**Spoiler Alert**
was anyone else extremely dissapointed by their Doppleganger? I mean you work all the way through pre-sear as a nobody...understanding nothing of the world. You pass through the academy and take on your rightful place as savior to the Ascalon people....you reach Yaks Bend and eventually Lions Arch and you complete the toughest quest in the game (Villainy of Galrath)...-STORY SPOILER- you become a member of the White Mantle....and then find out the Mantle is evil....you accept your duty to ascend and take on the evils of the world....
then you fight your doppleganger and it takes 23 seconds to pwn him and the only thing he does throughout the entire course of the battle is heal you for +4 +4....
Sad to say that this game has been ruined by the fact that a 4 yr old could effectively play it....
<3 GW...let's just hope the expansion makes the game a tad more difficult.
Doopleganger = Dissapointment?
Algren Cole
Sledge
From what I read your one of the fortunate ones. There are a good amount of players who have an amazingly hard time with thier mirror fight.
Seems certain professions have a harder time than others, monks mostly from the forums.
I have not done it yet, but from what I read, as a W/R, I won't have too hard a time. I didn't during beta so I probably won't this time round either.
Heh, I am so much the casual gamer. I think I post more than play, lol, very sad.
EDITED for abismal spelling lol
Seems certain professions have a harder time than others, monks mostly from the forums.
I have not done it yet, but from what I read, as a W/R, I won't have too hard a time. I didn't during beta so I probably won't this time round either.
Heh, I am so much the casual gamer. I think I post more than play, lol, very sad.
EDITED for abismal spelling lol
Aniewiel
Mine died very quickly as well. I'll tell you what disappointed me more than the rapid death: My mirror didn't even LOOK like me and it was using a bow? What is that all about? I'm a Me/Mo that wears purple with nicely styled hair and a VERY scary stick and mask. Pfft... 
arnansnow
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Originally Posted by Algren Cole
**Spoiler Alert**
was anyone else extremely dissapointed by their Doppleganger? I mean you work all the way through pre-sear as a nobody...understanding nothing of the world. You pass through the academy and take on your rightful place as savior to the Ascalon people....you reach Yaks Bend and eventually Lions Arch and you complete the toughest quest in the game (Villainy of Galrath)...-STORY SPOILER- you become a member of the White Mantle....and then find out the Mantle is evil....you accept your duty to ascend and take on the evils of the world.... then you fight your doppleganger and it takes 23 seconds to pwn him and the only thing he does throughout the entire course of the battle is heal you for +4 +4.... Sad to say that this game has been ruined by the fact that a 4 yr old could effectively play it.... <3 GW...let's just hope the expansion makes the game a tad more difficult. |
Just so you know, Villany of Galrath isn't even close to the toughest quest in the game. And the mirror is easy if you know good strategies, but if you knew nothing about him, it would be harder.
If you want to do harder stuff, go to Fow or Uw.
Zuggy
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Originally Posted by Sledge
I didn't during beta so I probably won't this time round either.
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I have done it with a monk and a ranger. My ranger took me over 15 tries to kill it, trying to find the right combo of skills and such.
The monk I killed it the first time with symbol of wrath, retribution and holy wrath.
Epinephrine
I agree that the doppelganger is far too easy - I can't imagine how you could fail going in prepared. If it were a complete surprise there are many builds that would have a hard time with it (monk primaries for example) but the fact is that it's not hard to beat if you set your skills first. Rather unchallenging - as a warrior it's less effective than you (especially as it doesn't time things as well), as a necromancer it'll sacrifice itself to death, as a mesmer you can beat it with your eyes closed, the ranger can rely on it using rituals for an edge and can interrupt its only heal with distracting shot, and sucker it into using distracting shot on something wimpy, the elementalists simply have to move out of the doppel's area attacks, it's too dumb to do the same, and the monks can equip wasteful enchantments to use up its energy and simply allow it to beat itself to death on a retribution while hooking heals through divine favour. And that's without even bothering to look at your secondary. With a secondary you just combine the elements of both - Necro monk? Load up on useless monk enchantments, take rend enchantments, Insidious parasite and a few sacrifice skills (use awaken the blood, he sacrifices 50% more...) He'll nuke himself nicely by rending your enchantments off, waste energy putting them up himself, sacrifice himself mostly to death and finish himself off on your insidious parasite. It's elementary.
Algren Cole
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Originally Posted by Aniewiel
Mine died very quickly as well. I'll tell you what disappointed me more than the rapid death: My mirror didn't even LOOK like me and it was using a bow? What is that all about? I'm a Me/Mo that wears purple with nicely styled hair and a VERY scary stick and mask. Pfft...
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that's because Doppleganger isn't your mirror....
arnansnow: The only thing I knew about my doppleganger is that he *SHOULD* mimic my build, my health/energy, and the skills I had equipped....that was enough to slaughter him(which is everything you can learn about your doppleganger through paying attention to the game). Villainy is the toughest quest up to the doppleganger...I've nver been to FoW/UW. I'm waiting until I have nothing else to do with the game.
epinephrine: I'm a R/W(though I have completely ignored my secondary since i got it)....and I literally just clicked on the doppleganger and then sat there and plunked him for 20-28 dmg while he healed me...
Aniewiel
Pfft...I still wish it looked like me. 
I guess I just need(ed) to learn the correct vernacular: doppleganger vs. mirror
If it's a mirror, it should look like you. If it's a crappy doppleganger, who cares.
I guess I just need(ed) to learn the correct vernacular: doppleganger vs. mirror
If it's a mirror, it should look like you. If it's a crappy doppleganger, who cares.
arnansnow
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Originally Posted by Algren Cole
that's because Doppleganger isn't your mirror....
arnansnow: The only thing I knew about my doppleganger is that he *SHOULD* mimic my build, my health/energy, and the skills I had equipped....that was enough to slaughter him(which is everything you can learn about your doppleganger through paying attention to the game). Villainy is the toughest quest up to the doppleganger...I've nver been to FoW/UW. I'm waiting until I have nothing else to do with the game. |
arnansnow
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Originally Posted by Aniewiel
Pfft...I still wish it looked like me.
I guess I just need(ed) to learn the correct vernacular: doppleganger vs. mirror If it's a mirror, it should look like you. If it's a crappy doppleganger, who cares. |
Algren Cole
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Originally Posted by arnansnow
I am talking about knowing NOTHING about the mirror. nothing at all, not knowing that he has your skills, nothing.
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arnansnow
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Originally Posted by Algren Cole
that would require that you didn't pay attention to the game at all...nor felt the need to figure out what a doppleganger was. ignorance doesn't make games difficult.
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Aniewiel
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Originally Posted by arnansnow
I use the word Mirror because Doppleganger is harder to type.
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You are 100% correct about that one. 
You also can't type DP since everyone will think you're talking about the death penalty.
Darksci
Mirror isn't meant to look like or act like you.
When i used my Monk against the Mirror. It was the MIRROR of me.
It was the exact OPPOSITE of me (what a mirror is).
I was there with my scar armor, and healing staff.
He was there with full metal armor, and chaos axe and bow.
To me - thats a good mirror. Because generally most monk wouldn't be using swords and bows now would they?
To me it seemed perfectly fine. Unfortunely because he was the exact opposite of me, i had a really annoying time trying to beat him lol.
In the end, i found the only way to kill him was to stop him doing what he wanted. So i used sourge heal, so he never healed. Then i use zealots fire and divine boon to kill him.
(of course i had to adjust all my attributes to smiting to achieve this).
When i used my Monk against the Mirror. It was the MIRROR of me.
It was the exact OPPOSITE of me (what a mirror is).
I was there with my scar armor, and healing staff.
He was there with full metal armor, and chaos axe and bow.
To me - thats a good mirror. Because generally most monk wouldn't be using swords and bows now would they?
To me it seemed perfectly fine. Unfortunely because he was the exact opposite of me, i had a really annoying time trying to beat him lol.
In the end, i found the only way to kill him was to stop him doing what he wanted. So i used sourge heal, so he never healed. Then i use zealots fire and divine boon to kill him.
(of course i had to adjust all my attributes to smiting to achieve this).
Algren Cole
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Originally Posted by arnansnow
It wouldn't require you to be oblivious to the game, just to be oblivious to what people say in forums, or in local chat.
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I don't read anything on the forums that might spoil the game for the future....I just happened to know what a Doppleganger is...and they elude to the fact that you'd be fighting "yourself" before you could ascend...one would only need to play any number of other RPG titles out there to have seen this one coming. it was the most predictable part of the storyline(which is weak to begin with)...and even if I hadn't known what a doppleganger is I could quite easily go look it up and figure out exactly how he/she would have acted in battle.
if it takes you more than 2 tries to beat your doppleganger you need to start thinking while you play.
Algren Cole
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Originally Posted by Darksci
Mirror isn't meant to look like or act like you.
When i used my Monk against the Mirror. It was the MIRROR of me. It was the exact OPPOSITE of me (what a mirror is). I was there with my scar armor, and healing staff. He was there with full metal armor, and chaos axe and bow. To me - thats a good mirror. Because generally most monk wouldn't be using swords and bows now would they? To me it seemed perfectly fine. Unfortunely because he was the exact opposite of me, i had a really annoying time trying to beat him lol. In the end, i found the only way to kill him was to stop him doing what he wanted. So i used sourge heal, so he never healed. Then i use zealots fire and divine boon to kill him. (of course i had to adjust all my attributes to smiting to achieve this). |
that's actually a very very good post....and also a very good insight into the Mirror Self....but a doppleganger is not a mirror self....
arnansnow
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Originally Posted by Algren Cole
I don't read anything on the forums that might spoil the game for the future....I just happened to know what a Doppleganger is...and they elude to the fact that you'd be fighting "yourself" before you could ascend...one would only need to play any number of other RPG titles out there to have seen this one coming. it was the most predictable part of the storyline(which is weak to begin with)...and even if I hadn't known what a doppleganger is I could quite easily go look it up and figure out exactly how he/she would have acted in battle.
if it takes you more than 2 tries to beat your doppleganger you need to start thinking while you play. |
While you say the mirror was easy, why are there a huge amount of posts asking for help against the mirror, and lots of people in Augury Rock ask for help against the mirror. So you knew what a doppleganger was, and was smart enough to know how to beat it. good for you.
Aniewiel
Main Entry: dop·pel·gäng·er
Variant(s): or dop·pel·gang·er /'dä-p&l-"ga[ng]-&r, -"ge[ng]-, "dä-p&l-'/
Function: noun
Etymology: German Doppelgänger, from doppel- double + -gänger goer
1 : a ghostly counterpart of a living person
2 a : DOUBLE 2a b : ALTER EGO b c : a person who has the same name as another
Interesting definitions, don't you think? Got these from Merriam-Webster online. The word sounds eerily like one's 'mirror' image but not precisely.
Variant(s): or dop·pel·gang·er /'dä-p&l-"ga[ng]-&r, -"ge[ng]-, "dä-p&l-'/
Function: noun
Etymology: German Doppelgänger, from doppel- double + -gänger goer
1 : a ghostly counterpart of a living person
2 a : DOUBLE 2a b : ALTER EGO b c : a person who has the same name as another
Interesting definitions, don't you think? Got these from Merriam-Webster online. The word sounds eerily like one's 'mirror' image but not precisely.
Algren Cole
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Originally Posted by Aniewiel
Main Entry: dop·pel·gäng·er
Variant(s): or dop·pel·gang·er /'dä-p&l-"ga[ng]-&r, -"ge[ng]-, "dä-p&l-'/ Function: noun Etymology: German Doppelgänger, from doppel- double + -gänger goer 1 : a ghostly counterpart of a living person 2 a : DOUBLE 2a b : ALTER EGO b c : a person who has the same name as another Interesting definitions, don't you think? Got these from Merriam-Webster online. The word sounds eerily like one's 'mirror' image but not precisely. |
doppleganger means "double walker". a doppelganger is a shadow-self that accompanies every human. it's a german word used to describe ones shadow...and why it's always 'lurking' behind you. everyones doppleganger should be wearing dark armor and their face should be shadowed.
Sekkira
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Originally Posted by Algren Cole
if it takes you more than 2 tries to beat your doppleganger you need to start thinking while you play.
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Personally I really don't see a way to defeat it with your specs in blood/death/illusion magic.
Algren Cole
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Originally Posted by Sekkira
I knew about this with my alt N/Me, prepared for it, got the skills I thought would work and prompltly defeated it the first time. AFTER I died. I then set up some different skills and done even worse. It wasn't until after I respecced my entire character and just put some hexes on him so when he attacked, he'd hurt himself while I had price of failure and could dodge most of the attacks that I won. I just sat there and didn't attack, letting him kill himself off. And even then it took some practice with the completely new setup.
Personally I really don't see a way to defeat it with your specs in blood/death/illusion magic. |
maybe the ranger doppleganger is the only one that's a joke...I'll have to fight him again with another character to find out. Though I didn't expect the final test of ascension to take 23 seconds....I was hoping for something a little more difficult.
Sekkira
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Originally Posted by Algren Cole
maybe the ranger doppleganger is the only one that's a joke...I'll have to fight him again with another character to find out. Though I didn't expect the final test of ascension to take 23 seconds....I was hoping for something a little more difficult.
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ManadartheHealer
Doppleganger is -very- easy with monk
I think that fighting Doppleganger should be much, much harder. It should last a solid half hour (or perhaps less ), and it should be harder than just "load up on certain skills, go and kill in 5 seconds, win"
With my monk (first character ascended), I got doppleganger 3rd try (first try I just wanted to see what he was, second I equipped the wrong skills).
There are missions in the desert that are much harder (comparatively). Why is this?
I think that fighting Doppleganger should be much, much harder. It should last a solid half hour (or perhaps less
), and it should be harder than just "load up on certain skills, go and kill in 5 seconds, win"With my monk (first character ascended), I got doppleganger 3rd try (first try I just wanted to see what he was, second I equipped the wrong skills).
There are missions in the desert that are much harder (comparatively). Why is this?
arnansnow
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Originally Posted by ManadartheHealer
Doppleganger is -very- easy with monk
I think that fighting Doppleganger should be much, much harder. It should last a solid half hour (or perhaps less ), and it should be harder than just "load up on certain skills, go and kill in 5 seconds, win"With my monk (first character ascended), I got doppleganger 3rd try (first try I just wanted to see what he was, second I equipped the wrong skills). There are missions in the desert that are much harder (comparatively). Why is this? |
The mirror isn't the true challenge of the desert. The three missions before are. Do you know why the mirror is easy? No stupid teammates to mess it up, unlike the missions before it.
Algren Cole
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Originally Posted by ManadartheHealer
Doppleganger is -very- easy with monk
I think that fighting Doppleganger should be much, much harder. It should last a solid half hour (or perhaps less ), and it should be harder than just "load up on certain skills, go and kill in 5 seconds, win"With my monk (first character ascended), I got doppleganger 3rd try (first try I just wanted to see what he was, second I equipped the wrong skills). There are missions in the desert that are much harder (comparatively). Why is this? |
arnansnow: the missions in the desert aren't difficult either. The party I was with beat Thirsty River quite easily and did the bonus...we stayed together and beat Dunes without anyone even dying once. We then split up and I went to Elona to find a party...I didn't take any time to screen the members because I was hoping to finish it quickly...our party was wiped out quite quickly...I went back to the outpost put in 15 minutes to screen members for effectiveness....went in and beat Elona in about 25 minutes. The entire Ascension process took about an hour and a half....that's too quick.
**SPOILER**DON'T READ IF YOU DON'T WANT TO KNOW HOW I BEAT THE DOPPLEGANGER*********
I literally equiped dust trap, barbed trap, winter, otyugs cry, and 4 spirits...then dropped my wilderness survival down to 0 and sat there and plunked him with arrows 20 times while he set traps and casted spirits.
Aniewiel
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Originally Posted by arnansnow
The mirror isn't the true challenge of the desert. The three missions before are. Do you know why the mirror is easy? No stupid teammates to mess it up, unlike the missions before it.
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Sekkira
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Originally Posted by Algren Cole
The entire Ascension process took about an hour and a half....that's too quick.
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Algren Cole
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Originally Posted by Sekkira
ROFL! You're the first person I've ever seen to complain about missions being too short XD
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I did spend 50 bucks on the game....I enjoy getting as much as I can for my buck
I enjoy difficult games...Most of the missions thus far have taken less than 45 minutes....the ones that are on the 45 minute mark were the most fun and certainly the most rewarding. I feel no sense of accomplishment beating most of this game.
Mistress Dasha
warrior dopple was a piece of cake..
spoiler
I beat her with frenzy as my only skill equiped.. I just walked up and auto attacked killed her in 12 secs or so...
spoiler
I beat her with frenzy as my only skill equiped.. I just walked up and auto attacked killed her in 12 secs or so...
Algren Cole
ok...I think we can safely assume that unless you're a complete moron the doppelganger is one of the easiest parts of the game....I, for one, think this should be changed...there should be a sense of accomplishment achieved in knowing that you have ascended...yes I know that its a PvE only problem and that this game was meant to be PvP...but ArenaNet marketed this game towards PvE players and they should atleast deliver a little drama...a little excitement.
arnansnow
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Originally Posted by Algren Cole
ok...I think we can safely assume that unless you're a complete moron the doppelganger is one of the easiest parts of the game....I, for one, think this should be changed...there should be a sense of accomplishment achieved in knowing that you have ascended...yes I know that its a PvE only problem and that this game was meant to be PvP...but ArenaNet marketed this game towards PvE players and they should atleast deliver a little drama...a little excitement.
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Aniewiel
True, Arnansnow. My sense accomplishment is broader than each individual missions. There are great missions (any of the three in the desert) and there are sucking missions (escorting that dope Rurik in the pre-release weekends when he'd run ahead of you and die). But the -accomplishment- comes by beating the game overall. Ascending was just the cap on the other five billion missions behind you and the other thousand in front of you.
And, quite frankly, I don't see how it is such an 'easy' game. Yes, it is beatable but I'd venture to say that you spent well less than $1 per hour. If you got 50 hours of enjoyment, you have spent your money well.
And, quite frankly, I don't see how it is such an 'easy' game. Yes, it is beatable but I'd venture to say that you spent well less than $1 per hour. If you got 50 hours of enjoyment, you have spent your money well.
Algren Cole
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Originally Posted by arnansnow
There is a sense of accomplishment, just not for the Mirror, but for beating the missions before the Mirror. Those are the real challenge.
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Sholtar
Ok, sure, if you know how to play the game and use your skills, the Doppelganger isn't very difficult. But what else do you want them to do? He already gets a better weapon and I believe better armor by default. He also gets all your skills. If the AI was better, he would dominate everyone all the time. Since the AI isn't that great, there's one way to beat him that happens to be pretty easy. The thing is, if you can't figure that way out, you're screwed. If you play without reading ahead on forums, like I do, you'll notice that the game is harder. Sure, I still figured out a strategy to beat the Doppelganger after trying two other strategies, but some people wouldn't even figure out how to beat him without looking it up on forums and websites. It's not that he's too easy, it's just that you people all either figured it out quickly or you read about it and found the easy way for your build. When you go against him it's not really a fight, it's more of a puzzle. If you already know the answer, of course it's easy, but if you come at it fresh, it can give a somewhat decent challenge until you find the right skills.
Algren Cole
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Originally Posted by Sholtar
Ok, sure, if you know how to play the game and use your skills, the Doppelganger isn't very difficult. But what else do you want them to do? He already gets a better weapon and I believe better armor by default. He also gets all your skills. If the AI was better, he would dominate everyone all the time. Since the AI isn't that great, there's one way to beat him that happens to be pretty easy. The thing is, if you can't figure that way out, you're screwed. If you play without reading ahead on forums, like I do, you'll notice that the game is harder. Sure, I still figured out a strategy to beat the Doppelganger after trying two other strategies, but some people wouldn't even figure out how to beat him without looking it up on forums and websites. It's not that he's too easy, it's just that you people all either figured it out quickly or you read about it and found the easy way for your build. When you go against him it's not really a fight, it's more of a puzzle. If you already know the answer, of course it's easy, but if you come at it fresh, it can give a somewhat decent challenge until you find the right skills.
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He SHOULD be hard...it's the culmination of your ascension...it shouldn't be easy. If you play the doppleganger once and don't realize that he is using all of the skills you have equipped..you aren't any good at the game and probably shouldn't ascend. I can't think of another game where a major boss takes less than 30 seconds to completely annihilate...I mean my doppleganger was HEALING me...HEALING!
kleps
all it takes is a knowledge of your skills to beat your mirror.
with my w/mo, was a piece of cake. i just hacked the shit out of him with gash and some other skills i dont remember. you can use equivalent skills for axes or hammers, if you have them.
for mo's, its current to carry useless skills along with retribution and healing breeze. let him kill himself while you hack at him and throw in the occasional healing breeze.
for ele's, all i did was carried AoE skills with long cast times. get in the first firestorm because he doesnt really move. dodge his firestorm, then hit him with meteor storm. finish him off with flare.
for rang's, i'll let you know. haven't gotten there yet.
it really doesnt matter if you need to use all your refund points to change up your skills prior to fighting your mirror, because after you beat him, you'll get 50k xp and all 24 refund attribute points back.
with my w/mo, was a piece of cake. i just hacked the shit out of him with gash and some other skills i dont remember. you can use equivalent skills for axes or hammers, if you have them.
for mo's, its current to carry useless skills along with retribution and healing breeze. let him kill himself while you hack at him and throw in the occasional healing breeze.
for ele's, all i did was carried AoE skills with long cast times. get in the first firestorm because he doesnt really move. dodge his firestorm, then hit him with meteor storm. finish him off with flare.
for rang's, i'll let you know. haven't gotten there yet.
it really doesnt matter if you need to use all your refund points to change up your skills prior to fighting your mirror, because after you beat him, you'll get 50k xp and all 24 refund attribute points back.
Aniewiel
Thing is, ascending isn't the end of the game. I never looked at my doppelganger as a 'major' ending boss.
A) It isn't the end of the game.
B) Ascending and facing your doppelganger is more akin to a 'religious' experience rather than a physical one. You are facing your own strengths and weaknesses. You must defeat the idea of -self- in order to ascend and be able to finish the rest of the game. The rest of the game, while 'beatable' with henchies, pretty much requires team play rather than the solo experience....much moreso than in the earlier levels/quests of the game.
One's character must defeat itself, essentially slaying the idea/concept of self in order to go on to defeat world domination of evil.
*considers the esotericness of this thought, OHMs a few times while sitting in the lotus position*
A) It isn't the end of the game.
B) Ascending and facing your doppelganger is more akin to a 'religious' experience rather than a physical one. You are facing your own strengths and weaknesses. You must defeat the idea of -self- in order to ascend and be able to finish the rest of the game. The rest of the game, while 'beatable' with henchies, pretty much requires team play rather than the solo experience....much moreso than in the earlier levels/quests of the game.
One's character must defeat itself, essentially slaying the idea/concept of self in order to go on to defeat world domination of evil.
*considers the esotericness of this thought, OHMs a few times while sitting in the lotus position*
Drakron
No, its not ...
Meeting Glint IS the culmination of ascension and that mission is not easy.
Meeting Glint IS the culmination of ascension and that mission is not easy.
Algren Cole
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Originally Posted by Aniewiel
Thing is, ascending isn't the end of the game. I never looked at my doppelganger as a 'major' ending boss.
A) It isn't the end of the game. B) Ascending and facing your doppelganger is more akin to a 'religious' experience rather than a physical one. You are facing your own strengths and weaknesses. You must defeat the idea of -self- in order to ascend and be able to finish the rest of the game. The rest of the game, while 'beatable' with henchies, pretty much requires team play rather than the solo experience....much moreso than in the earlier levels/quests of the game. One's character must defeat itself, essentially slaying the idea/concept of self in order to go on to defeat world domination of evil. *considers the esotericness of this thought, OHMs a few times while sitting in the lotus position* |
and that shouldn't be a struggle?
Drakron: According to the game doppleganger is the culmination...regardless fo what you want to believe.
Mistress Dasha
aye Glint is the end of that and was he a bugger to kill.. first time didnt know about his hibernation second time we went prepared and nabed him.