Due largely in part to my curiosity (and only partly to my cripplingly horrible bad luck with item drops) I was wondering if anyone had any insight, or possibly an article would be better describing how (or the best theory as to how) the game decides what items drop for who.
It could be paranoia for example that I've noticed less/drastically poorer quality items playing as an order necro for example as opposed to say...a damage dealer. Now, I am aware that an order necro 10 feet away from the battle will get more drops than one 100 feet away...that's not my question.
It seems like the game decides not only quantity of drops, but quality based on some kind of hidden formula. My question is: does anyone have any insight into whether or not attacks/damage spells/enchanting/healing (assuming these activities are done in reasonably close proximity to the battle) are given some kind of priority related to drop quantities and quality?
Now, I KNOW "drop bitching" is a bit of an annoying subject here, which is why I took the time to write a nice, legitamate question. If you want to post back to this with a fast "no ur drops r jsut luck so deel with it kthxbai" or any variant of that, then please do your fingers a favor by not bothering, UNLESS you're going to include some helpful information (ie. an article or source supporting your post - I've searched for one myself with no luck).
Thanks guys.
-Jessyi
Item drop assignments
Jessyi
Maria The Princess
actually i have notived same thing
well first off, it depends on how many people in your party, then on how much the same area is being farmed at the moment. if theres is 70% of all GW gamers farming there, good luck getting something decent... lol
but i have also noticed that i get most good drops only as being monk or a dmg warior. maby game calculates somehow your efficiency to the party.... last time in ToPK, i didnt get no green drops as ranger, but the monk of group got 3 ectos and 2 10k greens! and me NOTHING, and most rangers also got 3k greens...so what youre saying makes sense but i donnow if theres any official stats about it...
well first off, it depends on how many people in your party, then on how much the same area is being farmed at the moment. if theres is 70% of all GW gamers farming there, good luck getting something decent... lol
but i have also noticed that i get most good drops only as being monk or a dmg warior. maby game calculates somehow your efficiency to the party.... last time in ToPK, i didnt get no green drops as ranger, but the monk of group got 3 ectos and 2 10k greens! and me NOTHING, and most rangers also got 3k greens...so what youre saying makes sense but i donnow if theres any official stats about it...
The Unknown Enemy
When I do monk for FoW, I tend to get drops like crazy (good items). I guess it's just that i've always been lucky 
. As for the drops, ANet claims that it is random, but ya...can't always trust them.
. As for the drops, ANet claims that it is random, but ya...can't always trust them.
Silent Kitty
Monk better drops? Yeah, right........
arcanemacabre
You know, I think you are on to something. When I play my MM, it seems that as my army grows, so do my drops, and after a while I tend to get better/more drops than my wife (Interrupt Ranger). Thing is, she also seems to be the luckiest in the long run, since so far she has been the only one to get a Superior Vigor rune and a 20% enchant sword hilt. However, I have unlocked the most upgrades and runes on my account, so I get quantity, she gets quality.
Now keep in mind, this is the entire time we've been playing these two characters (around 250 hours each), very little has changed in our play style, and all in all with my minions I dish out much more damage. I think money-wise it evens up. We both got our 15k at about the same time and have virtually the same amount in storage.
There very well may be a formula, after all, they have a formula for "distance from action" drops, as you pointed out. A formula for effectiveness could be there, and if so, unlikely that it's fair. An orders necro would be a hard thing to account for effectively in a group scenario, as would e-denial. How would it know if your contribution helped defeat said foe if all your doing is eating your foe's energy, or feeding your friends?
Kinda lame if a formula like that exists.
Now keep in mind, this is the entire time we've been playing these two characters (around 250 hours each), very little has changed in our play style, and all in all with my minions I dish out much more damage. I think money-wise it evens up. We both got our 15k at about the same time and have virtually the same amount in storage.
There very well may be a formula, after all, they have a formula for "distance from action" drops, as you pointed out. A formula for effectiveness could be there, and if so, unlikely that it's fair. An orders necro would be a hard thing to account for effectively in a group scenario, as would e-denial. How would it know if your contribution helped defeat said foe if all your doing is eating your foe's energy, or feeding your friends?
Kinda lame if a formula like that exists.
Stealthy Trapper
blah blah blah.......yet another thread about how unlucky someone is about getting drops while ranting about some kind of theory on drop rates and types.
If there was any kind of system to it someone would have figured it out by now. Think about it. This game has been around for about a year now and you have millions and I mean millions of people that are playing it. You have people ranging from punk little computer hacking teenagers to grown men/women with college degrees and a whole life time of wisdom and knowledge under their belts. With that kind of players someone would have figured it out and posted it some where on a forum or in a cheat and hack program. You would have heard about it by now. So far I have been playing everyday since day one and all I have heard of is bot programs and asians getting payed to farm.
A-net has systems about drops sure. They have to or else rares would drop just as much as non rares. However there is no system that you can EXPLOIT or figure out to the point that you can do something else to get better drops. Just let it go and play the game for fun like it was intended.
If there was any kind of system to it someone would have figured it out by now. Think about it. This game has been around for about a year now and you have millions and I mean millions of people that are playing it. You have people ranging from punk little computer hacking teenagers to grown men/women with college degrees and a whole life time of wisdom and knowledge under their belts. With that kind of players someone would have figured it out and posted it some where on a forum or in a cheat and hack program. You would have heard about it by now. So far I have been playing everyday since day one and all I have heard of is bot programs and asians getting payed to farm.
A-net has systems about drops sure. They have to or else rares would drop just as much as non rares. However there is no system that you can EXPLOIT or figure out to the point that you can do something else to get better drops. Just let it go and play the game for fun like it was intended.
Maria The Princess
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Stealthy Trapper
blah blah blah.......yet another thread about how unlucky someone is about getting drops while ranting about some kind of theory on drop rates and types.
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i think that ToPK is the only hight end farming lace where people are happy to see rangers
Loviatar
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Maria The Princess
actually i have notived same thing
well first off, it depends on how many people in your party, then on how much the same area is being farmed at the moment. if theres is 70% of all GW gamers farming there, good luck getting something decent... lol ... |
i cringe under the thought that you could be serious and not joking.in case you were serious (please say no) you have your own instance of that area same as the other 70 % and your instance just for you has the assigned number of random/specified drops
Jessyi
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Stealthy Trapper
blah blah blah.......yet another thread about how unlucky someone is about getting drops while ranting about some kind of theory on drop rates and types.
If there was any kind of system to it someone would have figured it out by now. Think about it. This game has been around for about a year now and you have millions and I mean millions of people that are playing it. You have people ranging from punk little computer hacking teenagers to grown men/women with college degrees and a whole life time of wisdom and knowledge under their belts. With that kind of players someone would have figured it out and posted it some where on a forum or in a cheat and hack program. You would have heard about it by now. So far I have been playing everyday since day one and all I have heard of is bot programs and asians getting payed to farm. A-net has systems about drops sure. They have to or else rares would drop just as much as non rares. However there is no system that you can EXPLOIT or figure out to the point that you can do something else to get better drops. Just let it go and play the game for fun like it was intended. |
I tend to think a lot like you, and I thought long and hard before posting because I know how effective the "spam theory" is at finding all the subtleties of the game design (ie. the 1 Million+ players should have found something by now). Of course, it seems to me that such a pertinent question (this rumor is hardly new) would have yeilded a little documentation by now? I haven't found any and I'm guessing if you have, you'd have posted it. I still hope you're right though.
-Jessyi
NoChance
i think maybe part of it is just that we remember bad runs a lot better than the good ones, so things always seem bad... we always remember the one bad run where everyone else gets tons of goodies and we get only crap because it is unusual and memorable (in a bad way) -- we forget about all runs where we get tons of goodies and some other poor guy gets crap.
i think the example above with arcanemacabre and his wife shows that the drops are pretty fair and random (in terms of overall gold value of drops)
.. of course their example isn't scientific, but at least we are talking about a long time evaluation, as opposed to impression gotten from one run.
as for drops being worse if there are lots of farmers in the area -- i don't believe it... anyone have any REAL evidence for this?
i think the example above with arcanemacabre and his wife shows that the drops are pretty fair and random (in terms of overall gold value of drops)
.. of course their example isn't scientific, but at least we are talking about a long time evaluation, as opposed to impression gotten from one run.
as for drops being worse if there are lots of farmers in the area -- i don't believe it... anyone have any REAL evidence for this?
Maria The Princess
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Originally Posted by Loviatar
i cringe under the thought that you could be serious and not joking.in case you were serious (please say no) you have your own instance of that area same as the other 70 % and your instance just for you has the assigned number of random/specified drops |
Kaelis Ra
One thing I have noticed is that my N/Me almost never gets any decent drops; I could swear when I go out on PvE with a PUG that I get one drop to every three each other player gets, and it's a collectors item. Very frustrating if you see that there are a number of purples and golds on the ground. In stark contrast to this, when I play my pure healing monk, I seem to max my inventory every time I go out within a few minutes. My poor necro can't even half fill his backpack...
It really does make me wonder if there is some weird formula that attempts to judge how deserving of items the participants in a given combat are of any drops; my necro focuses only laying down curses, so it's whack a couple hexes on a monster then move to the next one and let the others finish it off, meaning I don't actually do a lot to a given monster other than make it weaker and easier to bring down. On the other hand, the monk battle participation would have healing as a major factor, and I am extremely trigger-happy with Healing Breeze; often spamming it entirely unneccessarily.
It really does make me wonder if there is some weird formula that attempts to judge how deserving of items the participants in a given combat are of any drops; my necro focuses only laying down curses, so it's whack a couple hexes on a monster then move to the next one and let the others finish it off, meaning I don't actually do a lot to a given monster other than make it weaker and easier to bring down. On the other hand, the monk battle participation would have healing as a major factor, and I am extremely trigger-happy with Healing Breeze; often spamming it entirely unneccessarily.
Angel Develin
I sometimes play as order necro and stay all in the back but get the most ecto or gold items.
I have seen ppl that play or use less in a group get very good items 2 so I think its realy just random and it has to do with luck.
I have seen ppl that play or use less in a group get very good items 2 so I think its realy just random and it has to do with luck.
tuperwho
I've heard all sorts of rumors from damage dealt, to energy spent, to number of skills used, etc. Sadly, I have never seen any proof on any of these ideas. It is supposed to be random, even though it really doesn't seem to be. All I know is when I'm in FoW with my mesmer and dishing out all sorts of damage, hex removal, and energy steals, I barely ever stop casting, and I always am at the front of the good item and shard count. Whatever's causing it, I'm not gonna complain
Loviatar
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Maria The Princess
have you ever woundered why you get great golds and rares more often in areas that not too many people knows about then in areas where most of people farm?
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it has to do with adjustments in the drop table not the number in it.70 % could have been farming Riverside getting 50 runes an hour in each and every instance of Riverside and after the nerf all of them would be getting the new lower drops.
a quote from a much earlier post
Quote:
| Riverside was obviously the most well known and the one I hit first. I was one of the lucky ones that made it there in time to get ahead of the game.. I understand why they nerfed those giants since you could get like 50 runes an hour if you knew what you were doing... But since then I have bounced from farming spot to farming spot only to have them closed within a couple of days at best. |
I Not A Real Doctor
I also seem to have mad luck with FoW on my Monk, I usually bond, so I am away from everyone....
Last 3 trips into fow....
1st trip - Shards-4 rares-Shadowblade req.9
2nd trip - Shards-5 Rares-Choas req. 9
3rd trip - Shards-0 Rares- choas req. 10
3rd trip ended just before we got the book, healing monk left
I have also had mad luck in Oro with my SS necro
Last 3 trips into fow....
1st trip - Shards-4 rares-Shadowblade req.9
2nd trip - Shards-5 Rares-Choas req. 9
3rd trip - Shards-0 Rares- choas req. 10
3rd trip ended just before we got the book, healing monk left
I have also had mad luck in Oro with my SS necro
XeNoGeArZ
It doesn't take millions of players to figure out a system. I would only take a handful if the handful were competent gamers. I've been playing GW since it released late April '05 (reg. May '05 here), and I remember when Elite skills where a bitch to cap.
I got a group of two other fellas and we went out to cap 'Battle Rage' from the Troll Boss outside Drok's, in the Talus Chute cave. We tried everything to make him use the Elite, so that we could use our Capture Sigs, but he never did. The word that was floating around was that you had to drop items on the ground before he would use it, and that just seemed too ludicrous, but we had tried everything and might as well try this, and it wouldn't you know it worked. Someone out there figured this one out.
Drop system is like the casino. Some people like to crack the system to have an advantage. I wish I could find more of those kinds with that zeal, so we can get cracking. I have lots of data that leads to possible theories, and some results might contradict others. The bad part is that they(ANET) could have rotations of different ways items are dropped, assigned, and valued. LF educated, mature peeps!
0XGZ
I got a group of two other fellas and we went out to cap 'Battle Rage' from the Troll Boss outside Drok's, in the Talus Chute cave. We tried everything to make him use the Elite, so that we could use our Capture Sigs, but he never did. The word that was floating around was that you had to drop items on the ground before he would use it, and that just seemed too ludicrous, but we had tried everything and might as well try this, and it wouldn't you know it worked. Someone out there figured this one out.
Drop system is like the casino. Some people like to crack the system to have an advantage. I wish I could find more of those kinds with that zeal, so we can get cracking. I have lots of data that leads to possible theories, and some results might contradict others. The bad part is that they(ANET) could have rotations of different ways items are dropped, assigned, and valued. LF educated, mature peeps!
0XGZ
Stealthy Trapper
The only thing that kills me about threads like this one is that nobody wants to believe the RANDOM theory. They always say things like "so and so gets all the drops when we adventure together" or "so and so didn't get drops because he stayed in the back ground and didn't participate in the fight that much."
Stop and think about what RANDOM really means.
You can do the quest/mission/farm area (you name it) for days and NEVER get a single rare drop. Then some casual gamer that plays once a month comes along and does the same area you do and gets a handful of rares in his first run. Yes the odds are against that ever happening but that scenario still defines the random theory. The casual gamer didn't get more drops for any other reason other than he got lucky and the dice fell his way. Simple as that.
Stop and think about what RANDOM really means.
You can do the quest/mission/farm area (you name it) for days and NEVER get a single rare drop. Then some casual gamer that plays once a month comes along and does the same area you do and gets a handful of rares in his first run. Yes the odds are against that ever happening but that scenario still defines the random theory. The casual gamer didn't get more drops for any other reason other than he got lucky and the dice fell his way. Simple as that.
tuperwho
Oh, and I should also add that there's an eerily strong correlation between my drops in FoW and my success in finding a female mesmer to dance with me (male mesmer) in ToA before leaving. Your guess is as good as mine, but don't knock it 'till you tried it.
Edge Martinez
I believe the random theory. Sometimes drops in ruined tombs are good, sometimes not. I've gone through where the best item I got was a blue raven staff, but then again I've gotten my fair share of Bulwarks. It's all just a crapshoot. I actually felt really good one time when our puller, who did a magnificent job, got an ecto, a black dye, the bulwark and the pillar in one run.
CartmanPT
The explination for bad drops is Here
Kaelis Ra
I agree with it most likely being random (insofar as a computer is random, since everything is based on one algorithm or another anyway), but it doesn't make me feel a great deal better when my necro has been played for 190 hours and I've gotten 4 gold items ever....
Not to be whining or anything eh?
Not to be whining or anything eh?
Maria The Princess
guys.... logicly thinking if you know pc, you must know no program can't do REAL random. especially when it comes to distribution of data to computers linked together (weapons are data, a small program) a program like this must have a data base from which it calculates the distribution, if not the computer cant go ahead and keep working. have you ever tried dividing 0 by 0 on a calculator? what number have you got? same principle here. to assign that small program appeared due to end of functiion of other program (boss killed) the program has to calculate (a+b /c -d=e+fxg) to figure out who this will be assigned for. just know that a program cannot do real random, it can generate it, but its NEVER random.
of curse ANET is not gonna explain all that, becase the program is suposed to generate random, and make sure all players are satisfied with their role in a prty, but its simply impossible only because of the very nature of computer programming.
thats why there IS a system for drops
CartmanPT
Yup it cant be real random but i dont think that there will be something like:
If profession = monk then chance = 40%
If profession = warr then chance = 10%
This is just stupid.
If i go to a place and someone also come in the same conditions we have the same chance to get the drop.
There are a lot of theorys with names of characters, professions, experience, etc...
For me its all BS. There´s the anti farm code, if u dont trigger it the chance is = to everyone.
Just my 2 cents
If profession = monk then chance = 40%
If profession = warr then chance = 10%
This is just stupid.
If i go to a place and someone also come in the same conditions we have the same chance to get the drop.
There are a lot of theorys with names of characters, professions, experience, etc...
For me its all BS. There´s the anti farm code, if u dont trigger it the chance is = to everyone.
Just my 2 cents
Str0b0
Well it's random but according to an equation. I suppose if you were like some sort of freaky Rainman math savant you could figure it all out and perhaps figure out some way to skew the results in your favor. I doubt you could ever figure out the algorithm it uses to determine what drops where, and even if you could there would be no way to exploit it. You could figure out the drop assignment thing but I think exploiting that is as simple as just solo farming.
Maria The Princess
the most reasonable explanation i could think off is efficiency to the party survival/killing/speed? i mean... a 5 man group CAN do it without a bonder in SF, its gonn abe hard, but possible. and imagine with no MM? evry1 will die in 2 minutes... so theres some hint of logic there.... as was said before, for some reason most drops i ever get is being healer. when im a ranger or a mesmer i hardly get whites..lol
Stealthy Trapper
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Maria The Princess
guys.... logicly thinking if you know pc, you must know no program can't do REAL random. especially when it comes to distribution of data to computers linked together (weapons are data, a small program) a program like this must have a data base from which it calculates the distribution, if not the computer cant go ahead and keep working. have you ever tried dividing 0 by 0 on a calculator? what number have you got? same principle here. to assign that small program appeared due to end of functiion of other program (boss killed) the program has to calculate (a+b /c -d=e+fxg) to figure out who this will be assigned for. just know that a program cannot do real random, it can generate it, but its NEVER random. of curse ANET is not gonna explain all that, becase the program is suposed to generate random, and make sure all players are satisfied with their role in a prty, but its simply impossible only because of the very nature of computer programming. thats why there IS a system for drops |
Honestly stated and true to the fact.
However, to go from the thought process of a human mind to the calculations of a pc you have to go from logical to reality.
In reality NO human can calculate numbers and code on the level of a pc so therefore, in REALITY it is as close to random as random can get.
Loviatar
actually it is simple but since it is server side i have no effect.take any place FOW as example
is there some entity that drops each and every time YES/NO
IF YES GO TO DROP TABLE A SELECT DROP
IF NO DETERMINE IF A DROP WILL HAPPEN
do you get a mix of good whites to green from it?
IF YES DROP TABLE A COMES IN TO DETERMINE WHAT WILL DROP
does it have a number in party minus x to determine the number of the party that get a drop?
IF YES RANDOMLY SELECT WHO GETS A DROP AND GO TO DROP TABLE A FOR WHAT DROPS
multiple variations on that basic theme could cover a lot
no loot lucy
and those who haven't sat there watching someone else be randomly "lucky" doesn't seem to get it.
I told this to my husband...let us say that you and a co-worker were working hard on a project. You were told that every hour, a name would be RANDOMLY draw and a bonus envelope given to one worker. One in two odds...random...sounds good and fair doesn't it? Only, every hour for 7 hours, your co-worker's name is pulled by a computer and each envelope yields hundreds of dollars.
Finally, your name is RANDOMLY drawn and your envelope contains $25.
"go ahead, tell me if you'd believe that all of this was RANDOM?"
He stared at me for a moment and said, "someone should check out the computer."
BINGO.
A FAIR method is for anyone receiving any kind of magical item should have his/her name removed from the assigning grid until EVERYONE has had a turn.
I mean if the entire reason for assigning drops is to be FAIR, they need to make sure that the assignee (the code) is fair...otherwise, why even bother assigning?
I told this to my husband...let us say that you and a co-worker were working hard on a project. You were told that every hour, a name would be RANDOMLY draw and a bonus envelope given to one worker. One in two odds...random...sounds good and fair doesn't it? Only, every hour for 7 hours, your co-worker's name is pulled by a computer and each envelope yields hundreds of dollars.
Finally, your name is RANDOMLY drawn and your envelope contains $25.
"go ahead, tell me if you'd believe that all of this was RANDOM?"
He stared at me for a moment and said, "someone should check out the computer."
BINGO.
A FAIR method is for anyone receiving any kind of magical item should have his/her name removed from the assigning grid until EVERYONE has had a turn.
I mean if the entire reason for assigning drops is to be FAIR, they need to make sure that the assignee (the code) is fair...otherwise, why even bother assigning?
Bowstring Badass
Honestly did we really need to bring a 2 yr old thread back?
The drops are fair just go with heroes and hench they dont complain about drops.
The drops are fair just go with heroes and hench they dont complain about drops.
Friday
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Originally Posted by Bowstring Badass
Honestly did we really need to bring a 2 yr old thread back?
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Also, the search function here has a "Random Result Finder"tm that Anet should steal and use as their "random drop assigner" as it works a hell of a lot better!!
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Originally Posted by Bowstring Badass
The drops are fair just go with heroes and hench they dont complain about drops.
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Commander Ryker
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Originally Posted by Maria The Princess
but i have also noticed that i get most good drops only as being monk or a dmg warior. maby game calculates somehow your efficiency to the party....
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So, random is relative or selective or something.
@bowstring: If you're only point is to point out that it's an old thread, then stay out. Trolling is against the rules.
@everyone else: There is another thread just like this in Riverside so I'm closing this.