You're too low! <kick>

I guess everyone, but heal only monks, have experienced this:
you join a team, that spams the channel with "need 1 more for mission, please, anyone???" tells and since you're going to do it anyway, you tell them to grab you, so that you can at least have some fun with non-henchies doing the mission.
Shortly thereafter comes the shock of 75% of the team, that you're too low, e.g.: average team level is 18 and you're a 14, resulting in a swift kick from the team.

Well, there surely are some people out there, whom I prefer not playing with, but asking desperately for s.o. to join and then being kicked is just such a low blow.

Anyway, in the end it turned out kinda funny, since I managed to finish the mission with henchies, whereas the original team was still busy working their way through that "too hard for a lvl 14" mission.

Point is, that I wouldn't judge by the level, unless it's more than obvious that the player must have been dragged to the mission by a high level friend, but give it a try first and see if the team can benefit from the "low" level persons skills, since (s)he must have gotten to that mission somehow.

Most of the pickup teams usually work out, or you can at least tell that it will result in a disaster as soon as you see <insert random class> charging like Leroy into the map.

Anyone else experienced such kicking or poor teaming issues?
(beside the common "WTF??? You're a monk and can't rez??? WTF man???")

Ive always done the quests, and helped out my lower level guild mates, so when I come to a new area I am almost always one of the highest people in that area, so no I havent experienced your issue.

I also was a lvl 19 playing with lvl 13's in a mission yesterday, so I cant say I am contributing to your problem either, actually I basically solod the mission after they all repeatedly died, I guess you couldnt really say I was being mean to the low lvls who just try to get through the game 100% ASAP either. In fact I was helping them out by beating the mission for them while they sat there and cheered me on.

Tsunamii Starshine

They were dead when they were cheering me on, and yes I was the only char alive doing the 4-5 pulls for parts of the game I was just getting to myself, 100% solo... just for clarification.

Tsunamii Starshine

There seem to be a lot of people playing GW that think only having high level players are the way to go with Quests and Missions. Or they only think certain Class types are what they need.

Ok, later in the game when you ascend, then lvl20 is a must most of the time. (I'm sure someone out there will disagree. )

On more than one occasion i have let in any lvl of player for certain missions and I try my best to help those who may be there first attempt at this mission because they show an interest and the fact they can almost hold there own and know what they are doing.

Then there are those high level players who think they know all and get wasted a lot, for there inability to play with the rest of the Team. "I am high level, I am the Team!!" Blah. They get res'd last or leave because they keep dying and blame it on the Monk who got cheesed of with keep trying to Heal Rambo Warrior, and attempted to keep all the others alive instead.

Sounds like you want to have fun and are willing to attempt most things. Good on you.

Ascended my 2nd char at 17, so I'll be the disagreeing one

I think this is common for a reason. Maybe I'm the jerk here, but "monk" does tend to imply "rez", even if you're not a "healing" monk. But honestly I'm of the oppinion that EVERYONE should carry a rez skill if they can or a rez signet if they can't. I can't count the times I've been in a party that wiped because everyone with rez was dead and the ones still standing never used more than 2 of their skills but still somehow couldn't find room for a rez. And when there's a monk still standing that can't rez people (who all have rez signets) it's like a slap in the face.

I actually meant after you ascend then lvl 20 is a must for most missions. I know you can ascend before becoming lvl 20.

Sorry, obviously wasn't written clearly. My fo par.

Not a Jerk at all. I have to totally agree with you on this one. Anyone who doesn't want to Mission with a Res, is hoping everyone with one will survive and be able to Res him. Sorry, but i check everyone has Res if going on a hard mission. Can never be too careful.
I always carry Monk Res and I'm either Warrior/Mo or Ele/Mo and i always asked to be Res'd first so i can res everyone else if it gets that bad and everyone only has Rez Signet so they can use it again if the need arises.

Yeah, I remember when I was a level 11 monk in the desert and people kept going "WTF level 11". The parties which kept me in though, completed the trials on their first try.

And yes, I agree that everyone without access to a monk res should bring the signet unless they have a very good reason not to.

Good points. I am a W/Mo and I carry the Rez Skill. I TRY to tell others that only have a Rez Sig to save it for ME or a Monk in the group. Since I am a Warrior I can die pretty darn fast, even with healing spells..and one of my last resorts Endure Pain.

I also have played with all kinds of levels of players. I have seen high level players die real fast too. I am a W/Mo 16 and (Just can't get the playing time in...Married, kids, job, NAPS) I like playing with "lower" level players. They seem to listen to me when I warn them about what is coming up. Higher level players (not all of course) can be a little bit arrogent.

BTW: NAPS are important to an Old Warrior Dood. Best Healing Spell I have in the real world.

ROFL

I think the system is pretty much the best it can be at this time.

A few nights ago, I helped "power-level" a bunch of my guildies. I (a level 19 monk) took them (levels 9-11) all the way out to Yak's Bend. Now, when they go questing with other players (or the "high-level henchmen") in that city, they'll be able to kill stronger beasts, and gain xp faster. Of course, it will be at the expense of other people there who are the normal level (13-14). If they don't want to go questing with my guild friends, they should have the right to kick them. Especially a lv 13 who is unsure of his abilities may want to kick my lv 10 friend, so that he can get all the power possible. I think this makes perfect sense. Do you disagree Saya?

I've noticed that some people think they are superior because they are a higher level. That's stupid. I've also seen (surprisingly) people think they are superior because they are a lower lever! For example:

When I first got to Dunes of Despair (the easiest of the ascension quests), I joined a group tht contained a lv 15, and the rest of us were lv 18+. The lv 15 was the only person who knew what he was doing. He constantly was giving us instructions, and was really headstrong about attacking the different groups. Obviously, it wasn't his first time. I thought we'd do fine with him, since he was obviously experienced with the mission. Well, we died, and he immediately dropped group. (he must have thought we were incompetent). We replaced him with another lv 19 newbie, and tried again, and passed the mission with no problem ) Hahahaha!

I've often dropped a player from my group because s/he was too low of a level. It all depends on how worried I am about failing. If it's a short quest, then I usually don't care. If we fail, we just start over again. If it's a long quest, and I've failed a couple of times already, then I will want only the best to go with me. I don't think that's being selfish. There's enough people around that they'll be able to find a group without level requirements, or start their own group. If they're still not able to find anyone, then they can always go grind someplace to increase their level. It may be boring if it's their 3rd of 4th character, but, hey, it shouldn't take them as long this time

@uigrad,

I think it was more the fact the guy creating the Party said he wanted anyone, didn't matter. Then when he joined he got kicked.

I agree that you should be able to have the group you want, but to say one thing and mean another as the Party Creater did, well, that is a little wrong in my books.

I have started a few groups. In fact the other day I was the third in line of a group and the other two above me quit because they could not figure it out. So I took over. I do not like to LEAD a group. I will make suggestions and commands like STOP...HEAL...WAIT...PLAN....other then that I as a warrior want to concentrate on what I have to Tank at. Also I am not a fast typist, so I like to work with people that have TeamSpeak. Much easier, even if the group doesn't have mics they can hear me. My friend added to his server Teamspeak...not all that hard...and it is FREE that way. We even made it possible for people to log on as a guest. My friend that plays this with me types over a 100wpm but even he doesn't like to type while playing. Me I stuggle at 40wpm.

BTW: The group I took over...we finished it. Wasn't that hard. It was the "Eye" mission. I kept calling it the STOOPID EYE. "Stop lookin' at me...ya STOOPID EYE" Always made me laugh...we had to be CLEAN to carry the STOOPID EYE to whom ever we carried it too. I thought we got pretty dirty carrying that EYE around the countryside. I know I needed a bath after that.

Nope,
and as Dirkiess mentioned it was more of a rude thing begging for s.o. to help and as soon as you join you get booted without even checking back if you would be capable of handling the mission or not.
I don't mind being kicked or not being picked into a team for the right reasons, just wasn't nice being booted back to the bench when the team was asking for any kind of help.

Actually, I didn't even know that it's possible to do the Ascend mirror match pre 20 - good to know.

Ha, that sounds actually like fun. Reminds me of a mission I played with my 20 monk (heal only ) and the 2 warriors and 2 elementalists on the team were charging like mad into the first big mob, assuming I would cover them all without a problem. Unfortunately I ran out of energy within seconds, resulting in the team being wiped out and me receiving tells to "RUN!!!" for a later rez - felt like Forrest there for a few

Yeah,
I was only refering to that one without any comments, as I experienced this a lot when playing my monk. Those */MO Players see a MO/* and suddenly think they can drop anything monk related for other skills and of course that's also the mission where the part of the group in the back gets attacked by a wandering mob or just plain bad luck and I died too soon, resulting in noone being able to rez.
Another thing that happened to me was, that I just arrived with my henchies in a new mission outpost, receive an invite, join the team and open the skill selection screen, when the mission timer appears - I ended up without rez and was on the receiving end of those curses then
But I pointed that out and we regrouped in the outpost right away, so no harm done - anyway, can't imagine playing without a rez signet or rez power when I'm teaming with real players, since there simply cannot be a skill that is more powerfull than rez'ing your teammate.

Heh, hope I didn't sound too much like a jerk there, it's just that I've actually listened to a Mo/W justify his lack of rez with: "I'm a good tank". Certainly understand getting pulled into a zone before you are ready though. That is generally a bad omen right there.

Since I mentioned it anyway, I don't understand the */W mentality. I know, I know, "there's no such thing as a bad build". But one of the most important abilities of a warrior is being able to wear a fortress on their bodies. The only good I can see to having a warrior secondary is the ability to actually do appreciable damage with a melee weapon (though still not as much as you won't have the armor piercing of strength), which puts you in the mob's face in your rice paper armor. I suppose also speccing tactics could allow the use of a shield and an effective healing signet, but is that enough to offset the fact that your standing toe-to-toe with a mob practically naked? Is it worth the attribute point expenditure? And it would seem that for any class other than a warrior, energy would be important enough to want to use a focus instead of a shield (unless you have energy storage, but an elementalist's armor is the weakest). No, I haven't tried */W so maybe it's more effective than I believe it could be, but I'd be interested to hear what primary monks (healers) have to say about */Ws. ?

missed the thread about the person who ascended as a level 3 did ya? =)

Yeah on one of my first days playing Gw I was leading a group into I think the 3rd mission, 3 lvl 8s including me and a lvl 4 I think necro something. Well the other 2 guys were in a uproar about how he's going to be uselss and die and yada yada yada. Of course I tuned them out and started. Well guess who was the first one to die? one of the lvl 8s. And when the necro said how useful his attacks are, they commented on how it would be better if he was higher, even thou they died first. I so do love playing with people like that

I'd take the lower leveled guy almost anyday.

Odds are this is their second or third time through and I figure someone who is lower level is going to have a higher chance of knowing what their doing than someone way overleveled because they keep failing missions.

I don't see any problem in taking low level players with you. First of all it isn't all about level but mostly about skill. And second, I like to help people out. Usually I give them a better weapon or somthing like that. The game is about having fun, it's not like a party should have a 18+ sticker on it.

LOL, speaking of low lvl's in teams. I was a healer in a team tonight doing the last mission with the linch "hell's precipiece" (or however you spell it). He was a lvl 18. Someone in the team asked him after we started the mission how the hell he got that far with out hitting lvl 20. Most of what I caught between healing was he went thru lonar's. And I guess from there ran to the towns doing only the missions he had to do to get there. He only died once "my fault I targeted the wrong guy to heal". And I only saw him at one time come sprinting past me at the back of the group to get a mob off of him. ROFL I thought it wsa kinda cool in a way he was there at lvl 18.

Really, with very very few exceptions, all people that are high level before Ascension suck - cause they failed numerous times on previous missions. I have to laugh when I walk up to Elona Reach to find that everyone is level 18+, when I can complete it easily with a hench team while being 15.

As for monks... I have a smiter... who often has to switch out for healer... I feel sorry for all primary monks... monks are like a magnet for bad parties that just want healers.

It was a great team we beat the end mission with ease considering we only had one warrior and the rest spell caster lines. me and the hench healer. and the necros throwing out Blood Well "I think is what the spell is called". I think in total we had like 7 deaths (we pulled to many mobs right at the start and alot of us died). we were gonna go to the HoH after. But the lvl 18 guy did not have it on his map yet. So we are gonna do it another time.

laughing at all lvl 18 folks are mean- I did every single skill quest, quests that only give xp, etc and I got lvl 20 naturally before I even hit sanctum cay. you probably skipped most of those quests and just did the missions and very very few quests.

sprint, balanced stance, farm

Ditto. thats the only warrior spells I got lol just for that reason. since all I do is heal in a PvE team.

I haven't had that problem, really. I try to maintain an even balance in games I join, if I feel I'd be holding the party back, I remove myself. Like today, I did a mission with four level 20's, a level 14 and me, level 15 at the time. We finished the mission, ran to Temple of Ages - which costed us each about a death a piece and that was that. After that I disbanded because I had no reason to be holding them back after that. Real nice guys, guild "kaw" or something of that sort.

Dunno what you're talking about, on my level 3 monk in Dunes I made my own teams (took a few tries), then did the same for Elona's and Thirsty River. I also joined teams running to the next missions ect. People dont kick for being low level, they kick if they think you're useless. Sell yourself to them that you're a good team player and not an idiot, you'll have no problems getting on teams regardless of your level. I think everyone's with me on this one; I'd rather have a level 10 team player then all the level 20 idiots in he game who agro, die a lot, go the wrong way, and generally have no idea what they're doing. Intelligence > Levels any day.

im a monk so i dont really have the problem of being kicked out but i prefer playing with low-level team members.

Usually when there are only high levels they all go for themselfs but with a few low-levels you stick together almost everytime.

I saw some formulas posted for calculating damage via spells/spell weapons and weapons, and level was fairly important. I believe I calculated that with equal attribute score in a given spell, a level 15 would do 11% more damage than a level 13. And a level 18 would do about 17% more damage than the level 15. That's pretty significant, especially in conjunction with the increase to maximum hitpoints and attribute points. I'm not totally sure the damage formulas were correct.

My general rule of thumb is that a skilled player within 3 levels of me is probably far more helpful to the team than an unskilled player 0-2 levels above me. Player skill, teamwork/communication, and solid character builds are crucial to winning missions in PVE.

Haha, I hit lvl 20 at Riverside - because I got stuck. I spent my first 13 levels not noticing the 'mission' button in the team window...
I was like "where the hell is the monument?!" in Surmia and stuff...

It did mean I cleared the whole available map, though, looking for an exit.

I'm usually quite a high level even when I first enter an area, mainly because I try to do all the quests I can find before leaving a place via missions/exploring, so I haven't really had this problem. I can easily see many people thinking this way, though -- I've suddenly hit upon the extensive 'jerk' problem that many have been complaining about. It wouldn't be so bad if people's levels weren't displayed in the party window beside their name...

Ascending automatically gives you level 20.



Pretty hard (if not impossible) to be under 20 for missions after ascension, since it is an automatic status, no matter what level you beat your mirror at.


Jana

That's about the funniest thing I've read on these forums! I did the first 2 missions not understanding how they worked. I just joined a group when I entered the northern wall, and found myself plunged into the middle of it, and then the same thing again at Fort Ranik.

I completely agree, since i've beaten the game... when i go through it again... i dont like to do all the quests/other things... so i tend to be about 4-5 sometimes even more lvls lower then most people... and yea, they think since you're a lower lvl that you suck, and well... this is a reason for why i've figured out a way to use henchman to beat all the missions... ascending i can only get past dunes with henchies... the rest i have to team with humans... Well, there was one other mission i couldnt pass by myself, the one where you have to do something to the portal before the other guys do, or something... the one with the "Crystals", and "Thorn pedastals(SP)"...

To be honest, I'd have thought people would think even more highly of low-level players than higher-level players, as they had to go through the same hard areas with less HPs and attribute points at their disposal. So they achieved the same as the other players, only they had a harder time doing it. And so people call them n00bs anyway. I don't understand people sometimes...