Avatar of Dwayna Imbagon variant

And given enough targets even less, but the point of an imbagon approach is to keep SY! up permanently without gaps. So the time it takes to run inbetween two groups can potentially result in a downtime which in turn can result in death. If your running that far to get to another group even the imbagon will take a while to get up SY as a dervish in a balanced team of hero's you will find keeping SY is very easy when you are running to the next group.

But hey that's my reasoning to stay with scythe an imitation build will not keep SY up like imba can or even the d-slasher. Same go's with dervish why do you think there is so many SY spamming dervish's around?

Heart of Fury expends a few strikes for SY! though so using Pious Fury would probably be better for the teardown effect. Zealous Renewal is kindof a given in the build though, for the energy management problems. Zealous spear should cover it fine IMO, assuming you don't use pious fury exactly due to emanage problems. A 10r that must be toredown on 10r just doesn't synergize with lyssa's haste approach, you can do it for slightly better adrenaline but it will cost some heals.

This build here:
OgGjomrJLTzXvXoXIYqXEYihxgA

Mysticism 12+1+2
Wind Prayers 9
Earth Prayers 9

Avatar of Dwayna (Elite)
Meditation
Lyssa's Haste
Whirling Charge
Fleeting Stability
Conviction
Pious Fury
Save Yourselves!

Equipment: Zealous Spear of *Anything but Enchanting*
Variants:
Replace Conviction with Eremite's Zeal if you run into energy problems.
Replace Conviction with Mystic Healing if anyone is running party wide enchantments (such as Aegis, Order of Pain, etc.)
Spec 9 Tactics instead of 9 Earth Prayers for Additional armor
Use more PvE-only skills". Really like the idea behind this build. Being a frontliner(/tank support I suppose, instead of actual tank ) can get a bit dull, especially in melee hating pve areas... Kind of a like a less offensive, but more reliable Orders D/N.

Thanks for posting it can't wait to try it out!

The biggest advantage of a Dwayna Imba is the fact you can pump out NOT ONLY +100 armor, but +50 healing to the entire party in a reliable (if not constant) fashion as well. One of the reasons why Para Imba is almost always more effective than any other SY! spammer is positioning- they don't have to push/stand at the front of the fight; paras can guarantee EVERY party member is under the effects of SY! by simply re-positioning.

What I'm getting to is that you should try this more defensive-oriented build. It allows you to ram up the defensive with a Dervish and be potentially more effective defensively than a Paragon Imbagon. This build also allows you to consider the positioning factor- that you don't have to be at the frontline of every fight.

This build here:
OgGjomrJLTzXvXoXIYqXEYihxgA

Mysticism 12+1+2
Wind Prayers 9
Earth Prayers 9

Avatar of Dwayna (Elite)
Meditation
Lyssa's Haste
Whirling Charge
Fleeting Stability
Conviction
Pious Fury
Save Yourselves!

Equipment: Zealous Spear of *Anything but Enchanting*
Variants:
Replace Conviction with Eremite's Zeal if you run into energy problems.
Replace Conviction with Mystic Healing if anyone is running party wide enchantments (such as Aegis, Order of Pain, etc.)
Spec 9 Tactics instead of 9 Earth Prayers for Additional armor
Use more PvE-only skills

Usage:
Spam 1-2-3-4-5-6-7
Use 6 + 7 for more controllable party healing (and IAS)
Spam 8 (Duh)
6 makes you more durable than the Paragon Imbagon (condition removal + bonus from mysticism + +10 armor + 8 AL from shield = better than para)

IF you could use cons+blessings+sup rune of Mysticism, you could potentially increase Meditation's energy return to 5 (at 18 specced), allowing you to spam a lot more.

This build is strictly oriented more defensively than other Imba builds, making it less "imba'd" but better than a Paragon Imbagon with essentially a spammable "TNTF!". Don't have time to properly test it right now but this is definitely along the lines of what I was looking for. Did a very quick test against mr. master of damage on battle islands showing that using a spear the adrenaline for SY! would charge in 7 seconds. But that's while taking zero damage! If you taken even just a little, it will charge in 6 seconds of less easily enabling you to keep it up 100% at R10+. Team heal spamming is also solid. That said energy management seemed very solid even without Meditation. So that one can definitely be removed and replaced with a better option, presuming there is one ofc xD (Probably should be because meditation has aftercast delay)

A short second after that I came up with this bar: Energy management is 100% solid unless facing energy denial and you have Zealous Renewal to cope with that. The highlight would be the 8\10 second uptime on 50% block which again adds even more to your self protection on top of hex removal and heals.

OgGjomrJLT8FjbihkbIYqXEYvXA

Nevermind the bonetti's defence, using a PVP character to test so thats just a 8 adrenaline substitute for SY! in order to replicate the usage effectively.

Don't have time to properly test it right now but this is definitely along the lines of what I was looking for. Did a very quick test against mr. master of damage on battle islands showing that using a spear the adrenaline for SY! would charge in 7 seconds. But that's while taking zero damage! If you taken even just a little, it will charge in 6 seconds of less easily enabling you to keep it up 100% at R10+. Team heal spamming is also solid. That said energy management seemed very solid even without Meditation. So that one can definitely be removed and replaced with a better option, presuming there is one ofc xD (Probably should be because meditation has aftercast delay)

A short second after that I came up with this bar: Energy management is 100% solid unless facing energy denial and you have Zealous Renewal to cope with that. The highlight would be the 8\10 second uptime on 50% block which again adds even more to your self protection on top of hex removal and heals.

OgGjomrJLT8FjbihkbIYqXEYvXA

Nevermind the bonetti's defence, using a PVP character to test so thats just a 8 adrenaline substitute for SY! in order to replicate the usage effectively. That's great. Although, why Zealous Renewal? Do you really need double zealous (unless you didn't have Zealous spear?)?

Also an idea occurred to me-
If you kept Lyssa's Haste and ran Balthazar's Aura instead, and ONLY used BA to fuel Pious Fury, would it be possible to keep up SY! ? 100% of the time at less than r10 (except on rare occasion when you want to lose a condition with Conviction) and still maintain energy/survivability?
FGJ! is also a viable temporary option as well.

That's great. Although, why Zealous Renewal? Do you really need double zealous (unless you didn't have Zealous spear?)?

Also an idea occurred to me-
If you kept Lyssa's Haste and ran Balthazar's Aura instead, and ONLY used BA to fuel Pious Fury, would it be possible to keep up SY! ? 100% of the time at less than r10 (except on rare occasion when you want to lose a condition with Conviction) and still maintain energy/survivability?
FGJ! is also a viable temporary option as well. No, mostly not. Which is why I prefer stripping it right away for instant 5 energy gain + healing. Basically it gives you a free Pious Fury cast which really is all you need. Either way it's a better form of energy management then meditation by afar.

On the Balthazar's Rage side of things, you can definitely swap that in somehow and strip using Pious Fury. Though I'm not quite sure you would actually gain anything from that since the cooldown is way longer then the duration of SY! you wouldn't be able to keep it up permanently.

So in short, the only way of keeping SY! up 100% of the time is to either have an outside adrenaline buff, higher IAS (green rock candy \ BU + Pious for 33% permanent) or simply put take more damage.

I'm not sure why you want to keep Lyssa's Haste though, reapplying enchantments does not trigger Avatar of Dwayna, so Lyssa's Haste opens up for the possibility of messing up the build more then you could possibly gain. Also Lyssa's itself has a long cooldown and a cast time

Call me crazy, but isn't the imbagon build suppose to mainly keep up tntf (which dervs can't use) and sy? Isn't damage suppose to be supplied by the rest of the team? I may be wrong tho, but I think spamming spear of fury and just attacking is faster than having to run up to all of the enemies which may die and have you running in circles this causig u no gain in adrnl an no party buffing will occur. TNTF: Horribly overrated. Only nominally useful next to SY.
Upkeeping SY: If the Derv upkeeps SY 100%, its not like a paragon using SY more often somehow makes it more effective. If anything, the Derv is less vulnerable in dangerous areas (specifically DoA) because AoD gives hex immunity to horrible things that would prevent adrenal gain.

Damage is always useful, no matter where it is coming from. Especially Scythe AoE damage.

Having to run up to enemies is the main problem. Ideally, you want to be the first one running in and to have a monk dump PS/SoA on you to make you invincible while you tank damage and get SY up. I don't find this to be a problem, especially if I have Fleeting Stability though its hard to fit it, and AoD's SY builds end up much more useful than Imbagon's. But its certainly a lot less fail-proof, which is what pugs more desire.

Reading these post help me developed my own variant of the "Dwayna Imbagon". Instead of going for a spear and focusing on pure defense, I wanted some sort of build that puts out noticeable damage and gives out +50 heals with +100 armor to the whole party. I put together something like this:

Scythe Mastery: 8+1+1
Wind Prayers: 10+1
Mysticism: 12+3

Grenth's Aura
Zealous Renewal
Eremite's Zeal
Whirling Charge
"Save Yourselves!"
Pious Fury
Banishing Strike
Avatar of Dwayna

Vampiric Scythe (for more dmg)

What I do is I run in with Whirling Charge in Dwayna form and right before I hit the mob, I hit pious fury then go to 1->2->3->4 while auto attacking. I always hit banishing strike whenever its off cooldown, and the skills should align up correctly where Pious Fury tears down Eremite's then Zealous. After you teardown Zealous, Grenth should be coming off soon (which is a +50 heal to everybody when it does), and then back to 1->2->3->4. And of course spam the heck out of SY!. Don't forget to hit Whirling Charge whenever it comes off cooldown since that is a free +50 heal to the party. The heals are quite nice, it isn't a constant +50, but it's frequent enough. Very frequent IMO.

Whirling Charge semi fixes the slow switch from targets that are far apart, and the damage isn't that bad. Around 40dps or so and all armor ignoring (then again, Master of Damage isn't really a sound test). So this build allows you to pump out 40dps (or more depending on how many targets you hit), +50 heals to allies/party, and +100 armor. It's the closest thing I got to a "hybrid" in guild wars and it works pretty well.

Variants could be switching out GA for AoHM when running in places with a lot of undead since the life steal part doesn't get the bonus damage. If someone else is bringing SY!, you can bring AoHM.

Give feedback on the build and tell me where I can improve on!
problems with this build:

Using a spear allows U to stay in midline. Which is important for Save yourself and Dwayna to affact all party members, not just frontline.

I made this build: OgGjUhqKLT9gvXXFoXIYih8ExgA

This keeps SY and dwayna going at a consistent rate. The only down side is "DpS" takes a backseat. In my opinion casters should be doing the DPS anyways.

PS. A tactic shield and a spear of enchanting is the set U should stay on the whole time.

problems with this build:

Using a spear allows U to stay in midline. Which is important for Save yourself and Dwayna to affact all party members, not just frontline.

I made this build: OgGjUhqKLT9gvXXFoXIYih8ExgA

This keeps SY and dwayna going at a consistent rate. The only down side is "DpS" takes a backseat. In my opinion casters should be doing the DPS anyways.

PS. A tactic shield and a spear of enchanting is the set U should stay on the whole time.
Mmm I did try a spear variation before I made the build posted, but I dislike doing such pitiful damage. And although I may not focus on maxing defense, most battles in guildwars don't seperate the backline and frontline so much that shouts won't affect them. If anything, you can always flag and pull. And with a high enough kurizck/luxon rank, keeping up SY! shouldn't be a problem with dark fury while being a frontliner. I'll try give spear another shot though, thanks for the reply!

PS: Wouldn't a spear of enchanting go against the idea of having your enchantments fall off as possible to maximize dwayna heals?

Mmm I did try a spear variation before I made the build posted, but I dislike doing such pitiful damage. And although I may not focus on maxing defense, most battles in guildwars don't seperate the backline and frontline so much that shouts won't affect them. If anything, you can always flag and pull. And with a high enough kurizck/luxon rank, keeping up SY! shouldn't be a problem with dark fury while being a frontliner. I'll try give spear another shot though, thanks for the reply!

PS: Wouldn't a spear of enchanting go against the idea of having your enchantments fall off as possible to maximize dwayna heals?
Only reason I have a spear of enchanting is to keep Lyssa's Haste up longer. That being said Extend Enchantments + Lyssa's Haste might be better. that way way U don't need a spear of enchanting.

Only reason I have a spear of enchanting is to keep Lyssa's Haste up longer. That being said Extend Enchantments + Lyssa's Haste might be better. that way way U don't need a spear of enchanting. Avatar of Dwayna only heals when enchantments end, not when they're reset. It was discussed previously that Lyssa's Haste is redundant and unnecessary for the build.

Avatar of Dwayna only heals when enchantments end, not when they're reset. It was discussed previously that Lyssa's Haste is redundant and unnecessary for the build. Besides the fact that U get a 33% reduction on whirling charge? Interesting.. never saw that thread

problems with this build:

Using a spear allows U to stay in midline. Which is important for Save yourself and Dwayna to affact all party members, not just frontline.
Why? if you are so far away that SY does not affect your party members you got bigger problems I guess.