The update has been a big blow to the build...
And holy veil has been nerfed slightly as well...
Are we going to find better alternatives?
To all the Boon-Prots out there...
Echowinds
Are you still going to use OOB and Mend ailment?
The update has been a big blow to the build...
And holy veil has been nerfed slightly as well...
Are we going to find better alternatives?
The update has been a big blow to the build...
And holy veil has been nerfed slightly as well...
Are we going to find better alternatives?
ump
This is what I would consider doing for a 4v4 Boon Protect monk. Even before the update, I used Mend Condition as it usually healed more while I used CoP to remove stuff on myself. Mantra of Recall probably was more synergistic with CoP, but I never really got the hang of it because Offering of Blood was just easier to use. Inspired Hex used to be a Resurrection Signet/Protective Spirit, but considering I'm already putting points into Inspiration, I might as well have a real hex removal. I'm not too sure how this would translate to 8v8, because I like to have Aegis and Protective Spirit available to me and take out CoP and use Mend Ailment for more flexibility over Mend Condition. Now, it's hard to lose the Mend Condition and CoP so either my condition removal, my hex removal, or my protection is going to suffer.
Divine: 12+1+1=14
Protection: 9+1=10
Inspiration: 9
1) Reversal of Fortune
2) Guardian
3) Mend Condition - not affected by update, however, can't target self
4) Inspired Hex
5) Holy Veil - still useful to stop stacks, just can't remove as much hexes as before
6) Contemplation of Purity - primary self hex/condition removal
7) Divine Boon
8) Mantra of Recall
Divine: 12+1+1=14
Protection: 9+1=10
Inspiration: 9
1) Reversal of Fortune
2) Guardian
3) Mend Condition - not affected by update, however, can't target self
4) Inspired Hex
5) Holy Veil - still useful to stop stacks, just can't remove as much hexes as before
6) Contemplation of Purity - primary self hex/condition removal
7) Divine Boon
8) Mantra of Recall
Keyote
OoB is definitely not worth using now IMO. You'll only gain around 1 extra heal from it per 15 seconds after healing yourself. Thats if you dont kill yourself in the process. I'm looking at P&H, 1 pip will make a much bigger difference than OoB and just cover it with boon.
I'd like to hear from more experienced players why that a bad idea though, because to me the gain looks better than OoB was to begin with.
I'd like to hear from more experienced players why that a bad idea though, because to me the gain looks better than OoB was to begin with.
Keyote
Ok my math was wrong...
But P&H now works out about the same as OoB, the difference is you dont lose any health running it.
But P&H now works out about the same as OoB, the difference is you dont lose any health running it.
Nader Syrin
Well I tried to tweak the prot boon monk with this build:
Mo/Me
Divine: 15 (12+3)
Prot: 12 (8+1+3)
Inspiration: 10
Skills:
Reversal of Fortune
Guardian/Mend Ailment
Protective spirit
Complementation of Purity
Peace and Harmony (Elite)
Channeling
Ressurection Signet
Divine Boon
Pro:
You'll have cover enchanments on you, which means mesmers needs more time to remove Divine boon on you.
Con:
You'll need to be near atleast 2 energy to regain the -2 energy loss from divine boon, which means you'll be in danger when the enemy swtiches
Please express your thoughts or maybe tweak the build so we can rebuild the boon-prot monks
Yours,
Nader~
Mo/Me
Divine: 15 (12+3)
Prot: 12 (8+1+3)
Inspiration: 10
Skills:
Reversal of Fortune
Guardian/Mend Ailment
Protective spirit
Complementation of Purity
Peace and Harmony (Elite)
Channeling
Ressurection Signet
Divine Boon
Pro:
You'll have cover enchanments on you, which means mesmers needs more time to remove Divine boon on you.
Con:
You'll need to be near atleast 2 energy to regain the -2 energy loss from divine boon, which means you'll be in danger when the enemy swtiches
Please express your thoughts or maybe tweak the build so we can rebuild the boon-prot monks
Yours,
Nader~
Age
Why not use blessed aura instead of boon as it is for spells not enchants?
Keyote
P&H and channeling sounds like it might work. I'll have to adjust to using 2 slots for energy instead of 1, but it's worth it.
If they'd only hurry up and fix the boss with P&H so I could try it
If they'd only hurry up and fix the boss with P&H so I could try it
4runner
question? was the nerf to OoB really that big of a deal it was 10 on its 20% sac> is that really that big of a deal?? Just curious!
JYX
10% is not an inconsiderable amount anyway, 20% is some bad bad stuff. You need to realise that this active energy management is not particularly wonderous at the best of times, its just that theres not much choice other than we use them. With the 20% health penalty, you're making a little more than 7 energy every time you cast it, thats around about 1.4 pips of extra energy you're gaining as well as putting yourself in danger for a bit...thats 1 extra cast.
In terms of monk energy management, we're already scraping the barrel. This nerf was just salt in the wounds.
In terms of monk energy management, we're already scraping the barrel. This nerf was just salt in the wounds.
noocoo
Quote:
Originally Posted by Echowinds
Are you still going to use OOB and Mend ailment?
The update has been a big blow to the build...
And holy veil has been nerfed slightly as well...
Are we going to find better alternatives?
why not use them?
They both were nerf indeed, but they still work.
Just not be as powerful as before.
The update has been a big blow to the build...
And holy veil has been nerfed slightly as well...
Are we going to find better alternatives?
why not use them?They both were nerf indeed, but they still work.
Just not be as powerful as before.
Echowinds
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keyote
P&H and channeling sounds like it might work. I'll have to adjust to using 2 slots for energy instead of 1, but it's worth it.
If they'd only hurry up and fix the boss with P&H so I could try it
I find channeling very bad as you need to be quite close to a group in order to use it effectively, and close to a big group = BBQ Monk meat 
If they'd only hurry up and fix the boss with P&H so I could try it
Esuna
Channeling is not too bad - I use it for my boon prot build in "queen farming" right now - the diameter is a bit short of a ward's diameter, which is pretty decent for a cheap enchant like that. Besides, as a monk, you're gonna be sought out anyway. Warriors will come to you, earth eles will chase you down, thumpers will be on your toes - why not use it? :P
Btw @ Nadar Sirin's build, why not use Mantra of Recall rather than Peace and Harmony? Seems like you'll use inspiration magic anyways. Although, I'm not sure on the math about energy regen pipes and what not. Can someone do a comparison between MoR and P&H?
Edit
Read it in another thread: Peace And Stinking Harmony!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Murder In China
Btw @ Nadar Sirin's build, why not use Mantra of Recall rather than Peace and Harmony? Seems like you'll use inspiration magic anyways. Although, I'm not sure on the math about energy regen pipes and what not. Can someone do a comparison between MoR and P&H?
Edit
Read it in another thread: Peace And Stinking Harmony!
Quote:
Wow 1 extra pip of energy, that translate to 1 energy per 3 seconds.
That is pure utter shit compare to other Elite Energy mangement spells.
Offering of Blood at 10 Blood magic nets you 11 energy and recharges every 15 seconds. That translates to 2.2 pips which is an extra 2.2 mana every 3 seconds plus it can't be stripped off since it's a spell.
Mantra of Recall at 10 Inspiration magic nets you 13 and recharges every 20 seconds (or more/less depending on enchantment mods and CoP) which gives you 1.95 pips of energy that translates to 1.95 extra energy every 3 seconds. Even though it's an enchantment can be stripped off, it provides you energy when it ends unlike Peace and Harmony. QuixotesGhost thanks for pointing that out.
Word of Healing is a bit different, it acts like an Orison of Healing OR a Heal Other depending on the ally's health. Heal Other cost 10 energy while Word of Healing cost 5. Say you find that one of your party member's life bar dip under 50%, you cast Word of Healing and it heals as much as Heal Other. You just saveD yourself 5 energy. This means you didn't have to wait 6 seconds to regenerate 10 energy to cast Heal Other on your ally if you had Peace and Harmony on.
Now why do I see PnH as shit? I guess now we have our answer, lol.
That is pure utter shit compare to other Elite Energy mangement spells.
Offering of Blood at 10 Blood magic nets you 11 energy and recharges every 15 seconds. That translates to 2.2 pips which is an extra 2.2 mana every 3 seconds plus it can't be stripped off since it's a spell.
Mantra of Recall at 10 Inspiration magic nets you 13 and recharges every 20 seconds (or more/less depending on enchantment mods and CoP) which gives you 1.95 pips of energy that translates to 1.95 extra energy every 3 seconds. Even though it's an enchantment can be stripped off, it provides you energy when it ends unlike Peace and Harmony. QuixotesGhost thanks for pointing that out.
Word of Healing is a bit different, it acts like an Orison of Healing OR a Heal Other depending on the ally's health. Heal Other cost 10 energy while Word of Healing cost 5. Say you find that one of your party member's life bar dip under 50%, you cast Word of Healing and it heals as much as Heal Other. You just saveD yourself 5 energy. This means you didn't have to wait 6 seconds to regenerate 10 energy to cast Heal Other on your ally if you had Peace and Harmony on.
Now why do I see PnH as shit? I guess now we have our answer, lol.
Keyote
The problem with MoR is the 10 energy cost. If your energy is running low and you spend 10 energy and wont gain anything back for another 20 seconds, it's completely useless. In that case you need CoP which is another 5 energy and for a boon monk you'll have to spend another 5 putting boon back on meaning you've just spent 20 energy and gain 3. So again thats useless.
With P&H you have a steady stream of energy, although only 5 every 15 secs. Used with channeling it's constant energy coming in.
As far as OoB, he says:
"Offering of Blood at 10 Blood magic nets you 11 energy and recharges every 15 seconds."
In what circumstances can you stand there waiting for natural health regen to gain that 11 energy? Any monk in 4v4 will be under enough pressure they have to self heal after OoB if they haven't already commited suicide, for a boon monk thats 7 lost making a 4 energy gain.
With P&H you have a steady stream of energy, although only 5 every 15 secs. Used with channeling it's constant energy coming in.
As far as OoB, he says:
"Offering of Blood at 10 Blood magic nets you 11 energy and recharges every 15 seconds."
In what circumstances can you stand there waiting for natural health regen to gain that 11 energy? Any monk in 4v4 will be under enough pressure they have to self heal after OoB if they haven't already commited suicide, for a boon monk thats 7 lost making a 4 energy gain.
Rukmedes
The 20% from oob is 100+ HP for me.
Also, Peace and Harmony = uninstall.
Also, Peace and Harmony = uninstall.
Keyote
Then give a better option for a boon monk. OoB?
aB-
Right now mantra of recall seems like the best option. If you are contsantly casting it every 20 seconds then you are gaining 13(?) energy every 20 seconds, the equivalent of nearly 2 pips of regeneration. The energy gain is similar to OoB except you receive the energy every 20 seconds instead of every 15. It can be hard to manage at times, but provides a solid amount of energy.
Peace and Harmony just seems too risky to me. If it gets removed, you are left without any energy management until the cooldown ends. The one thing that it has going for it is it can be maintained on 2 monks at once, but again, if it gets removed...
Peace and Harmony just seems too risky to me. If it gets removed, you are left without any energy management until the cooldown ends. The one thing that it has going for it is it can be maintained on 2 monks at once, but again, if it gets removed...
romO
I discuss and do the math on the alternatives for energy management on monks in this thread: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...d.php?t=131361
nebuchanezzar
IMO MoRs only glaring weakness is after you die. You only come up with E in the teens. Now you have to either leave your MoR alone or cast it and boon and wait and hope no one else dies.
If you were able to boon prot and keep you E in the midling range you will do just fine. MoR means you E bar should be from the 1/2 to full range. The only times I purposely CoP it is if it has recharged early.
IMO MoR does hurt the CoP ability of Boon/Prots as it can force you to remove your MoR earlier than wanted but that can be worked around.
If you were able to boon prot and keep you E in the midling range you will do just fine. MoR means you E bar should be from the 1/2 to full range. The only times I purposely CoP it is if it has recharged early.
IMO MoR does hurt the CoP ability of Boon/Prots as it can force you to remove your MoR earlier than wanted but that can be worked around.
Keyote
Numbers are all good, it's the situations that make it so complicated.
MoR would be a decent choice but when your energy is running low it becomes a real problem.
MoR would be a decent choice but when your energy is running low it becomes a real problem.
Dodo The Extinct
For me, the only real problem with MoR is that it can make easy prey to an above average inturrupter. That was a nice thing about OoB.
koneko
I've really tried to use MoR but it's just not working out. Shattered, shattered, shattered.
I've been playing around with Energy Drain instead of OoB and MoR for PvE on my boon monk. At 10 Inspiration, you gain 16 energy (-5en casting) = 11 energy.
Problem: It's slower than OoB with a 25 second recharge.
I've been playing around with Energy Drain instead of OoB and MoR for PvE on my boon monk. At 10 Inspiration, you gain 16 energy (-5en casting) = 11 energy.
Problem: It's slower than OoB with a 25 second recharge.
Tarot Ribos
Here's what I'm seeing...
Holy Veil didn't get that nerfed. Just some recharge time added on, preventing total spammability. Compare with Remove Hex, which has a 7-second recharge and a 2-second cast, ensuring that the hex will last at least 2 seconds. Holy Veil can still be taken off ASAP to remove the hex. It's like a pay-now-use-later deal. The cost of that deal? Five more energy.
Why am I talking about Holy Veil? Because it's an enchantment that is maintained. Why should Prot Boon monks care?
Blessed Freakin' Signet. Every 12 seconds (10 recharge + 2 cast), you get three energy per enchantment maintained. It's essentially 3/4s of a pip of extra energy no matter how many enchantments you maintain. Now, that may sound poor in comparison to the alternatives (MoR, PnH, and OoB)... but here are the things Blessed Signet has going for it:
-IT'S NOT ELITE. Caps to emphasize. You still have an elite slot open to do with as you choose.
-Not strippable, like PnH. Shares this quality with OoB.
-Harder to interrupt, despite casting time. After all, it's not a spell. Power Drain? Nope. Power Leak/Spike? Nope. Mesmers are stuck with Cry of Frustration and maybe Power Block (can't remember how that one works). Of course, I'll give you that interrupting rangers don't care. But it's easier to avoid them.
-No HP sacrifice. Is 20% of your health worth an extra pip of energy? Especially 20% of your health every 15 seconds?
-Energy NOW, not 20 seconds from now. Sorry, Mantra of Recall.
Think on this. You can maintain four enchantments, and with Blessed Signet, you've got the equivalent of three energy pips. Oh yeah, and your elite is still open.
Yeah. I like Blessed Signet. I'll probably get flamed for it, but I find it worth using.
Holy Veil didn't get that nerfed. Just some recharge time added on, preventing total spammability. Compare with Remove Hex, which has a 7-second recharge and a 2-second cast, ensuring that the hex will last at least 2 seconds. Holy Veil can still be taken off ASAP to remove the hex. It's like a pay-now-use-later deal. The cost of that deal? Five more energy.
Why am I talking about Holy Veil? Because it's an enchantment that is maintained. Why should Prot Boon monks care?
Blessed Freakin' Signet. Every 12 seconds (10 recharge + 2 cast), you get three energy per enchantment maintained. It's essentially 3/4s of a pip of extra energy no matter how many enchantments you maintain. Now, that may sound poor in comparison to the alternatives (MoR, PnH, and OoB)... but here are the things Blessed Signet has going for it:
-IT'S NOT ELITE. Caps to emphasize. You still have an elite slot open to do with as you choose.
-Not strippable, like PnH. Shares this quality with OoB.
-Harder to interrupt, despite casting time. After all, it's not a spell. Power Drain? Nope. Power Leak/Spike? Nope. Mesmers are stuck with Cry of Frustration and maybe Power Block (can't remember how that one works). Of course, I'll give you that interrupting rangers don't care. But it's easier to avoid them.
-No HP sacrifice. Is 20% of your health worth an extra pip of energy? Especially 20% of your health every 15 seconds?
-Energy NOW, not 20 seconds from now. Sorry, Mantra of Recall.
Think on this. You can maintain four enchantments, and with Blessed Signet, you've got the equivalent of three energy pips. Oh yeah, and your elite is still open.
Yeah. I like Blessed Signet. I'll probably get flamed for it, but I find it worth using.
aB-
Blessed signet is too risky. It has a 2 second cast time, interrupt fodder, and if enchantments are stripped from allies the energy gain is lost. And again, the 2 second cast time can mean death if you cast it while a target gets spiked.
Neo-LD
OoB recieved a nerf, but is still not only viable, but the best option. This is especially true in gvg, where the other monk and heal party support really make the extra sacrifice nearly invisible unless you are under direct attack. In TA, OoB is slightly more risky b/c you are always the primary target and there is less support, but its still perfectly manageable if you conserve, use OoB at correct times, and get adaquate support from teammates.
OoB's main strength remains its near invulnerability to shut down, relative to other energy management options. MoR boon prots fall apart easily under any kinda of shutdown, be it interupt, energy denial, domination mesmers etc. Energy Drain always has the issue of not giving as much energy as OoB, but its buffed while OoB is nerfed, so maybe itll work. Still not as impervious as 1/4s cast 15s recharge.
However, I have dumped mend ailement in favor of mend condition. I usually get at least the same amount of healing or more, than if I used ailment. Mend Conditions recharge is still 2s. In gvg, I can get conditions of myself from cross removal, or if Im on my own I can use cop to get them off in large chunks. Usually, tho, I ignore conditions on myself unless they are dazed, deep wound, or have stacked me to ~10 degen. They arent a significant threat.
OoB's main strength remains its near invulnerability to shut down, relative to other energy management options. MoR boon prots fall apart easily under any kinda of shutdown, be it interupt, energy denial, domination mesmers etc. Energy Drain always has the issue of not giving as much energy as OoB, but its buffed while OoB is nerfed, so maybe itll work. Still not as impervious as 1/4s cast 15s recharge.
However, I have dumped mend ailement in favor of mend condition. I usually get at least the same amount of healing or more, than if I used ailment. Mend Conditions recharge is still 2s. In gvg, I can get conditions of myself from cross removal, or if Im on my own I can use cop to get them off in large chunks. Usually, tho, I ignore conditions on myself unless they are dazed, deep wound, or have stacked me to ~10 degen. They arent a significant threat.
sno
I've been running with Mantra of Recall, mend condition, and inspired hex in Arenas, and that's been working fine for me. It's not as good as oob/ailment/guardian was, but nerfs called for a change. Here's my current bar
prot spirit
reversal
mend condition
holy veil
inspired hex
contemplation
mantra of recall(e)
I actually like inspired hex a lot compared to guardian or sig of devotion. It helps a lot considering without it, you'll have to wait 12 seconds to remove a covered hex, which in todays arenas are plentiful.
prot spirit
reversal
mend condition
holy veil
inspired hex
contemplation
mantra of recall(e)
I actually like inspired hex a lot compared to guardian or sig of devotion. It helps a lot considering without it, you'll have to wait 12 seconds to remove a covered hex, which in todays arenas are plentiful.
Ensign
OoB is actually dangerous to use now, though the returns are still excellent. I'm currently messing around with EDrain versions which are reasonably promising - you don't get the same returns off of the Drain, but you get a second management skill that can get you into the same ballpark. It's not as powerful but it's not as dangerous either.
Ailment isn't really impressive anymore but you need it if you're worried about splits at all. In straight up 8v8s Condition is a bit stronger. I don't really like my monks being responsible for condition removal though.
Not sure which way we'll swing in the future. I am glad that there are some actual choices involved now, though.
Peace,
-CxE
Ailment isn't really impressive anymore but you need it if you're worried about splits at all. In straight up 8v8s Condition is a bit stronger. I don't really like my monks being responsible for condition removal though.
Not sure which way we'll swing in the future. I am glad that there are some actual choices involved now, though.
Peace,
-CxE
Falcon213
I don't play TA much, but in GvG MoR + Inspired Hex is the way to go. MoR takes a lot of practice to get it down right. I'm still not as good as I could be, but by itself it works at near OoB levels except for right after a res. But when you combine it with Inspired Hex then energy problems are nearly gone. Inspired Hex may take longer to recast than Remove Hex and Holy Veil, but it casts in 1s and has the extra energy bonus. Since I've started using Insipired Hex my energy problems have been near gone.
OoB is still a viable option though. In GvG I would run one monk with Oob and Veil, and one with MoR and IH. As for Ailment/Condition, Condition is a must for boon prot, because spamming RoF/Guardian and sprinkling in Ailment just can't compare with spamming RoF/Condition with all the conditions in GvG.
OoB is still a viable option though. In GvG I would run one monk with Oob and Veil, and one with MoR and IH. As for Ailment/Condition, Condition is a must for boon prot, because spamming RoF/Guardian and sprinkling in Ailment just can't compare with spamming RoF/Condition with all the conditions in GvG.
Keyote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo-LD
OoB recieved a nerf, but is still not only viable, but the best option. This is especially true in gvg
Obviously in a team of 8 you have much greater options, so yes OoB may still be the best option.
For a single monk in RA or TA being constantly ganked, it's worthless.
For a single monk in RA or TA being constantly ganked, it's worthless.
JR
After looking very closely at the numbers, there are two forms of energy management I would be willing to run on my monks at the moment. Word/Drain Enchantment, and Energy Drain/Drain Enchant (optional).
I still don't like MoR, at all. Given the current popularity of surge/burn mesmers, and MoR's inability to dig you out of any kind of energy denial (infact it just digs you deeper for 20 seconds) I wont be running that. Energy Drain actually works out with a return not *too* far off OoB, and has the offensive bonus, the ability to run secondary energy management, and the ability to run distortion. All the good things about mesmer secondary, without having to resort to MoR. Which, incase you missed it the first time round, I really really dislike.
As for the Ailment nerf, in warrior heavy builds that I don't plan on splitting with I will be using Draw conditions. A very powerfull and very spammable condition removal. In builds that are designed to split, it's still all about Mend Ailment.
Offering of blood? Reserved for the odd necro that might need energy management without speccing in inspiration. I don't think it will see much more use than that for me though.
I still don't like MoR, at all. Given the current popularity of surge/burn mesmers, and MoR's inability to dig you out of any kind of energy denial (infact it just digs you deeper for 20 seconds) I wont be running that. Energy Drain actually works out with a return not *too* far off OoB, and has the offensive bonus, the ability to run secondary energy management, and the ability to run distortion. All the good things about mesmer secondary, without having to resort to MoR. Which, incase you missed it the first time round, I really really dislike.
As for the Ailment nerf, in warrior heavy builds that I don't plan on splitting with I will be using Draw conditions. A very powerfull and very spammable condition removal. In builds that are designed to split, it's still all about Mend Ailment.
Offering of blood? Reserved for the odd necro that might need energy management without speccing in inspiration. I don't think it will see much more use than that for me though.
Lazarus
I have been using pretty much the same boon prot build for 7 or 8 months. I vary it slightly depending on what I am up against.
Attributes
Attributes
Inspiration Magic: 9
Protection Prayers: 10
Divine Favor: 16
Skills
Guardian
Reversal of Fortune
Protective Spirit
Mend Ailment
Remove Hex
Divine Boon
Energy Drain
Restore Life / Rebirth / Res Sig
The condition removal is a bit slower now, but the decreased recharge of Energy Drain kinda makes up for it. I have never been a fan of sacrificing life on a monk and only tested OoB a few times. It just never paid off for me. If you do the math on this build you are looking at over 110 hit points healed for 7 energy on most casts. Reversal of Fortune and Mend Ailment pay off better most of the time. If you can figure out the "tell" of a spike group, you can keep the target alive while the other team wastes energy. The biggest draw back of this build is obvioulsy energy denial teams, but isn't that true of all enchantment based builds?
I hope this helps a bit.
Laz
JR
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazarus
Inspiration Magic: 9
Protection Prayers: 10
Divine Favor: 16
Skills
Guardian
Reversal of Fortune
Protective Spirit
Mend Ailment
Remove Hex
Divine Boon
Energy Drain
Restore Life / Rebirth / Res Sig I would certainly not run remove hex, it has a slow cast time which means you generally wont be able to get key hexes off before they are covered. Not to mention how easy it is to interrupt. Holy Veil is a far better choice, despite the recent change to it that added 2 seconds to the recharge. Personally I would run Inspiration at 10, and get more of an energy bonus. The benefit of running 1 more in prot isn't really as good as the extra point in inspiration.
Also, on a boon prot which is a fairly energy intensive build to begin with, I would consider running Drain Enchantment in place of where you have a res at the moment. More energy to keep your team alive lessens the chance of needing it.
Elurian
I took my pre nerf boon/prot into arenas last night and it didn't seem to be that much worse than what it was before. First match I was trying to lay off of it because the 20% was worrying me which hurt me more than it helped me under heavy hate I hit 0 nrg and went down quickly. After getting a rez the first match I spammed it too much and it again hurt me more than helped. The subsequent 10 matches I played I was fine so long as I rememberd guardian before OoB to ensure I was at full hp. Problems did arise when I was targeted for a spike when I was going to OoB but, that is easily prevented if you don't use it on a regular schedual. I found that under heavy pressure I was able to keep using OoB by spamming CoP/Boon the difference being I needed to keep Guardian up as well. Now the 5 + 5 + 7 energy cost of that sequence (guard/boon/CoP/guard/OoB/Boon/CoP/ etc) does send you negative in the energy management you still have your 3 pips per second which I think will put you still in the positive direction for energy. I think the change to OoB just makes the player have to walk a thin line between using it too much and using it too little.
Recharge time on mend ailment started to annoy me a bit, but the thing to remember is 1. You're a boon build 2. mend ail heals for remaining conditions Warrior A is bleeding/poisioned. Sure ideally you'd like to take them both off quickly. Fact is mend ail has 5 sec recharge now. So you hit the war with a mend ail and he is healed for 58 + 35 + 61 totalling at 154 hp on the first mend the second mend will hel for 93 hp thats still close to 1/5 or 1/6 of the warriors hp each time
The recharge addition on veil didn't even come up really as a boon prot you are not there to remove hexes (thats what your mesmer is for) veil helps mitigate the hex problem but it never was the be all end all hex removal.
Stats : Prot: 13 DF: 11 Blood: 10 (Defender Scalp + Minor DF + Minor Prot)
EQ: Firey Flamespitter of Enchanting (20%) and a Shadestone (Mods of importance 10% skill recharge 10% faster cast 20% longer enchants)
Recharge time on mend ailment started to annoy me a bit, but the thing to remember is 1. You're a boon build 2. mend ail heals for remaining conditions Warrior A is bleeding/poisioned. Sure ideally you'd like to take them both off quickly. Fact is mend ail has 5 sec recharge now. So you hit the war with a mend ail and he is healed for 58 + 35 + 61 totalling at 154 hp on the first mend the second mend will hel for 93 hp thats still close to 1/5 or 1/6 of the warriors hp each time
The recharge addition on veil didn't even come up really as a boon prot you are not there to remove hexes (thats what your mesmer is for) veil helps mitigate the hex problem but it never was the be all end all hex removal.
Stats : Prot: 13 DF: 11 Blood: 10 (Defender Scalp + Minor DF + Minor Prot)
EQ: Firey Flamespitter of Enchanting (20%) and a Shadestone (Mods of importance 10% skill recharge 10% faster cast 20% longer enchants)
koneko
Quote:
Originally Posted by JR-
Personally I would run Inspiration at 10, and get more of an energy bonus.
Energy Drain functions the same at 9 and 10 points in Inspiration Magic (8 energy stolen).
Sinjin
Don't forget CoP - an excellent addition to the benefits of boon.
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The main reason I don't like MoR is cuz it's hard to improve: 20% longer enchants don't help (it hurts), and 20% faster recharges don't help much either unless you CoP off early. On the other hand, OoB can be boosted with 2x 20% faster recharges in a wand/focus combo.
Consequently, my prefered choice now looks to be energy drain/drain enchantment which can at least be improved with 20% + 20% inspiration recharge.
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The main reason I don't like MoR is cuz it's hard to improve: 20% longer enchants don't help (it hurts), and 20% faster recharges don't help much either unless you CoP off early. On the other hand, OoB can be boosted with 2x 20% faster recharges in a wand/focus combo.
Consequently, my prefered choice now looks to be energy drain/drain enchantment which can at least be improved with 20% + 20% inspiration recharge.
Keyote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazarus
Attributes
Inspiration Magic: 9
Protection Prayers: 10
Divine Favor: 16
Skills
Guardian
Reversal of Fortune
Protective Spirit
Mend Ailment
Remove Hex
Divine Boon
Energy Drain
Restore Life / Rebirth / Res Sig
Laz Energy Drain as the only energy management isn't nearly enough for me in CA. I've been trying Edrain, channeling and Divine spirit. I'm lacking hex removal, so maybe inspired hex would be worth a try instead of channeling, but the options for hex removal are pathetic anyway.
JR
Quote:
Originally Posted by koneko
Energy Drain functions the same at 9 and 10 points in Inspiration Magic (8 energy stolen).
That was assuming he ran Drain Enchant aswell. Wasn't very clear there.
Neo-LD
All purpose TA/GvG/Split boon prot:
12+4 Divine Favor
10 Blood Magic
8+1 Protection Prayers
Guardian
Mend Condition
Reversal of Fortune
Devotion Signet
Holy Veil
Offering of Blood
Divine Boon
Contemplation of Purity
Works just fine, and shrugs off the patch nerfs nicely. Has the flexibility of all boon prots, able to deal with spike/conditions/hexes/warriors etc. In full 8v8 offering is only dangerous if under direct attack. The damage is otherwise invisible since it will dissapear after one devo sig, one heal party from your local flashbot, or crossheal from the other monk. Mend Condition heals much more than any other skill on the bar, and is available more than twice as often as ailment would be, for more healing and more degen condition removal.
In 4v4 (TA or split) it still works great, but takes more concentration. If under attack, heal yourself as high as possible before using offering. For example, you are at 2/3 hp with 12 energy, use rof and then oob, and you have a much higher chance of surviving than using oob first. Not having self easy self condition removal is not as big a deal as it sounds. There is only one condition I really care about, deep wound. And theres generally only one way Im going to get it, from warriors. If theres a warrior on me I probably have guardian on me too (if I was smart), and I can cop deep wound off with a nice 170 hp boost, 1 other condition potentially removed, and 2 hexes potentially removed. Degen conditions arent dangerous to you, they arent a threat. They are only dangerous when your entire team has them, and you should be feeding off the extra healing they provide to your mend condition (MC is the primary "heal other" spell unless there are no conditions or the teammate is almost dead, in which case you should use reversal)
Lastly, dont be afraid of devotion signet. It wont work all the time, but it certainly will work some of the time. Devo Sig really helps conserve energy, the primary concern of boon prots postpatch now that they have to heal up OoB. Theres really only one way it will get shut down, through interupt. Interupters are easily dealt with, just kite and cast nothing but reversal and he will either continue to be useless whiffing, or he will move to someone else, at which point you can go back to normal routines, which include devo sig.
Moral of the story? Relax, OoB Boon Prots still work fine.
12+4 Divine Favor
10 Blood Magic
8+1 Protection Prayers
Guardian
Mend Condition
Reversal of Fortune
Devotion Signet
Holy Veil
Offering of Blood
Divine Boon
Contemplation of Purity
Works just fine, and shrugs off the patch nerfs nicely. Has the flexibility of all boon prots, able to deal with spike/conditions/hexes/warriors etc. In full 8v8 offering is only dangerous if under direct attack. The damage is otherwise invisible since it will dissapear after one devo sig, one heal party from your local flashbot, or crossheal from the other monk. Mend Condition heals much more than any other skill on the bar, and is available more than twice as often as ailment would be, for more healing and more degen condition removal.
In 4v4 (TA or split) it still works great, but takes more concentration. If under attack, heal yourself as high as possible before using offering. For example, you are at 2/3 hp with 12 energy, use rof and then oob, and you have a much higher chance of surviving than using oob first. Not having self easy self condition removal is not as big a deal as it sounds. There is only one condition I really care about, deep wound. And theres generally only one way Im going to get it, from warriors. If theres a warrior on me I probably have guardian on me too (if I was smart), and I can cop deep wound off with a nice 170 hp boost, 1 other condition potentially removed, and 2 hexes potentially removed. Degen conditions arent dangerous to you, they arent a threat. They are only dangerous when your entire team has them, and you should be feeding off the extra healing they provide to your mend condition (MC is the primary "heal other" spell unless there are no conditions or the teammate is almost dead, in which case you should use reversal)
Lastly, dont be afraid of devotion signet. It wont work all the time, but it certainly will work some of the time. Devo Sig really helps conserve energy, the primary concern of boon prots postpatch now that they have to heal up OoB. Theres really only one way it will get shut down, through interupt. Interupters are easily dealt with, just kite and cast nothing but reversal and he will either continue to be useless whiffing, or he will move to someone else, at which point you can go back to normal routines, which include devo sig.
Moral of the story? Relax, OoB Boon Prots still work fine.
JR
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo-LD
Moral of the story? Relax, OoB Boon Prots still work fine.
However, now that you actually have to factor in the energy cost of post-OoB healing; OoB is no longer the king of energy management. There are definate viable alternatives to look at.
Keyote
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo-LD
In 4v4 (TA or split) it still works great, but takes more concentration. If under attack, heal yourself as high as possible before using offering. For example, you are at 2/3 hp with 12 energy, use rof and then oob, and you have a much higher chance of surviving than using oob first.
No doubt you'll survive it, but you've just healed yourself to max to make sure you can use it, then still need to heal after (to be at 2/3 and in TA you're almost certainly under pressure).
For a boon monk, thats a 7 energy self heal after to negate the 20% sac. You've just gained a maximum of 4 energy from OoB. It's simply worthless in 4v4.
Edit: ok i missed sig of devotion...but a 2 second cast signet after a 20% drop in health? No way I'd risk it.
For a boon monk, thats a 7 energy self heal after to negate the 20% sac. You've just gained a maximum of 4 energy from OoB. It's simply worthless in 4v4.
Edit: ok i missed sig of devotion...but a 2 second cast signet after a 20% drop in health? No way I'd risk it.
Elurian
Your logic is flawed in a couple ways. First you're assuming hes going to devo sig himself and second the big note most of you are glossing over -if everyone is attacking you then no one is attacking anyone else- Thats why OoB still works. You're running out of nrg having to heal yourself because of pressure. Ok... you're still healing/protting yourself while you're using OoB... you're running out of nrg because you're having to prot others... hrmm if they aren't attacking you then it isn't a problem to recoup the hp.
Devo Sig is a good idea though I might swap that in for something else.
Jr does have a point that other energy management systems are now more viable but, IMHO too open for shutdown/not able to dig you out of a hole/retardedly easy to shatter. I felt the same way as you did Keyote until I took my OoB Boon/Prot into arenas and tried it. GO TRY IT because it seems like to me you haven't.
EDIT: And thats 3 possible hexes removed 1 for coping with boon 1 for veil and 1 when veil ends
Devo Sig is a good idea though I might swap that in for something else.
Jr does have a point that other energy management systems are now more viable but, IMHO too open for shutdown/not able to dig you out of a hole/retardedly easy to shatter. I felt the same way as you did Keyote until I took my OoB Boon/Prot into arenas and tried it. GO TRY IT because it seems like to me you haven't.
EDIT: And thats 3 possible hexes removed 1 for coping with boon 1 for veil and 1 when veil ends