But that doesnt spell doom to us all, i am currently saving rare items and prepare to sell them later at a higher price, those little suckers.
Gear up while you still can, inflation is coming up next
Crom the Conqueror
Gear up while you still can, inflation is right next to the horizon. I am currently buying all the good weapons and runes while I still can buy at a lower price. Like all mmorpg games, inflation is right ahead of us. Inflation happens when the money supply(the amount of money in the market) become higher and higher. With more and more money in people's wallet, they will be willing to pay goods at higher and higher price. Maybe a good sword is 4k today, a few months from now it will be 10K or more.
But that doesnt spell doom to us all, i am currently saving rare items and prepare to sell them later at a higher price, those little suckers.
But that doesnt spell doom to us all, i am currently saving rare items and prepare to sell them later at a higher price, those little suckers.
Stev0
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Crom the Conqueror
Gear up while you still can, inflation is right next to the horizon. I am currently buying all the good weapons and runes while I still can buy at a lower price. Like all mmorpg games, inflation is right ahead of us. Inflation happens when the money supply(the amount of money in the market) become higher and higher. With more and more money in people's wallet, they will be willing to pay goods at higher and higher price. Maybe a good sword is 4k today, a few months from now it will be 10K or more.
But that doesnt spell doom to us all, i am currently saving rare items and prepare to sell them later at a higher price, those little suckers. |
ps. If its the latter. What you are doing is only helping the cost increase and aiding the rising cost of items. If it's the former then nothing can be done... except executing the dumasses who are selling gold on ebay.
ManadartheHealer
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Stev0
Who dictates this? Are items in the game going to recieve increment costs or are people just holding out for more cash for items?
ps. If its the latter. What you are doing is only helping the cost increase and aiding the rising cost of items. If it's the former then nothing can be done... except executing the dumasses who are selling gold on ebay. |
And what he is doing isn't contributing a lot to the problem (if most did it maybe it would). He is just starting his holding out sooner (which may be a waste of time. Remember, time=money).
Inflation is inevitable. If you don't like it, don't participate in the economy at all (which, no matter how bad it gets, is usually to your disadvantage)
Darc.Syde
well who cares? items arent worth anything anyway...
OrangeArrow
personally I also think that once People get money they wont care what price an item sells at as long as its good value i treasure free inventory spots more than anything
Crom the Conqueror
Higher damand and the increase of money supply. More and more people are joining the game, demand for an item get higher and higher. We can observe this right here in our own forum. Go to the market, see one person bit, lets say 1K on an item than another person want to get it, so he will bit higher, the next person will bit even higher. Because of demand, general price level will go up. And, each day we are earning more and more money, thus like I said, the money supply increases. And there we have inflation, and a pretty darn fast one.
Who dictates this?
the answer is no one. No one can control the market, only in a command economy. And I holding back items will not affect inflation, I will just get more money when the proce level goes up.
Who dictates this?
the answer is no one. No one can control the market, only in a command economy. And I holding back items will not affect inflation, I will just get more money when the proce level goes up.
Zeppelin
The real answer is everyone, and you are contributing to it, no matter how small of an impact you have as one person. It's a common desire to get as much as you can for something, but intentionally holding out until you get a certain price certainly aids inflation. If 1000 other people did the same thing as you, there would be a shorter supply of items, therefore raising prices even further because of demand.
Dagbiker
its 2:15 here so i might not sound cohearent, but i think what dictates this is the willingness and the beleaf that theres inflation. i do realize that there is a good amount of inflation. also we are given the ability to traid, and if no real person wants to do that, traid with an npc.
Crom the Conqueror
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Dagbiker
its 2:15 here so i might not sound cohearent, but i think what dictates this is the willingness and the beleaf that theres inflation. i do realize that there is a good amount of inflation. also we are given the ability to traid, and if no real person wants to do that, traid with an npc.
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obvlexi
this has already happened with sigils... not long ago they were selling for 35-40k and now they go for over 100k
SOT
I will simply do what I have been doing for the most part, getting drops, upgrading them with drops, and what not. That is a ridiculous town crier plot to make people panic. Not gonna happen with me 
sybban
The cheapest i saw sigils go for was 10k when I first entered the game
Nessaja
This doesnt count for runes and weapons I think, while it does count for sigils.
While it's true that more money is available, weapons arent exactly hard to get either. Evening it out.
Ñaz
While it's true that more money is available, weapons arent exactly hard to get either. Evening it out.
Ñaz
taion
Yes. The rate of increase of supply of weapons and other items in the economy is proportional to the size of the playerbase, but Sigils enter the economy at a constant rate, and thus experience relatively higher inflation. A number of the best base items and accessories are available from collectors anyway (most high-level collectors give top damage/perfect % mod weapons), so there should never be excessive amounts of inflation in that area. Besides, there are a number of high-level cash sinks like [email protected] missions and the 15k armours.
sybban
no the prices for weapons are going up too, I see max damage fire swords going for 30k when they used go for 15-20k. Everything gets affected. Dyes are going to be expensive too as you can see the price has already jumped from 500-2k on black dye
taion
There is some inflation as relatively more people gain access to higher level content that drops more gold, but weapon prices will level off before Sigil prices because of the nature of the supply. Black dye may have gone from 500 to 2000, but Sigils have gone from 5000 to close to max possible gold price.
I certainly don't understand the point of saving up items now to sell later, though. Sure, you'll get a better price, but most things you might want to buy would also have been subject to the same inflation, so unless you're making some wise investments, you don't come out ahead, and merely end up wasting time.
I certainly don't understand the point of saving up items now to sell later, though. Sure, you'll get a better price, but most things you might want to buy would also have been subject to the same inflation, so unless you're making some wise investments, you don't come out ahead, and merely end up wasting time.
Tetris L
Quote:
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Originally Posted by ManadartheHealer
What happens is as more and more people play the game, more money enters the market, therefore devaluing it.
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eventhorizen
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Crom the Conqueror
Gear up while you still can, inflation is right next to the horizon. I am currently buying all the good weapons and runes while I still can buy at a lower price. Like all mmorpg games, inflation is right ahead of us. Inflation happens when the money supply(the amount of money in the market) become higher and higher. With more and more money in people's wallet, they will be willing to pay goods at higher and higher price. Maybe a good sword is 4k today, a few months from now it will be 10K or more.
But that doesnt spell doom to us all, i am currently saving rare items and prepare to sell them later at a higher price, those little suckers. |
See the unfortunate thing between gaming and Real Life is that there no reason why say Little Johnny has to accept your prices, after all he could just go and try and find his own in the gaming world.
Iv been hearing/reading also that intensive farming of high end items has been looked at, and steps are being taken to make this less easy. From my experiances its easier to get rich from selling good items at high prices than it is from collecting gold coin drops.
I would assume that some 'little suckers' as you call them, will undoubtably have fat wallets, but I am also of the opinion that 'uber rare' items are going to be more difficult to attain, meaning less will be being sold, meaning less cash.
As in all mmorpgs, the amount of money in peoples wallets affects todays prices, or tomorrows, but prices into the future, perhaps even mere weeks, can never be guarenteed.
Im no economist, so maybe im not seeing the obvious signs flashing of a super dramatic change, but I have played enough mmorpgs that have super complex economic systems (Eve-Online anyone?) to know that regardless what anyone thinks, the future is far from predictable.
Stur
The only real thing I see this line of thinking being valid with at the moment is the guild sigils. My take on that is that they are not working as intended by the design team. I think they will implement a fix in the near future that will drive the sigil prices back down. So if someone asked me I'd have to advise not spending the high prices for sigils at the moment because when and if they fix the problem, they will be cheaper to get.
If you’re planning on playing Guild Wars for the long haul (2+ years) you must understand the nature of the beast. The design team will change things, it is inevitable and when they do it will make some things that where cheep, expensive and visa vera. The real trick is being able to look ahead and see the changes before they get here and act accordingly. A perfect example of this is fur squares. They were devalued over night; making any poor sap that was hoarding them thinking he would sell them at a later date for a high price a victim of the winds of change.
If you’re planning on playing Guild Wars for the long haul (2+ years) you must understand the nature of the beast. The design team will change things, it is inevitable and when they do it will make some things that where cheep, expensive and visa vera. The real trick is being able to look ahead and see the changes before they get here and act accordingly. A perfect example of this is fur squares. They were devalued over night; making any poor sap that was hoarding them thinking he would sell them at a later date for a high price a victim of the winds of change.
asdar
Doesn't bother me a bit either way. I've always gotten my own things and I still will. If I can't win a Sigil then I won't ever have one.
Stuff is easy to get right now and that's the problem with your inflation model. If prices go this high people will be willing to pay, one iota higher and they'll go get their own stuff. It just doesn't make sense not to.
Sigils take skill and so they DO suffer from legitimate and uncontrolled inflation. If you're not good enough to win a sigil then you can't find one on a random drop. You Have to win in the Hall or buy one.
The good thing about sigils is if it starts causing problems being too high they can drop a few generated ones on the trader and cut off inflation.
Stuff is easy to get right now and that's the problem with your inflation model. If prices go this high people will be willing to pay, one iota higher and they'll go get their own stuff. It just doesn't make sense not to.
Sigils take skill and so they DO suffer from legitimate and uncontrolled inflation. If you're not good enough to win a sigil then you can't find one on a random drop. You Have to win in the Hall or buy one.
The good thing about sigils is if it starts causing problems being too high they can drop a few generated ones on the trader and cut off inflation.
Storn
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Crom the Conqueror
Yes you can trade with a npc, but you dont get a better deal. I bet most us want more money, if you ask a person if he/she can sell something to a person for 10 bucks while another person will pay for a hundred, who will she choose? This is exactly whats happening in GW market, the npc pays very little, while players pay really high price for things.
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I find a good item that I cannot/ do not want to use. I go to the trader, see the price, and then broadcast that I will sell the item for that price. I don't care to make a profit. I want someone who can use the item instead of it vaporating into nothingness. In fact, I'll give the damn thing away if I have to.
Visual Storytelling
http://www.stornc.rpggallery.com/
c0r3y
Hahahahahaha - this entire post is stupid. Buying things today at 4000G (or not selling them for 4000G) to wait and sell them for 10000G "after inflation" is insane from an economic view. Inflation means that everything is devalued - including units of GOLD.
NO ONE is immune to inflation, so if you wait to sell items for 10000G, the 10000G will only be able to buy what you could have bought today for 4000G.
NO ONE is immune to inflation, so if you wait to sell items for 10000G, the 10000G will only be able to buy what you could have bought today for 4000G.
Corwin_Andros
Another thought to keep in mind is that just from the experience of I and my guildmates, we have found weapons in every catagory with max damage and nice attribute bonuses and the like..
Personally When I start a new character now, by the time he hits post searing there are a decent selection of weapons/shields/runes/icons or whatever waiting.. I have nothing to buy except armor.
SOmeone wants to milk noobs for cash.. THe problem there is that the drops are never going to inflate except in the higher levels and expansions.. By the time said noob has the cash for the overinflated item, they will have likely either (A) Already found a like item they are happy with.. or (B) joined a guild and have someone give them what they need either for free or at a reasonable cost that they can afford.
In my guild we already do this.. partly out of just being nice to team mates, but also from the point of view that the sooner new characters are properly outfittted and safely gaining levels, the sooner they are going to be of use to the guild as a whole.
I either sell my items to the merchant.. give them to my g/f to sell (She's a LOT more merchantile than I'll ever be).. or give/trade them with my guild. I have neither the time nor patience to sit around goin WTS blah, blah, blah..for endless hours..
Yes there is a bit of inflation in items right now because of the newness of the game. There will always be a good market for the really rare items with good mods. BUt in the end it's not going to be a big issue.
I do however hope that the devs add new ways for us to make use of this accumulating wealth though.
Personally When I start a new character now, by the time he hits post searing there are a decent selection of weapons/shields/runes/icons or whatever waiting.. I have nothing to buy except armor.
SOmeone wants to milk noobs for cash.. THe problem there is that the drops are never going to inflate except in the higher levels and expansions.. By the time said noob has the cash for the overinflated item, they will have likely either (A) Already found a like item they are happy with.. or (B) joined a guild and have someone give them what they need either for free or at a reasonable cost that they can afford.
In my guild we already do this.. partly out of just being nice to team mates, but also from the point of view that the sooner new characters are properly outfittted and safely gaining levels, the sooner they are going to be of use to the guild as a whole.
I either sell my items to the merchant.. give them to my g/f to sell (She's a LOT more merchantile than I'll ever be).. or give/trade them with my guild. I have neither the time nor patience to sit around goin WTS blah, blah, blah..for endless hours..
Yes there is a bit of inflation in items right now because of the newness of the game. There will always be a good market for the really rare items with good mods. BUt in the end it's not going to be a big issue.
I do however hope that the devs add new ways for us to make use of this accumulating wealth though.
kalaris
Well actually there is one thing he can buy at the same price
Stuff from them leet merchants! he could buy all the Expert Salvage kits in the world for 400g a piece!
The only real concern I have is the cost of Materials at the Material trader could be effected, as selling them off will have no real use, while people keep buying and buying, I think we could see 1000g for a stack of iron ingots eventually... I mean look how much Black dye is going for now.
I mean this won't be an issue for higher level people but noobies will certainly feel the pain with their limited gold.
Stuff from them leet merchants! he could buy all the Expert Salvage kits in the world for 400g a piece!
The only real concern I have is the cost of Materials at the Material trader could be effected, as selling them off will have no real use, while people keep buying and buying, I think we could see 1000g for a stack of iron ingots eventually... I mean look how much Black dye is going for now.
I mean this won't be an issue for higher level people but noobies will certainly feel the pain with their limited gold.
Grim_Grom
Indeed, last week I sold my black dye at 1.5k and it was 2,145 at the seller, this week my friend sold his for 2.5k, because it is now 3k at the seller.
Ramus
Quote:
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Originally Posted by c0r3y
Hahahahahaha - this entire post is stupid. Buying things today at 4000G (or not selling them for 4000G) to wait and sell them for 10000G "after inflation" is insane from an economic view. Inflation means that everything is devalued - including units of GOLD.
NO ONE is immune to inflation, so if you wait to sell items for 10000G, the 10000G will only be able to buy what you could have bought today for 4000G. |
Cragz
Owing to Guild Wars' structure, market saturation cometh. Demand pull inflation will be slain by its mighty sword.
asdar
Well, I don't much care but the person saying that gold will suffer from inflation is wrong unless the dev's change the value. The same mobs and the merchants hold the inflation of gold in perfect check.
For example if he sells 10 wands for 100g now he has 1plat. If he holds onto that plat for 10 levels he'll still have 1 plat and will have the same buying power with merchants and such but he won't be able to affor one of those wands if inflation went rampant, say 10X.
If he holds those ten wands and inflation goes 10X then he'll have 10K. I agree that because of inflation he won't be able to buy what 10k could have bought, he'll be exactly where he was at the start but the person that hoarded the gold will be 1/10th of where he was.
I don't think it's coming, and definitely not fast but even if it does it's not a big deal imho.
For example if he sells 10 wands for 100g now he has 1plat. If he holds onto that plat for 10 levels he'll still have 1 plat and will have the same buying power with merchants and such but he won't be able to affor one of those wands if inflation went rampant, say 10X.
If he holds those ten wands and inflation goes 10X then he'll have 10K. I agree that because of inflation he won't be able to buy what 10k could have bought, he'll be exactly where he was at the start but the person that hoarded the gold will be 1/10th of where he was.
I don't think it's coming, and definitely not fast but even if it does it's not a big deal imho.
Loviatar
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Cragz
Owing to Guild Wars' structure, market saturation cometh. Demand pull inflation will be slain by its mighty sword.
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as more people get to higher levels they will turn from desperate consumers to suppliers of all the stuff they want to get rid of just for the space of storagei just sold 97 bolts of cloth at 7 each just to get rid of them
the same thing will apply to things that are rare now but will glut the market later
already some people are giving minor runes away
FPhoenix
the bottom line is all of you are just lazy. frankly you should never need to buy anything other than salvage kits identification kits and armor. just plan accordingly. you should NEVER buy a weapon from an npc and just be patient. youll get a good weapon dropped to you. its not hard to find a good weapon/dye/runes. so as far as the guildwars economy goes i think its all useless....
Willow
This is just a part of a larger trend of resource speculation:
What increases (or decreases) in value faster: gold, items, dyes, or sigils?
Lots of people think they know the answer, but this economy is so new that no one can say how it's going to stabilize.
Dyes and Sigils are very clearly good short term investments. However their value is increasing too much, too fast, and eventually the bubble will burst.
When that happens, look for the crowds complaining how worthless dyes and sigils are.
What increases (or decreases) in value faster: gold, items, dyes, or sigils?
Lots of people think they know the answer, but this economy is so new that no one can say how it's going to stabilize.
Dyes and Sigils are very clearly good short term investments. However their value is increasing too much, too fast, and eventually the bubble will burst.
When that happens, look for the crowds complaining how worthless dyes and sigils are.
Redfang
It doesn't matter. This isn't a loot-centric game.
This guy here
High demand items always go up
Sigils are 70-100k they will eventually peak and drop
Sup Absorption, Vigor, Fire, healing (et al popular types) are 40-60k
Top end gold equipment (very very rare) is 100k (and i'm talking things like 20/15/15 damage increased items or 20/20/20 mage items)
Little low end swords of 15-22 damage yawn, I don't even bother picking them up.
Dyes are driven by the demand on colour... That is driven by end game characters who don't care about money anymore who go ahead and buy them from the dye trader because we are to lazy to hunt down players with the items...
Sigils are 70-100k they will eventually peak and drop
Sup Absorption, Vigor, Fire, healing (et al popular types) are 40-60k
Top end gold equipment (very very rare) is 100k (and i'm talking things like 20/15/15 damage increased items or 20/20/20 mage items)
Little low end swords of 15-22 damage yawn, I don't even bother picking them up.
Dyes are driven by the demand on colour... That is driven by end game characters who don't care about money anymore who go ahead and buy them from the dye trader because we are to lazy to hunt down players with the items...
Crom the Conqueror
Glad many people are interested in my topic. Heard someone talked about, supply increase as more people joining the game, that thus decrease the price level. True, for some goods their price will decrease. But not for rare items, yes their supply will increase too, as supply increases, but their demand will be alot higher than supply, after all they are rare itmes. Because at least in my opinion most people want to get rare or good items, so as the price of rare item increases, the value of the currentcy drops.
nechronius
There's not enough money sinks in the game, plain and simple. The money generating possibility is infinite in the game, unlike in the real world.
If you had to pay a percentage for "upkeep" of your equipment (the more expensive it is, teh more it costs to maintain it. You don't generally take your Lamborghini to Jiffy Lube for a tune-up.) then you would see less price inflation.
That's just one example. I'm not suggesting that my example is a good idea, or even a very workable one.
If you had to pay a percentage for "upkeep" of your equipment (the more expensive it is, teh more it costs to maintain it. You don't generally take your Lamborghini to Jiffy Lube for a tune-up.) then you would see less price inflation.
That's just one example. I'm not suggesting that my example is a good idea, or even a very workable one.
zemelett
This is what I like to do. I'm sure I'm going to get a lot of hate responses to this, as I already do when I'm in game. I try to know the going price for most things (most!!). Then when someone says WTB <insert whatever you want here> I wisper them a price that is lower than the market standard. Like some one says WTB Cloth...I wisper them saying selling them for 7 gold each. So basically I try to sell everything I don't want for less than the current going rate. The reason I do this is if someone says WTB <whatever> they will inevitably get peppered with wispers of people telling them how much they are selling it for. Selling things lower than going rates almost guarentees that someone will buy it from me instead of someone else. I don't care how you look at it but I'd rather sell my stuff fast and cheap and get back out into the game world than make a few more.
BTW - I have runes and weapons upgrades going VERY cheap IGN Argetlam Silverhand
BTW - I have runes and weapons upgrades going VERY cheap IGN Argetlam Silverhand
Phauran
it is literally impossible to not have inflation, seeing as this is not a playerbased economy, there will always be NPC's buying the stuff you find, with them buying more money comes into circulation, eventually i believe that money wont matter, it will be item for item trade. This is basicly the same for all non-playerbased economy
Anariel
I sell purple/rare gold items to the NPC store merchant all the time because inventory space is limited. This is why I see inflation on most weapon items being low, whereas for RARE items that people will hold onto such as superior vigor, sigils, rare upgrades etc. inflating to 100k quickly (but not higher, because that's the max).
Basically nowadays I don't bother selling to players anything that I know won't get more than 1k for. Last night I sold a gold water wand with +5 energy health below 50% for 370g to the NPC store. It took up an inventory/storage space that could be better used for something else.
I wish they would do something with the economy, really. Right now it's not even worth going to Ascalon 1/ Lion's Arch 1 and putting up with hours of buying and selling when in the same time I could get a bunch more runes and items that have far higher intrinsic value than cash. I really hope an auction house of some sort will be implemented in the near future, as well as more incentive to purchase the 60k armor set other than fashion.
Basically nowadays I don't bother selling to players anything that I know won't get more than 1k for. Last night I sold a gold water wand with +5 energy health below 50% for 370g to the NPC store. It took up an inventory/storage space that could be better used for something else.
I wish they would do something with the economy, really. Right now it's not even worth going to Ascalon 1/ Lion's Arch 1 and putting up with hours of buying and selling when in the same time I could get a bunch more runes and items that have far higher intrinsic value than cash. I really hope an auction house of some sort will be implemented in the near future, as well as more incentive to purchase the 60k armor set other than fashion.
Droz Nagat
A point I feel may be missing from this thread is as follows. The basic guiding rule for the GW economy is Demand. Right now, there is a HUGE demand for sigils and black dye because this game has been out for less than a month. A majority of the players have not leveled to a point or advanced the story enough to come into contact with these items regularly. Granted Black dye and Sigils may not be great examples, from what Ive seen these actually may be the two items that dont come down in price, but the point is that when the majority of players get into the later parts of the game and are skilled enough to quest for their own rare and elite items, prices will come down as those currently in possesion of such items will find fewer buyers.
What we are seeing right now is a glut of new people who want to experience every aspect of the game RIGHT FREAKING NOW and are therefore willing to pay through the nose to dye their armor just the right color or be the first on the block with a guild hall. When these people get further along, they will find their own max weapons, own dyes, etc resulting in a decline in demand relative to the elasticity of the market, which of course lowers prices. Now obviously, some items will remain rare, highly valued and expensive, but thats why CubicZirconium is so much cheaper than Diamonds. Also, as stated in an earlier post, another major factor of the economy is going to be storage space (black dye or Major rune, black dye or Major rune, black dye or Major rune, ahh decisions)
Just glad to finally use this d--- Econ degree.
What we are seeing right now is a glut of new people who want to experience every aspect of the game RIGHT FREAKING NOW and are therefore willing to pay through the nose to dye their armor just the right color or be the first on the block with a guild hall. When these people get further along, they will find their own max weapons, own dyes, etc resulting in a decline in demand relative to the elasticity of the market, which of course lowers prices. Now obviously, some items will remain rare, highly valued and expensive, but thats why CubicZirconium is so much cheaper than Diamonds. Also, as stated in an earlier post, another major factor of the economy is going to be storage space (black dye or Major rune, black dye or Major rune, black dye or Major rune, ahh decisions)
Just glad to finally use this d--- Econ degree.
Crom the Conqueror
Quote:
Originally Posted by c0r3y
Hahahahahaha - this entire post is stupid. Buying things today at 4000G (or not selling them for 4000G) to wait and sell them for 10000G "after inflation" is insane from an economic view. Inflation means that everything is devalued - including units of GOLD.
NO ONE is immune to inflation, so if you wait to sell items for 10000G, the 10000G will only be able to buy what you could have bought today for 4000G.
No, it is not stupid. itmes in shop still have the same price as before, that makes my 10K still worth the original 10K. Like the acension armor, right now each piece cost 15K, unless they change the price of those armor, they will still be 15K, am I not right?
Originally Posted by c0r3y
Hahahahahaha - this entire post is stupid. Buying things today at 4000G (or not selling them for 4000G) to wait and sell them for 10000G "after inflation" is insane from an economic view. Inflation means that everything is devalued - including units of GOLD.
NO ONE is immune to inflation, so if you wait to sell items for 10000G, the 10000G will only be able to buy what you could have bought today for 4000G.
No, it is not stupid. itmes in shop still have the same price as before, that makes my 10K still worth the original 10K. Like the acension armor, right now each piece cost 15K, unless they change the price of those armor, they will still be 15K, am I not right?