Update - Thursday, July 14, 2011

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Feedb...dates/20110714

Does anyone else find it amusing(and lame) that we can't use our EL tonics for this as well? Why not just be honest ANet and tell us that you are more about rewarding players that spend money in the cash shop as opposed to rewarding players that are loyal(6th year gifts are EL tonics that can be used in explorables for those not catching my meaning).

Making an account 6 years ago =/= loyalty. Also, loyalty doesn't exactly pay bills.

I can only speak to my loyalty for 6 years. I also see no reason why both shouldn't have been included.

Just because you bought the game 6 years ago, doesn't mean you've been playing for 6 years and doesn't mean loyalty. be happy you get anything at all for having the game and that anet is willing to give you something for buying it. as stated above, free bday presents doesn't pay their bills. There are people that bought the game 6 years ago played for a few months and put it down never to pick it up again until recently in anticipation for gw2....get over it.

like i said above, i can only speak to myself and the loyalty i have had to this game over the last 6 years. it would have been a nice addition is what i am saying, but everything these days seems to cater to what we buy in the shop.

What I find amusing is people caring about tonics.

Wintersday in July is going to happen?

Will I be able to obtain endless amounts of Candy Canes again!?

You want to try and bodyblock kunnavang?

Tonics and minis > game balance.

http://guildwars.com/events/ingame/wintersday_in_july/

And unless you grind the Snowball Arena the entire time, no (same page says "Earn these colorful fragments by competing in the Snowball Arena.")

If by "rewarding players that spend money in the cash shop" you mean "allow them to use something that gives no bonus or advantage what-so-ever", then I guess you're right.

Exactly, it is not exactly a reward to be able to use costumes. Tonics would be more annoying seeing as there can be some pretty big tonics out there and it would get pretty confusing. Honestly, I don't see the need for costumes either but they are not rewarding players that spend money in the cash shop.

Loyalty vs profit.

Loyalty well yes I am loyal to gw but if a better game came along I would be loyal to that too, and if GW became stale or just plain bad I would cease to be loyal.
Though I really love GW it isn't loyalty in its truest sense because I am here because it pleases me, so my loyalty is rather self serving.

Profit well of course they created GW to make money and to do that they aim to please the customers ie us.
If they didn't work that way they would go bust and there would be no gw.
So their reasons are as self serving as ours, we are in a mutually beneficial arrangement.
We pay then they please us, so that we pay them more and so on.

So they can create as many cosmetic add ons as they like to keep the cash rolling in as long as the game is free to play.

Venerated played should be given some love. Do not attempt to claim that Anet couldn't tell if a particular account has been active or sedentary for years at a time. this could be very easily accomplished.

I think Jazilla was trying to convey the sentiment that they can "pay their bills" by offering items/content through their shop while also proportionately offering freebies and gimmicky "fun" items for free.

You seem to ignore the potential for balance in this respect.

I find it entertaining people still complain after asking for this for so long.

Besides, they ARE catering to veteran players by allowing them to use festival hats.

yea, people complain too much. just enjoy the way it is now. its not going to ruin the game.

It's probably just an oversight. They knew that festival hats and costumes were something people wanted to wear all the time, especially when they first got them. People also wanted to make their characters as festive as possible during the holiday special events. These things specifically brought attention towards costumes and festival hats (seeing as they are both released during festivals, yet are not usable during the main activity in those festivals).

I think if you brought it to their attention, and the coding wasn't too difficult, ArenaNet would probably allow tonics in festival arenas as well.

I do think it's interesting in GW2 they emphasise how visual things will be (like different coloured AoE effects to indicate which team used them) and here in GW1 we will be losing visual indicators of class, which are important in Snowball Arenas.

^this. ruksak just happens to be more diplomatic than I. In my OP I think the strongest word I used was the word "lame". It's not like it was a rant or anything. It was just thinking it would have been cool to be able to use my 6th year tonic in the arena.

What i find amusing is people caring about costumes. Anyway , i got to agree with jazilla posts , it makes quite no sense to not be able to use those EL tonics in holidays arenas, but on the other side , much less players would buy costumes then and i don't think it's really what they want to....


But well , again on a side note , it's only for arenas that last 1 week so....

Anet is a BUSINESS. They don't owe us any loyalty, nor do we to them. Well, of course, they'd like for us to be happy for general "I want to make the world a bit nicer for everyone", too, they are passionate game makers, after all, but in the end, they still need to take a paycheck home at teh end of the month, and that money has to come from somewhere.

Instead, they have two concerns: a product that they sell and a reputation that will, hopefully, convince people to consider their other products. Whatever they choose to do with GW1 only has a point if it gets you to spend money eventually.

ANYTHING they do for GW1 is essentially "Look at how much we care for an old game we hardly gets sales from, and what this means for our future games, if you buy them." And if you think about it a bit, you'll notice that compared to other game companies who don't actually demand you pay them money monthly, they do a great job.

P.S. 6 years and loyalty... I was a bit late coming to the game, having arrived between Nightfall and Factions, but if I were thinking about my loyalty, I'd sooner point out that I have nothing left to buy in the online shop, than point out that I have... er... I think 6000+ hours in GW?

Jeez, people sure know how to always want a little bit more. I think it's nice of them to give people who are willing to pay real money for their costumes a little bit extra. I also don't see how tonics in arena's would work, it would be very annoying having one of the golem tonics running through your screen.
And about the loyalty, it all depends on how you define loyalty (though I find the whole word in the relation with a gamingcompany misplaced). You could define loyalty as buying all the costumes as well. Keeping your company going to create stuff you want, now that is loyal! Having bought a game 6 years ago, profiting of their servers, their updates and all of their work for all those years and still expect more makes you a parasite, not loyal lol. Be glad there is no monthly fee, I much as hell prefer Anet making their money this way, so I can at least behave like the parasite I am and use their content without contributing anymore. I feel, and you should too jazilla, more in a position of apologizing then in a position of complaining.

WHAT THE FACK!?!

Are you f'ing serious, guy?

"Parasite"?

"He should apologize"?

Playing that game ain't a friggin privilege. I bought their damn games, all of them. With the expectation, one garnered through advertising statements they made, that the game would stay fresh. Instead they bailed years ago in an effort to endeavor to create an updated WoW knock-off (GW2).

Tumbleweeds roll through Tyria and I should feel parasitic for continuing to play and desire some semblance of fresh content? Your attempts to paint Jazilla as a spongy leech are misguided at best. Dude is just making suggestions that would garner a higher level of appreciation from Anets customer base.

YES, it is a business. But I am the customer and I expect service after the sale. Constant baiting to give them more money for virtually no added content is dually noted. Okay, I pay $10 here and there and I have earned the right to wear a funny hat?

WoC was about 2 years too late for me to get on me knees and thank Anet. Whats more is it seemed to fall well short of expectations so far and you want me, and people like me, to apologize to them?

Hey, I'm sorry they didn't sell more copies early on. I'm sorry their subscribers didn't line their pockets as deep as they may have wished. I'm sorry that calm suggestions are perceived as greed. How's that for an apology?

There is a fine line between complaining and suggesting. I recommend you focus a tad more and see that the line isn't so blurry.

Personally I couldn't give a rats ass about stupid tonics. To me tonics are the lamest thing ever, even more lame than mini pets.

For the option to wear your costumes in holiday pvp arenas I couldn't care about that one bit either.

I use to love Guild Wars. You couldn't keep me from this game, but a series of events over 4 years would shake my loyalty for this company. I wouldn't call myself a loyal customer to anet anymore. Anet promised it's players(yes, promised) a quality campaign every 6 months. I thought awesome that's a lot of work, they must be dedicated. Just like prophecies I shelled out top dollar and bought the collectors edition of Factions the first day. I was there 10 minutes before the store opened and if they had a midnight release I would have been the first in line. After thoroughly enjoying the greatness of factions for 6 months I was ready to buy Nightfall. Again I was there 10 minutes before the store opened to purchase it. to be blunt Nightfall was a disappointment. The content seemed bland and uninteresting but some people liked it so I thought it was just me and that I had to bite the bullet till next campaign. Shortly after release of Nightfall my GvG guild dissolved because of how much Nightfall changed the game. All my GvG buddies lost interest and did care for the direction the game was taking with pvp, I blame mostly the skills. Despite this I still played and when I heard about GW: Utopia I was once again excited about the upcoming campaign. For weeks I was teased with the 2 new professions and loads of artwork, not to mention I am a fan of the whole Aztec culture. When I heard it was scrapped I was incredibly disappointed and after buying EoTN I felt like I gave them my money for a half-ass made game. Half way through EoTN I quit, gave a bunch of my stuff away and went off to WoW. Anet told me to expect the GW2 beta late 2008 and I payed attention to any news on GW2 but when summer 2009 hit I again lost interest. Somehow I ended up back in GW and am now waiting for GW2. If this is not loyalty I don't know what is and so far I feel like I was stripped naked and left in the desert.

My point is if a company cannot keep the promises it makes and return loyalty then where does that leave us.

Wrong. You can be angry that Anet abandoned the expansion model, that's the expectation we used to have. Expectation or new content for free, however, is not justified. Well, you could argue you expected it, but you could argue you expected to be actually given that bridge you bought.

That's the problem here - the costumers have come to have too great expectations. A few developers started to build up their reputation by offering above-the-expectations additional post launch content, and for some reason, instead of seeing those companies as exceptionally good cases, the player base became spoiled and started to consider this as normal.

Although I consider the price of a costume as excessive, I'll grant you that, I'd say they're worth maybe 2$, really. However, the game as a total, all costumes included, has offered me FAR more than I have spent by now, so I consider buying the costumes an act of repaying the earlier great deal I got from the game itself.

Amazingly, "we" generally don't have a problem with people not liking WoC. It did fall a bit short of my expectations, too, after all. What "we" object to is people showing an unreasonable feeling of entitlement.

Indeed, and it has been crossed by the OTHER guys. Also, there is also a not so fine line between suggesting the reasonable and unreasonable.

Both sides of this argument (specifically Tommy's and ruksak's latest posts) are so extreme in their stance that I can't take either seriously.

So, we're pretty much deciding to throw this entire thread off-topic from the start, huh? This update isn't about your goddamn "loyalty".

The change to the festival hat trader that allowed the hats to be worn over armor in PvE caused an oversight that prevented these hats from being used in festival arenas where people had commonly been using them before. It seems that ANet finally decided to restore that functionality, and also give that ability to costumes as well, since they work on the same system as festival hats. Personally, I think that allowing the body sections of the costumes to be valid is going over the line, due to confusion issues arising in Snowball, but I suppose that's a minor issue for now. Allowing players to use tonics would have a similar fault. If they wanted to get more selective for Snowball, they would have to turn it into an arena that is both PvP and doesn't allow these specific festival items. They may have to do similar things to other arenas to allow some tonics but disallow others, based on how much of a block of sight they become, or how much they aren't in sight (in the case of the bunnies), but that's probably getting too fine into detail.

The reason tonics aren't being allowed use in festival arenas is either because it was an oversight on account of them never being like that before, or because ANet actually recognizes that a few of the tonics would cause issues in PvP that they don't want to have to go through and hand-pick which tonics are valid and where they're valid for so that they do it right.

The only thing ANet needs to do now is adjust the Gamer points and disable Flux, and the festival arenas will be right back where they need to be.

How is my stance extreme?

I would say it is fine business advice. Maybe if they released new chapters, tons of free "fun" items and content, the game wouldn't be on life support? Maybe they'd sell more of these costume packs at $10 a shot if their were more people still playing? Has this not occurred to anyone?

Why would I want to buy a costume pack if I barely play? I barely play because it is, in essence, same ole same ole. Remove the monotony by way of new content and they have provided themselves with an increased profit margin.

We are discussing the merits of updating useless things as opposed to updating more pertinent content.

What do you expect from such an incredibly small update...

Compared to every other game I have bought over the last 30 + years this one has received the most updates bug fixes additional content etc.

Most games get no fixes others a couple in the first few months of release then nothing.

So if anet are treating us badly what does that say about every other games company

Be happy they are making changes to the game still. As for the tonics, it makes no sense to allow them to be in pvp areas because of the pathing issues they would cause. Just like Mox, it is good they arent allowed in any pvp formats

whine whine whine whine..

Enjoy the wintersday, have fun and don't be jealous.. share the joys and we all come back home in peace

Cheers

Because GWs usually has major bugs that have to be fixed such as the one stated in the OP. I played WoW for 5 years and I ran into 2 very minor bugs that didn't even affect gameplay. Not to mention Guild Wars would need constant updates since players burn through content so fast it forced Arena Net to abandon it for GW2 which has 80 levels and more endgame content than its predecessor would have if it had 10 campaigns. Why do you think people have been talking about the stale state of Guild Wars the past year. If anet is so generous with bug fixes where is the bug fix to my beloved JQ?

Who cares about some stupid costumes and hats in holiday pvp? It's not like you gain any advantage over anybody and the costumes are either bugged or fugly.

Closed.