I am concerned by the amount of players who curse and complain every time someone 'leaves' a group in the middle of a mission. Do you really think that everyone who leaves the game did it by choice?
A lot of people crash. Often. I crash myself every 2-10 hours or so. Sometimes it happens in the middle of a mission. Most of the time I dont remember the exact spelling of group member names afterwards, so I cant whisper them 'Really sorry, I crashed'.
Please stop jumping to conclusions and cursing people so quickly.
Please stop assuming that leaving = dropping the group
Celes Tial
Helios
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Originally Posted by Celes Tial
I am concerned by the amount of players who curse and complain every time someone 'leaves' a group in the middle of a mission. Do you really think that everyone who leaves the game did it by choice?
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Originally Posted by Celes Tial
A lot of people crash. Often. I crash myself every 2-10 hours or so.
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Celes Tial
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Originally Posted by Helios
But when you're doing a mission like Hell's Precipice (which is a very long mission) and you're halfway through when someone drops, you'd curse too.
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Originally Posted by Helios
Isn't that a bit excessive?
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One day I got whispers from 3 crashed group members in 4 hours... but not everyone always whispers when they crash, for memory reasons.
DrSLUGFly
I agree... granted that I always play international so groups tend to be smaller, I've never had a problem with early leavers.
I think a good portion of this is that I'm quite social and talkative so the people I game with tend to tell the group what their intentions are when they need to log out or when they want to map out (I have no grudge against someone who just says "look man, this is too frustrating, I'm mapping to the next town")
I think a good portion of this is that I'm quite social and talkative so the people I game with tend to tell the group what their intentions are when they need to log out or when they want to map out (I have no grudge against someone who just says "look man, this is too frustrating, I'm mapping to the next town")
sybban
If a group is hopeless then I'll leave. Who knows? Maybe I was the one making them suck.
xaanix
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Originally Posted by Celes Tial
I crash myself every 2-10 hours or so.
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Mr. Matt
People may also have real-life concerns which take priority over the game. I can say with some degree of certainty that if I had a phone call telling me that someone close to me had just been involved in a car accident or some-such, I'd log out, shut down and be out the door quicker than you could say 'Barzicalmopsicnakteliaponoponoponoponoweeeeeeeeee talalalalalapongtikmala!'. Frankly I wouldn't give a damn what people on an online game thought of me for doing so at the time, though I'd probably wish I'd said something later on.
The thread starter may also be referring to internet connection crashes, which can be a problem depending on your connection type/provider. I remember when I was still 56k that I simply couldn't stay connected for longer than an hour. My current broadband provider is usually reliable, but even they cut me off once in a while. The last time being in a game of Guild Wars, in fact, though I was just milling around a town at the time.
Simply put, unless someone says "I'm leavin' coz u suck an we ain't winnin'!", you don't know that's why they're leaving. Though I'll admit it's probably usually the case...
The thread starter may also be referring to internet connection crashes, which can be a problem depending on your connection type/provider. I remember when I was still 56k that I simply couldn't stay connected for longer than an hour. My current broadband provider is usually reliable, but even they cut me off once in a while. The last time being in a game of Guild Wars, in fact, though I was just milling around a town at the time.
Simply put, unless someone says "I'm leavin' coz u suck an we ain't winnin'!", you don't know that's why they're leaving. Though I'll admit it's probably usually the case...
xerigen
You have to admit though it's rediculous sometimes. Especially when you're in the middle of the mission, and a guy goes "bbl i have to cut the grass." This happened to me on the elona mission (timed). I could not believe it. After he left it started a chain reaction and even thoguh we were 2/3 of the way done with the quest, people continued to leave.
Mr. Matt
When you gotta cut the grass, you gotta cut the grass... *Shrugs*
If he knew he had to cut the grass, he shouldn't really have become involved with a mission in the first place. I would have thought that would be common sense, but I guess some people lack it. Well you can't expect everyone to be smart like that
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If he knew he had to cut the grass, he shouldn't really have become involved with a mission in the first place. I would have thought that would be common sense, but I guess some people lack it. Well you can't expect everyone to be smart like that
Willy Rockwell
When someone mutters "noobs" and disappears it's pretty clear what happened. I'd rather fight with noobs than a quitter.
Navaros
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Originally Posted by Celes Tial
Curse the game, not the people. It really isnt their fault pretty often.
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therefore i would say it's fair to curse the people since chances are their crashing is usually due to not-so-good hardware and/or a not-so-good ISP; both of which are their responsibility to remedy before even starting to play a party-based online game
Fantras
Not everyone has a uber rig with awesome ISP service. Trying to berate them for that will have you coming off as an a-hole.
C2K
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Originally Posted by Navaros
in all my time playing Guild Wars, i've only had the game crash once. right after Glint first knocks you down in Dragon's Lair. game froze on me. other than that, i've never ever crashed
therefore i would say it's fair to curse the people since chances are their crashing is usually due to not-so-good hardware and/or a not-so-good ISP; both of which are their responsibility to remedy before even starting to play a party-based online game |
No matter what kind of ISP you have, when they do maintenance, your getting knocked off line.
And you make sound as if people like to crash out of the game. Yep, they spent hard earned cash just to log in and get disconnected from the server.
toastgodsupreme
More often than not, I've been in groups where the dropper drops RIGHT after he/she dies.
Now when this happens, either the whole party has died (thus telling us we need to work on tactics or form a new party), or it was just him/her (telling us that this guy is a noob, with noob gear, and is probably doing something stupid).
Basically, in every group I've been in so far, we've only had one group wipeout (last night... stupid hydras; we start attacking two, then suddenly we have 6 on us, NOT good).
Now when this happens, either the whole party has died (thus telling us we need to work on tactics or form a new party), or it was just him/her (telling us that this guy is a noob, with noob gear, and is probably doing something stupid).
Basically, in every group I've been in so far, we've only had one group wipeout (last night... stupid hydras; we start attacking two, then suddenly we have 6 on us, NOT good).
Shagsbeard
If you crash that often you have a moral imperative not to play with a group. Don't care how much you spent on the game, you are ruining it for others. Stop joining groups and start a guild for people who can't finish missions.
Navaros
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Originally Posted by Shagsbeard
If you crash that often you have a moral imperative not to play with a group. Don't care how much you spent on the game, you are ruining it for others. Stop joining groups and start a guild for people who can't finish missions.
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this post is 100% spot-on
whether or not the droppers are dropping intentionally or not is besides the point
the important thing is, the result is the same no matter what. the non-droppers end up getting screwed-over, which is not fair to them.
hence like Shags said, droppers have a moral imperative to not play with non-droppers
Sting
Well part of the problem is its not a pay monthly game IMO. Alot more KIDS (not puting all kids in this catogory. But the Imature inconsiderate brats LOL).
And part of the problem also is people come up with excuses for them all the time LOL. Real Life is more important but just becasue its a game people should still show others common curtisey. And it happens at such a rate I can only imagine the lines at the emergency rooms around the world.
Hell I was told how bad my idea was of ranking the quiters so people will know who these jerks are (wich WOULDNT count against those who lost connection and would give you 2 free quits and a forgiveness of a quit for every 5 or so COMPLETED missions. This is an increasing topic on the forrums lately hopefully A-net will take some action.
And part of the problem also is people come up with excuses for them all the time LOL. Real Life is more important but just becasue its a game people should still show others common curtisey. And it happens at such a rate I can only imagine the lines at the emergency rooms around the world.
Hell I was told how bad my idea was of ranking the quiters so people will know who these jerks are (wich WOULDNT count against those who lost connection and would give you 2 free quits and a forgiveness of a quit for every 5 or so COMPLETED missions. This is an increasing topic on the forrums lately hopefully A-net will take some action.
toastgodsupreme
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Originally Posted by Shagsbeard
If you crash that often you have a moral imperative not to play with a group. Don't care how much you spent on the game, you are ruining it for others. Stop joining groups and start a guild for people who can't finish missions.
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there are henchies (and while not a dropper, I've played with them on many occassions)
smitty-gw
Proper etiquette would be to stay with a mission team until completed or until all members are dead. An outpost would be the desired and courteous time to exit a party.
Things may happen which prevent you from completing a mission and leaving abruptly. These situations are not prevalent and not a problem.
Some people do leave out of spite. That's unfortunate, but to be expected in an anonymous internet community. It does make it more difficult on the others to complete a difficult and long mission and that's a bit unfair.
Others leave because Mommy said no more GW for the night and they got caught going back to finish that last mission. That is also unfortunate, and the results are the same as the spiteful dropper.
If there was a way to see the number of times someone unpartied outside of a town or outpost, it would compel people to display more common courtesy or else be ostracized or outcast and greatly alleviate the aforementioned problem.
I would also like to apply the same logic to /deaths. It would be helpful to know the caliber of a player beforehand. This is not intended as an elitist smear. Some people I've partied with refuse to follow the aggro rules of the game and just attract mob after mob only to die every time and spam "rez plz." That ..errr..playing style
should be reflected for others to see, like an online caveat.
In addition, major computer crash problems should be addressed, not whined about on the forums. Your continued partying with others is as selfish and detrimental as the reasons listed above.
Just some thoughts.
PS. How do you know that most people have a legitimate exuse for dropping because you feel you have one??
Things may happen which prevent you from completing a mission and leaving abruptly. These situations are not prevalent and not a problem.
Some people do leave out of spite. That's unfortunate, but to be expected in an anonymous internet community. It does make it more difficult on the others to complete a difficult and long mission and that's a bit unfair.
Others leave because Mommy said no more GW for the night and they got caught going back to finish that last mission. That is also unfortunate, and the results are the same as the spiteful dropper.
If there was a way to see the number of times someone unpartied outside of a town or outpost, it would compel people to display more common courtesy or else be ostracized or outcast and greatly alleviate the aforementioned problem.
I would also like to apply the same logic to /deaths. It would be helpful to know the caliber of a player beforehand. This is not intended as an elitist smear. Some people I've partied with refuse to follow the aggro rules of the game and just attract mob after mob only to die every time and spam "rez plz." That ..errr..playing style
should be reflected for others to see, like an online caveat. In addition, major computer crash problems should be addressed, not whined about on the forums. Your continued partying with others is as selfish and detrimental as the reasons listed above.
Just some thoughts.
PS. How do you know that most people have a legitimate exuse for dropping because you feel you have one??
Alkarzar
"Stop joining groups and start a guild for people who can't finish missions."
I was going to do that but we never got past the first stages of setting up.
I was going to do that but we never got past the first stages of setting up.
Siephl Marks
Both sides of this debate are why I exclusively use henchies.. No need to group in this game(pve), so why do it unless your friends/guildmates are online. I think the problem here are PUG's and in most games they have always run the risk of sucking....people dont know eachother and find it easier to fly off the handle and/or leave a group early.
I work while i play solo, which makes me the afk king... I take pleasure in going afk mid mission for 2 hours or more sometimes... I'll go afk when new ideas come my way etc.. Sometimes I think that I just use the game to clear my head so ideas come easier.. then im afk again.. Thats just one of the things that makes this game great.
I guess im just so very glad that this game allows me not to have to interact with anyone if Im not in the mood for a PuG "party" ...
My suggestion for the OP is to only group with people you know.. period.
I work while i play solo, which makes me the afk king... I take pleasure in going afk mid mission for 2 hours or more sometimes... I'll go afk when new ideas come my way etc.. Sometimes I think that I just use the game to clear my head so ideas come easier.. then im afk again.. Thats just one of the things that makes this game great.
I guess im just so very glad that this game allows me not to have to interact with anyone if Im not in the mood for a PuG "party" ...
My suggestion for the OP is to only group with people you know.. period.
Demetrious
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Originally Posted by smitty-gw
Proper etiquette would be to stay with a mission team until completed or until all members are dead. An outpost would be the desired and courteous time to exit a party.
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Part of the issue is the basic game design. There should be clear missions that are long and clear missions that are short or at least more points along the path where progress can be resumed.
Ramus
Some people do not have an hour to waste when the group is down to 60% morale each and the monk jumped overboard 5 minutes ago. There are times when I leave groups to, I wont lie about it. I wouldn't just leave if I died though or something stupid like that.
Game design also has to do with it, give the team a henchman in the place of a player or such.
Game design also has to do with it, give the team a henchman in the place of a player or such.
Sting
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Originally Posted by Demetrious
But part of the problem is that you don't know how long the mission is. Proper etiquette goes out the door when you don't know what you are agreeing to. Say I can give you a 100% answer if I know the session will not run more than 40 min. That turns into 80% at 1 hour and 50% at 1 1/2 hours. I specifically asked the last group I joined how long is the mission and got 30min. It took us 1:20 to finish the thing. Now I had a great time and no issues but not all players can block off indefinite blocks of time. I guess if I had already beaten the game or if I were re-doing all the quests I would have an idea but so far I am one and done and in my last two missions we were all newbies to that mission.
Part of the issue is the basic game design. There should be clear missions that are long and clear missions that are short or at least more points along the path where progress can be resumed. |
smitty-gw
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Originally Posted by Demetrious
But part of the problem is that you don't know how long the mission is. Proper etiquette goes out the door when you don't know what you are agreeing to. .
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Well, like I said previously, things happen, but this is the exception, not the rule. If you could avoid leaving, wouldnt you stay with the team for another 5 minutes to complete a mission you were working on together for over an hour?
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Originally Posted by Ramus
Some people do not have an hour to waste when the group is down to 60% morale each and the monk jumped overboard 5 minutes ago. There are times when I leave groups to, I wont lie about it. I wouldn't just leave if I died though or something stupid like that.
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Then all bets are off.
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Originally Posted by Sting
Fairly good point. But this wouldnt be a bad Idea perhaps they should give an "APROX" time it takes for doing a mision. Or perhaps a they could put the info out on a thread here somewhere.
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I concur as well, but methinks this will lead to more ranting. I can for example run to ToA from Bergen Springs in about 3 mins, or I can try to fight my way there for nearly forever. Apply this logic to a long tough mission.
If you like to wipe the area clean, open every chest etc..... then it will take considerably longer then shortcutting, hence rendering estimations useless.
Time constraints and strategies are best discussed during party formation at the outpost prior to the mission start.
If the party's outlook doesn't mesh with yours......then don't go with them.
Peace
Bazooka
I'll give you the courtesy of not assuming you've dropped and left your group in the lurch, when you give the group the courtesy of not joining.
You maybe the coolest guy in the world that I would gladly call friend, but knowingly playing a team competition with a machine/connection that always drops is thoughtless and selfish.
You maybe the coolest guy in the world that I would gladly call friend, but knowingly playing a team competition with a machine/connection that always drops is thoughtless and selfish.
Xellos
I honestly believe Anet dropped the ball on PVE. Missions are just too long and feel like a drag for them to be fun for casual gamers, let alone people who PVP. There's a reason other then skill points that people ascend at level 3 now and still don't even have great northern wall. Instance missions need to be more plentiful, but shorter.
DismalClown
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Originally Posted by xaanix
Sounds like you have some hardware problems to work out. I wouldnt want you in my group till you get them fixed if you are that unreliable. That means you have a 1 in 5 chance to drop in any given HOH run. If I were you I'd figure out why i'm crashing so much so I dont waste the time of 7 other group members. I haven't crashed once since release.
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Now and then my internet connection (DLS - earthlink) with go out for about 10 minutes, only happens about once a month, but there is nothing I can do and it has nothing to do with my hardware.
WeiPing
I've hit a few Error=7's, and crashed once.
Unfortunately, the one crash was in the Underworld after we had cleaned out all the BigNasties in that first section. =/
Unfortunately, the one crash was in the Underworld after we had cleaned out all the BigNasties in that first section. =/
MyriaN
I was somewhat surprised when I found out that players who lose connection cannot just return to the same mission and party when they log back in. In my opinion this is poor design and should be fixed in a patch or a later release.
Pleistoanax Lambert
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Originally Posted by Celes Tial
Curse the game, not the people. It really isnt their fault pretty often.
I dont know, I just know it is true. One day I got whispers from 3 crashed group members in 4 hours... but not everyone always whispers when they crash, for memory reasons. |
Lews
I always whisper whoever left immediaetly to ask them why the did so. If they are not online, I tell the party to stop yelling at them. If they are online and say 'screw you' I tell the party, and add to my ignore list.
Jackell
I've crashed a few times, though infrequently.
I'm not going to avoid grouping with people when I want to group because of something that may or may not happen. It's happens every now and then, and if it's a hardware problem, get over it. They didn't intend on it, and they didn't forsee it happening. What's more selfsish? Loosing your connection due to something out of your control, or telling people not to play because they may possibly get disconnected?
I'm not going to avoid grouping with people when I want to group because of something that may or may not happen. It's happens every now and then, and if it's a hardware problem, get over it. They didn't intend on it, and they didn't forsee it happening. What's more selfsish? Loosing your connection due to something out of your control, or telling people not to play because they may possibly get disconnected?
SOT
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Originally Posted by Celes Tial
I am concerned by the amount of players who curse and complain every time someone 'leaves' a group in the middle of a mission. Do you really think that everyone who leaves the game did it by choice?
A lot of people crash. Often. I crash myself every 2-10 hours or so. Sometimes it happens in the middle of a mission. Most of the time I dont remember the exact spelling of group member names afterwards, so I cant whisper them 'Really sorry, I crashed'. Please stop jumping to conclusions and cursing people so quickly. |
As I said before several MILLION times, I have no issue with bots. In fact, I am about to hit Lion's arch, and there nothing but hard, cold, code-brained bots in my party.
Grim_Grom
^Well isn't that defeating the object of the game. I mean playing with bots on missions is just well, sad. I mean the whole idea is to socialise, on quests I can understand, but missions there's always plenty of groups going.
Anyway, onto leavers, I've had DC's once in a while, and I forgot the names of my party so I couldn't apologise. I don't generally curse people, but when some prat says "You are n00bs , I'm leaving" after ONE person gets killed, then it's annoying.
Anyway, onto leavers, I've had DC's once in a while, and I forgot the names of my party so I couldn't apologise. I don't generally curse people, but when some prat says "You are n00bs , I'm leaving" after ONE person gets killed, then it's annoying.
Helios
When I play missions long missions (I'll use Hell's Precipice as an example), I always tell the party that this mission will require at least an hour to complete and to leave if they cannot commit to that. No one ever says anything so it should be expected that everyone follow through. But everytime I play this mission, 2 people ALWAYS drop mid-mission. Whether we're doing well or not. I just find it rather odd that people drop a lot like that in the later missions as opposed to earlier missions.
As far as notifications, I think they should have 2 different messages when people leave the game. One for when they map out or close the program and another for when people's internet connection faulters. It may not cut down too much, but maybe it'll keep the non-droppers from being too frustrated.
As far as notifications, I think they should have 2 different messages when people leave the game. One for when they map out or close the program and another for when people's internet connection faulters. It may not cut down too much, but maybe it'll keep the non-droppers from being too frustrated.
Rajamic
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Originally Posted by xerigen
You have to admit though it's rediculous sometimes. Especially when you're in the middle of the mission, and a guy goes "bbl i have to cut the grass." This happened to me on the elona mission (timed). I could not believe it. After he left it started a chain reaction and even thoguh we were 2/3 of the way done with the quest, people continued to leave.
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Maybe he mixed up the words 'cut' and 'smoke'?
Burgio
u guys get dropped that much... i have a stock hp pc the one that is like $1000 the nicest thing is my lcd monitor that came with it and i got a regular cable internet connection and i have never been dropped from the game in my 100+ hours and where i live we are supposed to have bad connection here. once in a while when i open inventory it freezes and gets choppy for a few seconds but never dropped or disconnected
Great Gjl
It is difficult to avoid being so cynical when you are constantly greeted with scenes like these: