The market nowadays....

Started playing again in last weeks, and i wonder: how the hell did the market get so fu***d up?? Stayed in spamadan for some hours trying to sell a VS and an Obby edge (lucky fow run ftw) and i saw a thing. Nothing but super rare weapons , rare mini and El tonics seem to sell easily anymore. Can some1 explain me how we got to this point? I know 6 years is a long time and it's a miracle this game is still alive but, come on.

Ppl finally starting realize Inscriable weapons suck

its like a friend just said and i quote: "u only got billionaires and (can't forget his wurds but) broke ass ninjas anymore." the rich ppl got everythign they want pretty much. and the broke ass 'ninjas' dont' got enough moneyz. my opinion anyways

pretty much this. Either you have 20 stacks of ecto and a stack of armbraces, or you are broke, as in zero gold. There is no in between. It\'s partly due to the age of the game, and partly due to powertraders who destroyed their own markets. Overfarming of ecto and armbraces is an issue too.

Well, more or less yeah. I hide out in the seeking services section a lot and meeting guys who have everything from Panda to Kanaxai and 20 stacks of ecto on top isn't uncommon at all. Most of the guys I do runs for easily has at least a solid 4-8 stacks. Or you have the guys who thinks more then 10k for a VQ service with 500 mobs is outrageous because they can't afford it. Also, apart from uninscribables. Everything in this game is incredibly easy to attain, probably wouldn't even have to spend a week to get a hold of Q9 BDS's for all of my heroes. Not that I'm going to but to illustrate a point, no inscribable is rare. Apart from a few items that simply put don't get farmed but are still popular. Bonecage Scythe \ Clockwork Scythe and Demoncrest Spear comes to mind.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Market_saturation

GW items don't go obsolete, especially since no new rares are being added, the population is decreasing. The only "societal change" I can think of is the implementation of 7 heroes and no one's buying Obby Edges for them.

Even the low end FoWSC players are running with VSs and Obby Edges now, no one's buying them.

the few people inbetween the uber rich and the super poor are not standing in spamdan...we are playing the game with our 7 heroes---making the few plat that we need to get that last armor for the HoM.....(that would be me...no stacks of ectos, no super rare minis--still want to get ahold of a zippy sometime....but I have almost a full HoM so now I just want the last few things ....).

im one of the few in between those two groups. im rich compared to the poor group but so very poor compared to the rich group. i can afford to buy low-middle end stuff but i will never ever be able to afford the minis i really want. like MKG or polar bear.

A lot of the in-between players are also pvpers, and they all quit. Most of the people that I used to HA with had 3-5 stacks of ectos at the least.

Yeah there's definitely lots of people in the middle of the two groups. But the large majority IS either uber rich or dirt poor.

I think im in the middle of the 2 groups o.O i can afford some things but not like the rly high end stuff.

Well, I think it's hard to say what's the in between and what's the extremities. Because, in my opinion, I'm in the in between, I have about a constant of ~500e. But to someone dirt poor I would be insanely rich, as in comparison, a guy with a storage pane full of ecto's and a stack of armbraces would be insanely rich to me. So to some people I would be already in the extremity of being loaded, as to myself I would consider me middleground.

@Shy, I beg to differ, the amount of people that are sitting on 100-250e constantly vastly outdoes the insanely rich. As to the dirt poor, they make up the biggest chunk of this game I think. You just don't see them on guru.

You think you hit the nail, the 91000 new player that appear every month (according to GW sales) just don't know this forum even exists. Only player that played a while appear on this forums, and most are dirty rich. I'm not rich but not poor either, i played only 2 weeks since i returned, and i think my 3 arms and 14 ectos are a nice start. Too bad the only char that is used for anything nowadays are the sins, which i'm too lazy to create.

@Bright: Nah I agree that 80% of players ARE dirt poor, 15% are filthy rich, and 5% are in the middle, but I feel like on the guru the vast majority of people you see are in that middle category. Realistically they only contribute to a small portion of the community, but the funny thing is I feel like 80% of those people are on the guru while like 0.01% of the poor, new players have never even heard of the guru.

P.S. I consider the middle to be 100-1000e

Id think way more then 5% be on middle.. as for traders around here.. most are at 100-1000e like me..

Exactly. 90% of the traders here on the guru are in the middle(100-1ke), but in the whole game's demographic, the middle is only like 5-10% of the whole guild wars community.
But yeah, the percentages are prolly way off. That was just me spontaneously guessing.

but also i would like to add as one of the middle class i consider myself is that most of us dont want the vs or obby edges because honestly those items are so played out they have been around and so overfarmed that they arent anything special anymore i would much rather have a gold inherent nice wep anyday and the ones that do want one they alrdy have had one for ages now

This pretty much.

In Guild Wars and real life, most people don't understand how to make money. They were never taught how to make money, hence most of the population doesn't have a lot of money. A lot of the rich people I knew in Guild Wars wouldn't even waste their fortunes on a single weapon. Sure, there are some who will, but for the most part people who have a lot of money (In games or in real life) don't necessarily buy lots of expensive items. A lot of them probably put that money into armor for HOM, weapons/mods for all of their heroes and themselves, titles such as the Zaishen Title, etc...Besides that, rich people probably keep their money. If they ever need more money in the future, already having money expedites the process. Not to mention, a lot of the rich players probably don't play much anymore or already have the fancy weapons they want.

^ +1

Also

After 6 years there's nothing left in this game that I want that I don't already have (There is no Everlasting Yakkington tonic, if there was I'd sell my mother to get one). I have no use for ecto or arms so I give them to friends & maintain about 100k in storage. The economy is useless to me & I'm sure I'm not the only one who just doesn't give a flying f**k in a rolling donut about the "state" of it anymore.

15% are rich? No way. That's saying 1 in 7 players is extremely rich. The value is probably 1-2% of people are actually rich. That's how it typically works in real life societies. You get ~1% of the population earning 95% of all the money that is being earned...then you have everybody else who gets a portion of the money the top 1% is earning.

Yeah, this is me. I've never been "rich", I maintain around 50e + like 300k liquid most of the time, now I got GWAMM and 50/50 as well as the weapons and armour I want I have nothing to spend my money on and no motivation to farm or play the markets.

I just play Pre Searing to get the last PvE title left that doesn't require stupid time/money (Lucky/Treasure/Wisdom), I don't clock enough playtime anymore to attempt those.

I guess I must be one of the poor ones then. Lucky if I ever have 500k, usually have 200-300. But then there's nothing I really want, I dont feel the need to be rich.

I'm nearly always cash poor, with everything stuck in ecto and items so I don't consider myself rich at all. I'm definitely not filthy rich like some of the guys who were around back before I left the game, omg.. the wealth was so sickening.

I can afford to buy whatever I want, probably, but I'd break myself to do it, which is a horrible feeling. I don't like not being able to have things, if they come about.

Yes there is.

I have less than 300e in total. And still can't find anything to buy. Nothing really piques my interest anymore. Most of high-end items never did.

My GF feels the same way. When she gets to 300k she goes out and buys another set of armor.

To most of the powertraders- Right, you may have 1000e or less, but how much is left in q7/8 weapons that haven't been sold yet? Would you say you have an equal amount of money in items or much, much more?

Also, stacks of consumables would count for this too...

Just to chime in... I'm sitting on almost 3 stacks of e. and about a mill worth of random cons that would be easy to sell... But I buy everything for my HoM... so sure, maybe we all have had 1000's of ecto.. 10-20 stacks of e.. but w/e. I dedicated my ghostly.. Because it's just ecto, and it comes and goes.

As for the gap... 2/3 are less than 250e. Of the remaining 1/3 i'd say 1/10 are over 10000e. Lot's of people have tons of ecto. And when I say tons I am speaking relative to myself. I know of quite a few people with more than 1000e, and several with over 5000e, and a couple with over 10000e. Whether it's in ecto/arms/minis/weapons is irrelevant. But that's just my opinion, and like everyone else's, it might be wrong.

Those with lots, have less than they want, those with none have less than they want. We're all the same, relatively speaking.

I dont power trade much anymore just bc todays current market is bleh and most people know prices on everything in the game just about. Currently I have 150k and 45 ecto just because I have just about everything I need. Now if you take all the stacks of cons and high end weapons that are not custo'd into account I have probably in the area of 3000e. If all my weapons were non custo'd around 5000e. Also I have no high end minis bc I just don't like them.

I'm sitting at ~500e atm, but I've easily spent about 600e-700e on Shields, and a friend still owes me 150e... I'm happy, I don't care tbh. I have every item I want, except for 1 shield that I'll probably never find anyway, and I have 50/50 etc etc.. I don't think I have to little, I'm a rich, lazy bastard that overpays everything he needs because he doesn't want to look for a nice deal and underasks everything he sells cause he can't be bothered to sell for long. Not everyone thinks they have too little tbh. A lot of my guildies are exactly the same as me.

But you made a good point though..

I doubt it. If I managed to find and buy a Bo Staff with 20 hct healing after years of searching, there's no reason for you not to find the shield you are looking for. Btw, what are you looking for anyway?

Any skin +10vGiants -2ench shield to finish my collection. I'm currently pending trade for a +10vSkeletons -2ench and with the Giants, I'll have every mod +10/-2...

Oh, you're looking for -2 ench mods along with +vs bad guys. That's going to be a nice collection indeed. I thought you were looking fot +vs bad guys and whatever and immediately thought of my pro paladin wamo. XD

Anyhow... If I ever see the giants one you'll be the first to know. Collections ftw. \o/

Eh, I'll chime in as one more inbetween.

I have 50/50, all the armor I could conceivably want/need, and the cash titles completed, so could easily run into silly richness. I even enjoy some farms (DoA/Vaettir), and can do whatever runs I could want for myself. However...
I loathe popular expensive weapon skins. They're really, really fugly. I was fully geared in gear I consider better looking, even if it is moderately priced, before I got into a ton of DoA (and rich) and well before WiK added the Oppressors. When I was buying minis for the HoM I aimed for minis that I like, leaving none that I really have to have. (Albeit, no bears, but again, I'm not fussed about them.) Between all of my elite armor and having all of the costumes, I'm really not a fan of EL tonics - I've put too much effort (and RL cash :/ ) into how my characters look to want to be anyone else.

So when I basically have everything I could want of any value that's 100k+, what point could I possibly have in building up stacks on stacks of ectos? I've got a number friends and guildies who are lucky to have over 300k on their own, and I love giving them little gifts like a set of elite armor. But that's not motivation for me - I have no intention of playing/farming the game for someone else.
I still enjoy playing the game, but have no interest in building wealth I can't spend for myself.

Inscriptions helped kill the market, but time was the biggest killer.

I'm uber rich according to the scale. But I'm not uber rich by a long shot. 1st time I saw a stack of arms, I realized I'd never get to that level. The dupers and early exploiters had gotten theirs and it would take luck or ridiculous amount of trading to catch up. I had 1k+ ectos a while back and decided to diversify so I bought a bunch of kuuns at their peak. Now they are worth a third of what I paid. Should have bought rare minis, weapons, ectos, but who knew. Weapons have taken a dive a different times and so have ectos.

Everyone is saying they're in the middle (100-1k e)? I'm counting gold, ectos, and minis and semi fluid items - anything dedicated or unsellable. If you have a weapon collection worth 2k+ ectos, then by the 1k ecto cap, you are wayyy over. Maybe it should be more like a stack to 7 stacks you are in the middle. With 7 stacks you could buy a polar bear, but can't buy an uber weapon or mini. There is value in collections. So more of you are ultra rich or we change the parameters. I also think there is a value on armor and uber weapons that are unded/ded. Armors have a set value. You have to pay the same amount of materials etc to craft them. Ded weapons on the other hand would be trickier. Though some we know.

Wealth is relative and it changes. If they reintroduced all the nerfed weapons from the early days? Then that valuable weapon collection wouldn't be worth nearly as much. If they started giving out ultra rare mini's as prizes, the value would drop. If they offered you to trade in unded year 1 whites for a special mini those 1k whites would sky rocket! :8)

The main thing we use to measure wealth in GW is ectos. If suddenly people needed large amounts of gold cuz they raised max trades to 1k plat and storage to 1000k platinum, ectos would probably drop like a rock. I have a theory that at any given time there are more ectos in the game than any other material. Simply because I don't know too many people that hoard several stacks of anything that doesn't get used on a regular basis (consumables etc). But we hoard ectos. Even check other rare materials... I've had stacks of shards, onyx, diamonds, steel, etc., but usually only for a short period of time. I never even seen a stack of rubies or sapphires.

Besides markers, what good are ectos? They can be used for 2 things and 2 things only. Obisidian armor and chaos gloves. That means there are probably enough ectos to get obs armor and chaos gloves for every active player that needs a set. Most people already have their set of fow for hom. Many have several sets. By supply, ectos could be one of the least valuable materials in the game.

Thats to note that nothing is safe in game. Only the people who have inside info know what's up. Did you notice how much alcohol spiked the month leading up to update? You couldn't give it away for weeks and then people were getting 70+ a point? 90 a point days before? Why was that? It was probably because some players had inside info and bought it up.

So I may not have as much as lot of people, but I've found the best investment by far and a lot of the ultra rich have no clue. I help my friends. I find out what goals someone has for their title or hom and get them it. Probably the best thing Ive done with those pink pixels.

Games dead. Finish your titles, homs, your one last collection and then help others. Save some for the potential gw2 to gw1 trades that you might need to make and then make someones week. When one of the old school ultra rich quit my friends guild, he bought his guildies everything they wanted. You can do that or horde it all to impress some geek. It's just a game.

Basically what I did I had more ecto than I cared for helped get obby armor for around 12 friends that only had enough cash/mats for 1 piece.

That was a very nice gesture indeed. /thumbs_up

this.

when random gold drops went from being possibly worth something to 200-400gold at the merchant tops, that's when the market died.

if you get a gold drop in NF or Eotn, doing missions, it's going to be worth like 2-5k max. and that's if you wanna spend 5-30 minutes selling it.

Trade spam in Kamadan is as dizzying as ever.

Introduce an auction house and the middle ground will be established in a flash.