Save Fort Aspenwood
chuckles79
I sheepishly withdraw my panic. I didn't count on so many long-time Kurzick players, having seen what kills them and what doesn't, becoming motivated to switch sides.
makosi
They'll have to encourage Luxon playing in FA. Fixing ye olde turtle stalling bug would be a good start I think.
Our Virus
This makes me happier to be onthe Luxon side. With all my scrubby faction-mates on the other side, I now get in matches faster and farm te boobs who are looking for quick factions. I net alot more per match now, and still win very often. Honestly, I cap the quarry mine things and let kurz cap them back do I can farm more npc
IronSheik
Fix turtles, add a tad more winning factions to keep up with JQ/Vanquishing, it'll revive.
tummlykins
They might actually have to balance the arena properly this time. It has seriously been one sided since they reduced the victory time for the Kurzicks. There are so many exploitable AI flaws which allow Kurzicks to gain an unfair advantage (aside from also not requiring Kurzicks to actively do anything to win, whereas Luxons have to play torwards a specific win condition).
There have been so many suggestions for ArenaNet to fix the arena and many bugs/exploits/poor programming threads but they have all been ignored. They should have a good indicator of which side has a greater advantage simply by looking at the wait list to get in (FA Luxon side always has a much smaller population, same with the JQ due to that stupid map design bug which also favours the Kurzicks).
If you want to be infuriated by a poorly maintained arena, look at all the crap and garbage FA players had to waid through over the years just to get a few matches in an otherwise fine arena. From leeching, turtle respawn bugs, one interupt attacks, moronic turtle AI downgrades (why they did this is beyond me) and the victory timer reduction (instead of requiring Kurzicks to actively participate in the arena by increasing the timer reduction from amber - cause they never give it to Gunther with the current pointless design) just look at FA now.
There have been so many suggestions for ArenaNet to fix the arena and many bugs/exploits/poor programming threads but they have all been ignored. They should have a good indicator of which side has a greater advantage simply by looking at the wait list to get in (FA Luxon side always has a much smaller population, same with the JQ due to that stupid map design bug which also favours the Kurzicks).
If you want to be infuriated by a poorly maintained arena, look at all the crap and garbage FA players had to waid through over the years just to get a few matches in an otherwise fine arena. From leeching, turtle respawn bugs, one interupt attacks, moronic turtle AI downgrades (why they did this is beyond me) and the victory timer reduction (instead of requiring Kurzicks to actively participate in the arena by increasing the timer reduction from amber - cause they never give it to Gunther with the current pointless design) just look at FA now.
FoxBat
Fine with it languishing until devs can be bothered to balance. In meantime, kurzick farmers might play AB instead, which suits me fine.
melissa b
What if you don't get to pick a side, instead your randomly assigned as a kurzick or luxon? So no matter how lopsided the outposts are, as long as their combined sum is 16 players, matches will start.
tummlykins
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Originally Posted by melissa b
What if you don't get to pick a side, instead your randomly assigned as a kurzick or luxon? So no matter how lopsided the outposts are, as long as their combined sum is 16 players, matches will start.
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ThiaTheMuse
Personally, I think this is a good quick-fix. I'm a Kurzick supporter myself (their armor is cooler imho), but now I can jump over to the Luxon side and still get my desired Faction. Plus, Luxons actually earn more Faction than Kurzicks, so I think that is a pretty good incentive.
vader
I saw this on the wiki update notes this morning (didn't see it there last night):
I never play Luxon so I don't know how much faction you originally got for destroying a gate but it seems to be a fairly large increase.
EDIT: Checking the wiki it looks like it used to be 300 faction per gate and is now 500 faction per gate. Looks like the % is wrong in the notes.
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The faction rewards in Guild Wars Factions PvP formats were also increased: Fort Aspenwood now gives twice the faction for kills, twice the faction for completion of God's Vengeance on the Kurzick side, and ~667% more faction for unique gates destroyed from Luxon side. Jade Quarry now gives 20% more faction for each piece of jade and twice the amount of faction for kills. |
EDIT: Checking the wiki it looks like it used to be 300 faction per gate and is now 500 faction per gate. Looks like the % is wrong in the notes.
Eramon
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Originally Posted by tummlykins
Because both sides have different strategies, that would completely destroy the viability of bringing certain builds. A bonder or rit lord on the Kurzick side is incredibly powerful, on the Luxon side they are useless. There are things they can do to balance the arena, they just need to bother to do it.
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As far as a solution to FA, fix turtles. Change the Luxon NPC skills so the people who INSIST to play melee characters don't completely suck.
Maybe put your developer-like minds together and find a way to make things a little more interesting.
Alvarez
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Originally Posted by vader
I never play Luxon so I don't know how much faction you originally got for destroying a gate but it seems to be a fairly large increase.
EDIT: Checking the wiki it looks like it used to be 300 faction per gate and is now 500 faction per gate. Looks like the % is wrong in the notes. |
You do get 500 for each gate destroyed and an additional 500 for klilling Gunther (aka winning). So a total of 3,000 Imperial for a win and I think it's 20 Imperial for each kill.
chuckles79
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Originally Posted by Alvarez
I played a round last night, on Luxon. I went in with 0 Imperial and came out with a little over 5,000 after my first match, a win.
You do get 500 for each gate destroyed and an additional 500 for klilling Gunther (aka winning). So a total of 3,000 Imperial for a win and I think it's 20 Imperial for each kill. |
Shayne Hawke
Fort Aspenwood was never a fairly sided arena in the first place, and I have no qualms about seeing it disappear from activity (which it won't, because of Z-quests).
BlackSephir
Ah, biscuits, just as I'm almost R12.
Anyway, fix bugs (turtles, 8 luxon warriors spawning, lower the efficiency of heals between a healer and his healee if they're separated by a gate.
Make turtles smarter by not being stalled by gimmicky tanks.
Anyway, fix bugs (turtles, 8 luxon warriors spawning, lower the efficiency of heals between a healer and his healee if they're separated by a gate.
Make turtles smarter by not being stalled by gimmicky tanks.
Ghull Ka
That's weird, I would expect everyone to love playing Luxons.
I'm in a kurzick guild and am very pleased that now I can work on my Kurzick rep while healing turtles.
<3 turtles
I'm in a kurzick guild and am very pleased that now I can work on my Kurzick rep while healing turtles.
<3 turtles
Hobbs
I find both sides fun, but prefer playing Luxon. I'd be sad to see FA die, a fix for stuck turtles and a buff when you're around them like Juggernauts or shrines in AB would be nice.
Quantum Duck
People who want to get into a match instantly will play Luxon.
makosi
FA would be greatly invigorated if people were actually banned for leeching. I've said this before and I'll repeat it until it's enforced.
With the new rewards, there's even greater incentive to leech and the dishonor system does not counteract it enough. The devs don't seem to appreciate how detrimental one leecher is to a team in FA and they aren't acting appropriately enough.
Grow some balls and whip the ban scythe out.
With the new rewards, there's even greater incentive to leech and the dishonor system does not counteract it enough. The devs don't seem to appreciate how detrimental one leecher is to a team in FA and they aren't acting appropriately enough.
Grow some balls and whip the ban scythe out.
Ka Tet
I actually preferred playing on the Luxon side. I may come back and do some FA, I miss EOE bombs.
BlackSephir
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Originally Posted by makosi
FA would be greatly invigorated if people were actually banned for leeching. I've said this before and I'll repeat it until it's enforced.
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ANet doesn't think so apparently.
Horus Moonlight
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Originally Posted by BlackSephir
You'd think that a simple check if a player has not moved from his spot for x seconds would be better than relying on people's intelligence and trusting they will actually report leechers.
ANet doesn't think so apparently. |
BlackSephir
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Originally Posted by Horus Moonlight
ANet has already implemented this.
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Horus Moonlight
Because dishonor isn't permanent.
MithranArkanere
I strongly think this mode needs to have positions reversed randomly, so instead having some always attacking and some always defending, what you'll willbe random.
That or having both sides mirrored, having both attacking and defending, like in the Snow Battle of the Gods.
That or having both sides mirrored, having both attacking and defending, like in the Snow Battle of the Gods.
makosi
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Originally Posted by BlackSephir
Then why do I see the same characters leeching?
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This means that you can go to bed/work/school with GW on and an auto clicker to enter FA. You will get timed out for dishonor but your faction cap is likely to be full when you return.
Someone at anet will have to get a finger out and wave the ban stick (or at the very least, threaten the ban stick).
toek_boer
Good day to all,
Ive enjoyed Fort Aspenwood for a long time. I used to play Luxon, it was always a bit more of a challange to me. I think most of us agree that Kurzick is slightly favoured. This is proven by the numbers of people joining the sides, Kurzick has always been busier.
I think thats because the goals of the game are not clear to everybody. Most people just seem to attack whatever they see, the thing its, it works on Kurzick side but it doesnt work on Luxon side. This is why people keep coming back to Kurzick, but not really to Luxon. Ive always thought this was more of challange so thats why I played Luxon.
The thing I dont get is, why did they buff Kurzick, faction-wise that is. Its totally uncalled for. This makes a lot of players who know what to do in this map, shift to Kurzick. Of course this results in mass-monking on the Kurzick side. Easy games.
So, whats left? Kurzick had more players, even more players shift to Kurzick...
The Kurzick waits increase and FA slowly dies?
What needs to be done imo is the following:
1) Restore the balance faction-wise. I know what ANet may have been thinking, if Luxons win, they win within a smaller timeframe, so more faction per minute. But, at this moment, fact is that Luxon side is harder, so, if something is harder, more faction may be awarded for a win.
2) Add a FA-Mission GUI. Maybe something like a textbox with objectives and checkboxes to direct players in the right direction, especially for the luxons. Im sure a lot of people use the minimap to see these things, but a lot do not.
3) Deal with bugs, ANet cannot or simply will not fix them, nothing you can do about it. FA was doable before this Kurzick faction-wise buff. I would also like to see them fixed, but if it was possible, why hasnt it been done yet?
Hope somebody reads this.
PS. Im against randomizing the sides. I love the fact that you have to pick a build which is defensive, runner, offensive, supportive, etc. Putting both sides together only encourages meta and cookie-cutter builds.
Ive enjoyed Fort Aspenwood for a long time. I used to play Luxon, it was always a bit more of a challange to me. I think most of us agree that Kurzick is slightly favoured. This is proven by the numbers of people joining the sides, Kurzick has always been busier.
I think thats because the goals of the game are not clear to everybody. Most people just seem to attack whatever they see, the thing its, it works on Kurzick side but it doesnt work on Luxon side. This is why people keep coming back to Kurzick, but not really to Luxon. Ive always thought this was more of challange so thats why I played Luxon.
The thing I dont get is, why did they buff Kurzick, faction-wise that is. Its totally uncalled for. This makes a lot of players who know what to do in this map, shift to Kurzick. Of course this results in mass-monking on the Kurzick side. Easy games.
So, whats left? Kurzick had more players, even more players shift to Kurzick...
The Kurzick waits increase and FA slowly dies?
What needs to be done imo is the following:
1) Restore the balance faction-wise. I know what ANet may have been thinking, if Luxons win, they win within a smaller timeframe, so more faction per minute. But, at this moment, fact is that Luxon side is harder, so, if something is harder, more faction may be awarded for a win.
2) Add a FA-Mission GUI. Maybe something like a textbox with objectives and checkboxes to direct players in the right direction, especially for the luxons. Im sure a lot of people use the minimap to see these things, but a lot do not.
3) Deal with bugs, ANet cannot or simply will not fix them, nothing you can do about it. FA was doable before this Kurzick faction-wise buff. I would also like to see them fixed, but if it was possible, why hasnt it been done yet?
Hope somebody reads this.
PS. Im against randomizing the sides. I love the fact that you have to pick a build which is defensive, runner, offensive, supportive, etc. Putting both sides together only encourages meta and cookie-cutter builds.
makosi
@toes_boer, I agree with almost all of your post.
This is a too big a problem for the Luxon side. The reason the turtles' attacks were modified and buffed so many times was to try to offset the Kurzick advantage and bring each side in to alignment. As it stands now (actually, for several years), the turtles are becoming stuck on the spot and will not progress.
I whine about this a lot and get the same old answer, "you don't need turtles to win." I know this - Gunther just has to die to win - but the disadvantage experienced by the Luxon side is so great when one or more turtles are out of play. And, of course, broken turtles don't die and therefore don't respawn.
To "deal with bugs" isn't the right attitude. Fixing bugs of this magnitude is what needs to be done. Anet are still supporting the format by having Zaishen Combat days and Competitive Mission weekend events yet they bury their head in the sand with turtles.
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| Deal with bugs, ANet cannot or simply will not fix them, nothing you can do about it. |
I whine about this a lot and get the same old answer, "you don't need turtles to win." I know this - Gunther just has to die to win - but the disadvantage experienced by the Luxon side is so great when one or more turtles are out of play. And, of course, broken turtles don't die and therefore don't respawn.
To "deal with bugs" isn't the right attitude. Fixing bugs of this magnitude is what needs to be done. Anet are still supporting the format by having Zaishen Combat days and Competitive Mission weekend events yet they bury their head in the sand with turtles.
Urcscumug
To me that says that the turtle issue is too complicated to solve. It probably has something to do with AI and the FA map. Neither of which can be easily changed by the live team.
makosi
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Originally Posted by Urcscumug
To me that says that the turtle issue is too complicated to solve. It probably has something to do with AI and the FA map. Neither of which can be easily changed by the live team.
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The Luxon Warriors follow the turtle, which cannot move if the warriors have collision.
ShaJiexi
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Originally Posted by makosi
I'm inclined towards the idea that the turtle becomes stuck because the Luxon Warriors are blocking the way. The Luxon Warriors are programmed to encircle their turtle which means that when the mob goes out to fight then returns, the might be blocking it's path.
The Luxon Warriors follow the turtle, which cannot move if the warriors have collision. |
It must be an AI issue. Though it would be nice if someone could SS a stuck turtle with no warrior entourage, just to make sure ^_^
makosi
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Originally Posted by ShaJiexi
If it were that simple, they could simply remove warrior/turtle collision. Solved.
It must be an AI issue. Though it would be nice if someone could SS a stuck turtle with no warrior entourage, just to make sure ^_^ |
toek_boer
If it really was simple to solve, then you would expect it to be solved already right? (Right?)
I've never seen a stuck turtle without warriors.
Assuming the warriors ARE the cause, how about a skill like Carrier Defense, only it works on Allies? This should not be hard to implement, no changes to the map or AI (maybe minor). Most of it is duplicating a skill and changing a few mods of that skill.
I've never seen a stuck turtle without warriors.
Assuming the warriors ARE the cause, how about a skill like Carrier Defense, only it works on Allies? This should not be hard to implement, no changes to the map or AI (maybe minor). Most of it is duplicating a skill and changing a few mods of that skill.
melissa b
What about an account based rotate system?...regardless on what side your on you play 3 times as a kurzick and then 3 times as a luxon and so on. There could be an icon to indicate what you will play as next.
Coraline Jones
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Originally Posted by BlackSephir
You'd think that a simple check if a player has not moved from his spot for x seconds would be better than relying on people's intelligence and trusting they will actually report leechers.
ANet doesn't think so apparently. |
Despite that I was clearly playing and using spells to counter bombers and such in every game, I would get Dishonor Points and get temp banned despite that nobody had issued a single report against me while I was playing. After a time, I realized that the game didn't want me to play defensive at all, and I switched to standard gimmick builds.
The system that you described has done literally nothing to help the situation. Sure, leeching is almost never done anymore. Now it's full-blown botting where you have an AI-controlled player running around like an idiot and clicking the buttons so it looks like they are playing. Whenever ANet does any kind of automated system to get rid of exploiters, then all this does is slow them down for two weeks at most. The botters have far more resources than all of ANet, and they quickly figure out how to counter any preventive measure and keep on doing it.
ShaJiexi
Turtles got stuck in 4/5 matches played as Luxon today. Each time had warriors right in front of them. Guessing it is a blocking issue.
On a side note, killed Gunther while the weapon was at 26%. Kurzick side had 3 monks, at least two of which were healers. I felt kinda sorry for them :\
On a side note, killed Gunther while the weapon was at 26%. Kurzick side had 3 monks, at least two of which were healers. I felt kinda sorry for them :\
Kanyatta
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Originally Posted by Urcscumug
To me that says that the turtle issue is too complicated to solve..
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Maybe I'm just that lucky to have less than a 2% turtle block rate, but I've just rolled a DwG Rit and I've won at least 80% of the games I've played on the Luxon side. It's so easy to just spike out the Green Gate guards and then spike out each gatekeeper while a monk isn't paying attention. And you only have to kill one Gatekeeper each respawn, since there's no Death Penalty, and there's definitely enough power in one Ritualist to put out enough damage to kill any single gatekeeper within 3 seconds (Spirit Rift, Channeled Strike, DwG, along with Ancestor's Rage + 2nd DwG, if necessary). The only time I ever really lose is when there's a bond monk and no one with mass enchant removal on the Luxon side.
Overall, the map is sided more heavily towards the Kurzick side, since they're playing defense and have all the NPC advantages, but whenever you stick 8 random PvE-ers together, there's not going to be much coordination leading to good play. Same for the Luxon side. That's why everyone just plays builds where they can stay alive solo for as long as possible, and that's the downfall of FA. Unless you allow groups a certain period of time to discuss strat or share builds, FA is always going to be like it is right now, and that's what makes it different from any other form of "PvP" (using that term lightly).
So, I dunno, to me the only solution to change FA is if syncing is encouraged, or something like that. I feel like FA is suiting its purpose exactly as it was intended right now. 8 randoms grouping together and fighting NPC's and another team of randoms...
Skyy High
Imperial faction made FA so much more replayable.
SebaZ
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Originally Posted by makosi
They'll have to encourage Luxon playing in FA. Fixing ye olde turtle stalling bug would be a good start I think.
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Hobbs
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Originally Posted by Skyy High
Imperial faction made FA so much more replayable.
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