Guild Wars Guru

Does anyone else wonder what Empathy is doing in the domination line?

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Dave_Spanners
Ascalonian Squire
• #1
Pretty simple really, just what it says in the subject. Mesmers are set up (generally) so that dom is anti-caster and illusion is anti-war/ranger (and now assassin too). I've thought before that it's weird empathy is in dom, and I've just thought it again since I've been trying to make a decent anti-assassin build.

It's just frustrating having to spread my attributes more just to use this spell when everything else I will need is in illusion/inspiration, so I'm just ranting really!
Dragannia
Dragannia
Krytan Explorer
• #2
No attribute is set to a particular counter. Realistically, IMO Clumsiness and Ineptitude should be under Domination, but I can understand why Ineptitude is Illusion (since it sorta Blinds them, and you can't really explain how it Blinds them if it's under Domination). Empathy punishes someone for doing something- it belongs in Domination.
Avarre
Avarre
Bubblegum Patrol
• #3
Empathy dominates the opposing mind, creating an empathic link to them, reflecting the pain that they deal. It directly locks the hex into the enemy body, causing them to take damage when they try to cause it.

Illusion, on the other hand, muddles their mind and makes them err, strike themselves, see phantoms. Illusion also makes the enemy feel the emotional pain that they cause, resulting in SV, remorse, etc.
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Eaimirth Etaivella
Jungle Guide
• #4
Domination hexes also tend to last longer than illusion; so in stating things that have not already been said this is the case for empathy.
Knight of Balthazer
Knight of Balthazer
Ascalonian Squire
• #5
empathy- understanding and entering into another's feelings.

To me I think it belongs in the Dom line.
Manda Panda
Manda Panda
Frost Gate Guardian
• #6
I think empathy in domination makes sense. However, I've always wondered why Spirit Shackles is inspiration
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Maedhros
Academy Page
• #7
well, in a logical point, it does give energy often enough to the caster...inspiration is for gain on health or energy...

~Maedhros
Apoc
Apoc
Lion's Arch Merchant
• #8
Quote: Originally Posted by Manda Panda
However, I've always wondered why Spirit Shackles is inspiration Good question. Spirit Shackles is like Empathy, but you lose Energy instead.

I think it should really be a Dom. skill.
NatalieD
NatalieD
Desert Nomad
• #9
Like others said, it's not that Domination = anticaster and Illusion = antiwarrior. Empathy is a Domination skill because it punishes the target for doing certain things, just like Backfire or Wastrel's Worry.

Spirit Shackles really does look more like a Domination skill... as does Signet of Humility... and Arcane Thievery seems more like Inspiration... well, whatever.
c
calamitykell
Banned
• #10
so shouldn't Ineptitude and Clumsiness be domination, then?
Avarre
Avarre
Bubblegum Patrol
• #11
Both of those create visages that make the enemy fumble. You aren't punishing the enemy, you're tricking them into hurting themselves.
Terra Xin
Terra Xin
Furnace Stoker
• #12
Strange though how mesmers can make you feel like your so clumsy you hurt yourself badly.

The idea behind sympathetic visage is much like spirit shackles and empathy...

This can get confusing...
Avarre
Avarre
Bubblegum Patrol
• #13
SV - A visage is an image... and the foe sees one that he/she is sympathetic too. SV creates a continual illusion that causes a striking foe to see something they are sympathetic to. Example: Axe warrior is hitting mesmer. Mesmer uses SV. Warrior no longer sees enemy, but sees injured suffering woman. All adren and their will to fight is hampered because they feel sympathy and guilt towards what they struck.

It's illusion because you create it around yourself to fool foes.

Clumsiness : You create an illusion around the foe, either by editing their perception of weight, positioning, or whatever else, that causes them to badly stumble and injure themselves trying to attack.

It's illusion because you're creating an illusion to make the enemy hurt himself.

Spirit Shackles :

You're sapping energy whenever the foe tries to attack by opening a channel in their energy. Either by linking it to the Id of the foe, or by barbing it into the energy 'area' of the foe, the hex leeches power out for each attack attempt.

It's inspiration because it preys on energy without directly injuring or effecting the enemy actions, like domination would. It's not illusion because its a binding hex and not an alteration of perception.

Hope that helps a little..
Terra Xin
Terra Xin
Furnace Stoker
• #14
wooooooooooooooooow

I can't say anything else now... Avarre, you have me completely dumbfounded^^
NatalieD
NatalieD
Desert Nomad
• #15
Quote: Originally Posted by Avarre
It's inspiration because it preys on energy without directly injuring or effecting the enemy actions, like domination would. Just like that other Inspiration skill, Signet of Weariness.
Terra Xin
Terra Xin
Furnace Stoker
• #16
oh, question!

how does... most of those skills under inspiration magic aspire to that of being.... inspirational?

Is it self-inspiring?
r
robrobrob
Banned
• #17
I like to think that I know mesmers since my main is one, but Avarre is and always will be the source of all knowledge mesmer.
NatalieD
NatalieD
Desert Nomad
• #18
Avarre is only giving fluff justifications, which aren't terribly helpful and aren't what most of the posts in this thread seem to be about...
Avarre
Avarre
Bubblegum Patrol
• #19
Quote: Originally Posted by NatalieD Avarre is only giving fluff justifications, which aren't terribly helpful and aren't what most of the posts in this thread seem to be about... What's your point. Oh yes, there isn't one, because you don't have an answer. The skill is where it is because of its inclinations.

Quote:
Just like that other Inspiration skill, Signet of Weariness. Weariness rips energy away, whereas things like energy tap draw and magnify it to you. Shackles is inspiration because the hex is causing the enemy to lose energy, the enemy mesmer isn't forcing it. It's the question of spell attitude and aggression, which are much easier to understand if you can examine and explain spells in an RP sense.


Inspiration spells are those that deal with the channeling of energy - into elemental shields, away from enemies to you, draining or gaining. Of all mesmer skill lines, it is the least aggressive, not one of the skills in insp cause damage. The soft manipulation, either by granting yourself energy (inspiring) or draining from enemies (discouraging their spirit) is what characterizes the skills.

Domination on the other hand is the most aggressive, the energy draining skills found here are powered by using a spark of energy to ignite enemy energy pools, or by ripping it away. Again, its a question of attitude.
d3kst3r
d3kst3r
Krytan Explorer
• #20
Quote: Originally Posted by Avarre
SV - A visage is an image... and the foe sees one that he/she is sympathetic too. SV creates a continual illusion that causes a striking foe to see something they are sympathetic to. Example: Axe warrior is hitting mesmer. Mesmer uses SV. Warrior no longer sees enemy, but sees injured suffering woman. All adren and their will to fight is hampered because they feel sympathy and guilt towards what they struck.

It's illusion because you create it around yourself to fool foes.

Clumsiness : You create an illusion around the foe, either by editing their perception of weight, positioning, or whatever else, that causes them to badly stumble and injure themselves trying to attack.

It's illusion because you're creating an illusion to make the enemy hurt himself.

Spirit Shackles :

You're sapping energy whenever the foe tries to attack by opening a channel in their energy. Either by linking it to the Id of the foe, or by barbing it into the energy 'area' of the foe, the hex leeches power out for each attack attempt.

It's inspiration because it preys on energy without directly injuring or effecting the enemy actions, like domination would. It's not illusion because its a binding hex and not an alteration of perception.

Hope that helps a little.. Spoken like a true mesmer.

Me: Avarre is using Mass Confusion on Guildwarsguru!
Me: Avarre is using Mass Confusion on Guildwarsguru!
Me: Avarre is using Mass Confusion on Guildwarsguru!
Me: I'm using Distract Shot on Avarre!