or theyre better off dying + being ressed at max with UA - redbarring someone with heal other/gaze is just a waste of energy. Hope this helps Agreed there have been multiple FoW runs that the UA has left and as the Quality of the MT has been good enough the team has still completed the run from Forge onwards without a monk.
HOWEVER this is PUG runs we are talking about the MT is usually a PUG and the standard of them is usually pretty low. So assuming that the MT is going to be bad is generally a good Idea for the monk

As for seed of life the same rule is in effect. I am of course assuming that you are talking about a PUG run. This means that you are going in with people of generally lower exp that a guild team. As the monk you should recognize this.
Seed of life in the wailing forest can be extremely useful especially with the high rate of fails that occur with the canyon pull. (Where the 100bs jump over the canyon to spike the wailing lords[quest] group)

The OP referred to using vigorous spirit. For each attack you gain hp. Or skill used etc. The idea of the spike is that the MT balls the group and the 100bs/VoS jump in and everything should die in 1. Giving them an enchantment (in the 100bs case) is going to make the shadow mesmers in forge reason to change target to use shatter enchantment on them which is going to make them lose more hp than they would gain. This being said in the case of VoS having an well timed cover enchantment could be useful so that VoS isnt stripped.

It all really comes down to what sort of team you are running in. A guild exp team doing t3 way would drop the monk all together. If the spike is clean enough. BUT with Pugs it should be the monks choice as to what build they feel comfortable with.

Infuse health can be very effective as a full health heal, with UA up it (should) fully heal any team member however if this member has agro using infuse will break the agro on to yourself

Air Of Superiority is nice in the same way it is on the spikers and MoP etc. Having the large numbers of mobs that die, you get a good chance to get lots of energy back and a instant recharge on all your skills. This can be particularly useful if things go wrong.

Heal Party- as MR said quite so plainly that healing a tank to above 50hp is useless this isnt always true. Again as I said before it depends on the quality of the tank. If the MT is less exp then having the odd heal when hp is down at 25% can save the day. If the main team is slow on clearing the forge while the MT is tanking the whole 360 agro it could very well be the case that heal party IS needed to prevent a fail. (This being said of course any party wide heal including Seed Of Life in this instance can keep the tank up if its used on the warriors when taking damage)

The main rule of monking is NEVER ever cast on the tank if he has agro) Seed of life may heal everyone to full hp for 5 seconds but after those 5 seconds everyone is going to start dying pretty quick

Hymn

Hymn

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2009

Legion of the Golden Aguila [PNOY]

Me/

Alright, thanks for the info.

So right now, this is the bar I'm running

Heal: 12+2
DF: 10+1
Command: 8

Dwayna's Kiss
Patient Spirit
<Optional space> (Been filled with Healing Ribbon; I'm sure you get it that I use this on the melees)
Cure Hex
"Fall Back!"
Heal Party
Selfless Spirit
Unyielding Aura

LifeInfusion

LifeInfusion

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: May 2005

in the midline

E/Mo

Vigorous Spirit is more for the Spiteful spirit/Empathy spam than anything, it's not required if your MT is any good.

Heal Party is generally useless if the tank is any good; the only other use is if you need to redbar people that are outside your aggro circle.

Mig Coconut

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2009

Gulfstream Owners

R/

I agree with everything Slaphead and LifeInfusion said. HP is pretty much useless, vigorous spirit is mostly to counter empathy/SS, and big heals like infuse are useless since you can just UA (exception for lots of deaths and pugs who don't bring dp removal). I recommend:

Patient, dwayna's, cure hex, fallback, cant touch this, UA, vigorous spirit, optional

HP if nub tank (only use if he's ~30% hp).
Healing ribbon/infuse/etc for nub spike teams.
Evas/FH for good teams.

[Nika]

Academy Page

Join Date: Dec 2010

Fissure Of Woe

Mage Is [SenT]

A/E

Ua-bar:
Infuse; Evas; Fh; Patient; cure hex; seed of life; Ua; gole

Or the Mo/P-bar.

Hymn

Hymn

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2009

Legion of the Golden Aguila [PNOY]

Me/

Just a question, is bringing "CTH!" really useful? There are only 2 touch skills at the main team side (Lightning Touch and Throw dirt [I've been to teams where MoP brings Foul Feast])

Minimized Rook

Minimized Rook

Academy Page

Join Date: Jul 2006

Shadowlands Terrorists [SiT]

N/

I'll just assume you said CTT!
That's incredibly handy at the worms in forest.
I used to play MoP a LOT and when we got a team that all knew what they were doing I simply did not use foul feast very much (well, a few times each run). Not getting the front end of a manly spike blind is a huge advantage.

What I used to do as mop with a 100B that was used to me and vice versa was just spike the worms (1grp, usually) while he has ctt. He used to put up all preps, get ctt and go in so mop didn't get interrupted. If that spike failed not being blind is still a huge advantage.

As for lightning touch, that shouldn't affect you team alot. The only person that should get hit by it is the main tank. He shoudn't even be targetted by that much, since it's a touch skill used by casters.

To summarise: CTT! prevents blind by worms wich is very, VERY handy.

Vlad

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2009

Canada, UW

O.O

R/

Virgorous Spirit--- Never use it in fowsc but still have it on my bar for some reason.. Useless IMO

Saru The Boss

Saru The Boss

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Nov 2010

Texas

We Gat Dis [HRUU]

A/

Bring Great Dwarf Weapon!

Way2dead

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jul 2010

Me/

only problem then is splinter weapon..........

Windbow

Academy Page

Join Date: Dec 2010

R/A

You use it when the rit isn't around, during griffs for example.

tipiak

tipiak

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Nov 2006

Hellsace

F*ck Yeah Ion Cannons [dBal]

W/

Well, in guild run you can almost take what you want if your MT and spikers know what to do. I play RoJ with some antihex and seed just for kicks.

But when in PUG run, you'd better pack some heal. I think that vigorous is plain stupid. Almost every PUG monk plays it because it's on f**king PvX :

- first HP is not needed except if your MT is newb in FoW
- GoLE : I play with 45 energy and I rarely switch to staff or high mana set, but it might be needed to fuel your HP if MT is a freshman.
- vigorous : gets shattered everything when mesmers are encountered

So, what's to use ? I play :

patient's spirit
dwayna's kiss
infuse
seed
cure hex
remove hex (I like two antihexes with PUGs)
YMLaD (good when berserker are chasing you after a fail spike)
UA

Unless major fail occurs (massive aggro steal, MT dying, whatever), no one should die.

San Arios

San Arios

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jun 2011

Bernd das Brot [MisT]

Mo/

dwayna's |patient |seed |cure hex |fallback |ee |ymlad |ua
working very well if u got a not oo bad team (80% u got a team whos good enough)

Essence Snow

Essence Snow

Unbridled Enthusiasm!

Join Date: Nov 2009

EST

DPR

I'm going to have to agree with Panic. IF we are talking about PuG's, then some of these skills have uses. Asumming your MT(and really thats the player that matters) is lackluster...HP is the only O-S*&t skill, since it can save them from dying at the major pulls...toc..forge (360)...wailing. Besides that like others have said it's basically pointless. That being said going mo/e for gole is redundant. Vig spirit with it's 30 sec duration adds an enchant for d-kiss and relieves pressure from that war or derv that swings away blindly..again this would be based on poor spiking usually due to bad balling by the MT. CTT is crutch when it comes to wurms in the wailing forest. It out-performs the condition removal of the mop when it comes to throw dirt. 1 use of CTT at 6 spec is equal to up to 6 condition removal skill casts at wurms. FB will be on the mop if they are n/p so bringing that is meh.

Ofc alot of this is based on bad MT. There are other spikes where other members of the group should be aiding where typically they dont. example at forge where 360 pulls are concerned the eoe should be using technobable on the mesmer monk groups. That will aleaviate most casts of empathy. But ofc u must assume a lazy eoe...so bringing hex counters is recommended.

paranon

paranon

Site Contributor

Join Date: Aug 2006

UK

[Zraw]

Mo/

last post: May 27, 2011, 09:52 AM