Anti Not getting paid for running

Well, The way I make money with my warrior is, runs in the desert. I run for tips. Well... I dont mind small amounts (100 gp or so) but once we get there and the entire team just leaves and puts me on ignore, well....that pushes my buttons .


So, I was thinking that A- net could install somthing like

Player "Nubpatty" Will give player "ME " 150 gp once the team reaches the area "Dunes Of Despair", so basicly, you put up what you give to a certain person once you reach that location, also, you would know what they offer because it would show you if it was towards you.



Kinda hard to understand, but If you can, please reply!

I don't think they look too favorably on runs to begin with, considering how often they rape income means via running. Why they even added running skills I don't know.

I've actually been on a tip run with my necro in which the runner accused everyone that didn't pay right off the bat on an easy run of being cheap, even ridiculing others of being cheapskates when they paid 500 gold, bragging on how she usually made 2k from each person. I was attempting to trade with her while she was complaining, and was about to give her 2k before she started complaining. She got 700 gold.

No, I don't think this should be added into the game. When you say you're running for tips people assume you don't mind doing it for free, and that you wouldn't mind the OCCASIONAL couple hundred gold from someone. If you expect to get paid, say "Running to Dunes of Despair for 500g" or whatever the ammount might be. Or if you don't want to set an amount, ASK people before you leave whether or not they intend to pay you anything. Otherwise they can only assume it's alright for them to not pay up. You are entirely in control over how much you get payed for your "services", there's no reason to add something like this simply because people don't tip how you want.

I just expect somthing, but my last three groups just left as soon as we got there, I dont mind little money, but none is D:!

This is what everyone thinks, and I have seen a few runners come on the forums with the same complaint you have. They think tip means one thing, but everyone else thinks it means another. You may have to start being more specific if you are going to have a problem with this.

Just like tiping at a restaurant, sometimes you give one, if they are nice and curteous and you aren't a jerk, sometimes you don't if the server is rude and not very helpful.

Running isn't an official activity for guild wars, its created by the players..

Personally I do forge running on my warrior, out of the 140+ people I've ran I've only been scammed by about 12, and D/Ced by about 16 (But I don't consider D/C scamming) As for the most part I find players to be pretty honest.

Edit: Don't charge for tips if you want money.

Dude Anet isn't a fan of running or farming so there is an almost 0% chance that they'll put something in the game to help them (on perpose).

ANet will never endorse taxi services, and therefore you shall never, ever have guarantees that your get-rich-quick scheme to ultimately drive up inflation will work. So please, give up, and focus on running your guildmates places.
Or do you charge them too?

Yeah it sucks when you get scammed, I as a runner even know that someone can scam me. Dont take at heart you will make the money back by charging a little more next time. I dont think there should be anything of the sort for runners. I have had people run missions asking for a piece of armor to hold to make sure you pay.

I dont think there honest, and charging a full price wont help, they can still just leave once I get there.


(I dont charge guildies =/)

Look at being scammed as redemption for our fast making money with minimal work.

Out of complete honesty (And no means of boasting), After about 10 runs to Droknars, it really isn't that hard you know it by heart. It was quite simply 10k every half hour for me (Average time it'd take me to do a run) 2k per person, 5 people.

It pays to remember that any player requested changes to the game takes up resources at ANET that will either put more load on the servers (more lag) or take away from development of overall improvements.

Since the issue of runners and those being ran scamming one another has been around since the beginning of the game, it's highly unlikely there will be anything done about it. That doesn't even take into account the larger issue of running in general, which a lot of players think should be nerfed out of existence.

Runners not getting paid, and those being ran getting scammed by runners, is just part of the running game. If it bothers you that much, you should find another way of making coin.

Anet have said of varying occasions that they are perfectly fine with runners. I don't know where some of you are getting the notion that they are opposed to it.
Yeh, a few run spots have been tweaked over time, which only implies that they don't want it to be too easy in some spots, not that they are opposed to it.
They seem to be all for player run money making ventures in general. (except gambling, or anything else that might be actually illegal)

They have also said how opposed to scammers they are of course punishing offenders on a regular basis, so, while i don't think we should assume that making running 'fairer' is necessarily a big priority of Anets, we can assume that minimizing scammers and cheats is quite up there.

What i'd like to see, which i think may be like what the OP is mentioning, is something like, before the trip, the runner clicks somewhere that his destination is XXX, and the price is XXX. Then, before leaving, each person agrees to the amount, and the cash disappears from there characters and is essentially held somewhere by the game.
As soon as the runner reaches the destination, the funds are automatically given to him, if he fails, or the player leaves the party before the destination .. the funds are returned.

Probably complicated, probably not going to happen .. but something that would be nice nonetheless.

I whole heartyly agree with the OP for being annoyed, but at the same time there is a chance you wont get anything for running for tips its a double edge sword. I know when I get ran for tips I tend to pay more than the average price just to be polite ^^, but for the post part most people will tip you if you do a good job and are polite.


~Konohamaru

Thats what I was trying to say!

/Not Signed

Runners can be scammed, People being run can be scammed. Pretty much this game is like the wild west, anything extreme they will actually do something.

One of the reason's why this game doesn't cost any money is no internal GM (staff) support the players against scams, internal abuse etc. But I don't see anet going the other way (or need to) to set up a running system / token aka anti don't pay me system.

Agree that Anet has nothing against runners and nor do I. Only problem I have is running to be "uber" in the Drak/Asc Arenea but that is different topic.

And to you runners that run of tips, I do thank you greatly

(Now I tip what I can afford, if I have 100 gold, I will pay 20-50, if I have 3-4 plat I am far more generous depending on the runner). I've been to Drak early to get armor and resumed twice now one for tips / test run, the other for free -refused tips.

So some noob monk in pvp doesnt run around Fort Koga for 10 minutes while my team gets slaughtered, and then in turn i am slaughtered.

Please allow me to point out some thoughts being ignored by the pro/anti running crowd:

For those of you that don't know, "grinding" to level 20 is merely a tutorial, IMHO, to learn the game mechanics. For your 3rd or 4th characters, if you chose to play them in PVE, do you honestly want to go through the same storyline again? Just because some of you may be so in love with the content provided by GW to the point you want to repeat the experience over and over again, not everyone have the time that you have and just want to get to the higher level content for whatever reason. For example, SF green farming = somewhat fun. Going to Ascalon Settlement with Cynn and company for the umpteenth time, = not fun!

I've ran many nice people who's only goal was to:

a) not waste money on intermediate armor when they can just buy the final armor they want. Why waste time and effort to get armor that can only be salvaged into materials you wont ever need again?

b) level up so they can play the game they want, be it UW farming, PvP w/PvE character, or just hang out in Marhan's Grotto. That's how they chose to play their game, just as you chose to see Rurik die for the tenth time and still hope that maybe somehow he dug himself out of the avalanche just in your instance and Ascalon history was changed forever? We can respect everyone's choice. By limiting our options, we are only limiting our freedom to play the game the way we want to play.

c) to be frank, an experienced player can have the entire map opened up and leveled to 20 in about a day. For those of us that have already gone through the grind, why put up with random pugs and people that really just don't know how to play the game which is why they toil in the lower level content in the first place?

For those that get runs to get an unfair advantage in newbie arenas, shame on them, but at least you know it doesn't last forever. They will level with experience where they have no choice but to move on. So you were griefed for one free PvP session. Suck it up. That's what you tell us reputable runners that are willing to believe in the human kindness and accept payment for our skilled labor at the end of the service only to see people leave the party and put you on ignore. At least you have some recourse. All we can do is make sure not to run that invidual again if that's even possible (Anet, can we have a bigger ignore list?)

Advice for tip runners: by tip it does imply what people feel like paying you. If that feeling is 0, that is what you get. if you don't value your time and skill, by all means run for tips. But to complain about it does seem silly. There are many mechanisms to which you can guarantee payment. Practice them and you will be rewarded for your time. And while I agree, good people definitely outnumber bad people, it's that 10% of bad members of the community that makes it seem like they are everywhere. By allowing yourself to be scammed, you are only encouraging that bad behavior. If someone cant agree to your terms, don't run them. There will be someone that appreciate your service and it is those people that you want to cater to, not the scammers. Just remember, difficult people at the beginning the run before you started will not magically turn into not difficult people by the end of the run. Don't waste your time and efforts with them.

do elona run, less scam pay at last shard :P

Sometimes if I don't plan on paying well I just tell the person before hand that I plan on stiffing them, and they're nice about it. Ussually...

It aint happenin'. As said numerous times above, running is not an official part of Guild Wars. It was merely created by the players. I cant emphasize that enough. A lot of runners are ignorant of that fact. As with all business, you must take risks, especially one that isnt backed up by protection of some sort. And we all know there will be countless threads after this one, as there have been before this, so please runners out there, remember, if you got scammed, suck it up, possibly think of a way not to get scammed, and dont rant about it.

Note: I'm not anti-runner. I have nothing against it except for really extreme running to places where people shouldnt be run to. *cough*Droks*cough* but that's a different story.

Runners deserve to be scammed, I have not scammed anyone but everytime I read a thread like this I really feel like doing so. If you are a runner getting scammed is just a work hazard, deal with it.

Has anyone thought about charging half before you leave and half after? So if they do scam you at the other end you efforts aren’t completely wasted. Odiously you would have to charge a reasonable amount of gold for the complete run. And I should imagine that this would depend on the length of time it takes and the shear difficulty it takes to get there.

For example. ( I don’t know the game well yet so I'm sorry I cant mention any places yet ) if someone wanted to be run somewhere that would take around half hour and little risk from monsters and all the rest. You could charge say around 500gp. (I don’t know what the going rate for that type of run is. So don’t get mad at me if it’s really big. Or small) and charge them 250Gp before the run. And then cash the rest in after they have reached there destination

But of course you could argue that the runner could then simple refuse to run them. But then the non-runners would have to choose there runners wisely. And then the shoe is on the other foot.

At the end of the day if a non-runner is scammed that’s down to there own stupidity really. They know the price they have to pay. If they accept that price then that’s there problem. But I think the exchange of armour to guaranty payment for the runners is a little 2 far.

Oh and as for Anet adding a payment feature. I don’t think so, I mean come on. It's a game you made up your selves, it’s got nothing to do with them at all. You think they really care weather or not you get scammed out of a couple of 100gp. I don’t think so.
This is my opinion. What do you lot think?

In Heroes Ascent it's used a lot by warriors namely:

-capture the relic
-going slightly ahead of the rest of the group making themselves targets protecting the ones with lesser armor (this also applies to pve but not many ppl do that.
-when target is running away to overtake him
-cheap way of staying in a stance making weapons and shields that require to be in a stance more effective.

That are some reasons to have running skills

Running skills also have pve applications,
- Sometimes you're group gets split up, or snuck up upon, these skills let you bridge the gap to either save the squishy players if you're the toughie .. or flee in terror if you are the squishy.
- A number of the running skills have other bonuses, like escape also offering a 75% chance to avoid attacks, always useful.

RBK: Half before the run, and half at the end would work in a world where only the runee's are scammers, as it stands, you can't give money to anyone before the run, for the chance that this person is just going to take your money, put you on ignore and change districts is very high.
And again, like many others, you have decided to mention that Anet don't care whether you're scammed out of some money, which is blatantly false.

While i don't see them implementing this feature being discussed, people really need to stop suggesting that runners deserved to be scammed, and Anet don't care.

*Noone* deserves to be scammed, and *No* scamming should be tolerated, and all indications thus far seem to have implied that scammers aren't tolerated by Anet, and do get punished.

Runner: alright everyone pay up half
(Everyone pays)
(Runner leaves party)

That's why no legitimate runner asks for payment upfront; it's one of the oldest of scams.

Some peoples attitudes here bother me, but I will let that be.

As a professional runner (= my running service is open always when I'm online) I would like some feature to prevent scamming, but I do not see Anet adding such feature anytime soon. Anet IS against all kinds of scamming and supports running, they have said both, so this might happen some day.

Avoiding scamming (both runner and runned) is relatively easy on most runs if you are cautious enough. For longer runs with many area portals and outposts you can take a payment for example at each outpost or at each portal that preceeds an outpost. A runner able to run the beginning and willing to use time for some of the money will run the rest of the trip too, if the payment parts are reasonable. A customer needs to pay a small amount for progression, so no scamming possible, unless they leave at first outpost, which is not a big deal for the runner. Small runs are a problem, as you really can't ask money upfront and with no portals between the start and destination you need to rely on the customer and hope he pays after the run.

Also sayout aloud that 1) you will restart run if one of the customers doesn't pay 2) you report scammers, who then might get a ban. After this scammers mostly leave the party. I have only ever been scammed twice (for 500g or less) and I have run a LOT.

I do understand what you’re saying and believe it or not I do agree. And I’m not saying that I agree with scamming. infact I can't stand scamming its diabolical that people need to cheat other people to get what they want. - i just wanted to clear that up. just incase anyone though otherwise.

I’m Just trying to understand why people scam I don’t get it. unfortunately there will always be people wanting something for nothing. And at the end of the day I think people just have to accept the fact that people scam. And yes it is the minority that do it but its that minority that seems to over shadow the rest of the guild wars gaming community. And any gaming community come to think of it.

I like most others like to pay my way in everything I do. At the end of the day I want to have a positive reputation on any game that I play. And I hope I haven’t offend anyone with my comment that anet doesn’t care about you. What I ment was I don’t think anet are that bothered by someone not paying someone a couple of 100GP. thinking on it now it was wrong of me to stay that.

it's only I'm not yet acustom to this game yet. and other games like this one the mods don't really care about things like that. i asumed they anet wasnt that botherd by the odd scam. i was wrong and im sorry for sujesting that.

I guess whats I'm trying to say is that i don't think anet would intorduce this payment idea because i think they have other priorities at the moment. maybe they will look into this idea at another time.

After all there are risks in any scheme that anyone makes to generate funds, and where there are people working hard. And we all know that the people that are out to to get something for nothing aren’t to far behind them. It’s a fact and I don’t think that it will ever be solved. Unfortunately there will always be someone to ruin someone else’s fun, and abuse the unwritten rules layed down by people and anet. not sujesting that scaming is a unwirtten rule but i think you know what i mean.

Forgot totally. Has anyone really seen a good proposal how to implement this kind of system? I haven't. It should be easy to use, but it shouldn't be such a major thing that would promote running too much. If something highly visual is added, it might make new players buy runs and not play the game. I always ask my customers if the character is their first. If they admit that it is, I ask them to play the game, not to run past all storyline elements. Maby this system would have an unlock system that lets you to use it only to make agreements on runs to locations that you have visited with one of your characters. (Lol, unlocking cities )

I will take time to make an UI proposal today and then post it here.