Grind, now in pvp Enjoy

Grind in PVP? Are you an idiot? You're doing the same thing you've always been doing. Now be happy that you're actually getting rewarded for it.

Look at it this way... people can now farm PvP! Woot!...!? Personally... I can't stand farming, unless special occasion.

People forget to include that once you unlock it ITS UNLOCKED FOREVER. Come on guys. This is the reason why Korea has started to hold the hall more and more. Whiney American brats sitting in the corner of a dark room, or GWG, sobbing that they can't be competetive unless they get everything handed to them and they'll quit, or won't play, till their "demands" are met by Anet. All the while Korea is out doing something and just getting it done.

And the rewards system DOES allow you to unlock things at a faster pace if you use it as an extension of unlocking things the normal way. Getting 3000 faction to unlock an elite may take a while compaired to loading up on signets and going to the proper zone with a hench party and grabbing the skill in 20 minutes. But most of the other unlocks are a LOT faster. I have YET to unlock a 4 or 5 version vampiric handle or string for any weapon. Nor have I unlocked a max hp handle, or a max sundering handle, or a lot of the top things and this has been going on 2 months now. All it will take for you is a couple good sessions of GvG and boom there you go.

Very well put, Red Locust. I agree with the above statement.

The problem seems to be that nobody is in a Guild. If you do PvP, then you should be in a PvP guild. The arenas I find are more of a distraction. I do the arenas when I don't feel like doing anything else. You could also do PvP in the tombs. which gives you more points then the arena.

I swear people are such liars. For months we kept hearing "well if they just make a way to unlock stuff in PvP we'll be happy" They did and the PvPers are whining because they want a UAS/R option. Put some effort into it for goodness sake. Find a guild, PvP in the tournament, the arenas aren't for mass faction gaining. Any idiot should be able to see that. Playing in the arenas is like pub hopping in any other online game. You don't really gain much from it, that's why you join a clan and play on the same servers so you can gain rewards, skill and a sense of how to play with a team.

Haha yeah, even the Europeans are holding the HoH more and more.

Perhaps if the Americans would just shut up about the "I need all skills to win" and actually show some skill instead, this wouldn't have been the case.

Gawd, why are ppl bothered anyways to unlock all skills. Sure certain situation , new trends require you to run new strategy. But more often than not it's just one more skill I need to get, hardly more than that. Most of my old skills are still necessary as I don't build crappy builds. At the most I need 2 new skills in order to beat a new trend.

Sigh... I guess ppl who aren't good would simply blame it on anything they can mwahahaha. Sore losers.

Wrong, Arena is the most fun PvP if you meet the following 2 conditions

1) You have a dumbass guild... or a dead one, ;p
2) You can't find a good PuG in tomb.

The PvP unlock system makes sense, however those who use their PvE characters to PvP are at a slight disadvantage.

As some of your are saying, it is a lot easier to unlock stuff with the faction point system. In which case you can make your PvP character better without having to PvE at all.

Makes sense and all but, think about this -

They are nerfing farming with newer updates. PvPers who made PvE characters for the purpose of farming to unlock goodies for their PvP characters were no longer able to do this. But, now they have this faction point system that complete eliminates the need for them TO farm! But, what of the PvE players who want to do the occasional PvP battle? They will be completely outclassed by characters who didn't have to rely on the luck of the drop to get all the great runes and upgrades.

They simply have to continue what they enjoyed doing. Farmers however... can't continue to do what they enjoyed doing. PvEers will be screwed when they want to PvP against players who have the best possible equipment in the game. PvEers would have to grind until they earn enough gold to buy the equipment they need (which in some cases would be tens of thousands of gold). Even then they have to find the person who just happens to have the exact item you seek.

It won't be long until the PvE players are complaining about how much stronger PvP characters when they fight on another. Don't think I've ever played a game where the patches make the game worst...

Farming in PvE is always going to be luck, you can get a major rune you never unlocked in a purple drop or yet another ninor in that purple armor drop you just send 1 hour to get.

For example, I have yet to see a vampiric upgrade.

Farming is painful, its boring as hell and with henchies we get few drops ... worst is chest farming because now its suicide to go looking for a chest sole since there are mobs guarding then and they drop junk, with henchies they steal the chest drop most of the time so there is no much point.

I really can't see this happening. PvE players have other ways of gaining strength that aren't readily available to PvP players, such as purchasing things and capturing skills. The time PvP only players spend unlocking a certain item or skill will probably balance with the time spent by a PvE player making gold to be able to afford the item they want or capturing/questing skills.

Maybe it's because they enjoy trying new things as opposed to using the same build over and over again?

I don't see what's not hard and monotonous about using the same build over and over even if it's a failed attempt at a good one because you can't get the tools available to fix it. PvE and PvP are miles apart from each other, but A.Net tryed to force them together with all this unlocking crap. People don't like being forced to play hours at a time so that they compete later on, even if the playing for hours at a time is in a part of the game they'd normally like.

And lose the rude bitchy tone... I'm sick of trying to respond in a civil matter to someone who's being an asshole.

The major problem that I see is the lack of skills that are unlocked at the start of the game if you just want to play PvP characters. There isn't enough skills to actually create different templates and with a few exceptions your pretty much stuck with the ones your given.

I don't think an unlock all is the answer but there should be enough skills available to each PvP only class from the start to allow for mixing and matching different templates. Then by the time someone dedicated to PvP exhausts those possibilities they will have enough faction points to gain the other skills so they can try out some more.

I would like to mention what I'm tired of. All the PvE twits acting like this is their game and anyone who doesn't agree with them on how it should be managed should "go away", "shut up", or any of the many, many other flames.

When the world champion New England Patriots were in the superbowl against the Eagles, they switched back and forth between the 4-3 and the 3-4 defense. I'm sure the coach was very happy that he had unlocked the 3-4 defense earlier in the season after capturing it from the Stealers. Most experts would agree that an important key to the Pat's victory was their constant alignment changes, keeping the Eagles off balance. If there had been some arbitrary rule forcing them into a single base set, they MIGHT have won anyway, but considering how close it was I don't like thier chances.

In every sport I played in school, we were always allowed to use EVERY formation, set, allignment, and strategy allowed under the rules. This is the ONLY way to ensure a level playing field.

I'm sure most of you have played chess at some point. Imagine not being allowed to play with a rook until you had unlocked the rook skill doing something totaly unrelated to competitive play. You could still win some games without rooks, but against any half decent opponent it would be pretty embarasing for them to lose to your rookless army.

Sure, every other MMO works the same way, as you PvE tards have never ever gotten tired of pointing out. But as has been pointed out before, this game was advertised as and is still refered as a COMPETITIVE rpg. You cannot ever have fair competition without all involved parties having equal acess to all skills/equipment in the environment.

Until you are willing to pay us back for getting ripped off, I cannot see where you get off telling us to shut up. If ANet were really interested in customer satisfaction, a buyback program would have shut up just about all of us.

Kinda off topic: Well, even real competitions are hardly fair in the way you're describing it. In the real world teams that have more funding, have better equipment, have better coaches, come from better backgrounds, etc all give a advantage. Nothing is truly ever fair.

Also, haven't you already played quite a bit of this game? You really can't return a product you already used for so much and expect full compensation =P Not to mention, the game is based on "skills", maybe just not the definition that you or me wanted. Also, it is a "competitive" game, just maybe not at the level you or me wanted. You can also just not spend very many hours and play "competitively" at the arenas lol, they never stated anything explicitly, so its hardly false advertising.

I totally agree with this thread, i was a farmer before a-net made the change came back cos of pvp because im a duel type person like pvp and pve (im Bigamual) but with this update i think its more grind for people in pvp, i've had team that went 30-0 even 50-0 and we quit after the 50th game (Fake tank was my chars name if you were in my group pm me in game so we can talk ) no reward seems a bit dumb, just move to team arenas, and keep fighting, i think pts should raise after certain amounts consec. wins

My 2 cents

Shot Your Eye 20 R/me
Burning Hemrroid 20 E/me
Big Bong Hit 20 N/w

[QUOTE=Malchiel
Gawd, why are ppl bothered anyways to unlock all skills. Sure certain situation , new trends require you to run new strategy. But more often than not it's just one more skill I need to get, hardly more than that. Most of my old skills are still necessary as I don't build crappy builds. At the most I need 2 new skills in order to beat a new trend.

Sigh... I guess ppl who aren't good would simply blame it on anything they can mwahahaha. Sore losers.[/QUOTE]

And this is perhaps the single greatest obstacle to any mutual understanding. Those of you who PvP with your PvE toons are universaly horrid at PvP. You think your good, because most of you keep to the arena's, and if you can kill someone (anyone) in a PvP match, you must be better than them. If your team gets wiped out quickly, but you managed to kill someone, you will forever believe you have skill. Even if the truth is much more likely that they ignored you to concentrate on the rest of your team.

You only need 1 or 2 new skills to counter a new trend? And how many might you need to design a new trend yourself? How about if team needs requires you to get on a Ranger for a change? Of course, that doesn't fit with your RP concept of the game, so it must not be important.

The makers of this game have often compared it to Magic the Gathering. Can you imagine anyone on the Pro Tour not having 4 copies of every spell available for the environment? The arguement that they could probably counter Stompy with a little creature removal and keep using their solid blue control deck ignores one very important possibility: What if solid black control is suddenly the best way to go?

All of you PvE'ers are satisfied with good enough. You play 2 or 3 toons, and once you get attached to them, you're not likely to change out. What you really want is to force the rest of us down to your skill level, and for the most part you've succeded. PvE toons get several advantages and no disadvantages at all, and still there are no PvE guilds at the top of the ladder. Could it be that your skill level isn't all that after all? Could it be that your lack of understanding as to why anyone would need to unlock everything is a flaw in you, and not us?

With a good team in the random PvP areana it takes about 1:20 to win a battle. That's 14-22 points per battle (If no one drops before being killed and if they have one pet or more for higher ammount). So in 60 minutes you might have around 50 wins = around 700 points, so in 6 hours play you may have enough for two elites.

Is this time saved? Most likely not. Do you get to PvP untill you vomit? Yes.

Are we also forgetting that GvG wins = 200-500 points per win? With a good guild I doubt you'de need to grind too much

How does them adding rewards for PvP make it any differant from when there was no rewards?

Now you can play PvP and unlock stuff without having to play PvE for a longer ammount of time?

Thing I have not noticed stated in many threads posted today and yesterday is any PvEers complaining. Someone who makes a PvE character develops it, plays 100 to 150 hours takes that character into PvP and no matter how much they win they can never use the Faction Bonus to unlock anything for that character.

A PvPer W/Mo can unlock superior vigor, many things for example. If my PvE W/Mo wants superior vigor he will have to buy it 50 plat or find it, LOL.

But you dont see many PvEers complaining much. Its mostly PvPers complaining and I sense soon nobody will listen to them. I say good for the game hopefully will develop a center base where once and finally people hopefully will start tallking about how to play it instead of demanding the game be their game.

UAS/UAR/UAWU is probably not going to happen. Its a moot point. Most of the good guilds and good players know how to get what they want and soon will. Its a moot point. Most have already like me arrived.

Hehe I already invested 200+ hours if you have not to bad. Nobody cares. Practically already everyone has been grinding one way or another these past weeks and has arrived. UAS/UAR/UAWU is moot.

Most grinded through the game and ugly posts and now there is a system for pvp. LOL play the game.

Now good PvPers know and most guilds know, builds and team strategy is what wins. Whether my PvE W/Mo ever gets a sup vigor or not is moot. The fact a PvPer character can is moot too. One way or the other if you want it you can get it.

Only people left complaining now after all these updates are people who dont belong to good guilds are not trying to create a good guild or are busy trying to postulate why? Why cant I just buy the game today and win HOH with a bunch of friends.

If you believe its the skills you dont have then its also because they grinded for them or soon to be unlocked them in PvP. So get to work. Sorry but nobody cares anymore.

You can only take 1 elite into battle, and most superiors are unnecessary. There is nothing really to talk about.

Thats where the problem is, There is no way of telling if its our lacking items holding us back or your playing ability. Why? Because we dont have them.

To say No one cares is a rather selfish responce, Just because you dont care does not mean other players dont see it as an Issue.

i'm trying to look at it from the bright side:
1) it is an improvement to what it was. you get something where you first got nothing
2) it allows for getting that rune or weaponupgrade that you needed. no way i'm going pve to hopefully get that one in a million chance i get the weaponupgrade or rune that i need.

that said, i see the point of the pvp crowd. i think ANet will take it noticed, and will change it. after all, have they not listend to us EVERY single time? granted, they may need some time, but this is a company. Give them a break. Everyone makes mistakes, and i must say that ANet is constantly trying to fix theirs.

my 2 cents,

Makkert

Well a few people consistently posting in these forums might not know it and the constant PvP whiners might not know it but believe me:

Basic Builds + Team Play is 10X more important than you having superior runes or all the elites for your primary profession. Its that simple.

Anyone who has built at least one PvE character and invested 100+ hours of which there are many can within several days collect any elites they want by changing professions and consequently create any 1 elite based built PvP character. Its quickly if not already a non issue.

The only people left complaining are the 10% of PvPers who couldnt be bothered to play at least through the game once over the past 6 weeks.

There obviously not going to do UAS button for it would nullify 75% of the gaming base who are already close if not soon to be ascended characters. Its the first character that allows for the quick collection and multiple development of several PvP only characters.

Like some one pointed out ANet is obviously committed to maintaining the single player game as the jump off point for PvP to some extent although they are lessening it with each update. They have effectively I imagine reached their limit of accommodation.

They are actually very close to creating a interesting hybrid of a game and for most of their fan base UAS is moot. Time has passed.

With more and more of the casual players learning the intricacies of changing professions and capturing elites in PvE and the faction bonus of PvP the developers have created a level of satisfication for the majority of their players.

The expansions will introduce new skills, and items you will need them for PvP and again you will have choice of PvPing for it or PvEing. Nothing will be free. LOL what can you say. Nothing. Either you have been playing the game and understand it or have not but are thinking of clever ways of tearing it down.

Go to Draknors Forge, anywhere high level and ascended characters are and for every one character understand in a week they could each have 2-3 PvP only characters with 1 elite/based builds with all the necessary support skills. Its not as bad as some people try to make it out. UAS is dead.

Long live PvE content, PvP strategy, PvP team builds and all the things that make GW unique. >>

I'm very confused here. Why can't you get the tools to fix your build, or make a new one? It appears to me that there's more options than ever to do exactly that.

Can't we all just get along? Okay, probably not, but it was worth a shot.

Personally, I'm a very big PvEr. Sometimes, I'd rather just do that than PvP all the time, mainly because that's how I've always played MMOs. I've dabbled in PvP with the skills I've unlocked through PvE, and have had a very good time. I consider myself getting better each time I play PvP since when I first started, yeah, I was a complete newbie. I think my timing with distracting shot is getting rather good, though.

Anyway, this patch is a good addition I think. It lets me get rewarded for playing PvP whenever I just want to go to the arenas. However, I do see one big thing. After half an hour playing, I had only gotten like, 110 points. I agree with a few people that it will take a very long time to unlock anything this way. Yet, I still don't mind. Of course, I'm one of the ones who enjoy this 'grind' people keep complaining about. Maybe if some of you played during the time spent on GWG, you'd unlock more? I dunno. It's worth a shot, right? With the new way to capture elites, I've unlocked almost every skill for the warrior except for a few elites, and my warrior hasn't even completed the game yet...and why is that? Because I just play, and enjoy myself.

This is cham (thread starter)

Ok first off i wasn't saying it's not a good ideal to have a way to unlock skills/runes. I am trying to state that it takes a great deal of time to do this (which this game is suppose to reward skills and not endless hours of trying to attain something so u might can play at the same lv as others that have way to much time on there hands).


First off pvp and pve are linked, was very linked before the update due to the fact u were forced to pve to unlock skills/runes.

Even with the new PvP reward system, it still FORCES u to have a pve chacter.

Simple fact - no way to collect on the reward unless u have played pve; due to the fact u have to talk to the guy in pve mode and not pvp mode.

Ok, now there is a screen when u want to make a chacter; it says "pve", or "pvp".

As stated by someone else in this thread, you should get rewared more for more consecutive wins; and the price on the runes/skills should be lowerd.

You can cap each skill/buy faster then u can pvp to get the points.

Only thing the pvp allows u to do is weapon upgrades/runes; but that takes a long time as is.


So to end it, its a great step forward into it; but still will take to long.

I do love the updates, and this is the first game that iv'e seen implemnt patch's very quickly and effeinctly and no server down times. Just asking for a little improvment on what has been put in. Thx.

BTW put in a way for pvp only chacters to cash in there rewards; some people MAY actually want to buy the game and never beat the game and only fight real players. Go figure :P.

Look these posts, and the supporters of thse posts have repeatedly stated persistent world MMORPGS, even competitive ones, are not for them.

If you cant stand unlocking thats your problem, everyone is getting sick and tired of the numerous excuses and whines about people finding the game unfair or whatever, and its about time this crap ended.

Hmmm and name a single online RTS apart from the Total War Series where players dont have to unlock abilities or units?

Think of Homeworld 2, C&C, think of RoN, think of Star Trek Armada, in fact think of EVERY none FPS player versus player game in EXISTANCE, then tell me one which doesnt require the unlocking of things.

You talk CRAP.