Paying full price for a game you only half enjoy...

plasmasword

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Sep 2005

Should the price of GW:Factions be what it is or should they cut the price in half? As soon as you start playing in cantha, you will need to choose a side thereby forcing you to only expirience the game from one point of view. If quests and missions are different for each side of the war, then you will be paying full price for a game you will only get to half enjoy. In the first GW there was quests that gave you skills as rewards, but if the quests will be different on each side then will that mean you will only be able to unlock half the skills through pve?

Laibeus Lord

Laibeus Lord

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2005

Philippines

Holy Order of the Light [HOL / Holy Order]

R/N

You can play both sides. Though you will have to go to your side's town to enjoy the NPCs coz your enemy's NPCs will not talk to you.

Oh, as of FPE, be sure your own faction's faction points is greater than your enemy's faction points, coz a bug (or maybe not a bug) will reset both factions 'friendship' status to you ^_^

Studio Ghibli

Studio Ghibli

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2005

Gaelic Storm

If I were a Luxon, while the Kurzick NPCs would not talk to me, would I still be able to take Kurzick quests?

Savio

Savio

Teenager with attitude

Join Date: Jul 2005

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Studio Ghibli
If I were a Luxon, while the Kurzick NPCs would not talk to me, would I still be able to take Kurzick quests?
As far as the FPE shows, yes you can.

Renegade ++RIP++

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Feb 2006

you'll have to drop your luxon faction below your kurzich faction to be able to do quests. Ether by keeping a kurzich quest on standbye or doing a couple of pvevp missions for the kurzich.

Although never really checked though sinc ei always had a couple quests on standbye.

Dav85

Dav85

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jan 2006

choosing to be allied with luxon or kurzick does not change anything in the gaming experience. u can reach all cities and do all quests.
the only thing u have to do is go to a city ruled by your side to buy/sell from merchants and traders. that's it

WasAGuest

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2006

Quests are attainable by anyone no matter the faction, at least from what we saw in the FPE. Missions will be a different issue though. Those missions are rumored to have the best drops and best challenges to them.
You'll have to be in the controlling alliance to gain access to those.

Page three of interview with Jeff Strain

So it seems elite content and end game content will be for the most part locked out unless you are in a faction point farming alliance. Hopefully, that will change before the release.

wolfe2dale

wolfe2dale

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Feb 2006

Hemel Hempstead

Guildless...

E/Me

This is a silly thread that makes no sense...someone close it.

Anarki

Anarki

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Dec 2005

Sweden

Almost Famous

W/N

This is not a silly thread and it surely makes sense and points out to a problem that should be looked at.
So far in Prophecies you could enter FoW/UW as long as your side had favor, and everyone could fight for it.
If alliance holds missions not letting other players access it would seriously ruin this game economy, leaving only those leading alliance have access to best drops which would put prices sky high.
Not to mention me and thousand other players being pissed off at not being able to access those missions just because clans we are in are not top.

Snowman

Snowman

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Apr 2005

Wales, UK

Devils Scorpions

W/E

Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfe2dale
This is a silly thread that makes no sense...someone close it.
I'll second that...

This is one of those idiots I referd to in another post.

fiery

fiery

Banned

Join Date: Oct 2005

maryland

InYurFace Gaming [IYF]

R/

Um no, I bet many people would have got confused to stick to ONE side and never venture into the other. Yes you can travel between kurzick or luxon, does'nt matter if your guild picked either one.

antialias02

antialias02

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2005

Eastern Iowa

Forsaken Wanderers [FW]

Me/E

You don't see Blizzard charging half price to someone who only has Horde or Alliance characters, do you?

The idea is preposterous.

KvanCetre

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2005

The Madison Scouts

E/Mo

Quote:
Originally Posted by antialias02
You don't see Blizzard charging half price to someone who only has Horde or Alliance characters, do you?

The idea is preposterous.
Quoted for Truth

boxterduke

boxterduke

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2005

Walking the ruins of Ascalon

DVDF

Me/

I think Anet should make it more obvious on how to play the game.
Lots of people get confused, and lots of them do not even read the manual.
Now I know the the FPE did not come with a manual but there is an alarming number of people that think they are locked from one side when choosing the other.

As others said you can play for both sides.
Here is what I'm planning (and others I know) to do when the game is out.
Pick a side, do all the quests for it and then get all the armor/quests etc from it.
Once done then go to the other side and do the same.
The thing I care about most is armor since I want to be able to craft armor from both sides. So after done one side, just go to the other.

EternalTempest

EternalTempest

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2005

United States

Dark Side Ofthe Moon [DSM]

E/

Quote:
Originally Posted by boxterduke
I think Anet should make it more obvious on how to play the game.
Lots of people get confused, and lots of them do not even read the manual.
Now I know the the FPE did not come with a manual but there is an alarming number of people that think they are locked from one side when choosing the other.

As others said you can play for both sides.
Here is what I'm planning (and others I know) to do when the game is out.
Pick a side, do all the quests for it and then get all the armor/quests etc from it.
Once done then go to the other side and do the same.
The thing I care about most is armor since I want to be able to craft armor from both sides. So after done one side, just go to the other.
I'm planning on the same thing. Take my one character from C1 choosing a side till the end of the game. Then take my other character from C1 then going to the other side.

Dove_Song

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Mar 2006

The seems game is more like Final Fantasy 11 Online....your not blocked from entering places or taking quests regardless of who your allied with.

The only thing that is "Fluid" is which faction controls which areas....So keep in mind just because an area is "in" the Luxon side of the game doesn't mean the Luxons always have "controle" of it. It is not like World of Warcraft where the towns are set in stone as to who controles them.

During the Preview you could see how much hold each faction had over an outpost by clicking on it as if to travel there.

I *assume* through interviews and what-not , that the combinded PvP and PVE missions done for an area, and which faction is most successful in that endevor will maintain hold of the area.

Apparently in order to get certain elite missions your faction must be in controle of a certain area. This is no differnt from the current system of having to have favor with the Gods in order to enter the UW etc. Except instead of by location on a real wolrd map it is by Faction.

"But I am on the other side what if I never get to do those elite missions!"

you've got two options:

1. Gather some buddies up and GO KICK BUTT and take your friggin area back!
2. Go gather Faction with the other side through repeatable quests and missions, and be a traitor....at least till you change back.

Renegade ++RIP++

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Feb 2006

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dove_Song
The seems game is more like Final Fantasy 11 Online....your not blocked from entering places or taking quests regardless of who your allied with.

The only thing that is "Fluid" is which faction controls which areas....So keep in mind just because an area is "in" the Luxon side of the game doesn't mean the Luxons always have "controle" of it. It is not like World of Warcraft where the towns are set in stone as to who controles them.

During the Preview you could see how much hold each faction had over an outpost by clicking on it as if to travel there.

I *assume* through interviews and what-not , that the combinded PvP and PVE missions done for an area, and which faction is most successful in that endevor will maintain hold of the area.

Apparently in order to get certain elite missions your faction must be in controle of a certain area. This is no differnt from the current system of having to have favor with the Gods in order to enter the UW etc. Except instead of by location on a real wolrd map it is by Faction.

"But I am on the other side what if I never get to do those elite missions!"

you've got two options:

1. Gather some buddies up and GO KICK BUTT and take your friggin area back!
2. Go gather Faction with the other side through repeatable quests and missions, and be a traitor....at least till you change back.
dove song the point is not that you have to be LUXON or KURZICH to get access to this elitecontent. But that you have to be a member of alliance Pwn since they have combined 2 top 10 pvp guilds and 1 full out manic pve-farm guild (in case of an alliance being maxsized at 3 guilds) and are dominating together with 10 more alliances the entire map. Pvp decides the movement of a line while faction decides the controll of an outpost. So in the end it means that a lot of the smaller guilds will never be able to contest for these outposts with elite content and therefore will never have access to it. Which imho should not be the case. Even in the system we have now everybody has on occasion the chance to go to to the elite places. And on top of that Anet added a couple more 'elite' zones that aren't locked off to a limitted number of people because they wanted to give everybody a chance to contend... you know the skill over time spend debacle which in my opinion has gone all out of the window with the mechanics of faction.

Kali Ma

Kali Ma

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2005

N/Mo

I posted this in another thread, but can see that it needs to be added here as well...

The following is a direct quote from Gaile Gray which was posted in Marketplace D1 on 3/24 of the FPE:

"No, you cannot do quests in an area controlled by another faction. That is why you want to help to gain that control."

Here's the link to the original: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...d.php?t=142804
It's in the first screen capture, toward the bottom.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Studio Ghibli
If I were a Luxon, while the Kurzick NPCs would not talk to me, would I still be able to take Kurzick quests?
According to Gaile's quote above, the answer would be no if those quests were currently within Kurzick controlled territory.

So to clarify:
  • Players cannot do quests within the opposing Faction's territory.
  • NPCs in a territory won't speak or do business with players of the opposing Faction.
  • Elite coop missions are accessible to only those players who are members of a Guild within an Alliance that controls the town where the portals are.

Quote:
Originally Posted by plasmasword
Should the price of GW:Factions be what it is or should they cut the price in half?
Of course not, that's ridiculous. An average movie ticket costs $9 for a two-hour passive experience, and an average single-player $50 CRPG runs between 20 to 50 hours of content these days if we're lucky. GW:Factions is worth the $50, regardless of how they slice it.

Now does that mean it's going to be worth investing one's time and money in? That's really a personal choice.

Kakumei

Kakumei

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2005

Grind is subjective

learn this please

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kali Ma
  • Players cannot do quests within the opposing Faction's territory.
  • NPCs in a territory won't speak or do business with players of the opposing Faction.
  • Elite coop missions are accessible to only those players who are members of a Guild within an Alliance that controls the town where the portals are.
The bolded is blatantly incorrect, at least at the time of the FPE. I did every single Kurzick quest that existed, and then immediately went over and started collecting and doing Luxon quests--didn't quite finish them, but I did do quite a few.

Kali Ma

Kali Ma

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2005

N/Mo

Quote:
I did every single Kurzick quest that existed, and then immediately went over and started collecting and doing Luxon quests
As did I, mostly. However, there were many things about the FPE that were reportedly altered to allow players easy accessibility to all the features. For instance, how one gets into Alliance battles was altered for the event; players started at lvl 20 and were given free max weapons and armor; inventory access and material trading were restricted; and several features were simply disabled.

Whatever one's opinion is, or experience during the FPE, that quote above is from Gaile Gray directly when she was answering questions from players about Factions during the FPE event, and until someone from Anet comes forward and says otherwise, I don't see any reason to doubt what she says. If there's no truth to it, then why would she say it? She Anet's public relations representative, for pete's sake.

I don't see the logic in accepting a quote from Jeff Strain, and then simply disregarding Gaile's.

Mordakai

Mordakai

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Aug 2005

Kyhlo

W/

Regardless, you can always cash in your Faction (for crafting material even), and start at zero to do the other side.

This game is not "split in half", unless you want it to be.

Mandy Memory

Mandy Memory

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Mar 2005

USA

Xen of Sigils [XoO]

W/

You are right, Im paying full price...and half of the game is sissy Kurzicks. Sure Ill play it, BUT I WONT ENJOY IT!

nomed

nomed

Banned

Join Date: Feb 2006

Shouldn't it cost twice as much, because they need to give players of both sides a whole unique game experience?

Woutsie

Woutsie

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jul 2005

Belgium

I bought Factions for 45€, I think thats like 55$ or something. Bit much, but if you see how long you can play Guild Wars... 50$ for a game you can like play, maybe 500 to 1000 hours? That is cheap.

mqstout

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2005

Pittsburgh

"I'm planning on the same thing. Take my one character from C1 choosing a side till the end of the game. Then take my other character from C1 then going to the other side."

Doesn't work. Faction is per-account, not per-character. You'll have to cash in like some people say you can.

"So it seems elite content and end game content will be for the most part locked out unless you are in a faction point farming alliance. Hopefully, that will change before the release."

That is absolutely rediculous. Refer to previous threads that argued at great length that that's an extremely terrible system. Alliances are quite limited -- and they definitely exclude the casual players like the vast majority of Guild Wars players. You might say "casual players would never want this content" but that is not true. Even as it is now, even casual players can occasionally make journeys into FoW/UW. With missions locked by alliance control, that's impossible. Extremely casual players sometimes don't even join guilds, let alone alliances... and moreso alliances that farm faction points.

Phoenix Denfer

Phoenix Denfer

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2005

Homeless since the Charr

Order of Pointed Sticks (OOPS)

Quote:
Originally Posted by nomed
Shouldn't it cost twice as much, because they need to give players of both sides a whole unique game experience?
My thoughts exactly.

I see it as paying to own two games for the price of one.

Don't be so hasty to hate one side over the other. The game trailer shows that it was a champion from each side of the war that defeated Shiro. Something drove those two sides apart, and each will have their own story to tell about it. I'm curious to find out if there will be more then one ending from the two story arcs. We won't know that until we see both sides.

WasAGuest

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2006

Quote:
Originally Posted by mqstout
That is absolutely rediculous. Refer to previous threads that argued at great length that that's an extremely terrible system. Alliances are quite limited -- and they definitely exclude the casual players like the vast majority of Guild Wars players. You might say "casual players would never want this content" but that is not true. Even as it is now, even casual players can occasionally make journeys into FoW/UW. With missions locked by alliance control, that's impossible. Extremely casual players sometimes don't even join guilds, let alone alliances... and moreso alliances that farm faction points.
Yea, that's what I was saying. The system as it is, is a mess and needs to be reworked. Farming for points takes the time of actually being able to play the game's missions for the casual gamer. Hence "Hopefull it will change before release".
I wasn't defending it by any means. My entire guild (but me) could be considered casual players. So, it'll be little old me all alone come release day (if I buy it) because of this mess of a system.
You can even find me being ripped apart in several threads for saying what you just did. lol - Fun times these days in the forum world. Woot!

Lucifer PVP

Lucifer PVP

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Oct 2005

Refuge From Exile [RFE] Refuge-From-Exile.com

W/Mo

-Spoiler-
The Factions portion of gw:Factions (luxon Kurzick)seems a rather small part of the game coming out. If you made it to the only real pve mission during the weekend you would notice they join sides after the mission is over. So half of the game comment seems a little out of bounds. Unless they really changed the structure of the game

Mordakai

Mordakai

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Aug 2005

Kyhlo

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucifer PVP
-Spoiler-
The Factions portion of gw:Factions (luxon Kurzick)seems a rather small part of the game coming out. If you made it to the only real pve mission during the weekend you would notice they join sides after the mission is over. So half of the game comment seems a little out of bounds. Unless they really changed the structure of the game
It depends on what you mean: The Alliance battles seem like they would be a huge part of Factions, after all, those are missions you can play over and over after you've "finished" the PvE portion, to capture towns or whatever little gimmicks Anet puts as rewards.

CKaz

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Feb 2005

Quote:
Originally Posted by antialias02
You don't see Blizzard charging half price to someone who only has Horde or Alliance characters, do you?

The idea is preposterous.
You're also able to play both sides as they have multiple servers.
Here we have one server and all characters share the same guild and faction pool.

I happen to like the [now old] EQ model in this respect, where each character could be in a different guild, had their own side, had their own faction. Oh and hey I was able to play every type of character without being hamstrung - there I had 8 characters per server.

An additional concern of mine not getting a lot of coverage - so I'm ready to try the 'other faction' hardcore but my guild isn't. Guild/Alliance have a faction set. So to go deep with the other side I have to consider finding a new guild? Another reason why all chars, shared guild/faction points, doesn't always pan out. If we had other servers... but we don't.

[And yeah I know EQ had a $10/mo fee, but considering multiple accounts through x chapters is equivalent]

Kali Ma

Kali Ma

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2005

N/Mo

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kali Ma
...and until someone from Anet comes forward and says otherwise, I don't see any reason to doubt what she says.
Wanted to followup that I'd sent a PM to Gaile the other day asking for clarity on her comment about not being able to do quests in opposing territory, and she clarifed that she simply misspoke and was probably tired at the time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kakumei
The bolded is blatantly incorrect...
And that is 100% correct.

Mandy Memory

Mandy Memory

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Mar 2005

USA

Xen of Sigils [XoO]

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mordakai
It depends on what you mean: The Alliance battles seem like they would be a huge part of Factions, after all, those are missions you can play over and over after you've "finished" the PvE portion, to capture towns or whatever little gimmicks Anet puts as rewards.
And HA is the endgame for Prophecies...which is 8 people vs the world...Thats way more hate than half vs half.

Mordakai

Mordakai

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Aug 2005

Kyhlo

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mandy Memory
And HA is the endgame for Prophecies...which is 8 people vs the world...Thats way more hate than half vs half.
By no means was I implying that the Alliance war portion of Factions is limiting... it is a way of extending the game after you've "finished" all the quests. And it should be better than HA.

But I should have been clearer: The Luxon/Kurzick war is only as big a part of Factions as you choose it to be. You have lots of options, including:

1. Just doing one faction at the exclusion of the other.

2. Doing both factions' quests, cashing in points so you can access both Faction's NPCs.

3. Doing both factions, but keeping your points, thus making you an "enemy" (just for the challenge of it!)

4. Joining an Alliance to farm Faction for exclusive content.

5. Shunning all of Alliance Wars, instead just focusing on pure PvE exploration and farming.

6. Some combination of these options!

mqstout

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2005

Pittsburgh

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mordakai
5. Shunning all of Alliance Wars, instead just focusing on pure PvE exploration and farming.
You can't do that when so many of the cities' missions are locked from nearly all of the playerbase and never will be open for most.

xxSilhouette

xxSilhouette

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2006

Lost in the sands of time...

Blood Of Orr [BoO]

R/Rt

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dav85
choosing to be allied with luxon or kurzick does not change anything in the gaming experience. u can reach all cities and do all quests.
the only thing u have to do is go to a city ruled by your side to buy/sell from merchants and traders. that's it
I do have one question myself, Hoping someone will answer it on here...Do the armor merchants for example, sell different types of armor? Like can you only get certain armors depending on your side?

Mordakai

Mordakai

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Aug 2005

Kyhlo

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by mqstout
You can't do that when so many of the cities' missions are locked from nearly all of the playerbase and never will be open for most.
What are you talking about? A few elite mission will be locked, yes, but that won't stop people from farming other areas...

Loviatar

Underworld Spelunker

Join Date: Feb 2005

Quote:
Originally Posted by mqstout
You can't do that when so many of the cities' missions are locked from nearly all of the playerbase and never will be open for most.
how wrong can people be?

MOST?

the missions that are essential to finish the game are not locked period.

you do not have to pvp at all if you dont want to from a PM on that from Alex Weekes

roughly half of everything will be under control of your side to begin with.
that automatically gives you roughly half right there.

YOU CAN SWITCH SIDES WITHOUT LIMIT

gives you the other areas dont it?

only a few elite quests are locked and those are bonus material like the UW on steroids which would insta kill 99.999% of the people yelling i want it.

like the dog who chased a car and bit the bumper as it was moving.

*NOW THAT YOU HAVE IT WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO WITH IT?*

S e X e N ™

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Mar 2006

Team Explicit

W/Mo

honestly i see this in one way, fractions gives you 2 character slots if u have gw original so 6 slots total correct? make one character luxon and other kurzick? or is there flaws in my vision :P lol

Mordakai

Mordakai

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Aug 2005

Kyhlo

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by S e X e N ™
honestly i see this in one way, fractions gives you 2 character slots correct? make one character luxon and other kurzick? or is there flaws in my vision :P lol
Your Faction, like all Faction, is common among all your characters created on a single account. If you make a new character, it will have the same Luxon or Kurzick Faction as all your characters. (Weird, I know).

The only way to accomplsh what you seek is to have two accounts. Sorry.

(Or spend the Faction...)

S e X e N ™

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Mar 2006

Team Explicit

W/Mo

GiR well i have 2 gw accounts might as well have 2 fractions too