I'd like to request that rods/staves for Ranger's Wilderness and Beastmastery be added to the system. Here is my logic.
1. Ranger is the only class where 'Marksmanship' is the sole attribute that gives you a max-damage weapon. Elementalists have their choice of element, Mesmers have domination or illusion, Healers have smiting or divine favor, Warriors have their weapon choice, and Necromancers have curses, blood or death magic. The Ranger is the only class with "just" a single attribute with a max-damage weapon.
2. It is not appropriate for an "expertise bow". Expertise is not about using a bow, it's about being praticed, a professional -- dedicated to one's cause. The only other class /w a weapon associated with a primary attribute is the monk (divine favor), and this is only done because protection and healing don't make any sence to be a weapon attribute.
3. Wilderness and Beastmastery, are, for the most part, just like any other caster's skill line (think blood or curses for a necromancer). Both of these two lines _deserve_ a weapon/foci because they are both semi-offensive (traps for wilderness, and pet attacks for beastmastery).
4. Since a ranger is mid-way between a caster and a warrior, it makes sense for them to have the option of having a rod/staff. Some rangers might want to stick with the 'bow' and be more warrior like. Other rangers might want instead to be more like a druid, harnessing nature.
In conclusion, I'd like to see wilderness and beast mastery staff/rod added to the game to fill this problem with Ranger's lack of weapon choice.
Druid: Wilderness and Beastmastery Weapons
IxChel
theclam
Why would beast mastery give you a rod/stave, I think it would give you a whip instead 
why would you use a rod/stave? most of the ranger skills are about bows, why would you needlessly cripple yourself?
If you really want you can get a rod/stave from pre-searing, those don't have any requirements so you can use those with your ranger
why would you use a rod/stave? most of the ranger skills are about bows, why would you needlessly cripple yourself?
If you really want you can get a rod/stave from pre-searing, those don't have any requirements so you can use those with your ranger
Epinephrine
I suggested BM and WS off hand items a short while ago; they would thus be paired with a wand or sword; staves for these attributes would also be nice.
arnansnow
Why would you want an off-hand weapon with a ranger?
THEY ARE A LONG-RANGED BOW-WIELDING CLASS.
If you want an off-hand item, be any class but a ranger.
EDIT:
I do agree that rangers need more weapons, but don't give them wands.
THEY ARE A LONG-RANGED BOW-WIELDING CLASS.
If you want an off-hand item, be any class but a ranger.
EDIT:
I do agree that rangers need more weapons, but don't give them wands.
arnansnow
Beast Mastery isn't about having a weapon and doing damage yourself, so why would you have a weapon for that attribute?
Having a staff for Wilderness would make you unable to use skills from one entire line and half from another, who would cripple themselves that way?
Having a staff for Wilderness would make you unable to use skills from one entire line and half from another, who would cripple themselves that way?
IxChel
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Originally Posted by theclam
Why would beast mastery give you a rod/stave, I think it would give you a whip instead
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by theclam
why would you use a rod/stave? most of the ranger skills are about bows, why would you needlessly cripple yourself?
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I suggest making wilderness a 'staff', since that's kinda what I imagine a druid carrying. It would work like any other caster's staff and have max damage accordingly. Yes, you wouldn't be able to use your bow skills with it -- however, it would make a Ra/X viable with Expertise /Wilderness /Some-Secondary-Line, rather than always having to have Expertise and Marksmanship.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by arnansnow
THEY ARE A LONG-RANGED BOW-WIELDING CLASS.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by arnansnow
Beast Mastery isn't about having a weapon and doing damage yourself, so why would you have a weapon for that attribute?
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by arnansnow
Having a staff for Wilderness would make you unable to use skills from two entire lines, who would cripple themselves that way?
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Zubey
I agree with the original post. I'd like to see Staves in Wilderness Survival.
Currently, Ranger's are forced into Marksmanship to have any weapon output. They need some of the flexibility that other classes have.
Currently, Ranger's are forced into Marksmanship to have any weapon output. They need some of the flexibility that other classes have.
arnansnow
If you want to survive in the wild (wilderness survival) which would you rather prefer:
A. going up straight to an enemy and hitting him from up close, and risking getting hit
or
B. staying far away and shooting the enemy full with arrows, with little chance of retaliation.
Ok so they should make some non-marksmanship bows, I can agree with that, but rangers are all about being away from the enemy, basically the only touch skill is throw dirt, which people can live without, so why would you go up close?
A. going up straight to an enemy and hitting him from up close, and risking getting hit
or
B. staying far away and shooting the enemy full with arrows, with little chance of retaliation.
Ok so they should make some non-marksmanship bows, I can agree with that, but rangers are all about being away from the enemy, basically the only touch skill is throw dirt, which people can live without, so why would you go up close?
Epinephrine
As has already been brought up:
Each line for warriors has an item - three types of weapon (hammer, axe, sword) and two types of shield (strength and tactics)
Each line of Elementalist has both weapon and focus, excepting energy storage (which only has a small number of skills) - fire, earth, air and water all have foci and wands, as well as staves.
Each line of Monk has an item associated; Divine favour and smiting each have staves, healing and protection have foci, smiting and I think DF have wands.
Each line of Mesmer has an item, excepting fast casting (which has only one skill); Domination and illusion have wands and staves, inspiration has a focus; I believe both domination and illusion also have foci.
Each line of Necromancer except Soul Reaping(which has no skills) has a staff and a wand, as well as a focus - there are staves for all three lines, wands for at least two of them and foci for all three.
Rangers have one line with a weapon, and none with a focus. A ranger focus in BM and WS as well as a staff in these would put them on equal footing in choice of skill line as the other professions. I think that the staves are a good idea, but I'd also like to see the foci decribed here (http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...88&postcount=1) as they would be a nice complement to a sword/axe as well as a wand, for those caster/rangers who want added protection with it or those warrior-type rangers who wish a bit more energy than a shield gives.
Each line for warriors has an item - three types of weapon (hammer, axe, sword) and two types of shield (strength and tactics)
Each line of Elementalist has both weapon and focus, excepting energy storage (which only has a small number of skills) - fire, earth, air and water all have foci and wands, as well as staves.
Each line of Monk has an item associated; Divine favour and smiting each have staves, healing and protection have foci, smiting and I think DF have wands.
Each line of Mesmer has an item, excepting fast casting (which has only one skill); Domination and illusion have wands and staves, inspiration has a focus; I believe both domination and illusion also have foci.
Each line of Necromancer except Soul Reaping(which has no skills) has a staff and a wand, as well as a focus - there are staves for all three lines, wands for at least two of them and foci for all three.
Rangers have one line with a weapon, and none with a focus. A ranger focus in BM and WS as well as a staff in these would put them on equal footing in choice of skill line as the other professions. I think that the staves are a good idea, but I'd also like to see the foci decribed here (http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...88&postcount=1) as they would be a nice complement to a sword/axe as well as a wand, for those caster/rangers who want added protection with it or those warrior-type rangers who wish a bit more energy than a shield gives.
arnansnow
the easiest solution would be to have bows for wilderness and beastmastery, not getting foci or staves/wands or swords.
Epinephrine
Except that a Warrior/Ranger taking a pet won't benefit from a bow, ever - he would use an off hand item like a focus perhaps, but a bow doesn't fit the W/R or R/W setup. Neither will the wand wielding mage with one, and staves carry energy bonuses, which are especially important as a caster class with a ranger secondary. EVERY class but the ranger has a focus/shield. Every class but the Ranger has several lines with weapons, and a choice of one handed or two handed (wand/staff or sword,axe/hammer). Give them these options.
arnansnow
benifit from what?
You know, if you really want a ranger with a staff, get a secondary profession and use a staff from it.
You know, if you really want a ranger with a staff, get a secondary profession and use a staff from it.
Rhombus
i only read the first 2 post but... ooooh.... whipping the charr to death
arnansnow
The whip would be the perfect distracting weapon.
Epinephrine
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Originally Posted by arnansnow
benifit from what?
You know, if you really want a ranger with a staff, get a secondary profession and use a staff from it. |
arnansnow
Why do you want to give rangers melee/rods/staves?
Why not just keep rangers with bows?
Why not just keep rangers with bows?
Lasher Dragon
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Originally Posted by Epinephrine
Each line of Necromancer except Soul Reaping(which has no skills) has a staff and a wand, as well as a focus - there are staves for all three lines, wands for at least two of them and foci for all three.
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BTW I agree that the Ranger gets hosed on weapon choice... I think there should be bows w/expertise requirements myself.
arnansnow
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Originally Posted by Lasher Dragon
I hate to disagree with ya there, but:
BTW I agree that the Ranger gets hosed on weapon choice... I think there should be bows w/expertise requirements myself. |
that would be the most useless item in the game if not for the +12 energy, although the energy requires soul reaping as well, which dampens it some more.
Epinephrine
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Lasher Dragon
I hate to disagree with ya there, but:
BTW I agree that the Ranger gets hosed on weapon choice... I think there should be bows w/expertise requirements myself. |
Do they have one for energy storage and fast casting as well?Quote:
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Originally Posted by arnansnow
Why do you want to give rangers melee/rods/staves?
Why not just keep rangers with bows? |
One main reason for not making it a bow is the number of bow skills that could then be used too easily. Ignite arrows for example, requires investment in at least two attributes to be very useful - putting a bow based on WS would reduce it to one attribute, profoundly changing the balance. Likewise, the skill distracting shot is a great skill, and though it is in expertise it is effective at 0 investment - but you need marksmanship to use a decent bow. If you make a WS or BM bow it changes this as well, possibly making it too easy to use these skills.
Staves aren't linked to any of the ranger abilities, so would give a weapon that doesn't get around the most likely intentional need for marksmanship to use a high damage bow. It seems like the devs wanted real bow use to be a ranger's ability, and adding WS and BM bows would get around that - staves, wands and foci don't disrupt the careful placement of arrow enhancing preparations in a skill line that doesn't allow high damage bow use.
Lasher Dragon
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Originally Posted by Epinephrine
Ok, I was working from what I've seen :P That's one impressively useless staff
Do they have one for energy storage and fast casting as well? |
arnansnow
why do you use a melee weapon as a ranger, sure you can use warrior skills with it, but then, why are you not a W/R instead? you can still use ranger skills, but you will have more life and armor.
Epinephrine
Quote:
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Originally Posted by arnansnow
why do you use a melee weapon as a ranger, sure you can use warrior skills with it, but then, why are you not a W/R instead? you can still use ranger skills, but you will have more life and armor.
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Takkun
Ehe whips... I like that idea personally, since I loved using them in Nevewrwinter Nights.
I also think that there should be another weapon choice for the Rangers since all the other profession have two different types of weapons also since they can use canes and staves and wands and such....
I also think that there should be another weapon choice for the Rangers since all the other profession have two different types of weapons also since they can use canes and staves and wands and such....
arnansnow
another weapon for rangers could be a crossbow, like a bow only weaker and one-handed (just an idea)
Jwh6913
whips would work, wilderness could have like a plant like wand that shoots green balls, plant foci, and beastmastery could have whips indy jones style, with animal items as foci. gives minotaur horns a new purpose
arnansnow
you know the person who said the original whip thing was being sarcastic?
Jwh6913
yeah so? try coming up with beastmastery weapons! claws?
arnansnow
beastmastery is whip (so you can whip your animal in shape) 
Jwh6913
Quote:
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Originally Posted by arnansnow
you know the person who said the original whip thing was being sarcastic?
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arnansnow
Couldn't think of a better way of making sarcasm, i guess
Jwh6913
lol ok
ok
Beqxter
Yeah, he was joking, but it's still an interesting suggestion. Whips as in Indy Jones would be cool, but (purely from a RP point of view) it doesn't seem like whips are in style with BM. It's all about charming and befriending the animal, not whipping them around.
That said, I could see fun uses for a whip as an offensive weapon. Maybe an elite skill disarming an opponent?
And, as a ranger, I'd love to have more options than a bow for an offensive weapon. I think staves makes perfect sense (think Robin Hood). Darts, as has been suggested elsewhere, make sense for another ranged weapon.
That said, I could see fun uses for a whip as an offensive weapon. Maybe an elite skill disarming an opponent?
And, as a ranger, I'd love to have more options than a bow for an offensive weapon. I think staves makes perfect sense (think Robin Hood). Darts, as has been suggested elsewhere, make sense for another ranged weapon.
Jwh6913
but the animal itself won't be whipped, the mobs would :P
quarterstaves are good, but a tad difficult since rangers aren't made for melee combat
maybe remedy that with giving the quarter staves a certain distance- something like 6 to 10 feet long.
quarterstaves are good, but a tad difficult since rangers aren't made for melee combat
maybe remedy that with giving the quarter staves a certain distance- something like 6 to 10 feet long.
arnansnow
whips are for training stuff, or would you rather just hold a collar as a beastmaster?
Canook
throwing stars 
King of Fools
agree. 1 hand spears with shields, 2 handed staff, dual wield wooden staves, trident and net, thrown weapons, and others; all would fit in well with traditional and fictional potrayals of rangers.
currently, rangers have to depend on their secondary for their non-bow weapons. i think this works out well.
the main issue that original poster addresses is the lack of items that correspond to ranger attributes.
adding
'grim cesta of the pack 7-12(requires beastmastery 3) 10% chance to reduce recast timer on beastmastery skills'
would definately help non-marksmanship rangers.
currently, rangers have to depend on their secondary for their non-bow weapons. i think this works out well.
the main issue that original poster addresses is the lack of items that correspond to ranger attributes.
adding
'grim cesta of the pack 7-12(requires beastmastery 3) 10% chance to reduce recast timer on beastmastery skills'
would definately help non-marksmanship rangers.
arnansnow
cesta? what decent ranger uses a cesta, a whip at least.
Barraind
A whip does sound somewhat interesting, but it seems like throwing axes/knives would fit in better.
If a ranger can carry around eleventybillion arrows, im sure they would be plenty easy to carry around, plus the ranger would get to keep their ranged damage thing.
If a ranger can carry around eleventybillion arrows, im sure they would be plenty easy to carry around, plus the ranger would get to keep their ranged damage thing.
IxChel
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Originally Posted by Barraind
A whip does sound somewhat interesting, but it seems like throwing axes/knives would fit in better.
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Wilderness 11
Expertise 10
Beast Mastery 10
Without any way to get a 'max damage' weapon or higher energy.
..
arnansnow: Welcome to my ignore list; your comments are numerous, unthoughtful, and in general, simply a waste of time.
arnansnow
If you don't want to use Marksmanship, be a different primary, and be a ranger secondary, so you can use wilderness and beast mastery and use a close range/far range max damage weapon from your primary.