/signed
Randomness ftw
N
The reason why high-level content is soloable and why PvE is easy in general.
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Well, currently, in order to balance they lack of inteligence, and variety of skills, they have much more HP and deal more damage.
It's not like a PvP battle where you have to battle an equal team at level 20. It's not 4-12vs4-12; it's 8vs800. There are some quests that will make your party have to battle more than 20 enemes over level 20 at the same time. And you rely in your knoledge of they builds to make another that can beat it and survive.
And there are something you must remember.
Only 'inteligent', 'humanoid', creatures could be able to have multiple skills. Tengu, Margonites, Naga, some undead.
You can't have a spider, a skale or a sandwurm have variable builds, thay can't learn or do different things.
If they were to add variability to them, some areas would require a develing of creatures, since you can't change you between PvE battles, and you don't face lvl 20 eneimies, but over 20 ones. Would you reall battle in PvP if in all your battles the other party had more than 3000HP per member and +20 permanet armor?
This game is for all, and not everone can stand high levels of playing or gets used slower. Not everyboady have been playing enough to habe a good average build, they are growing. An old playing wanting more challenge can't force a newbie still learning drop the game due to difficulty.
We don't want people saying 'I don't like it' after their first campaing, we want them to buy them all.
In Elite missions, realms of the gos and such areas, randomnes should be fine, but not in campaings that shoudl be available for everyone, not frustrating.
It's not like a PvP battle where you have to battle an equal team at level 20. It's not 4-12vs4-12; it's 8vs800. There are some quests that will make your party have to battle more than 20 enemes over level 20 at the same time. And you rely in your knoledge of they builds to make another that can beat it and survive.
And there are something you must remember.
Only 'inteligent', 'humanoid', creatures could be able to have multiple skills. Tengu, Margonites, Naga, some undead.
You can't have a spider, a skale or a sandwurm have variable builds, thay can't learn or do different things.
If they were to add variability to them, some areas would require a develing of creatures, since you can't change you between PvE battles, and you don't face lvl 20 eneimies, but over 20 ones. Would you reall battle in PvP if in all your battles the other party had more than 3000HP per member and +20 permanet armor?
This game is for all, and not everone can stand high levels of playing or gets used slower. Not everyboady have been playing enough to habe a good average build, they are growing. An old playing wanting more challenge can't force a newbie still learning drop the game due to difficulty.
We don't want people saying 'I don't like it' after their first campaing, we want them to buy them all.
In Elite missions, realms of the gos and such areas, randomnes should be fine, but not in campaings that shoudl be available for everyone, not frustrating.
=
Some issue, especially for elite skill capping, may occur.
My proposals:
*Boss should always spawn in the same spot.
*Every creature have 8 skills.
*Every creature have 4 staple non-random skills, including their elite. Plus 2 random skills from their primary profession (corresponding to the attributes they have) plus 2 from a different profession (in these random skills, one id for the rez, whatever it is - Flesh of my flesh, rebirth, rez signet or signet of return).
*Mobs spawn randomly on map, and randomly patrol (meaning cross the map)
*Mobs composition is semi random. A healer, a damage dealer and a disrupter should always be together.
Anyway,
/signed for the idea.
My proposals:
*Boss should always spawn in the same spot.
*Every creature have 8 skills.
*Every creature have 4 staple non-random skills, including their elite. Plus 2 random skills from their primary profession (corresponding to the attributes they have) plus 2 from a different profession (in these random skills, one id for the rez, whatever it is - Flesh of my flesh, rebirth, rez signet or signet of return).
*Mobs spawn randomly on map, and randomly patrol (meaning cross the map)
*Mobs composition is semi random. A healer, a damage dealer and a disrupter should always be together.
Anyway,
/signed for the idea.
/notsigned
Reason? Because we only have 8 skill slots, we can only be prepared for limited situations. Random encounters shouldn't be implemented unless we get access to all the skills all the time, and we all know that won't happen.
Enemies working together? What's it like to have 1 monster mind freeze on the monk, maelstrom it, while raining meteor shower over it? Mobs should be smart. It's player play game after all, not being played by the game.
Reason? Because we only have 8 skill slots, we can only be prepared for limited situations. Random encounters shouldn't be implemented unless we get access to all the skills all the time, and we all know that won't happen.
Enemies working together? What's it like to have 1 monster mind freeze on the monk, maelstrom it, while raining meteor shower over it? Mobs should be smart. It's player play game after all, not being played by the game.
Alright, here's my main beef with this issue (since this thread from 2 months ago has been so kindly brought up :|).
The current level of "difficulty" in GW PvE is giving monsters rediculously overpowered stats and crazy monster-only skills. A great example is anything in DoA, or the axates in UW (how many warriors consistantly hit for 300+ damage against 60AL with 1 attack?). Monsters are retardedly stupid, but by throwing 20 of these hyperpowered things against us, a party wipe is almost guarenteed. So the solution is actually make monsters level 20, and then give them a decent skill selection instead of throwing in "Enraged" just to make everyone's life miserable.
Another issue with this is PvE battles would become rediculously drawn out. Would I really want to fight a mob where everyone has a res signet that recharges every time they kill one of you, competant prot monks, etc? If I want that sort of thing, I can play PvP. It'll take you 2+ hours to get across 1 zone at that pace, and not everyone really has that much time on their hands.
And, as it goes without saying, henchmen would also need a drastic improvement, or we should be allowed to take 7 heros at a time. This way, we'd actually be able to have an AI only team capable of defeating these things.
The current level of "difficulty" in GW PvE is giving monsters rediculously overpowered stats and crazy monster-only skills. A great example is anything in DoA, or the axates in UW (how many warriors consistantly hit for 300+ damage against 60AL with 1 attack?). Monsters are retardedly stupid, but by throwing 20 of these hyperpowered things against us, a party wipe is almost guarenteed. So the solution is actually make monsters level 20, and then give them a decent skill selection instead of throwing in "Enraged" just to make everyone's life miserable.
Another issue with this is PvE battles would become rediculously drawn out. Would I really want to fight a mob where everyone has a res signet that recharges every time they kill one of you, competant prot monks, etc? If I want that sort of thing, I can play PvP. It'll take you 2+ hours to get across 1 zone at that pace, and not everyone really has that much time on their hands.
And, as it goes without saying, henchmen would also need a drastic improvement, or we should be allowed to take 7 heros at a time. This way, we'd actually be able to have an AI only team capable of defeating these things.
Basically, the entire game would consist of disruption, blind, overpowered spiking builds, life stealing via blood magic, wells that remove enchants, and plague touches everywhere. The only classes that would be wanted would be warriors to take+hold aggro, domination mesmers, infuse health monks, Me/N well exploiters, Verata's Aura necromancers...
Sounds fun?
Sounds fun?
Lets turn the whole game into DoA.
While your at, make Mesmers, Ritualists, Paragons, Dervishes and any non-SF Elementalist PvP only.
That way i can go everywhere with a heavily bonded Obsidian Flesh tank... not just DoA.
Be serious, we all want PvE more challenging, but varying mob skills is just annoying. Consistancy is what PvE is about. If DoA monsters changed builds every 5 minutes it would be impossible. Pugs to FoW/UW would be hopeless.
While your at, make Mesmers, Ritualists, Paragons, Dervishes and any non-SF Elementalist PvP only.
That way i can go everywhere with a heavily bonded Obsidian Flesh tank... not just DoA.
Be serious, we all want PvE more challenging, but varying mob skills is just annoying. Consistancy is what PvE is about. If DoA monsters changed builds every 5 minutes it would be impossible. Pugs to FoW/UW would be hopeless.
=
You are taking this WAY too far, to the opposite side of the spectrum. There is something in between... I don't think the idea of the poster was to make every zone like DOA, and all this secondary profession stuff?
I think some things to make it less predictable would be great, but lets not hyper extend everything.
I think some things to make it less predictable would be great, but lets not hyper extend everything.
A
This has been covered, and I don't want to reapeat the many arguments, but I'll add some that I've always liked.
You're a big bad hero, you've honed your skills over and over. Even if you die, you know what's ahead in the road a little bit, just like you mentioned.
Your average mob though, is a different sort of being. They mill around all day, some even just sit and hide underground, not even enhancing their dexterity like the charr do by picking belly button lint and flicking it into the camp fire.
You've average mob is in a war maybe, like the charr, but they're mostly not frontline guys, they're not expecting a party of Hero'esque characters to come storming around the next boulder.
But, lets make the rez shrines make monsters come back to life just like we do.
That's the ultimate realistic part of it, oh, and when they rez, they all remember where you're at, of course, so that by the time you get a group or two dead, workign on the third, whammo, right up the butt the way you like it.
If you just want to increase their AI, it can be looked at another way. They are in a war, and know you're coming, so they've trained to prepare just as we have, and they don't scatter about randomly in groups of 4 or so on a map, they're all right at the normal entry zone, waiting to pounce on you, every single creature on the map. That's their goal right?
Some parts of the game are easy, yes, but they get progressively harder, over all that will get easier with more play time also. If you're bored with it, ever contemplated not playing it?
It's comparitive to someone playing pitfall on atari and complaining that it's boring, yet, returning to it for about 12 hours a day.
If it gets to where it's now boring to PvE, well, I'd say you got your 50$ out of it, now you've still got unlimited PvP also. Beyond that, go buy a new game and conquer it as fast as you can, then bitch to them that it's not hard enough.
Ever played it through with 1 hand and no hero's henchmen or pugs/guildies?
no?
STFU
You're a big bad hero, you've honed your skills over and over. Even if you die, you know what's ahead in the road a little bit, just like you mentioned.
Your average mob though, is a different sort of being. They mill around all day, some even just sit and hide underground, not even enhancing their dexterity like the charr do by picking belly button lint and flicking it into the camp fire.
You've average mob is in a war maybe, like the charr, but they're mostly not frontline guys, they're not expecting a party of Hero'esque characters to come storming around the next boulder.
But, lets make the rez shrines make monsters come back to life just like we do.
That's the ultimate realistic part of it, oh, and when they rez, they all remember where you're at, of course, so that by the time you get a group or two dead, workign on the third, whammo, right up the butt the way you like it.
If you just want to increase their AI, it can be looked at another way. They are in a war, and know you're coming, so they've trained to prepare just as we have, and they don't scatter about randomly in groups of 4 or so on a map, they're all right at the normal entry zone, waiting to pounce on you, every single creature on the map. That's their goal right?
Some parts of the game are easy, yes, but they get progressively harder, over all that will get easier with more play time also. If you're bored with it, ever contemplated not playing it?
It's comparitive to someone playing pitfall on atari and complaining that it's boring, yet, returning to it for about 12 hours a day.
If it gets to where it's now boring to PvE, well, I'd say you got your 50$ out of it, now you've still got unlimited PvP also. Beyond that, go buy a new game and conquer it as fast as you can, then bitch to them that it's not hard enough.
Ever played it through with 1 hand and no hero's henchmen or pugs/guildies?
no?
STFU
S
/notsigned
Reason. It doesnt matter when mob is eaten by my scythe or i fall with scream on my mouth. Its about fun, unbeatable mobs will destroy faith in player and he will never play GW anymore. Thats why in DoA are playing uber experienced players, and thats why our community have some barriers. Its hard to accept new player without experience.
Reason. It doesnt matter when mob is eaten by my scythe or i fall with scream on my mouth. Its about fun, unbeatable mobs will destroy faith in player and he will never play GW anymore. Thats why in DoA are playing uber experienced players, and thats why our community have some barriers. Its hard to accept new player without experience.
/notsigned
Reason. It doesnt matter when mob is eaten by my scythe or i fall with scream on my mouth. Its about fun, unbeatable mobs will destroy faith in player and he will never play GW anymore. Thats why in DoA are playing uber experienced players, and thats why our community have some barriers. Its hard to accept new player without experience so that is the reason to own mobs sometimes.
Oh and btw some ppl love to farm... not me, but maybe for them is GW perfect game.
Reason. It doesnt matter when mob is eaten by my scythe or i fall with scream on my mouth. Its about fun, unbeatable mobs will destroy faith in player and he will never play GW anymore. Thats why in DoA are playing uber experienced players, and thats why our community have some barriers. Its hard to accept new player without experience so that is the reason to own mobs sometimes.
Oh and btw some ppl love to farm... not me, but maybe for them is GW perfect game.
/notsigned
Reason. It doesnt matter when mob is eaten by my scythe or i fall with scream on my mouth. Its about fun, unbeatable mobs will destroy faith in player and he will never play GW anymore. Thats why in DoA are playing uber experienced players, and thats why our community have some barriers. Its hard to accept new player without experience so that is the reason to own mobs sometimes.
Oh and btw some ppl love to farm... not me, but maybe for them is GW perfect game.
Reason. It doesnt matter when mob is eaten by my scythe or i fall with scream on my mouth. Its about fun, unbeatable mobs will destroy faith in player and he will never play GW anymore. Thats why in DoA are playing uber experienced players, and thats why our community have some barriers. Its hard to accept new player without experience so that is the reason to own mobs sometimes.
Oh and btw some ppl love to farm... not me, but maybe for them is GW perfect game.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by BigTru
Have a monk in about 80% of all enemie groups.
|
But putting a monk in 80% of groups might be making lower level content too hard. If we assume that the monks would bring 4-5 skills:
2 Healing
1 Hex Removal
1 Condition Removal
1 Resurrect
That's what I see with the majority of enemy monks (currently in Desolation). Resurrecting enemies for level 3-7 players might be a bit too much IMO.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Aeon_Xin
This has been covered, and I don't want to reapeat the many arguments, but I'll add some that I've always liked.
You're a big bad hero, you've honed your skills over and over. Even if you die, you know what's ahead in the road a little bit, just like you mentioned. Your average mob though, is a different sort of being. They mill around all day, some even just sit and hide underground, not even enhancing their dexterity like the charr do by picking belly button lint and flicking it into the camp fire. You've average mob is in a war maybe, like the charr, but they're mostly not frontline guys, they're not expecting a party of Hero'esque characters to come storming around the next boulder. But, lets make the rez shrines make monsters come back to life just like we do. That's the ultimate realistic part of it, oh, and when they rez, they all remember where you're at, of course, so that by the time you get a group or two dead, workign on the third, whammo, right up the butt the way you like it. If you just want to increase their AI, it can be looked at another way. They are in a war, and know you're coming, so they've trained to prepare just as we have, and they don't scatter about randomly in groups of 4 or so on a map, they're all right at the normal entry zone, waiting to pounce on you, every single creature on the map. That's their goal right? Some parts of the game are easy, yes, but they get progressively harder, over all that will get easier with more play time also. If you're bored with it, ever contemplated not playing it? It's comparitive to someone playing pitfall on atari and complaining that it's boring, yet, returning to it for about 12 hours a day. If it gets to where it's now boring to PvE, well, I'd say you got your 50$ out of it, now you've still got unlimited PvP also. Beyond that, go buy a new game and conquer it as fast as you can, then bitch to them that it's not hard enough. Ever played it through with 1 hand and no hero's henchmen or pugs/guildies? no? STFU |
I think its OK, just there needs to be predictability in the randomness. Like instead of totally random skills to go with the totally random mobs at totally random places it should be the same 3 [insert class here] builds randomly distributed to the mobs with a semi-random (1-2 wars, no more than 1-2 monk, 1-2 ele, 2-3 random) make up who spawn at semi-random locations (Some zones off limits to patrols or spawns)
If it got too hard that would be a bad thing.
I like the idea or making them rez and come after you lol