When did the great prenerf/postnerf nerf actually happen? - Guild Wars Guru archive powered by Guild Wars Legacy

MaxBorken

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24 May 2014 at 17:34 - 1

So , these may be stupid questions, but I'm going to ask anyway.

When did the items we now consider to be prenerf stop dropping? Gold 13^50 or purple 11/stance, or -2-2 shields for example.

And what was the change that they made? (Apart from stopping them dropping)

There must have been more than one change. What were they? I have seen historic shields with 'received damage -2' instead of the 'received physical damage -2' we're used to.

Dates would be handy if anyone knows please

Thanks,

Max

The Mountain

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24 May 2014 at 18:56 - 2

I have always been interested, too, although almost all I know is that most of these changes happened before the Sorrow's update.

To add another specific question for anyone who does have records of such things, when did purple weapons cease containing the dmg%/-5nrg mods?

tooburns

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24 May 2014 at 21:27 - 3

i would like to know to, i did tcheck on wiki once to see all patch note but never found anything weapon mods related, maybe i should tcheck again more carefully

Yawgmoth

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Join Date: Apr 2005

01 Jun 2014 at 12:08 - 4

26th April 2006 update (Factions release) has increased the minimums on variable mod ranges on purple and gold drops. Since then gold weapons couldn't drop with like +13% dmg or purples with +11% or gold shields with low +hp like +24, etc.

I think it was also this same update that made dual reduction shields stop dropping. It could have been a bit earlier, but not earlier than 3rd March 2006. It could NOT have been later than 26th April.

carnage-runner

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01 Jun 2014 at 18:05 - 5

Yawg's right. And there was a second nerf shortly into factions that removed max r7's and then another nerf just before NF that reduced max r8's from chests. ( I believe it removed certain r8's from chests as well) Are there any dual neg factions skins shields? I can't remember anymore... :S

MaxBorken

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01 Jun 2014 at 18:23 - 6

This is precisely what I was hoping for gentlemen. Good work, thank you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by carnage-runner

Are there any dual neg factions skins shields? I can't remember anymore... :S

As the owner of 42 dual reduction shields, I can say with 100% certainty that I am qualified to say that there are no factions skins. Prophecies skins only. You can see them in the collectors thread recently posted on page 59

EDIT...
About 60 dual reductions, and several r7 max swords etc now. On page 65 and 67.
Greets,

Max

Cleavage

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Join Date: Jun 2006

[TRDR]

02 Jun 2014 at 03:13 - 7

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaxBorken

This is precisely what I was hoping for gentlemen. Good work, thank you.

As the owner of 42 dual reduction shields, I can say with 100% certainty that I am qualified to say that there are no factions skins. Prophecies skins only. You can see them in the collectors thread recently posted on page 59

Greets,

Max

Dual Redux to my knowledge was before the release of Factions. Yep

MaxBorken

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30 Dec 2014 at 09:15 - 8

Im reviving this a little because of a conversation last night, and also after the recent controversy surrounding salvagable mode being prenerf or farmed. (And overpriced accordingly)

Can anybody definitively say which salvageable mods are truly prenerf (ie cannot drop any more), and what the ranges of those mods are?

For each weapon type. Sword and axe I know about, but it's staves, hammers, bows etc.

Also, mods like +37/ hexed on shields can still drop. But I presume that it's considered prenerf on gold or purple shields only? Does anybody have that info too?

Max

Pleikki

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???oo ???ugs ???lan [?????????]

30 Dec 2014 at 09:29 - 9

Erhm, yeah so Blue items can have really low salvageable drops, but well noneone rly keeps em so im not sure even which still drop or not, ive allways though Staff wraps +1attri/10 is nerfed, and all below 10, Eventho heard they would still drop but never seen or heard from where. same with 10% Enchant mod for staff.

On other weapon types, also the 1/10 mods i belive are nerfed and below that (not 100% sure!) and enchants, 10% and below, But i think other do drop, except for the sundering ofcourse..
Shields and wands only come "non inscri" thinking the "Pre nerf times" so i wouldnt compare insc vs non insc shields at all

IF someone here has greater knowledge on this, and knows if some of those 1/10 or 10ench mods comes from collector/quest items, or drop from blue weapons etc, please share the knowledge

Edit@ so yea max, as u say u know about sword/axes, i think the same mods goes for each weapon type, atleast i dont know reason why wouldnt hammers/bows have same nerfed and not nerfed mods as others

also on shields, Purple shields can have really low hp mods, atleast it can go down as 30/st and 30/ench, not sure on hex. i cant think any other purple shield being "prenerf" then dual reduction or one with 3/xx mod, atleast proven to be

Zephyr of Light

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[PhD]-[?????????]-[pupu]

30 Dec 2014 at 13:24 - 10

To hop into it.
I know there is a 10% ench available in pre from a quest reward axe. (salvageable)

The quest is right outside Fort Ranik (pre) from a woman that asks u too retrieve a basket of apples.

Edit : i think making a list of salvageable "pre-nerf" mods that are still obtainable will clear out the fog surrounding this subject.
Same goes for placing a "pre nerf" shield next to a shield with just low stats...

take_me

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Join Date: Mar 2006

Europe

Country Roads [HOME]

30 Dec 2014 at 14:55 - 11

What about Staves that don't have a fixed HSR-mod ?

Also, I have a req 8 Restoration Celestial Staff (pre-nerf). When did that attribute get removed ?

Pleikki

WTB q8 15^50 Weapons!

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???oo ???ugs ???lan [?????????]

30 Dec 2014 at 15:38 - 12

The restoration was removed at same with rhe pre/post nerf change. Dont know exacly the date but i belive it was 2-3months after fact release

MaxBorken

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Teh Academy [PhD]. Officer. Gentleman

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30 Dec 2014 at 16:23 - 13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zephyr of Light

Edit : i think making a list ..... will clear out the fog surrounding this subject

I think that is a great idea. I hereby decree that a list shall be made by our contributions. We should do copy/paste additions so that the last post always contains the up to date list. It could be tricky if people add things they believe to be prenerf, but in fact aren't, so stick to the certainties please.

If it's successful, perhaps a mod can make it a sticky? I can see it getting out if hand in this thread, so I'll start another one later exclusively for listing stat ranges we know to only be prenerf, including whether it's gold, purple, blue or white.

Examples being:
Any weapon in r7 with max damage regardless of mods
Any shield in r7 with 16 armour regardless of mods
Any shield with two inherent [reduces physical damage received by X] mods
Any staff with a restoration requirement
Any sundering sword hilt of 10/9% or lower (10/10 is still available)
Any GOLD weapon with +13%[condition] or lower inherent mod
Any purple weapon with +11%[condition]
Any purple weapon with +xx%/-5 energy, +xx%/-10 armour or +xx%/-1[energy or health] regen
Any weapon with an unconditional inherent damage mod, eg. [+14% damage] with no negatives
Any GOLD non-inscribable Crystalline sword
Any r8 staff with max (11-22) damage
Any GOLD Non-inscribable Dwarven Axe
Any staff whose HSR mod is not written in white text
Any shield with a non max -5(20%) mod (these only come -5/20 or -5/19% now). For example -4(19%).
Any shield with a [received physical damage -3(10%)] mod. (including non-max mods)
Any shield with a +8 armour or lower vs damage type mod. For example +8 armour vs slashing
Any sword pommel with +25% damage vs Charr
Any shield with a -2/hexed mod. (These only come -3/hexed now)
Any shield with a -1/enchanted or -1/stance mod. (These only come -2 now)

Etc

Add more if you can think of them, and I'll collate them into a new thread later.

Max

Pleikki

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???oo ???ugs ???lan [?????????]

30 Dec 2014 at 16:27 - 14

Purple weapons with 11% and purples with xx/-5, xx/-10, xx/-1 weapon mods. And purplr inscriable crystalline swords for purples id say

take_me

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Europe

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31 Dec 2014 at 13:01 - 15

At which point were non-max Crystalline Swords removed from the drop pool or the Fire Staff with the Dead Staff skin ? Might all have been the same update.

O O O Yoji O O O

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01 Jan 2015 at 18:18 - 16

K , here its all the nerfed weapons/items i know about:

Triples( mausoleum 2010 halloween):
3 New Triples:

THE SCREENS(proofs):

...

pre-nerf mods:

pre-nerf shields:

i do also own like 10-15 non-inscr spears, 1 scythe(from mausoleum)

As u requested.. sry it took so long xD

Pleikki

WTB q8 15^50 Weapons!

Join Date: Nov 2006

???oo ???ugs ???lan [?????????]

01 Jan 2015 at 19:03 - 17

Quote:

Originally Posted by take_me

At which point were non-max Crystalline Swords removed from the drop pool or the Fire Staff with the Dead Staff skin ? Might all have been the same update.

I allways though non max crystas came from keyless chest so they were removed at same as the chest but after that max ones still came hoh chest. No idea on fire/water stafffs with dead skin

Also max purple shields still can have 8armor vs someting and -2hex mods so those should be for any gold shields only
Also blue shields can have -1 mods
think same goes for 5/20's, you can get lower in purples

Also Gold Swamp clubs,dwarven hammers and tyrian serpent axes, (krytan axes?) non inscriable.

Purple non inscriable crystallines, dwarvens, serpents, krytans etc still are avaible tho from reward chests

also, you still can get Clean "non inscriable" crystas and dwarvens! so kind of non insc ones still avaible!

The Mountain

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Join Date: Jun 2006

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W/

01 Jan 2015 at 20:37 - 18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pleikki

Purple weapons with 11%

I'm actually pretty sure purples can no longer drop with 12% either.

Keep in mind, the "other" dmg mods that have a max of 20%. I am quite sure they only drop in 19/20 now, so any 15-18 (below 50 or while hexed) are also in the nerfed class.

Vizi

Forge Runner

Join Date: Aug 2009

France

01 Jan 2015 at 22:14 - 19

A lot has been said concerning mods and inherent, I have myself tons of prenerf weapons in case you need some example.
Though prenerf items are missing from the list, here's a small list :
-Costumized miniatures
-Zaishen Medaillons
-Naga Fangs
-Jade Wind Orbs
-Old runes : +2/-50HP purple runes, blue superior runes -> nerf was not long after Faction release so there are a few ones from Faction, there are extremely rare though.
-Old version of Worth's Holy Rod (q9 Smiting 20/20 Prot)

Pleikki

WTB q8 15^50 Weapons!

Join Date: Nov 2006

???oo ???ugs ???lan [?????????]

02 Jan 2015 at 06:10 - 20

Yeah also gold staffs only come now xx/9-10hct all or xx/19-20? So hct below those are neerfed? Same goes fot wands right? And more on blues hod axe sword hammet bow etc

and mixed dyes

trademeimfamous

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Nov 2014

Blashyrkh

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R/

03 Jan 2015 at 02:07 - 21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zephyr of Light

To hop into it.
I know there is a 10% ench available in pre from a quest reward axe. (salvageable)

i think i found a +10% ench mod on a blue weapon (one that was dropped by an enemy, no quest reward) recently. dunno which weapon type it was and not 100% sure that i did but around 90% lol.
i merched it because i didnt think it was special

MaxBorken

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04 Jan 2015 at 09:29 - 22

Quote:

Originally Posted by trademeimfamous

i think i found a +10% ench mod on a blue weapon (one that was dropped by an enemy, no quest reward) recently. dunno which weapon type it was and not 100% sure that i did but around 90% lol.
i merched it because i didnt think it was special

It wasn't special. It was most likely a blue weapon with a non-max mod. Anything which still drops today is not prenerf. This thread is specifically about prenerf items, and identifying them.

Max

Zephyr of Light

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[PhD]-[?????????]-[pupu]

04 Jan 2015 at 21:32 - 23

Imy has posted 2 new screens of her wielding a purple Q8 plague & echovald.
So heres the deal i wanna bring up : pre-nerf, or not?

Both fit in the lines of how HP modifications can be applied (ench 30-45, normal 10-30).

I can already sense someone calling dibs on it being pre-nerf, but i highly have my doubts when it comes to Shields, really.
Those are near impossible to classify except from the obvious ones (dual red, q7/16)

What concerns me more is when dual reds were generated, was it possible too have for example dual +10 armor to drop.
I know the said above has not ever been mentioned anywhere as far i am aware of it happening, its just theoretically a possibility.

But in the case in dual reds is most likely that the % value of random generated mods to be applied, was probably that high it applied twice.

Due obvious reasons, Dual Reds got ''nerfed'' because the game didn't intended to have some mods to be duplicate generated on the loot tables.
(obvious reasons = abuse in Top GvG back then?)

However, OS shield's still can drop with dual inscription mods, like +1/20 +10 armor for example.

I feel this mechanic of how many mods are applied, the mod variable, and mod value is determined by alot of factors.
Some example's are Me & Red's clean items, and Yoji's triples.

Matter to think about.

Zeph

Pleikki

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???oo ???ugs ???lan [?????????]

04 Jan 2015 at 21:45 - 24

Both of imys purples still would be avaible to drop. Very unlikely tho

For other mod combos. Dual reds dropped quite long time while there still was alot ppl playing the game if other dual mod combos wouldve dropped we sire wouldve heard from em

MaxBorken

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Teh Academy [PhD]. Officer. Gentleman

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04 Jan 2015 at 22:01 - 25

If it can still drop, it is not prenerf. Prenerf items are physically impossible to be generated any more. As you stated, those purples are still within the current drop tables, so are not prenerf. The chances of dropping another are excruciatingly rare, but theoretically it could happen... Like the r8 +30 -5/20% magmas all those chestrunners are hoping for...

There are some blue shields that have multiple +10vs armour mods, but these are quest rewards and are specially programmed.. The game has never been able to generate shields with two +10vsX mods. There was another thread on this a little while back I think..

Max

Pleikki

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???oo ???ugs ???lan [?????????]

04 Jan 2015 at 22:19 - 26

Also zeph. Prenerfed canthan shields never excisted as the nerf was before fact release. So all canthan q8-13 shield mod combos excistin still could drop. Q7's are whoöe diff thing tho

Zephyr of Light

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Sep 2013

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[PhD]-[?????????]-[pupu]

05 Jan 2015 at 23:40 - 27

We need a Guy who has info or access to Anet employee's that can give us a detailed list of what the odds are of mods being generated for items.

Think of:

% clean
% single mod
% dual mod
% triple mod (nerfed)
% dual Inscrips (only seem to appear on OS? / only since NF?)
% Crude combinations (how much chance Health, Armor, Etc etc are applied)
% mod variable (10-30hp, 11-15^50 etc).

We need this info, otherwise we can go into oblivion guessing things that dont give hard facts that we need oh so badly.
This also gives us the chance to determined value of items better specificly to the odds of such item being dropped and to seperate the garbage from the gems.

Edit : and give people reason why not to bid 500e on a "common" drop.
Edit2 : Guru Mods, please enhance your usefulness for the sake of this thread with your knowledge or network..
***mod edit--sorry no network or knowledge here of such things, I think the mods who had the 'network' have gone---mod edit***

MaxBorken

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Teh Academy [PhD]. Officer. Gentleman

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23 Jul 2015 at 15:21 - 28

Bumping this up as there's a discussion on Facebook which refers to this thread. So I'm making it easier to find this thread.

Max

Zephyr of Light

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Sep 2013

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[PhD]-[?????????]-[pupu]

19 Oct 2015 at 15:31 - 29

Found a piece of interesting infortmation while browsing for a other ''nerf''

Update - Wednesday April 26, 2006

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Game_...nd_Focus_Items

''Weapons, Shields, and Focus Items
Significantly improved the quality of rare (gold) and uncommon (purple) items.
Upgraded Sundering weapon components to provide a maximum Armor Penetration of +20% (Chance: 20%).

The bolded part could indicate the quallity of a weapons Requirement, or Mod Variable.

Surge goes pre

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Mar 2008

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19 Oct 2015 at 15:34 - 30

Yeah what does that even mean? Haha

MaxBorken

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Teh Academy [PhD]. Officer. Gentleman

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19 Oct 2015 at 15:37 - 31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Surge goes pre

Yeah what does that even mean? Haha

Beats me....

Zephyr of Light

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Sep 2013

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[PhD]-[?????????]-[pupu]

19 Oct 2015 at 15:40 - 32

What i mean by that, is that ''improved quallity'' translates to instead of being able too generate +24^stance on a gold item, too +30 at minimum.
The same goes for other mod variables.

But its a wild guess.

Edit : the timeline of when that happened could indicate that that may have been the date that certain mods and/or variables have been removed on certain quallitys (gold).

Also note that this update has happened exactly on the same day that Yawgmoth mentioned.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yawgmoth

26th April 2006 update (Factions release) has increased the minimums on variable mod ranges on purple and gold drops. Since then gold weapons couldn't drop with like +13% dmg or purples with +11% or gold shields with low +hp like +24, etc.

I think it was also this same update that made dual reduction shields stop dropping. It could have been a bit earlier, but not earlier than 3rd March 2006. It could NOT have been later than 26th April.