Guild Membership Sales - Guild Wars Guru archive powered by Guild Wars Legacy

Inde

Site Contributor

Join Date: Dec 2004

02 Mar 2006 at 05:40 - 1

From Gaile Gray:

Some of you may have heard about guilds selling memberships. It happens sometimes, and we really don't have a position on it, although some on the team feel strongly about it privately.

A high-ranking guild is currently offering to sell "temporary memberships" to their guild. I don't know what's driving the buyers, whether it's wanting to get high-level training or whether it's a desire on the part of the player to gain the reward connected with the fun season just concluded on the Guild Wars Ladder. If a purchase is based on the regards, then two things need to be known:

The reward for this "fun season" is temporary, and it will go away at the end of the 1st Qualifying Season of the GWFC.
The reward only applies to those who are active members of the guild, not those who have joined on a temporary basis. So if you join and are cycled out for another temporary member, you will outright lose the reward and you will not be able to get it back.

Anyone considering buying their way into a guild needs to be aware that they may be getting exactly what they seek or they may end up with far less than they bargained for, depending on their personal objectives. I hope providing the information above will help answer a couple of questions about the in-game item and guild membership sales.

Sendai

Elite Guru

Join Date: Feb 2005

02 Mar 2006 at 07:07 - 2

that's what happens when almost every guild wars ladder event is made for the top 10 - top 20 guilds.

torquemada

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Feb 2006

guildless

02 Mar 2006 at 08:32 - 3

Bleh...I'm feelin sick....bleh...cough

Archias

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Aug 2005

Las Vegas

Force of Arms {FOA}

02 Mar 2006 at 08:39 - 4

Thats so lame...

Takeko Nakano

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2005

Great Britain

W/P

02 Mar 2006 at 08:40 - 5

Top guilds sell membership? That is so lame - my opinion of them drops even lower

Fantus

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jun 2005

02 Mar 2006 at 08:45 - 6

Indeed - that's about as lame as it gets. Well, it takes more to be a "Top" guild than only having a good rank, obviously. In terms of ethics, these guys seem to be a "Bottom Guild"...

Gaile Gray

ArenaNet

Join Date: Feb 2005

02 Mar 2006 at 08:46 - 7

The concern we had was that people were not disappointed by the outcome if they were purchasing the guild reward. Now that the guild is making it clear that the reward is temporary, and that it will expire of the person leaves the guild, all should be well on that part of it.

We don't have an official position against selling guild memberships, as long as it is for in-game items or gold, which this is. It's a great guild and they consider the gold given as "donations" to help them acquire items for their competitive characters. I guess now that everyone knows the conditions of the reward, as to the guild membership sales, if everyone is happy -- buyer and seller -- it's really between them. It's not something I expected to see, but capitalism shows facets that continuously surprise me.

Makkert

Black Beast of Aarrrrgghh

Join Date: May 2005

The Netherlands

The Biggyverse [PLEB] // Servants of Fortuna [SoF]

02 Mar 2006 at 08:47 - 8

Slightly off-topic: Does anyone know what exactly the reward is?

Savio

Teenager with attitude

Join Date: Jul 2005

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

02 Mar 2006 at 08:50 - 9

Out of curiosity, what exactly is so wrong about selling temporary guild membership positions?

Makkert

Black Beast of Aarrrrgghh

Join Date: May 2005

The Netherlands

The Biggyverse [PLEB] // Servants of Fortuna [SoF]

02 Mar 2006 at 08:53 - 10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savio

Out of curiosity, what exactly is so wrong about selling temporary guild membership positions?

Nothing, if you read the words right.
This is a clarification about the workings of the new in-game reward, so that players won't buy membership for this reason. Because they won't get then what they had hoped for.

Vaga

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Dec 2005

02 Mar 2006 at 08:54 - 11

Are the people buying these temporary guild memberships being trained or whats the deal?

Gaile Gray

ArenaNet

Join Date: Feb 2005

02 Mar 2006 at 08:54 - 12

There is no rule against it. Few do it, but no rule prohibits it in any way.

The only thing that is wrong is if the person is buying to attain the "guild reward" that is being distributed this week. If that's the case, the prospective buyer needs to know (1) it will go away if he leaves or is removed from the guild and (2) it will only last until the end of the qualifying season (unless you are No. 1).

With communication about those issues, then it's a free market.

Sagius Truthbarron

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jun 2005

Animal Factory [ZoO]

A/

02 Mar 2006 at 08:54 - 13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savio

Out of curiosity, what exactly is so wrong about selling temporary guild membership positions?

Those people were appearently tricked into thinking that by buying their way into the guild, just being a guild member could allow them to get the special rewards from the guild thingy that's comming up.

So, buying membership to get those rewards is kind of like being scammed?

Or not so much tricked as "led to believe"

Makkert

Black Beast of Aarrrrgghh

Join Date: May 2005

The Netherlands

The Biggyverse [PLEB] // Servants of Fortuna [SoF]

02 Mar 2006 at 08:55 - 14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vaga

Are the people buying these temporary guild memberships being trained or whats the deal?

That is everyone's guess. It could be training, it could be fame powerlevelling, it could be bragging rights to belong to a high ranked guild. Or the in-game reward, in which case they won't enjoy it long aparantly.

Lasareth

Aquarius

Join Date: Jun 2005

Somewhere between Boardwalk and Park Place

02 Mar 2006 at 08:58 - 15

I would hope that the benefit is at least training... it's kind of silly to pay just to say you're in a high ranked guild :/

To each his own I guess.

Archias

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Aug 2005

Las Vegas

Force of Arms {FOA}

02 Mar 2006 at 08:59 - 16

im sure there are a lot of people out there that would pay just to have bragging rights. I dont see the point of it but hey whatever floats your boat

Makkert

Black Beast of Aarrrrgghh

Join Date: May 2005

The Netherlands

The Biggyverse [PLEB] // Servants of Fortuna [SoF]

02 Mar 2006 at 09:08 - 17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Archias

im sure there are a lot of people out there that would pay just to have bragging rights. I dont see the point of it but hey whatever floats your boat

Well, the only thing I really can see for bragging rights:

1. enter high ranked guild
2. make screenshot of you being in the high ranked guild
3. apply for membership with ohter mediocre (/high) ranked guild, saying you were in guild X.

.............

This sounds so strange, it can't be true... Then again, some people are very talented in bending their minds in strange ways.

Vaga

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Dec 2005

02 Mar 2006 at 09:13 - 18

Easy way to get a tombs group too.

Fantus

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jun 2005

02 Mar 2006 at 09:32 - 19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savio

Out of curiosity, what exactly is so wrong about selling temporary guild membership positions?

Well, most people are members in good guilds because they are good players and deserve it. So most people will assert that someone wearing maybe an iQ or LuM or EviL tag is an elite player.

Buying a top ranked guild tag is like buying a Ph.D. degree in real life. Technically it might be legal in some cases or countries, but people who have a real one will consider you lame for doing it...

A top ranked guild should be better then people selling Ph.D. degrees, don't you agree?

Savio

Teenager with attitude

Join Date: Jul 2005

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

02 Mar 2006 at 09:56 - 20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fantus

Well, most people are members in good guilds because they are good players and deserve it. So most people will assert that someone wearing maybe an iQ or LuM or EviL tag is an elite player.

Buying a top ranked guild tag is like buying a Ph.D. degree in real life. Technically it might be legal in some cases or countries, but people who have a real one will consider you lame for doing it...

A top ranked guild should be better then people selling Ph.D. degrees, don't you agree?

I would argue that their guilds are on top because their members are good, not because their members "deserved" to be in a top guild. They worked for their rank X guild, so if they really wanted to sell memberships, they can go ahead and do so. It may be lame, but lame =/= unethical.

Poison Ivy

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jan 2006

Toronto

Hopping

Mo/A

02 Mar 2006 at 10:15 - 21

*Starts gather guild members to prepare an assult on the "low" high ranked guilds*

Hockster

Banned

Join Date: Jul 2005

02 Mar 2006 at 10:27 - 22

I'd like to know what this wonderful reward is to. If it's nothing more than a special emote, then pfft, keep it.

wolfe2dale

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Feb 2006

Hemel Hempstead

Guildless...

E/Me

02 Mar 2006 at 12:11 - 23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inde

From Gaile Gray:

Some of you may have heard about guilds selling memberships. It happens sometimes, and we really don't have a position on it, although some on the team feel strongly about it privately.

A high-ranking guild is currently offering to sell "temporary memberships" to their guild. I don't know what's driving the buyers, whether it's wanting to get high-level training or whether it's a desire on the part of the player to gain the reward connected with the fun season just concluded on the Guild Wars Ladder. If a purchase is based on the regards, then two things need to be known:

The reward for this "fun season" is temporary, and it will go away at the end of the 1st Qualifying Season of the GWFC.
The reward only applies to those who are active members of the guild, not those who have joined on a temporary basis. So if you join and are cycled out for another temporary member, you will outright lose the reward and you will not be able to get it back.

Anyone considering buying their way into a guild needs to be aware that they may be getting exactly what they seek or they may end up with far less than they bargained for, depending on their personal objectives. I hope providing the information above will help answer a couple of questions about the in-game item and guild membership sales.

Gaile,

Anet only has itself to blame for this.... As the game progresses into new chapters, (see Factions), more & more people will desperately be trying to join/ally with the top guilds so that they can enjoy the unique game content you have promised to those who control cites in the new continent. Also, the new GWWC is aimed only at the top guilds, leaving no chance for all the little guilds to get involved further prompting players to pay up for temporary memeberships.

I predict, no gaurantee, that large guilds will start charging for temporary alliances to allow smaller guilds access your promised 'elite mission' content.

This isn't a reflection on any players ability because not every player can be part of an elite guild, no matter how good they may be.

How do you intend to address this issue, or like WoW, do you intend to just let some players get scalped by others based on the Guild they belong to?

Vaga

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Dec 2005

02 Mar 2006 at 12:37 - 24

wolfe2dale, I am assuming to control a continent, ect... on factions you are going to require more people than these elite guilds can provide. You do not see the top 20 guilds with a member list of more than 20 odd people, and in factions you will probably need a lot more than that to take over a city.

Having an average guild with an average amount of people is probably going to be in just as good of a position if not better as an Elite guild with few people.

wolfe2dale

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Feb 2006

Hemel Hempstead

Guildless...

E/Me

02 Mar 2006 at 12:41 - 25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vaga

wolfe2dale, I am assuming to control a continent, ect... on factions you are going to require more people than these elite guilds can provide. You do not see the top 20 guilds with a member list of more than 20 odd people, and in factions you will probably need a lot more than that to take over a city.

Having an average guild with an average amount of people is probably going to be in just as good of a position if not better as an Elite guild with few people.

This one will have to be borne out with actual play, but I really believe that after everyone has settled into the game some alliances will hold onto thier bit of the continent for dear life.

The only challenge to them will be other 'giant' alliances... Any guilds not fortunate to be in these alliances will be left out in the cold, unless they pay to join...

Unless, of course, you are telling me that all guilds will be able to be part of a huge alliance, & that noone will be left out? Seems unlikely...

wolfe2dale

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Feb 2006

Hemel Hempstead

Guildless...

E/Me

02 Mar 2006 at 12:55 - 26

I've actually opened a new thread on my question above titled 'Elite Areas?' please reply to me there

Kakumei

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2005

Grind is subjective

learn this please

02 Mar 2006 at 13:30 - 27

So what, exactly, is the reward? Why hasn't this question been addressed at all?

myword

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2005

Korea

02 Mar 2006 at 13:50 - 28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sendai

that's what happens when almost every guild wars ladder event is made for the top 10 - top 20 guilds.

i agree. sub-par guilds should be rewarded.

wolfe2dale

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Feb 2006

Hemel Hempstead

Guildless...

E/Me

02 Mar 2006 at 14:00 - 29

Quote:

Originally Posted by myword

i agree. sub-par guilds should be rewarded.

I got this sort of response on the Guild Hall forums when I asked why all comps were aimed at only the top 50 guilds...

The silly thing is I wasn't asking for special treatment to be handed out to average guilds. I was asking for layered comps aimed at players of all abilities so that everyone could feel involved.

I was flamed off the forums for even suggesting that non-elite players should have a chance to join in the fun.

Urfin

Academy Page

Join Date: Nov 2005

Moscow, Russia

W/

02 Mar 2006 at 14:30 - 30

The large alliances hugging content & preventing access to it for other players is what's happening in EVE-Online too - but it's designed that way, and you always have the ability to just go and kill the bastards. Ok, they'll swarm you with numbers & finance of course, but at least you can try. And dying in EVE hurts alot, so if you succeed in killing them enough, you can chase them out of the territory.

Now in GW, dying doesn't hurt at all, and I don't see any mechanic that would allow a single player or a guild even to force access to content that another large group of players restricted in some way.

paulscott

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jan 2006

02 Mar 2006 at 15:15 - 31

/guilds zombies area 24 times a day

since there will prob be that limit

elite guild realizes it needs alliences

for all of those hours. and it realizes that it will need to increase its size so theres always a team there to defend for its shift(s).(this still applies for mixed guild teams)

and since the guild is increasing its size and its alliences more people will have accesse than you would think.

and don't forget that theres more than 1 district

antialias02

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2005

Eastern Iowa

Forsaken Wanderers [FW]

Me/E

02 Mar 2006 at 16:59 - 32

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolfe2dale

This one will have to be borne out with actual play, but I really believe that after everyone has settled into the game some alliances will hold onto thier bit of the continent for dear life.

The only challenge to them will be other 'giant' alliances... Any guilds not fortunate to be in these alliances will be left out in the cold, unless they pay to join...

Unless, of course, you are telling me that all guilds will be able to be part of a huge alliance, & that noone will be left out? Seems unlikely...

That's what I'm worried most about - a few players (in comparison to the entire GW population, anyway) getting in on all the action.

Kakumei

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2005

Grind is subjective

learn this please

02 Mar 2006 at 17:03 - 33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kakumei

So what, exactly, is the reward? Why hasn't this question been addressed at all?

????????

Mystical

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: May 2005

Mississauga, Ontario

Inyurface Gaming [IYF]

02 Mar 2006 at 17:12 - 34

Ditto the above question.

Dr Ripley

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jan 2006

Seattle

Force of Arms [FoA]

02 Mar 2006 at 21:49 - 35

Same: What is the reward?

Lasareth

Aquarius

Join Date: Jun 2005

Somewhere between Boardwalk and Park Place

02 Mar 2006 at 21:53 - 36

Gaile wouldn't say, or hasn't said, yet.

Fantus

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jun 2005

02 Mar 2006 at 21:58 - 37

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulscott

and since the guild is increasing its size and its alliences more people will have accesse than you would think.

If these so called "Elite Guilds" have like 50 members on average and if there are like 100 of them, we're talking about 5,000 players here. Double or triple that number if you like, it doesn't really matter. GW has about 2 million players now, so go figure. Honestly, if a significant number of developers is making content just to keep a fraction of GW's population happy, something seriously went wrong. Yeah, yeah, they say players won't miss any "important" content when they can't or don't compete in Alliance Battles, but they'd probably say UW and FoW are "unimportant" areas, too...

Count to Potato

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Feb 2006

Imagination Land

I Swear She Was Eighteen [Gwen]

W/

02 Mar 2006 at 22:03 - 38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Takeko Nakano

Top guilds sell membership? That is so lame - my opinion of them drops even lower

Think how much money they make??

antialias02

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2005

Eastern Iowa

Forsaken Wanderers [FW]

Me/E

02 Mar 2006 at 23:07 - 39

Yep. Nobody knows the reward and won't until it's actually handed out. Gaile said she would let those who are receiving it show it off without spoiling it for them.

But it's golden-something. That much we know from the froggie.

Sendai

Elite Guru

Join Date: Feb 2005

02 Mar 2006 at 23:33 - 40

Quote:

Originally Posted by myword

i agree. sub-par guilds should be rewarded.

ok may be you missed my point. What i meant was that the various ladder events (let's put the GWWC aside. Right now i can think of: this event, "own the devs", or "Bring out your builds") currently involves 2% to 10% (10% was "own the devs") of the actual ladder.
the fact that people are willing to join a top guild in order to have an item or whatever clearly shows that they're is some people in the lower ranked guilds that are willing to participate in such events. But right now the only ones they have are things like unofficial tournaments or ESL.

(that's a bit off topic...)