What do you expect from a warrior?

Let me begin by saying I started my warrior last April and have played only PvE so far. This is my first online game and I have at times felt overwhelmed by the expectations of more experienced players, so have mostly played with guildmates or henchmen.

She's finished the game and has lately been doing Tombs runs mostly, while I bring my other characters through the game. What I would like to know, is what is the expected role of a warrior in PvE, and how does it differ in PvP? My guild is small and has little to no PvP experience, but we hope to start learning soon.

I know how to watch my aggro circle, I can pull groups, I wait for my monks and casters to regen. I try to trap a group on a corner or chokepoint so they can be hit en masse. Okay, so I'm not perfect and yes, I do sometimes get caught up in the fray and all of a sudden realize the red bars of my party have turned gray, and I can't retreat fast enough. Yes, my target sometimes retreats and hauls me with it out far enough to aggro all those others we didn't want yet. But I'm no Leroy.

I have always felt that if some enemies get by the warriors and are whacking on the soft people, that my primary task should be running back and getting rid of them. Is that right? As my monk, I really, really hate it when the warriors run off leaving us dodging 3 Enchanted Hammers. If I'm running madly in circles, I'm not healing.

So, what's the primary task of a warrior? Protecting the casters in a group, or attacking out front? Ideally, one in front, and another runs back if needed? And do I stop the enemy warriors, and let the casters do the damage to the enemy monks, mesmers, etc, or am I supposed to be attacking them?

I don't mind jokes at my expense, but please no flaming. I'll crawl back into my little circle of friends and never become a better player!

I've been a warrior since April as well, and my main duty has been to let the enemies attack me while casters nuke from safety, not that I mind doing it. I've also provided a little firepower for some new players in the Ascalon Missions.

If the enemies slip past my aggro because another player has drawn their attention I normally go back and attempt a rescue, may not be what people want but I do it anyway.

I usually keep an eye out on my monk (he's kinda pissy when he's getting slammed), and try to head back to help out. It's all about timing tho, you don't want to drag back a bunch of enemies that you've held at bay for a while, just to have them in the middle of your party hacking away.

What do I expect from Warriors? Impatient charging, barked orders, multiple aggro, unpredictably leaving the baddies with me while he moves out of reach for a new objective, incessantly pinging his death to make sure that I've noticed, and a lot of verbal abuse. When I don't get these things (which is often, maybe even half the time), I am surprised and try to let the player know that I appreciate it.

Those are all exclusively PvE skills, and don't work against human players. For PvP, the #1 skill is communication. Which is why most teams are calling for Vent or TeamSpeak. Build discussion, geographical strategy, shifts in objectives... you have to be quick to improvise with that.

1. Call targets.
2. Defend yourself.
3. Aggro as much as possible, but don't bring the fight to the casters. In other words, if an enemy or two slips by you, it's usually wise NOT to go back to help out, since that will likely bring the other 3-4 guys that were pounding on you back to the casters as well.
4. Emergency ressurecting.
5. Avoid skills that lower your armor (e.g. Frenzy and Healing Signet) or try to self heal. Instead, pack skills that can help the party/casters, such as Watch Yourself, Succor, etal.

I generallythink of warriors as tanks for other casters. Usually you should let them get full agro than nuke from safety. If the caster group get's the attention of some foes, those are usually warrior class foes that you can easily observe (how can you tell wich mesmer monster attacked your ele?). In this case nukers should have a ward prepared to protect the caster group untill the tanks finish off enemy monks or other primary targets.

Unually if only one or two monsters attack a group of 6-7 casters/rangers, than a good idea might be to focus nuke on those, while holding frimly so the monsters don't walk ouyt of your meteor shower or whatever.

While almost no1 uses wards in pve, they are still a better solution insted of running madly in circles.

That's about as much as I ask form the warriors I play with.

This depends on your situation. If EVERYTHING breaks aggro and goes for the rest of the group then, by all means go back and help. If one or two mobs slip by out of a group of 6-8 or so, it would be best to stay put. Even if they are squishy, all the support members should be able to deal with excess aggro with a minimal amount of damge. Pretty much, if going back in to defend will only pull more baddies into the group, don't do it. Mobs attack the nearest stationary target, so you running back to defend your monk or whatever will only scrape off what aggro you once had on other members of your Party.

I do whatever I am told to do, if they want a human wall then sure, if they want me to deal damage then sure, the one thing I don't do is run people. However let us not forget one person does not make the team, the warrior may have a job to do but it will only be successful if everyone on the team carries their own load.

Well, in PvP, they are the best sources of consistent damage per second. In PvE, they are usually used as "tanks".

The biggest thing that I want Warriors to know, is that pulling doesn't mean to pull the mobs into your teammates. Other than that, wait for casters to regen, pull only the groups that you are told to pull, and most importantly, don't bitch at the monks for not keeping you alive, especially when you agro too many.

(I actually had one tank run the opposite way than the rest of the group while in the FoW and then start yelling, "Where the hell were you monks!" after he was killed.)

With the AI I just don't know anymore in pve. I've notice they have priority targets now. They will go after the target that does the most dmg to them or the closest monk. I've noticed that wars are unable to hold arggo like they used to. I pretty much stopped inviting them all together. Instead I go for rangers, necros, and mesmers.

Just my opinion.

If I ask for a tank, it means I want a warrior with stances and perhaps doylak's sig who's not going to die after 2 hits from the aataxes.

That said, I'm coming to the point where I prefer two damage warriors who can body block, caues the monsters can't do pysical damage to the casters if they can't reach them.

If you use frenzy, have another stance to get you out of frenzy please, your monks will thank you for it. And if you're a monk and I have a frenzy warrior on my team, please use protective spirit on them so they can deal damage more effectivly.

What I expect from a warrior is to NOT charge five miles deep into enemy lines to attack a monk, while leaving the rest of his (squishy) team behind to get pounded on by the enemy melee fighters.

I've consigned myself to being disappointed 99% of the time.

I hit stuff.

I play warrior. Here's asre some things I pride myself in doing.

1. Have decent level armor for the area. I remember a warrior with ascalon level armor in Fissure AND using Frenzy. It wasn't pretty.
2. Not aggro everything on the map, i.e. no more than 1 group at a time.
3. Pull with longbow. (I have a +4 defense one with 0 attribute req.)
4. Call targets.
5. Wait for casters to regen energy.
6. Stand behind traps if trapper ranger says so.
7. Ask what type of build group wants (defense/damage).
8. Bring a buff at all times. (Dolyak signet/watch yourself, etc.)
9. BRING A RES.
10. Just because people call you a warrior noob, don't stoop to their level and say stupid things back to them. Just ignore it.
11. Realize W/Mo is only good for condition/hex removal and smiting NOT 3 pip mending. Then choose another secondary.
12. Realize not everyone has 116 AL vs. physical and absorption.
13. Bring condition removal if possible (mend ailment/plague touch) because it wastes monks' energy to remove blind/weakness/cripple.
14. Put remaining points in strength because it is CONSISTENT armor penetration, unlike sundering.
15. Bring alternate weapon if using vampiric.
16. Realize KNIGHT's LOOKS GOOD but sucks in stats.
17. Realize that gladiator armor shows one of the sides of your chest (males) and nobody likes it.
18. Realize /dance right in front of another person is somewhat sick and inappropriate (males).
19. Do not get a team with no casters (i.e. just warriors and monks).
20. Bring self healing and use when appropriate. i.e. do not healing signet when unbuffed, use it when buffed to about 156 armor.

Amen.

I agree with mostly what you have said but I feel like picking it apart a little.

[QUOTE=LifeInfusion]3. Pull with longbow. (I have a +4 defense one with 0 attribute req.)

Absolutely essential. Have a longbow ready at hand at all times.

Probably not too neccesary, it's easy to get caught up in the moment as a warrior, so they're best following a target. Your ranger is probably best suited for this.

Also note that if a monk NEEDS a battery to keep their energy up, before you head in, leave. They're a very bad monk. A battery necro is a complete waste of a player slot and in my opinion is insulting to the player of said necro.

I always bring one just in case, but most of the time though, in a good team, if anyone is going to die, it will be you first. This pretty much renders ressing useless on your behalf.

Forget strength at the moment. The attribute line is bugged and doesn't add that +x% armour penetration per level like it's supposed to. Only use it if you have skills on your bar requiring it.

Yes, absolutely essential. However these days I haven't seen anyone using just a vampiric like the first few months of the game. Everyone has switch outs these days.

Knights is good in stats, but there are superior alternatives. The armour gives you a -2 global damage reduction, so gloves or boots is really nice. Same with the Ascalon. If you want armour though, go for Gladiators or Platemail for at least chest and legs. Gladiators is superior to Platemail when it comes to physical damage, on top of that it gives you some extra energy. However Platemail is better for all around damage. If you need the energy, go for Gladiators, if not, Platemail looks rather sexy, stat wise and in appearance as well.


To the OP:

Aggro management is not just a warriors job. It's an effort of the whole team. It's up to the team to stay back while the warrior takes aggro, then they can come in to assist. It is not the warrior's fault if a few enemies break through and should continue where they stand to handle the enemies beating on them at the time. It is up to the rest of the team to bring the aggro around the warrior again.

Unfortunately this concept seems absolutely beyond anyone in PvE. When an enemy breaks through, the whole backline runs around like headless chickens in absolute chaos, leaving the warrior to consequently die because the monks were too busy being retards to heal them at which point the rest of the enemies come charging through to the rest of the party. If the party didn't take down the original mob in that time between it breaking through and the warrior dying, it's gg.

This is the main reason I prefer to take 2 warriors into the Underworld to body block choke points so even if the enemies want to get through, they can't. This also works nicely in PvE tombs and well, anywhere else.

Incorrect. Body blocking is a very effective skill in all aspects of this game. PvP is a little harder though as it has to be done in such a way that there is no possible way past. Or have a snare/ward that makes them slow enough to make a block in an open area effective to stop them in their tracks and able to shift left to right if they try to get around you.

Quoting for mostly truth, some false, hence corrections. Directing comments to the OP.

1. Yes.
2. Yes.
3. Yes, a ranged bow is best.
4. Yes, unless someone else has said they will call. if they don't consider them incompetent and take over.
5. Yes.
6.. If possible, sometimes the ranger trys to be all important with traps but using them lessens the effectiveness of the rest of the team in initial combat, you will learn to recognize these situations in time.
7. Yes.
8. If you have them, yes.
9. Some will argue a repeatable rez, I say a sig is fine in most cases, you won't last long without your monk anyway. Unless you're lucky. But yes, bring A REZ.
10. Probably good advice.
11. Wrong, W/Mo are good at self heal and assist heal, this is usually only in the case of PvE though. Don't let anyone tell you that a W/Mo is only good for one thing or another. It's good for more things then people want to bother investigating. Keeping a W/Mo as a W/Mo is not a crime, sin or stupid, it's just as well rounded as any other combo in the right hands.
12. Yes.
13. Yes, double yes. Nothing more useless than a blind W, except for a dead one.
14. Your choice, I've run builds with and without much strength, the overall performance remained about the same.
15. I wouldn't advise evening using Vamp., but that's your preference.
16. No comment, I don't use knights.
17. Yes, and also realize it has good effects.
18. Yes, double yes, triple yes.
19. Generally Yes, but you might get lucky...I have....but generally....yeah, take the advice.
20. Yes, and yes concerning Healing Sig.
21. Bonus: People are fashion freaks, ignore this trait, combining armors will probably make you ugly as sin, but it will make you a better hybrid Warrior, i.e. mixing a heavier armor and gladiator. If you want to look cool, go ahead and sink your gold into the full suit and wear it in town. I wear full dragon in town, but a mix in the feild.

The basics have all been stated, but each caster has their own little preference about what you "should" be doing. Generally, a lot of them haven't played a W and therefore should be ignored. The usual way of identify a caster who doesn't know the first thing about a W is one that TELLS you to do only what they tell you, as opposed to asking if your build allows for that or how you could tweak YOUR build to more what they need. If you get one that TELLS you what to do, give a little attention to it, but do what's nessessary to keep the team alive, even if it gets you yelled at.

Any descision a W makes that ends up saving the team was a correct choice. Maybe not the best, most efficient, fastest, or the most popular, if it works, it works.

Any decision a W makes that gets the team kill was a bad choice, no matter how good the intentions, or the plan, if it got the team killed, it was a bad choice, take the blame. Usually, TAKING the blame willingly for a bad mistake will actually increase the confidence your team has in you, showing that you know enough about what's going on to know that you messed up. And if they toss you anyway, it will generally be more polite a send of.

I expect them to call targets, take 90% of the damage for us so the squishy classes dont die, and for them not to be an aggro monkey.

You shouldn't try to go back to your teammates if one or more baddies run past you.
See, if you do that on the short term it will seem that you're helping (going back) but on the long run you're just bringing the mobs that were already attacking you to the "squishes" (monks, mesmers, etc..).


See, if you have a mob hitting you and you MOVE there's a good chance that the mob will switch targets and attack the other party members.
Best thing to do when you go in is just stand still really. Try not to move at all after the mobs are hitting you.

The only thing I expect from warriors is to not draw on my RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing minimap unless its already been determined that you will lead. Otherwise, this ranger is gonna have to choke a bitch.

I expect the warrior to stand there and hold the master gear and do absolutely nothing else except spam stances.

Very Simple

Things happen, accidents (pulls, etc) happen. I have no trouble w/ this and I think you should be doing your own job the way you want to do it. But here are some thing that make me not want to heal you / raise you (I still will most likely).

Things that give good W/XX a bad name.

Beat mob group, ping my 3 of 40 engery and then you deicde to grab a new mob group.

Heal Me / Rez Me - yelling at me - I'm staring at the health bars.. I know what's going on. If your not being healed it could becuase I have engery issues atm, your out of range where it will take 5 sec to get to you and I know you will be dead anyway, or keeping you alive will cost 2 other players to die or your taking on way too much damage quickly that healing you would not prevent you from dying and waste my engery.

If I point out you were 10 feet away, or by using rebirth I lose all engery and other charcters would die, etc and you listen, no issue.

There's been plenty of good advice for PvE warriors here, but I think you have that pretty down pat
In PvP, I expect a warrior to get a good idea as to what the opposition is running, and where you can cause the most pressure and damage. You have to be able to:

Know who to attack. Watch for overextended targets. Realise that warriors are the best source of caster pressure in the game. The very presence of a warrior disrupts the caster and prevents them from fighting on their terms.
Make sure your teammates relay essential targets that are hampering them, like interrupt mesmers, or energy drainers. It's up to you to pressure priority targets.

Know when to change targets. Realise that you don't have to be within healing range, but know your limits. Know how far you can pursue a monk running back to NPCs with pin down. Know how to "pinball" to different targets to gain adrenaline. Know how to change targets at just the right time, so that it's not blindingly obvious to someone that a warrior with full adren is making a beeline for you. This includes watching the minimap, looking for people like incoming flagrunners or overextended targets.

There are so many nuances to causing pressure via a warrior. Just watch a high level GvG, and see what the warriors do. I'd say it's the hardest profession in the game to master.

I expect warriors to act dependent on the amount they are with.

In general 1 warriors goes and get the aggro. If some pass through him the second warrior goes and intercept those before the get to the squishies. If a wall is possible, you form a 2 man wall in stead.

You can run back in case you are the second warrior who has no aggro on him (you'll notice that) and one of the little ones got past you. If however you do have aggro, stay put. No need to draw a bigger group into the squishies.

This is for PVE:

1) Warriors are not meant to lure. That is a job for rangers, but if there are no rangers, any other party member will do. The warrior or warriors if there are two (should never be more than 2 in a party) should take a stance near where the battle optimally should be fought (away from where other wandering mobs may come by) and right where the ranger, if there is one, is laying traps. The mobs are lured back to the waiting warriors, and the battle takes place.

2) Warriors should keep an eye on the squishies in the group and fall back to protect them (leaving who they are currently fighting if necessary) in the a case that enemy circle around the warriors.

3) Warriors should NOT set the pace of the fighting, since they do not have the energy recharge needs of elementalists, monks, necros and mesmers. So it helps greatly if what I said in 1) above is followed.

I agree almost fully with this.

Have both finished W and Mo and from my monk exp. one of the most important ones would be the last one. Its a pain for a Monk to try to keep at live a W that is using Frenzy + healing sig in front of an Abissal.
Please don't do that. there are better options (Watch yourself f.ex , as one of many) and just let the monk do the job. The ammount of health your'e having with signet maybe get lost with the spike you receive when low in armor. And remember ,we have 2 maybe 3 W in the front we have to keep at life.If you bring it, use it in the right moment or as said above , when buffed

Have wasted loads of energy with those while the W think H.S is über.

I expect my warrior to be able to output damage. 2-3 skills on his skill bar should be dedicated to some type of attack skill. In addition he should have 16 in his weapon skill. Place the remaining points where necessary and output damage while trying to control most of the agro. The rest of your team can kite if they have to. Dead things don't attack though. If necessary a short breather can be required. However for the most part I should be able to continue functioning non-stop if I am on a caster class (I have 4 pips and energy management for a reason.

Also, strength is not bugged. It only applies the armor penetration with skills. The description is just vague. However it still isn't a great primary attribute.

As a Warrior, I think I should list what I want from you.

1. I'm not a Leeroy, but let me grab aggro. It's easier on us all if I take most of the damage. Many people think I'm stupid and rushing, but I think your stupid and will try and solo half the stuff from Kryta to the Fire Islands. We need to find a balance.
2. Once I have aggro, DON'T make me lose it, i.e. scattering the mob with Firestorm/Ignite Arrows. Because then all the enemy Warriors will go straight for the casters.
3. Monks, don't waste your energy and cast things like Retribution, Mending, or Strength of Honor on me. First off, Retribution does little or no damage, because I take little or no damamge. Mending: I can heal myself. And if I wanted, I could bring my own Mending. And Strength of Honor... my main goal isn't to deal damage, it's to prevent damage on you. So this isn't to say a good maintained enchanment isn't welcome, say Life Bond, but usually the enchantments with a time limit are usually better. (Vigorous Spirit)
4. And lastly, this applies to every character everywhere.

BRING RES!

If you are in no way part Monk, bring Res Sig. If you ARE part Monk, bring Rebirth. Hands down, no questions asked, period.

Thank you for your time.

Thank you to everyone for their well written responses. It was nice to get input from both warriors and "squishies". I feel now that I have been on the right track and have picked up some very helpful hints for new things to try.

As most have mentioned, I think the thing that leads to successful group play, is to remember you are part of a group, and no one person makes it work. Sadly, one person can make it fail.

I wonder if many of the rushing, aggroing warriors have tried playing any other class? The view from up front looking at all the enemies to choose from *rubs hands gleefully* is a lot different from the back, where you see big warrior behinds dashing off*throws hands up in disgust*!

Just had to say something to this. I play a battery necro, and I find that it is very useful, not just for monks but for all the caster classes and even trapper rangers. To me, the longer someone can continue nuking (or trapping or interupting or etc.) or able to keep everyone alive, the better chance of survival you have. Besides, it's one of the most thankful builds I've done.

Warriors, please make sure your health is where it should be. There is no reason a lvl20 warrior should have 288 health. Read the stats on the superior runes and weapons carefully, those -20's add up. Another thing, don't expect the battery to "juice" your energy. You are able to deal damage without energy, something the other classes cannot do.

Quoted for truth.

Depends on where I am:

PvE: Damage sponge
PvP: Melee doom

Everything else is superfluous for me now.

Didn't read the whole thread so I may be repeating things here.

Warriors aim should be to make the monks job easier. Minimise damage to the group by taking agro, protecting yourself and healing. You're really not much help charging in if you aren't set up for tanking.

Quite often I'm more inclined to tank as a monk myself than try to keep a bad warrior alive. At least that way the damage all goes on me and I dont have to worry about healing anyone else.

A great mystery may have been revealed at last! Is Alesia programmed to copy your behaviour?

lol, possibly. I dont think orisons is quite enough for that to work though

Yes, but, uh, where are YOU standing? Alesia is programmed to stay somewhat near to a human player, and so if that human player is tanking, then she is not going to be far away. Which means it must be particularly difficult to play with henchies only as a tanking warrior.

What would Alesia respond to this thread, if she was able to? She would probably wish that the warrior would be continually aware of his/her position while tanking so that Alesia could be nearby without getting beaten upon by other melee enemies. Alesia would wish that the warrior would change position when needed so that she would not find herself suddenly "tanking" while remaining close enough to heal the warrior.

I agree with a lot in this. Though the heal yourself thing is a bit iffy. Yeah bring your own healing. it helps out when your monks are busy, but it's by no means gonna save you for the simple fact that it shouldn't. Remember, you are not soloing', your working as a team . I mean, when your healing your not attacking right? A warriors primary purpose.

Also to add to that list. Monks, please. When I'm fighting in the thick of it, please don't put enchantments on me when there are enchantment removers in the area. It's no fun watching in horror as enchantments are put on me in front of Heretic's. Dropping my heatlh by nearly 200 point's is worse than having no healing assisstance at all.
I know you mean well, but don't do it .

PvP is where the warrior really shines. Bring Frenzy, learn how to cancel the stance properly with sprint, learn to pick squishy, unenchanted targets effectively. gg.

I find that in PvE it's dangerous to have too many expectations. Having said that I have the same expectations of warriors that I have of everyone else. Be familiar with your mini-map and look at it frequently. Pay attention to party formation and the location and movements of enemies. Communicate with your team and try to stick to whatever the plan is. It's amazing how smoothly things run when a party can stay in some sort of reasonable formation...