You dont really start the game until lvl 20!

ManadartheHealer

ManadartheHealer

Desert Nomad

Join Date: May 2005

Awaiting GW2

W/

03 Jun 2005 at 20:33 - 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dazzler
Don't feel bad. I've put in about the same and hit 19 last night. I think I am close to Riverside, which I think means I am close to the Crystal Desert everyone talks about.
*Spoiler*

If you are at riverside, you are VERY close to the crystal desert.


*End spoiler*??

Celes Tial

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2005

Pirates of BBQ Bay

Mo/Me

03 Jun 2005 at 21:50 - 42
The game starts at level 20 for those who enjoy PvP. For pure PvE'ers, there really isnt much left.

Eclair

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Apr 2005

03 Jun 2005 at 22:54 - 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by smitty-gw
Unfortunately, even I am not as interested in this game as I was with D2 shortly after its release. It still feels a bit constricting to me.

The problem is that there is a certain penalty for those who want to put their all into this game. The bragging rights of high levels has been removed.
"I'm lvl 20". "So what, I'm lvl 20 too".
You mean the, "I'm level 99". "So what, I'm level 99 too"?.

Quote:
Even the item farmers, which was the downfall of D2 in my opinion, are frustrated with the lack of variety.
"I got a max dam 15-22 sword". "So what, I got a max dam 15-22 sword also".
"I got a Breath of the Dying Collosus Blade." "So what, I got a Breath of the Dying Collosus Blade also".

Sorry, but I just couldn't help myself XD. The item analogy is less true, as there are still small variations in percentages, 10-20%'s out of 400% for example, but we have that too. For example the perfect 15% while health is >50% sword is still very rare.

Anywayz, D2 was all about items, but GW is all about skill combinations. There are so many skills to choose from, and although many of them seem useless by themselves, when combined with other skills, they start to shine.

The best analogy I can make of this is magic cards. leveling up to 20 and getting your elites is like playing drafts to get cards. However, when you have a huge pool collection, you can start messing around to come up with new combos to surprise and own the metagame. I'm playing a monk ranger right now, and I was frustrated as I couldn't figure out any successful way to use ranger skills. However, last night I just came up with a interesting combo, so I can't wait to get the skill I need (should get it by this weekend) and start testing it out to see how effective it is XD. I believe the target audience is for people who like to be creative and competitive, who have a small penchant for grind, as opposed to people who like to see their exp bar fill over and over again.

shinseikaze

shinseikaze

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: May 2005

Dark Side Of The Force

E/Mo

04 Jun 2005 at 00:21 - 44
the game ends at lvl20..........until new content just my opinion

DrSLUGFly

DrSLUGFly

Desert Nomad

Join Date: May 2005

European Server or International

04 Jun 2005 at 02:05 - 45
I just hit 19 tonight, and I spent an hour escorting a level 10 and 15 from Grendich to Lion's Arch (actually only made it to Frost Gate)

I must say, when you can take out the bad guys with one shot, the game is a lot more pleasing visually. You can look around at the environment without twitching like a rabbit every time a red dot shows up on the compass. And when I saw bad guys, I tanked them (I'm elementalist) so I could get right up close and see what they loooked like. Some of these guys are pretty damn sweet!

spiritofcat

spiritofcat

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Mar 2005

Sydney, Australia

Order of the Sanguine Dragon [OSD]

E/Mo

04 Jun 2005 at 02:23 - 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dazzler
Don't feel bad. I've put in about the same and hit 19 last night. I think I am close to Riverside, which I think means I am close to the Crystal Desert everyone talks about.
I hit level 19 two days ago with 74.5 hours played and I'm only up to Aurora Glade.

DrSLUGFly

DrSLUGFly

Desert Nomad

Join Date: May 2005

European Server or International

04 Jun 2005 at 02:58 - 47
lol.... I've been rushed through the game (against my will) and so I've been doing the mission all out of order. Last night I helped someone who I already know to be the bad guy, discovered to everyone's shock that the people I've already killed are the bad guys and killed several people who were already dead ... :? I recommend if it's your first time through that you ONLY go with groups that are doing missions or quests you want (missions anyway) since otherwise you will miss story related quests.

I'm at Riverside, but after 30 hours awake and 12 gaming I was in no condition to try to get to the crystal desert...

I'm in no condition to post right now.... must sleep

Stone

Academy Page

Join Date: May 2005

Australia

Sacred Order

E/Mo

04 Jun 2005 at 05:07 - 48
same boat same lvl myself , Kitty , I closed down the proggy 5mins ago thinking of dropping the game & going back to mu , ive done all the quests & im prolly wrong but the only thing i can do atm is get owned in lions arch arena , trade or wait for eu to gain gods favour so i can try fissure & underworld again.. ive explored all possible areas & quite frankly am dissapointed at how much land we Cant get too...

im trying to be patient & find what else to do myself , hence my visit here today ^_^

really ive no idea what to do now.. suggestions any1?

Ashock

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: May 2005

04 Jun 2005 at 05:25 - 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stone
same boat same lvl myself , Kitty , I closed down the proggy 5mins ago thinking of dropping the game & going back to mu , ive done all the quests & im prolly wrong but the only thing i can do atm is get owned in lions arch arena , trade or wait for eu to gain gods favour so i can try fissure & underworld again.. ive explored all possible areas & quite frankly am dissapointed at how much land we Cant get too...

im trying to be patient & find what else to do myself , hence my visit here today ^_^

really ive no idea what to do now.. suggestions any1?

Yah, play a different game. Once you don't play this ill-conceived game for several days, when you remember playing it, you will ask yourself "Why did I spend so much time on a game with no purpose?" I felt like that after I dropped Dungeon Siege after 2 weeks of mindless running and I never went back to it. So far after about a week of replaying KOTOR, I have absolutely no desire to play GW again. After all, they still have not fixed the fundamental flaws, so why bother.


-A

fireflie

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Apr 2005

04 Jun 2005 at 16:36 - 50
About getting bored with the game--I think I actually got bored (or let down is a better way to describe it) after I beat the game (i.e. finished all the missions). But that was still a considerable amount of time after I reached lvl 20. I guess after lvl 20 the "real" fun comes in:

-exploring areas for elite skills
-being with somewhat better players (as everyone has now gotten a better feel of playing and their char)
-the freedom of just trying out a bunch of skills/strategies for your char without having the pressure to keep lvling or getting to the next town (similar to like trying out new builds in PvP)
-helping out other chars (if it floats ur boat)
-making crazy gold
-farming by urself in areas without henchmen

etc etc. You basically just get a bunch of new possibilities when you reach lvl 20 without any "grinds" I guess you can say.

And about the let down in beating the game--it just lasted a bit. I say I play less now that I've beat it, but there is so much to playing Guild Wars than just lvling. PvP is great, GvG is fun etc.

Studio Ghibli

Studio Ghibli

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2005

Gaelic Storm

04 Jun 2005 at 16:57 - 51
.. people dislike grind, but people want to level; it's hilarious.

I heard Lineage 2 has a lot of "purpose" to it.

kyeo138

Academy Page

Join Date: Jun 2005

08 Jun 2005 at 19:27 - 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dazzler
Don't feel bad. I've put in about the same and hit 19 last night. I think I am close to Riverside, which I think means I am close to the Crystal Desert everyone talks about.
Hey Mountain man & Dazzler, I got about 60hours in and I'm only lvl 13. Just got to Frost Gate. I went back and found I missed Piken Square. I'm kind of stuck at the moment, not sure where to go. The problem is, I walk around all over the place but don't really know where to go. I do the missions when I find them, but mostly with just henchman since there isn't anyone around doing the ones I want do. Most of my time has been spent running around the maps trying to find out where to go, hence me being only lvl13.

I really really want to like this game, but I'm beginning to get a little bored with it just because I don't know what I'm doing lol.

salja Wachi

Banned

Join Date: Jun 2005

Chicago

the Bleeding Edge

N/Mo

08 Jun 2005 at 21:06 - 53
if you want to "level" endlessly so you can say you are a level 2000000000.00000E17 then this is not the game for you. if you want to develope your skills and learn how to play characters and work with a team then this is the game for you.

there is a lot more to this game then level. in fact level means nothing in this game.

the main point to "leveling" is to unlock skills and runes so you can use them in PvP not so you can tout your godlyness to "noobs"

i hope they enver increase the leveling on this game as it it perfect the way it is now. with the new areas and content coming there will be never ending challenges and quests to do.

i have now finished building 3 characters that is unlocking almost every single skill of every profession with the exceptions of a couple of elites, not the goal is to learn to play them all and figure out proper strategy for PvP which in the end is what this game is all about tnayway.

good luck to you

theclam

Jungle Guide

Join Date: May 2005

08 Jun 2005 at 21:38 - 54
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyeo138
Hey Mountain man & Dazzler, I got about 60hours in and I'm only lvl 13. Just got to Frost Gate. I went back and found I missed Piken Square. I'm kind of stuck at the moment, not sure where to go. The problem is, I walk around all over the place but don't really know where to go. I do the missions when I find them, but mostly with just henchman since there isn't anyone around doing the ones I want do. Most of my time has been spent running around the maps trying to find out where to go, hence me being only lvl13.

I really really want to like this game, but I'm beginning to get a little bored with it just because I don't know what I'm doing lol.
From the Frost Gate, you can get to the next area by doing this:
Frost Gate --> Anvil Rock? --> Deldrimor Bowl --> Griffin's Mouth
It takes a bit to run that far, but once you get to Kryta, there are several missions and dozens of quests that open up.

theclam

Jungle Guide

Join Date: May 2005

08 Jun 2005 at 21:51 - 55
This game is not like other RPGs. It's not about character development, it's about strategies. With other games, like D2 or WoW, character development just involves making certain numbers go up. It's very rare that you'll ever get anything that changes the nature of the gameplay significantly. Character development means that you'll get more powerful, while the monsters get more powerful, but you'll still be doing the same sort of gameplay. I've found that in D2 and WoW, there is a very small amount of strategy in character development. It's just "I'm going to be a Hydra/CL Sorceress" or "I'm going to be a Dark Pact/Nightfall Warlock". The choices are minimal and they don't feel unique. With Guild Wars, there is a tremendous amount of room for discovering your own strategies and making your character build unique. In Wow and D2, I felt like I was just repeating the same things over and over again. Life Tap, Immolate, CoA, Corruption, Drain Life, Drain Life, Immolate, using Shadow Bolts when I got Nightfall, rinse and repeat. There wasn't another good strategy to use for an Affliction Warlock at my level. In Guild Wars, when I get bored, I can completely switch my setup to something different. To me, that's real character development, not just making numbers go up.

rei

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Apr 2005

08 Jun 2005 at 22:19 - 56
when reaching level 20, you enter a new world of.. fascinating sceneries, more organized pvp, and a set of sexy lookin' 15 platinum armors
its true this game lacks a bit of pve world of warcraft is praised upon, yet the ingame-pvp stradegy makes it so much interesting. The game is called "Guild Wars." if you have not already made few friends or entered/formed a guild, now is the time to do it. Playing with friends can make all the difference.
Just conluding the post with one more response since im hearing alot of these kind of complaints around other forums.
"this game doesn't have enough classes/proffessions." Thats because Guild Wars focuses on a main tree of a character, unlike Everquest which have around 5 builds of different "Fighters."
Guild Wars does not lack in combination of skill usage and there are so much more stradegy usage during Organized PvP matches. Just wait until you get to level 20, form a party. =)

Yamat

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2005

San Diego, USA

08 Jun 2005 at 22:22 - 57
Quote:
If the content isn't there and the character advancement carrots aren't there, most gamers will get bored and leave.
OMG I am so shocked by this mentality that I had to post.

How have games like chess lasted so many centuries? Because you get better the more you play. Guild Wars is computerized chess, not ForeverQuest. And you know what, people who play chess twice a year still enjoy chess...

People need to understand ANet are trying to break the mold here and be leaders, not followers.

If people thought they were buying Everquest with better graphics, sorry, wrong game. That one is called Everquest 2.

DON"T WHINE TO GET THIS GAME TURNED INTO ANOTHER MMORPG.

Someone else said it right... at L20 (post ascension) for the frist time you are on a level playing field... from that point on it's down to skill, not grind.

Ashock

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: May 2005

13 Jun 2005 at 21:35 - 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yamat
How have games like chess lasted so many centuries? Because you get better the more you play.

Chess is the king of games because from game to game, the possibilities and variations are almost endless. Even at Grandmaster levels, there are still many different possibilites after the first 25-30 moves.

OTOH, in GW, from game to game and from character to character the possibilities for sameness are almost endless. After lvl 20 and Ascention, the possibilities for sameness are completely endless. Not really the same thing.


-A

CtrlAltDel

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: May 2005

Ohio

Brotherhood of Havoc

Mo/Me

13 Jun 2005 at 21:47 - 59
everyone that complains about the level 20 cap was an old D2 or FF player that all they did was run the same area 7 billion times to level up higher than their buddy

and those same people still lack the ability to grasp that this game isnt about leveling up

Yamat

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2005

San Diego, USA

13 Jun 2005 at 22:01 - 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashock
OTOH, in GW, from game to game and from character to character the possibilities for sameness are almost endless. After lvl 20 and Ascention, the possibilities for sameness are completely endless. Not really the same thing.
-A
What?!

So are you saying that you use exactly the same skills with your L20 chars and never change them?

Personally I change them with almost every group I'm in, thereby changing my role. Plus every group I'm in has a different mix of people, necessitating I change my role slightly to maximise the group effectiveness.

How is that sameness?

Phaedrus

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Apr 2005

13 Jun 2005 at 22:10 - 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashock
Chess is the king of games because from game to game, the possibilities and variations are almost endless. Even at Grandmaster levels, there are still many different possibilites after the first 25-30 moves.

OTOH, in GW, from game to game and from character to character the possibilities for sameness are almost endless. After lvl 20 and Ascention, the possibilities for sameness are completely endless. Not really the same thing.
I'll go out on a limb and guess you don't play in the tombs much.

It's fine if you fill a skillbar and never change it. That explains your boredom. Players who are still in love with Guild Wars are constantly evolving...not out of respect for the "celestial carrot at the end of the stick", not out of necessity...but more for the sake of discovery. Winning the HoH isn't about muscle, it's about strategy. It's about building a character who's useful not just in one way, but in many. It's about building a team that can face the all-air-elementalist strike force, the win-by-attrition monk team, the dark-army-of-the-night necro team, and everything in between. It's about understanding your skills, your skillset, and your teammates and learning how to employ effective strategy.

You can do this in PvE, if it matters to you. Pay attention to where you are, what skills your opponents do, whether they bleed or can be diseased, what elemental weaknesses they have, discover the quirks in their AI (like how a monk prioritizes heal targets, which differs from monk AI to monk AI).

I don't mean to be a troll, but Guild Wars is sort of a game for people who already see inherant beauty in what it offers. If it doesn't interest a player, that player will leave. In that respect it's no different than any game. I certainly don't want to try to convince or goad people into playing here...I don't want people like that on my teams. Instead of insulting the players who *do* see what Guild Wars has to offer them, you can find a game you enjoy more and play that.

[ ]

Ashock

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: May 2005

14 Jun 2005 at 16:06 - 62
I play Action RPGs in large part because I like character development. Past lvl 20 and Ascention, there is no character development. End of story.

Lebdan

Academy Page

Join Date: May 2005

Mo/Me

14 Jun 2005 at 16:35 - 63
Well, too bad. End period. Go play another game.

Mormegil

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2005

14 Jun 2005 at 16:38 - 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashock
I play Action RPGs in large part because I like character development. Past lvl 20 and Ascention, there is no character development. End of story.
Of course there isn't. Because you should provide character development by testing the sheer number of skills in the Tomb and in the two most competitive PvE ares, UW and FOW. You should capture new skills and use them, maybe try some combination as well.
From what I've read, I'm 100% sure you don't even have an idea how to.

You just whine.

End of the story.

Darkest Dawn

Darkest Dawn

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2005

Ohio, USA

W/Mo

14 Jun 2005 at 17:11 - 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mountain Man
Wow...I'm slow. I've put in a little over 60 hours, and I only just reached level 18 last night!
I hear ya! I am enjoying hunting and searching every nook and cranny for all this game has to offer. I've had this game for a little over a month and played it exclusively. As of date, I just got my first level 20, and not yet ascended.

I'm excited about what this game still has to offer: more expansions, PvP, helping guildmates make it through missions, helping guildmates with tips and/or resources, etc....

Nothing like doing a drake run through the Gates of Kryta mission for some good purple or gold items.... hehe

Frankly, every game will some day lose it's luster, and life neither begins or ends with Guild Wars, lol. Still, it's a fun ride, and I will continue to enjoy it for quite a while.

Darkest Dawn

Darkest Dawn

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2005

Ohio, USA

W/Mo

14 Jun 2005 at 17:14 - 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by theclam
From the Frost Gate, you can get to the next area by doing this:
Frost Gate --> Anvil Rock? --> Deldrimor Bowl --> Griffin's Mouth
It takes a bit to run that far, but once you get to Kryta, there are several missions and dozens of quests that open up.
And don't forget Beacon's Perch...

Just don't go out the passage that says Lorner's Pass, hehe

Deagol

Deagol

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2005

Denmark

14 Jun 2005 at 17:54 - 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashock
I play Action RPGs in large part because I like character development. Past lvl 20 and Ascention, there is no character development. End of story.
Fine. Then Guild Wars is not for you. There certainly is no lack of games directed towards people who play to level.

I play games because I like the content. I guess when I have explored the underword and fissure, there won't be more content. Then I take a long break, maybe until the next chapter, and start another character (with new professions) so the content will feel fresh.

Until now that is 110 hours of content, and I'm still in Kryta... Pretty good for US$50.

What I like with Guild Wars over the MMORPG's I have tried, is that it doesn't try to artifically extend the content over more hours by meaningless grinding. Grinding is only necessary for those who want the perfect character, but I couldn't care less about having the perfect character.

The part of me that RP think being imperfect is an important part of RP.

Luggage

Luggage

Elite Guru

Join Date: Feb 2005

sweden

14 Jun 2005 at 18:01 - 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashock
I play Action RPGs in large part because I like character development. Past lvl 20 and Ascention, there is no character development. End of story.
Here's a tip: http://www.progressquest.com/
You don't have to thank me.

Lebdan

Academy Page

Join Date: May 2005

Mo/Me

14 Jun 2005 at 18:14 - 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deagol
...but I couldn't care less about having the perfect character.

The part of me that RP think being imperfect is an important part of RP.
Couldn't agree more. Without mentioning that even with the perfect character you'll always have someone with the right skills to counter you.

Not bein' able to "pwn" everyone is one of the most important parts on a MMORPG. You aren't god for doing so.

Just my 2 cents and opinion on the game.

EDIT: Man, Progress Quest owns. Been playing it for 10 minutes and love it!

Ashock

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: May 2005

23 Jun 2005 at 23:33 - 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luggage
Here's a tip: http://www.progressquest.com/
You don't have to thank me.
Ahh, I admit your sense of humor is excuisite.

I hope that gave you the superiority jolt that you were hoping for.


It's ok, I acted like an obnoxious little brat after I had my first beer also.


Have a nice day.



-A

Numa Pompilius

Numa Pompilius

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: May 2005

At an Insit.. Intis... a house.

Live Forever Or Die Trying [GLHF]

W/Me

23 Jun 2005 at 23:44 - 71
I'm level 20, and I'm starting to feel it's boring now. The missions are DAMN hard, pretty much impossible to do with henches, at least if you're not a monk, forcing you to group.
And I hate to group.
So I'm abandoning my lvl 20 and starting over with a new guy, and I've learned my lesson - the next guy has monk as secondary profession.

Shadowsting

Shadowsting

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2005

Gentlemen's Club

24 Jun 2005 at 00:18 - 72
I think the problem is that some players, including myself, want to feel like they have a tangible reward. They need something to strive for. And, "you have gained another skill point" isn't really impressive.

Just my 2 francs.

KaPe

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2005

24 Jun 2005 at 00:20 - 73
"The missions are DAMN hard, pretty much impossible to do with henches, at least if you're not a monk, forcing you to group."

That's *terrible*. I mean, to party with other people in MMORPG... Unthinkable. These "damn hard" mission quickly separate bad players from good ones and you can get decent allies fairly easily. It's not like you can ask "high level" friend to do Elona/River for you, since you're all level 20 already(or close to it). Plus, as a Mo/Me(although might as well not have 2nd class, since I only use Hex Breaker from it ) I did lots of these "damn hard" mission(except for River) with henchies. These do better than poor team who lacks coordination - but are still inferior to good team with balanced skills and expierence at using them.

I've been level for, dunno 2 days already(it's only a week since game first shown up in my country ) and I still find PvE interesting. It's challenging, unlike in numerous other (MMO)RPGs, where it's basically about continuosly leveling your hero and making sure your uber spell or weapon is enough. Here, such approach will only get you slaughtered by enemies who have same skills as you and use them well.

As for "carrot" - elite skills and 15k armor. Admitedly, something more would be nice, but hey, it's not like making full set will be an easy task. Not to mention PvP.