Monks are too powerful

Im really sick of this game, monks are too powerful. It's like, our life depend on monks. Two people hardly to kill a monk if if 1v1 monks like invincible.

Most of group win or lose are totally depends on monks. Group that has no monks = 90% chance will be lost against group that has monk.

Muuuhhuuhhuuuaaaaaaaaa!

As monks are the only real healing class in the game and one for one healing is stronger than damage (it needs to be), then yes, monks are needed to be successful. Overpowered? Pfft no. Random arena does not dictate real pvp balance issues at all. If it's that frusterating, try playing a mesmer?

So, I'm guessing the only way you've tried to take down a monk is to hit it repeatedly with your sword. Since that hasn't worked, you're now here complaining about imbalance.

This thread will soon die alone like its predecessors and you'll have to either quit the game in a rage or realize you're not playing Diablo anymore.

Too strong! o_O Whoa! I play a Monk & I quite often find myself stressing big time keeping my team alive. Of course a lot of that has to do with the stupidity of some players, but still...

It aint easy being a Monk. First of all EVERYBODY(save your own team of course) wants you dead & 9 times outta 10 will attack you first, then you have to deal... ahh eff it. Why go into this again?


Monks are not to powerful. If you think so then...well you're wrong.

All you need to do is shutdown the monks' healing abilites, like with backfire or powerspike , or drain his/her energy and they're toast.

You need to read up on counters.

Monks are always the first target in an organised PvP match,so there~~~

why would you battle without monk?
is like going to war without medic.
If you say monk is too powerful. I don't think 8monks will be good idea against group with healing,tank, and support class. Let see who have better chance.

Why does healing have to be greater than damage? That doesn't seem obvious at all. Characters are supposed to die in the game and monks are supposed to be a support class.

They seem to be overpowered, but not so much so that it is ruining the game.

Perhaps if pure monks could not multi-class. Or perhaps if monks had less mana to play with or if healing were more expensive.

I am working on leveling up a monk secondary now, so I don't have anything against the class. But there are some balance issues. Elementalists seem to be a bit weak (warriors seem to be able to hit just has hard on average and they have great armor on top of it!) Necros could probably use a small bump too, but I really haven't seen them at work in pvp except for the arenas. Things might be different for them in other fights.

Warriors are probably a bit too tough, but not by much.

I think the game is pretty well balanced. Some tweaking could make it better, and that would include either a small nerf on monks or a small boost for everybody else.


Pop


Hrm. Here is an idea. Armor should work against healing just as it does against damage. This would make monks slightly less effective, and the same thing goes for warriors. It will boost the elementalist who has the worst armor, and would make the necros a bit more important because life-tap and other vampiric spells wouldnt' be subject to this.

Yeah, I like that idea.

That was like the most positively absolutely perfect thing you could have possibly written for reply number one.

ROFLMAO!

But all joking aside...

This is the situation with any MMORPG. In order to prevent this you would have to seriously limit the amount of healing possible in the game. OR Give healing to EVERYBODY.

And actually, I do think that this game is lax with this sort of thing. (Just my opinion) For example. A level 1 warrior can heal himself in combat.

In Everquest 1, if you were a level 60 warrior, you could maybe do one solo fight, and then you would have to sit and rest for 30 minutes to regen your hp.

On the other hand, Everquest was a serious RPG... I think Guild Wars is more of an Arcade Action type of RPG... Just like Diablo.

BTW, the trick with monks is to hit them fast and hard. kill them before they have a chance to stack up thier spells

-Witt78

Hrm. Dunno about that. I'd put 8 warrior/monks up against anything in the game I think.

Stick together in a group. Area effect heal in sequence. Personal heal when in dire need. Use sprint to chase down and kill enemies. Use bodies to block enemies into corners or dead ends.

A healing ball like that could probably keep itself alive forever even if they just sat there against anything the opposing team threw at them.

I'm not trying to be a stick in the mud... but I think you are forgeting, that there are like, 200 different types of warrior, and 200 monk classes...

There really isn't any such thing as a "Warrior" per say...

For example... I have a Mo/E roleplay character... but I use fire spells more than any monk spell in my spell book.

I have a Ranger friend that does not even own a bow.

That's the cool thing about Guild Wars... The class lines are REALLY blur'ed. Maybe the reason you are having so much trouble killing the monk in PvP is cuz it's the guy that LOOKS like a Warrior that's actually doing the healing.

Everybody always talks about killing the monk first. Did nobody ever think to put a disquise on your healer?

-Witt78

This isn't even the case in random arena either. :P

I went on a 31 win streak in the lvl 15 random arena, with no monk primaries or secondaries, before quitting. We killed many monks in that time, teams with 2 monks, 1 monk, doesn't matter. What matters is strategy, skill in keeping yourself and teammates alive(monk or no monk), and luck of the draw. I've seen others with high win streaks with monkless teams as well, so they're not all powerful.

They are a necessity in PvE, and in HoH you'll almost definitely need some defensive monks, by they are far from god-like.

Yeah, I agree that monks hog the defense department way too much. Currently besides wards, which secondary eles can cover, monks are pretty much it. Healing Breeze is the only move that isn't bad and isn't affected by divine favour.

It's not that it's unbalanced, rather at the moment, the importance of monks makes the defense part of the game lack diversity.

In tombs, there's a reason monks are wanted more then anything in PUGs. Monks aren't played by the majority of players, yet represent about 30-50% of a balanced team. How can you possibly supplement the supply and demand?

No one's calling for a nerf, rather more options.

I've recently started a Mo/W, because I enjoyed the Monk side of my R/Mo in team PvP. I have to say, I think Monks are (a little) overpowered. Not for their healing abilities though, that's what they're meant to do, but because of Smiting. That the strongest defensive class (for self and team) also has some of the most deadly offensive abilities available is a little twisted, to say the least.

That doesn't make Monks uber or invincible, but I do find it worrying that Monks are best or near best in almost every situation this game has to offer.

Diversion
Migraine
Enfeebling Blood
Energy Surge
Any interrupt
Sympathetic Visage
Defile Flesh
Malign Intervention
Wither
Most skills from the Inspiration line which deal with energy stealing.
Amity
Scourge Healing
Among others.


On topic, why are monks so overpowered? If your reason is because your life depends on one, then you have a wrong vision of the game, because your life should depend on one. Can't kill a monk 2v1? You should analyze what skills you are bringing into battle.

My vision of the game was that everything was balanced, at this point in tombs, I could care less about necros. Rangers and warriors aren't even that desired for me, and I'd only grab a mesmer if I was sure the mesmer was set up to counter something specific that my strategy cannot. Otherwise, their just not important. Same with elementalists back awhile bit. When KOR introduced Life Barrier War/Mo, who cared about eles back then?

The point is that throughout the entire change, monks remain strong. Sure, they suffered a bit in the beginning, but ever since beta 1 or so, they became the main dominant counterpart in any party. Name one class that has a "must have" in a party. There is only one. And that is monk. Flavours of the month control which classes are useful and which aren't at the moment, but monks are not even affected by the slightest.

My vision was that under the right circumstances, a secondary monk would work just as well or even better then a primary monk. As of right now, that is impossible. Monks are solidly hogging the defense department in every way possible.

I'm a warrior and I've not really had a problem trying to kill monks. It all depends on who can do more damage compared to how much is being dealed. I've played in PVP a lot and I kill the Monk in the first minute.

If healing was less efficient than damage there would be no point to playing a healer, as you'd only ever be a speed bump. The time/energy that was spent healing would be better served dealing damage, so no healing would take place.

Healing has a huge weakness, which is its dependence on energy, and the fact that it is constantly cast. A warrior can deal damage consistently without energy while a monk can't heal without any (Hmm, there's an idea, healing wands zap your party to health). This creates a vulnerability: You can exhaust their energy supply by continued damage, you can interrupt the spells being cast with disrupting chop etc., or you can disrupt their energy supply.

Anyone who thinks that the solution to a monk is to hit them more is stuck in the damage/healing mindset. Yes, damage spikes can kill, but it is more practical to remove a monk through his weakness than by opposing his strength.

If Healing wasn't better than damge there would be no rock-paper-scissors effect - damage would be king. Because healing dominates damage but damage dominates countering, and countering dominates healing you have a nice mix. In addition, a single good anti-caster mesmer can shut down two casters pretty well, just like a healer can oppose two warriors about right, and a warrior who gets up close to an anti-caster build can handle him pretty easily, probably without losing half his health (thus a 2:1 sort of effect) making the game pretty balanced. Then you get into disguises - that monk is actually a smiting monk/mesmer using ilusionary weapons, empathy, scourge healing and smiting, and he's bad news for the warrior facing him. This warrior is actually a Wa/Me monk-killer with Power Block and Blackout in his skill bar, along with a pile of warrior snares, disruptions and damage. It's all in what build you bring in.

I have little patience for people explaining how unfair something is when easy counters exist - there is more than one way to play, and if the build you are playing has difficulties vs other builds, change your build. You'll always have a weakness, but pick a role and play to it - there is no "ultra build" capable of dominating every other type. It seems every few days someone is on to complain about how weak they are, or how strong someone else is, when the truth is they just lack the experience to play the game right. Think of chess...is the Ruy Lopez or Queen's Gambit too powerful? No, they are effective, but defenses evolve to match the penings. There are always ways to counter or it would be no fun. Alekhine blew his opponent away when he first played his defense, but there's an easy solution to it - don't chase him. Rangers are hard for you warrior to catch and waste youtime chasing after them all over, only to gradually die to his poison and such? Don't chase him. Go for the other targets, and drop them, or bring along skills that will catch the ranger - sure, that'll hurt your offense in other areas, but that's the trade-off.

The best way to kill a monk is use a Mesmer.

No kidding... this is my experience too. Even the computer A.I. goes after monks first (unless intercepted by kind allies).

That actually worked in Tombs, for the first few days or so, after that people discovered how to counter them. Healing is not overpowered, and in certain builds Monk secondaries can be almost as effective as a primary Monk. For example, a high Energy Storage El/Mo using Ether Renewal and higher energy heals like Heal Party can be very effective. There was a point in the game where El/Mo's were the best healers and the devs bumped up Divine Favor to ensure that primary Monks kept an edge.

I trump your 8 W/Mo's with 8 Me/N's (or N/Me's). 8 of all the same thing is going to have a simple and deadly effective counter.

LOL, that's only untill we make new stradegies... such as massive defensive spells and rangers using traps + healing spring...

Monks < Mesmers

A mesmer will drain the mana, stop the spells, and shut them down completely... you don't play much do you?

Each class also comes with its own healing sort of spells, so it is very possible that one day, there will be a good pvp group with no monk (which would cause TOTAL confusion onto who to target) and may end up winning quite a bit.

just one question to those who think a monks healing is overpowered:

How is a few healing spells that are limited to the energy you have, MORE overpowered than any other rpg where you can have as many health potions as you can afford?

lol that made me laugh out loud in this computer lab, so now I look like an idiot



Monks are you friend, maybe if you didn't hate us so much we would join your party.

This monk bashing BS has been on every forum multiple times. Every class has its advatages over other classes...monks are at the mercy of a well played Mesmer and a Ranger can do some hurt to a monk as well. And even if monk heals are powerful, they need to be, afterall they not only keep themselves alive, but the entire team...besides they are the ones who get ganged on from the get go by the entire other team.

*end rant*

It seems like you are somewhere in Ascalon Arena or Random Arena where monks ain't needed. I wonder, have you ever been in HoH ? I'm sure with you that in HoH people need monks in their groups rather than you. In HoH no monks in your groupls signify to your group will never reach to HoH. Does your life depend too much on monks ?

ok I assumed that you can take down a monk but how long does it take you to do that ? 5 mins ? 10 mins ? or 30 mins ? by the time the monk died you and your team mates may not be alive.

For those that say that monks can be killed easily by warriors if that warriors just hit them continously. Have you asked the questions that will those monks stand still for you to hit them ?

If you saying that monks are just like other classes then why do ppl need them in their group, in HoH ?

Why would people wanted to kill the monk first ? why not Meser, elementalist, warrior , ranger ? does it play a very important role in pvp ?

I really enjoy pvp, in Ascalon Arena, Random Arena ....... Monks ain't really needed. However when you reached to level 20 and play in Team Arena, in HoH (especially in HoH ) then you might agree with me that, Monks are needed.

this has to be a joke right? how about 2 monks, and 6 ele's with ward against melee, ward against foes, and lightning air attacks? i had the wonderful opportunity to be in a group that stomped a team of W/Mo's just the other night. the match lasted 58 seconds.

in 8 player matches 8 of the same anything dies almost immediately.

This will work if you keep the monk from getting Spell Breaker on.

More like 0% chance of winning without monk.

Cant complain about that, each prefession has its job in Guild Wars. If they make monk any weaker than they are now, I bet there will a hundreds and thousands of letters demand to make monk stronger. You cant satisfy everyone. But monk's ultra-super-weak attack balances its strong healing power.

i made a monk just for farming purposes. found that with minor tweaking i also became super powered for pugs in 4v4. can also run in groups with not only extremely good heals and prots, but with good bonding on the right players (they gotta work with me on this for me to keep energy coming in) then i can also dish more damage than the eles.

are monks over powered? got me, but they sure are fun as hell to play.

It's true. My monk is a one man God. I log into the game and within 1/2 a second I have an invite from the most l337 of groups to go out and spank in PvP. We do this. With my monk alone, no group has ever lost. I can deal 900 damage in about 3 spells and heal for the same amount in under a nano second. I have a new skill, I don't think I've read about it anywhere, but it's called "I win". Only monks have this. I spam this and within a 3 second window, we have won. Also, the other day when I was soloing my way through The Tombs, I looked down and noticed my feet were 3 feet off of the ground the whole time. It was neat. Monks can float too.

"i win" haha

Maybe it's not because monks are too strong but in the rock paper scissors cycle of damage/healing/disruption, disruption is underpowered. A lot of monk skills are hard to interrupt because they cast near instantly and hex removal is cheaper than placing a hex on. Enchantments, when compared to hexes, don't have more efficient ways to remove them.

lol... hilarious man

that made me lol

This is and isn't true. There are reasons to choose each class as your primary. Choosing monk as your primary is clearly because you intent to heal in some way. If you want to smite, don't be a monk primary. The Divine Favor attribute is, in ways, actually underpowered compared to the attributes of other classes: strength lets warriors ignore armor more effectively (and with certain weapon/skill combos, WAY effectively), expertise lets rangers rip out more devastating combos with lower energy cost, fast casting allows mesmers to tear out their denial spells far more quickly, soul reaping keeps necros supplied with energy, and energy storage allows elementalists to blast out way more than normally possible.

Divine favor, like any primary attribute, is only useful to you if you know how to capitalize on it. Most monks don't.

If you want a great defensive build, work on an E/Mo earth/prot build. It can be effective. Most monks aren't willing to lose divine favor though, because defense to them isn't the same thing as healing. Protection monks are likely loathe to lose it for the same reason; divine favor adds a little something to their enchantments.

As for naming classes that are "must-have", it depends on the situation. In every situation in the game, you WILL take damage. That's why monks are so "universal". You might not always want an interrupt mesmer with you, however. You might not have corpses to exploit for a necro, you might not have victims for a fire elementalist, you might not have opponents who bleed or can be poisoned. When you do, you want the respective classes to join you, yeah? How do you suggest this be fixed? Make all undead bleedable so sword warriors are essential? Make everything susceptable to all elements?

I guess I don't see how the logic of needing something to prevent death makes it so overpowered. You can't beat missions or players by simply preventing damage, and acting as though it were the case is beneath everyone who's used the argument. Damage prevention is only helpful to the cause of survivng. It is a constant in the ever-changing world of pvp, to be sure. The other constant? To win, you need to kill more effectively than your opponent.

How tragic for other classes that they need to be creative in order to make that part happen.

[ ]

Yesterday morning we had 35 wins in the ascalon arena. Yeah, I know newbish - but we got one Warrior (me) 2 rangers and 1 elementalist.

No monk, neither primary no secondary. Our enemies were very confused

Although we lost to a team with 2 monks, but not because of the healing but because of the more rez available We won against 2 monks a few times before... So healing is not the main point here (same in the yak's bend arena), if you know you have to watch yourself you play different. An other char of mine is a healer (Me/Mo) and I can really see the difference - if I say i'm the team healer people depend on me to heal them... So they die pretty fast when I get into trouble and not be able to heal them for a time...

A healer is important to a team, but also a Tank is. And if you got noone that can deal range damage then you also got problems... One team we fought that morning had only rangers or at least most of them were... They stayed away from us and I (as warrior) had no chance to get close to them, because everytime I tried to get closer they shut me down so I had to stay out of the battle and let the elem do a nice AoE spell so they split up and all ran in different directions

That's just my 2 Cent, I know I'm not far enough to tell if monks are too strong/weak, but currently I feel they are perfectly balanced. No killer class so far...