Henchmen are absolutely impossible for me in PvE

Lack of features making them act counterintuitive aside, it's just insane how often my henchmen get bugged.
And yes, I do still need them, as most people don't want to go on quick skill runs/quests just for you, nor do I expect them to.



This is a little while ago, doing the Ranger's Path quest. Little Thom is in a mountain. At least HE is dead.



Same deal, except this is why I'm VERY frustrated. Orion is alive and well inside this hill, and later on, the party is killed, all except for him, and so I have to leave the area to revive.



Another mission with a human player, and we had to abort because of him. [image cap, bah, next post >.>]

Luckily, she dies through degeneration later on, but it's still bad that she got stuck in a mountain.



Alesia the Magic Mole, she's deep underground this time. You can see the tree roots far above her. Once again, had to abort because she was the only one alive.



While focusing the camera on Miss Mole, it shows up for some reason here on the map.

Usually, this issue seems to pop up after the party is annhilated then resurrected, which is pretty frequent when soloing for me, but as you see in the screenshots, even with other players, if we have hench, they tend to get stuck.

Anybody else having this problem or know of a quick fix for it?
Those screenshots are just a couple of many, as I take a screenshot each time this happens >.<

I like using henchies as cannon fodder or meatshields. Anything else and they're useless.

Especially Alesia.

For some reason, she insists on standing RIGHT IN FRONT OF ME, despite there's a monster right there.

Yeah i dont understand it! Ive seen a henchman walk right through a mountain! But when you WANT them to walk through things and come to you when they get stuck they dont! They never used to have this problem, the henchman used to be great. I dont understand it.

I find that Thom and Stephen do exactly what I want them to. Reyna is quite intelligent and always seems to do what rangers are supposed to.

Alesia and Orion enjoy pain and always fan out to attract the attention of every single ranged mob they can find. If they can manage to stand in some poisoned water then so much the better.

The Cultist guy (can't remember the name) is fun because he casts Blood Ritual on me. Immediately afterwards he will often sprint into the action, for a touch spell I presume, and get his but whipped.

Durham is reasonably smart, and never runs into the fray. If he does get attacked, he'll use Distortion to stay alive. If he has any other useful traits, I have yet to notice them. XD

No Thom is a BASTARD..
He ruined my char flame temple quest, he decided to get stuck in a mountain while we were working on the last group of char and died. We had to start completely over..
They REALLY need a respawn timer as soon as the last human charecter dies, Even if its 5 or 10 mintues, id rather wait that have to do a several hour quest again. Or a /kill option for the henchman.

Ah yes, we lost the eye thing that judge's you in one of the missions, it got trapped in the mountains, and the mission probably took over an hour to complete because of that, most of the time being hunting down where that blasted eyeball went.

Agreed. Thom and Stephen are excellent; as long as you remember to CTRL+SPACE to get them attacking who you want; they are perfectly obedient meat-shields.

Henches aren't meat shields...one time I hired 5 out and went against the Summit and EVERY SINGLE ENEMY totally ignored the two warriors, one mage, one ranger and monk that I had hired...and all went after me! I was dead in less than 10 seconds.

Improved movement pathways, and the inclusion of adjustable A.I. scripts would definitely make using the Henchmen less of a nerve wracking experience. It's strange though, I feel like once I got to Yak's Bend it seems as if the Henchmen started "playing smarter". The warriors didn't try to pull every mob on the mini map, and the back line personnel didn't try to sidle up next to me(I'm a warrior) as often as they did earlier in the game.

Once in a while each of the issues mentioned in this thread make a return appearance, but I feel like I'm better now at choosing strategies and pathways that minimize the chances of something screwy happening. I just finished the Borlis Pass mission and I was quite please with the performance of the H-mob.

As much as I want them to be improved, their shortcomings do add an extra challenge to the game. Not to imply that I'm this great strategist or anything, but i feel that if I was playing with a party of human players, each of whom played the way I play(focused and extremely patient), then we would waltz through every quest and mission on the first try. That wouldn't be all that fun. At the same time I don't want to party up with human players who aren't locked in the way I am. So it is what it is.

Oh good, it's not just me.

I felt exactly the same way. I notice that my hench-people (that is the politically correct version of henchmen) don't act nearly as stupid as they used to.

Just to confirm, I took some henchies from Ascalon out for a spin again the other day. They don't perform anything like they do later on.

Feature? Or Bug?

Clearly, in an attempt to make the henchbots act like human players in as many ways as possible, there's a newbie subroutine in the AI.

I must say that I've been playing the GW beta events from the beginning and the Henchmen definately seem more bugged than the Beta versions did - a real pity.

Healer hench thinks shes a tank and the fighter hench thinks that joining the fight is optional... when he's even in a position to do so. Unfortunately I dont have much experience yet with the high lvl Henchmen.

Dont get me wrong - the henchmen concept is great - their 'ability' just needs some tweaking

I've posted this pic in another thread but Il use it again coz its a classic:

I found that if I'm out exploring or doing small missions(go here talk to this person) I take alessa, stephen thron, and orion, and that seems to work well. Orion seems to throw that aoe fire spell pretty well, alessa on the other hand ether dies first, or gets me killed by not healing in time, even thou I had less health then the guy she just healed.

Overall thou I don't think I wouldn't gotten or explored as much as i did without them. I mean it's hard to find players willing to do suicide runs.

I only take henchmen if I absolutely HAVE to. They ALWAYS get stuck on me espiacially alesia and when i neeed her the most.

The monk henchmen is dumb as a bucket of rocks. She never heals me enough/in time. She also very rarely resurrects anyone during the fight, especially me if I go down. And, most annoyingly of all, she INSISTS on being right next to me and getting owned hard almost every fight. I'm a warrior, the damned monk needs to stay in the back.

ya, the henchmen can be highly annoying, but if you play with them often enough, you figure out what they do and how to counter some of thier foolishness. I play most my time with them, because I can not count the number of times people ditch group at the first sign of trouble, or them being stupid, we call them on it and they leave instead of playing better.

I managed to beat the final mission with just henchmen and compared to the other groups i used for that mission, they were god sends.

However, it is annoying when they get caught on small object or in a mountain under the world. I've had my share of hair pulling using them. Some examples are them not porting on the teleport pads, getting stuck under the world after a rez, getting caught behind objects like barrels, chests, or open wreckage, or standing like idiots in front of a mob because it's blocking the target behind it i need to get dead (like the thirsty river mission where you kill the priests before the named).

They aren't perfect, but they don't complain or leave you and your group stranded by leaving. If you play with them enough, you will learn how to control thier positioning to an extent, but by no means perfect.

Also, I have noticed a difference in the levels of the henchmen AI. Seems the level 17 healer is poorly scripted compared to the rest. Not sure what the difference in them is, but the level 20 and 15 performed much better than the 17 level one.

You know what is the best thing about henchmen, the thing you can almost never get out of a full group of humans?

Call Target works. You pick the first target and the henches are on him. I think it is probably the only way we can get anything out of them, considering their other faults, they provide concentration of firepower.

Lots of things to remember when using henches, here are a few:

#1 If your 2nd profession isn't monk, you're in for some pain. Switch to monk for your hench stuff.

#2 Follow up for #1, put Rebirth on your bar. Teleport rez is required for the henches who like to bury themselves behind enemy lines.

#3 Before each fight, make sure all your henches are with you. I'm near the very end of Mineral Springs, have two encounters left to finish the map, including uncovering a new elite probably and then... party wipeout. Only, see, it wasn't a party wipeout, cause the mage hench is stuck on a tree about a mile back. ARGGGHHHH.

#4 When rezzing henches, rez them in this order: tanks--everybody cept healers--then the healers. If you do not rez the healers last, you can be assured that they will inadvertently pull the same mobs that killed you the first time, again, and this time your tanks won't even be up.

#5 Do not look at the (m)ap while moving. If you do so, you keep moving, the henches don't. Bad things can happen. :-) Alternatively, I've been thinking one might be able to umm, err, exploit this behaviour in certain situations, if the mobs stop like the henches do.

#6 Do not get the protector monk without the healing monk. Protecting dead people doesn't work that well.

#7 When people tell you something can't be henched, they're probably wrong(and lazy and dumb). Sure, they can't do it with henches, doesn't mean you can't. As far as I'm concerned, most of the missions are EASIER with henches than with the average group of GW players.

Henches don't give up, they don't get phone calls, they don't have parents, or homework, or class, they don't get frustrated and leave, they don't complain endlessly when you make a bad pull. They're good people. :-)

Henches rule, they'd never ditch me like...a lot of actual players always do. And I've only encountered a bug with them twice, one where Stefan got stuck in a mountain, another time when they ran in the air to the enemy that killed us, not a big deal though. I alt+tab and when I get back in the glitch is fixed strangely enough. I don't know if that'll work for everyone though.

The fighter henchmen always do what I want them to, being a mesmer I always stick back as do the healer henchmen and the rangers and what not, the fighters always go for the mob I want them to (usually the one I'm hexing), and whenever the healer gets murdered (never because she runs into trouble, because trouble always runs after HER, so we just kill off the last few baddies, then she gets a rez, she heals herself, and we move on.

Also I ALWAYS look at my map and know where the henches are at all times, and I always stop and analyze a fight before I charge in as well. I never understand people who see one bad guy so they grab their weapon, charge in and expect everyone else to do the same. People are too impatient.

Go henchmen.

I dunno, Alesia sometimes amazes me in her rezzes. There was this one time my friend and I were running to Fisherman's Haven from Temple of Ages, and he got lightning orbed by a Drake right before the portal. Lo and behold, Alesia runs up and res's him while taking damage from the Drake...and we made it XD

I rather like the Henchman most of the time compared to some rather uber-unintelligent players that I have seen on pick-up teams. I henched my way all the way to Ring of Fire, including Thunderhead Keep. After that I had to team though, henchies just can't stand up to the power of the Mursaat and Jade

I HATE Alesia. She is NOT a tank, now somebody tell her that. She uses like 1/10th as many heals as I would if I were a healer, and is generally a nuisance.

And whoever mentioned the henches playing smarter after Yak's Bend, no. They might have better skills that allow them to be more effective, but they are still really stupid. Once I got to Kryta, they were about 3-4 levels lower than most players, and that's not good.

What REALLY pisses me off is that the monsters seem to be so much smarter than the henches. While Alesia pretends she's a warrior and Little Thom runs around in circles in the distance, the monsters all gang up on me and kill me real quick. And then Alesia, instead of rezzing me, decides to try to avenge my death by meleeing the enemy.

I hate that stupid healer SO much.

The henchmen are twitchy to be sure...but hey, they got me through to the River when several (miserably bad) pickup teams failed. Unbelievably bad night in the finding competent players department, solved by good old reliable Meatshield and his Merry Band.

Ever have the situation where the henchies and critturs are standing (literally) inches apart, and somehow can't see each other? Not stupid Stephen facing the wrong way while the healer's getting massacred--that happens every mission. But the whole bloody lot of them, and a mess of monsters, standing around like it's a bad ****tail party they can't wait to leave.

Odd thing is, it's like the AI is 'stuck'. I can attack, blast as many critturs as I want, and still they don't wake up (until you run short on mana, that always stirs them from their slumber)

But earlier this evening I had the Classic Mexican Standoff--this one is wild.

Half of the party (including self) is examing the grass in a face down position. Three henchies are left, facing a boss and a couple of grunts.

Stephen can't do more than dink the boss, who heals every other action. Alesia's going heal heal heal heal on Stevie. Boss+grunt can swat Steve hard enough to hurt him, but can't overcome the healing. Archer's plinking away at minions, they're plinking back, both catch a heal every time their health dips briefly.

This went on for ten minutes. Alicia can turn the tide of the battle completely by raising any nearby corpse (but no, she's gotta keep Steve at 100%, 90% is too dangerous!) Archer or Steve can (likely) break the standoff by switching targets--but nope, never happens. Minion could decide Steve or the healer is a tastier target--nope, never happens.

Bosses, minions, and Henchmen NEVER run out of juice. Ever. Must be nice.

So I bugged after ten minutes I bugged it and discoed, or it would likely *still* be going on.

i shall add to the almost-unanimous consensus that henchmen are indeed extremely mentally deficient (they were in the betas also) and really need to be worked on hardcore by the devs (many many hours of work, no doubt)

I will then to the minority oppinion that the henches are way smarter than the average random team of human players.

And I'm probably the only one for whom Alesia don't tank. She do ranged attacks, but that is not tanking. All the mobs attack her though, and defending her often become the primary tactic when playing with henches.

I do believe she will get herself in a lot of trouble if she tries to keep some of the human I have played with alive...

I get no issues with the henchies at all. Some NPC's have got stuck, like Prince Roland on an early map, but the henchies give me no problems.

Wasn't really talking about their AI defieciencies, just the straight out bug that happens over and over again for me.



Somehow, Claude (prior to his death) ran up into the air and on top of some nearby building, got killed, then ended up under ground. I was just lucky he had degeneration hexes on him, or he'd be safe and happy on that building indefinitely.

Here's how it happened:
Came in from the map, the party got wiped out (wasn't really trying to fight), and Claude ran ahead of the group and up into never never land somewhere in the sky under the earth. It seems to always relate to resurrection after having the entire party killed.

Alesia doesn't tank, at least in the common sense of the term. But she has an overwelming urge to atack monsters, thereforebeing detected, and probably killed because I can't simply kill All the monsters that go on atacking her because she didn't stay on the back.
Definatelly, "protecting the healier hench" is a vital part of the strategy when going around with henchies. Despite the power of the firestorm, I lately take the archer instead ot the mage. The archer so far seems the brighter of all henches. she does what an archer is supposed to do, atack from range and if a monster comes near she takes a new position and tries to lure the monster away.
On the other hand, henches are most of the time better than Pick Up Groups. Most of the PUG's I participated in are dumb people who run, run, never wait for the party to get in formation and neither call targets, nor recognise a healer when they see one. Usually the healer forgets his job and people end up dying.
I got further on Althea's Ashes with henchies, than I got with human players....

Maybe henchies are not that smart because this way everybody would solo with them, who knows?..

Cheers.
--Qin.

Speaking of screenshots:

I don't mind the henchmen too much and have used them many times to complete a group. The only time I have a real problem with them is if there are only one or two human players and you accidentally try to go down what looks like a path but instead hit an invisible wall the henchies will pin you down and you can't move. I've tried waiting a few minutes but they never move and you have to map out...

After using then henchies as much as I have, I've learned some of the tricks to get around the stuck problems. On the one stuck behind the random object, I honestly usually miss them until we're about to wipe. But if you notice the henchman isn't dead when everyone else is, it's probably safe to run back looking for them.

But here's the whole point of the post : Solution to them running through the air and burrowing into mountains. Target yourself while you're rezzing, I haven't had them run off a single time if I have myself targetted(F default) when the rez shrine gets you if you have a few more people in the group, let them know too. It is hard for it to become a habit, but when I saw them running off every time I didn't do it, it caught on fast. If the problem was them floating before a rez, I've never had that problem.

I've actually had good luck with henchmen as well. The only real failure was trying to solo Lion's Arch. Everything was fine until we had to trudge through the poisonous swamp, in which case the NPCs displayed absolutely no sense of self-preservation and would stand in the poison until death.

At which point I promptly got into a party of 1 warrior and 5 rangers (including myself) and we proceeded to peck opponents to death. If I had brought my pet along for the adventure there would have been 5 pets. Oh well.

Okay, after playing with henchies a bit more, I have decided henchment are better than 25% of the players in the Crystal Desert. We almost beat Thirsty River in one try with 3 henchies 3 players and no real monk (we screwed up a pull on the final boss and ended up mobbing too omuch)

Before that game, we had 6 real players, and both of them died at the devourer/sand giant area...twice...

Having read all about hench-"intelligence" I have to say that it seems( and this is solely going from ascalon all the way to Yak'S Bend thru missions) they are more intelligent now. Now this could also be because I am playing a ranger/mesmer, and use chaos storm with glee on anything and everything I can, but an excellent example of how they can assess the situation was in the Nolani Mission. Found the graveyard, and was faced with about 25 level 10 spirits. Since I was only level 12, and the hench only 8, I worried that they might just aggro them, and tpk. But lo and behold, they did not rush headlong into battle, and I was able to, thru painstaking caution, pull groups of 2 and 3. All of a sudden, it was much easier to take them.
Another example, the bonus in the Ruins of Surmia(sp?) . I have been in PUGs where they rushed headlong at any opponent, and so that portion was ruined. But the hench stayed with me, did not go rushing at the enemy, and I was able to follow them and get the bonus.

That being said, I agree that there are some times when you wonder what school Alesia graduated from. Because if I, the human player, am taken down, and it is just her and the fighter, do not rez the mage! I am level 12, the mage is level 6 or level 8. I can tank a little, so rez me! Rez me!

I guess it also depends on how you approach things. Take working with both hench and PUGs with a grain of salt. Sometimes it can be a thing of beauty. Other times, well, don't feed the Dog chili

i didnt read all posts, but when u use henchies, i usually wont make it in a mission or quest. The henchmen, wich are lv20, dont use their skills properly. They only have the basic set of spells. The most annoying things is that the henchmen rush into a group and die, but you just wanted to shoot 1 enemy and let a few rush to us. Why cant there be an option to choose how henchmen react? defensive mode and attack mode?

Level 20 henchies have nice elite skills =)

Also, Stefan has this one move that seems to take off 20-25% of an enemie's life. My friend, a 20 W/Mo, can't figure out what he does, and he'd really like to.

Henchmen are real boneheads, but the sad thing is they are better than some players. They don't argue, they are obedient, and they always follow you and never run in the opposite direction until you can never find them again (except in some bugged instances)...

But, on the other hand, i have run into some really good and intelligent players. Persevere right until the end, and never give up. plus, they support their team. if you are part of this 3% or so of the GW players, I salute you!

I know what you mean about having something targeted when you res.
I had been fighting a big boss guy with my henchies, Alesia included, and when we all died, I still had the boss targeted. As soon as we respawned Alesia went running off after him again and vanished.

As much as I love Alesia the Healer, someone has got to teach her some sense.

Many many times, after our entire party dies and respawns, I count only FIVE green dots on my radar. "Where is Alesia?" I'll ask, clicking on her name, unable to see her on my map.

Turns out - she runs ahead without any of the party and by the time we reach her, we find a group of enemies swarmed around her dead body. I don't know what she is thinking - trying to be a hero and get revenge maybe.

Other times, I find that she takes a different route to the spot we died at, than the one the rest of the party is taking. She refuses to follow sometimes. I think she wishes she was leader.

Alesia is always the one that messes me up. She is usually always the one that glitches or gets stuck behind a pole. Yes, stuck behind the pole that tells you where you are going. Also, sometimes she just stands there, so when the rest of the team dies and she is the only one left, I have no choice but to restart. That annoys me like crazy. Also, today I experienced a the henchmen floating away glitch. Ugh.