I very much wanted to work this into a build when I first got it. Then when I was making my pvp character...
15second cooldown, 4 second duration????????
The next Otuguh's Cry?
Is there *any* use for Arcane Languor?
Shoitaan
shoot n loot
not in itself, but if you make a fastcasting build, then its mean as hell 5 or 6 second duration and if u echo it... wellll its not fun to have on u as a monk ill tell u that, with all those near instantanious spells vs exhaustion per cast, if u cant interrupt them this is way to go (they get SCREWED)
Terra Xin
yep, most of monks spells range in the 1/4-1 second, with the occasional 2 second. Two spells under exhaustion and they're hurt.
If they're trying to res someone, the obvious counter would be to wand them or use offensive spells
If they're trying to res someone, the obvious counter would be to wand them or use offensive spells
Hex Nexus
Is it Illusion? Then Mantra of Persistence ftw. Also, look at the Ranger spirit Equinox. Awesome combo. Equinox doubles exhaustion.
JR
It's really not all that interesting.
Treat it like diversion; don't cast - have it removed. If you have to cast through it once, big deal? It's just like playing in a negative energy set for a while, as long as you don't cast heal party or something ridiculous.
Treat it like diversion; don't cast - have it removed. If you have to cast through it once, big deal? It's just like playing in a negative energy set for a while, as long as you don't cast heal party or something ridiculous.
Terra Xin
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hex Nexus
Quote:
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Originally Posted by JR-
It's just like playing in a negative energy set for a while, as long as you don't cast heal party or something ridiculous.
it's just like having temp DP. Cast it any more times on the same target, and the monk will run like an idiot.
Xasew
If you have 16 FC, you'll get Arcane Languor on a target every 16 seconds and it'll last for 5 seconds. This means that if he casts 1 spell through every AL, he'll be getting 20 points of exhaustion every minute or so. This means that it sucks. And this is when the Monk casts through it, you're able to put it on him every time and it isn't removed.
You can't even use it effectively on a spike, because the Monk can just Infuse trough it. Diversion is so much better.
Avarre
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terra Xin
Nope, Fast Casting attribute.
it's just like having temp DP. Cast it any more times on the same target, and the monk will run like an idiot. 15s recharge 10e cost... you can't cast it many times quickly, and a reduction to max energy isn't hurting a monk too much. Temp dp to energy isn't worth the elite slot at that kind of recharge.
JR
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avarre
15s recharge 10e cost... you can't cast it many times quickly, and a reduction to max energy isn't hurting a monk too much. Temp dp to energy isn't worth the elite slot at that kind of recharge.
That's not quite accurate. If it was like Diversion in that it triggered on a spell and then ended, you would be correct. However it will stay on, so not only does it give you the exhaustion effect if you cast through it, but it will continue to do so untill it ends or is removed. This makes it a little more appealing, in that unlike diversion you can trigger it multiple times from a single application, but not much.
Francis Demeules
Well..... AL has its own utility but we must know how. I used AL with WW in pvp to "react" my target. It can stop the Spell Spammers too (Flare, Stone Daggers, WW, etc).
In all, we must know the utility of this one even with the cost/recharge/duration.
Shoitaan
16 Fast Casting
10 or 12 Inspiration 9 or 10 Illusion That should be right..ish 1) AL (elite) 2) Arcane Echo 3) Power Drain 4) Leech Signet 5) Mantra of Persistence 6) Signet of Humility (I dunno why, wanted to try it out I guess... the only group I ran across long enough to try this build out long enough with.. their monk had Crippling Anguish as an elite o_O) 7) Energy Tap 8) rez sig No it didn't work.. the 'build' was just to see if people would cast through the 5-7 (persistence - rounded down) seconds of AL. At the most, I only ever got 2 casts, but that happened like.. once, maybe twice. Usually its only 1 cast IF ANY. Granted my crappy test build didn't pressure the casters much but honestly.. this is just terrible. edit: just so we're clear, I didn't run against slow casters. I got people using reversal of fortune amongst other things... reversal was the only time I 'scored' 2 casts off the enemy... really.. this is... just... dont even bother capping it ;_; rii
Since when did mantra of persistence stop reading 'increase illusion hexes you cast...'?
Shoitaan
Quote:
Originally Posted by rii
Since when did mantra of persistence stop reading 'increase illusion hexes you cast...'?
goddamnit lol, I forgot.. its 1:30am, gimme a break :P
well there you go, the spell is even more shat than previously thought
Francis Demeules
Quote:
Originally Posted by rii
Since when did mantra of persistence stop reading 'increase illusion hexes you cast...'?
This is what I thought too. MoP increase the duration of Illusion hex, not Fast Cast, Dom or Insp.
Themis
Well i think that it could be interesting to alternate AL and Diversion on a Mo target, while casting the rest of skills on other targets. It leaves a 3-4 sec interval every 15 seconds to the Monk. On long battles (not 4vs4) AL/Diversion combo should be efficient : Mo don't remove low-duration hexes.
This combo may oblige them to do something : but what ? The only answer (i can see) is SB. So, perhaps AL should be in a shutdown Mo build along with Diversion, EtherSignet and Signet Of Disencantment ? Let's not forget that you don't need a high Dom to make Diversion efficient...
Hella Good
Spell isn't a big deal. You won't catch more than 1 spell on a good player. Lowering max nrg by 10 for what like 30sec is useless. Plus there is too much of the element of surprise about this skill. Once they get caught by it, they will be aware to watch for it. The 3-4s duration along with the 15s recharge is totally killing this skill. Needs to be min 6s duration at about 11 Fast Cast.
Shoitaan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Themis
Well i think that it could be interesting to alternate AL and Diversion on a Mo target, while casting the rest of skills on other targets. It leaves a 3-4 sec interval every 15 seconds to the Monk. On long battles (not 4vs4) AL/Diversion combo should be efficient : Mo don't remove low-duration hexes.
This combo may oblige them to do something : but what ? yeah, I too concluded that AL is useles 4vs4 and I guess also Alliance battles. My guild is nice and small with only 3 active people (including myself XD) so I've never done GvG so can't speak with any experience whatsoever about the situation/viability in there  One thing though... whats the viability of this crappy spell in some sort of edenialISH build revolving vaguely around mind wrack? echo AL so you can try to keep it up, hope they spam spells while all the while you energy tap and sig of weariness, and powerdrain in the lul times between AL's. And occaisonally throw on a mind wrack? yes? no?
Evilsod
Quote:
Originally Posted by Francis Demeules
Well..... AL has its own utility but we must know how. I used AL with WW in pvp to "react" my target. It can stop the Spell Spammers too (Flare, Stone Daggers, WW, etc).
Hardly, they cast it once, realise they're massing alot of Exhaustion from it (which in 30 seconds is gone) and stop for 3 seconds till they start again. Diversion, they cast through it once before they see it and can't cast it again for 59 seconds. Which one shuts down better
 If your targetting a monk who has 15 energy left out of 49, do you really think they'll care that you just lowered there max energy by 10 or 20 points for 30 seconds? It doesn't last long enough or cause enough problems to matter in the slightest.
Themis
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shoitaan
One thing though... whats the viability of this crappy spell in some sort of edenialISH build revolving vaguely around mind wrack? echo AL so you can try to keep it up, hope they spam spells while all the while you energy tap and sig of weariness, and powerdrain in the lul times between AL's. And occaisonally throw on a mind wrack?
yes? no? Well, no actually. I don't think AL can be included on a E-Denial build. It can be only on a shutdown build, along with Diversion and/or Blackout. I edited my previous post so i repeat it once more : Perhaps AL should be in a shutdown Mo build along with Diversion, Signet Of Disencantment (preventing SB) and Ether Signet (SoD recover) ? Let's not forget that you don't need a high Dom to make Diversion efficient...
Francis Demeules
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evilsod
Hardly, they cast it once, realise they're massing alot of Exhaustion from it (which in 30 seconds is gone) and stop for 3 seconds till they start again. Diversion, they cast through it once before they see it and can't cast it again for 59 seconds. Which one shuts down better
If your targetting a monk who has 15 energy left out of 49, do you really think they'll care that you just lowered there max energy by 10 or 20 points for 30 seconds? It doesn't last long enough or cause enough problems to matter in the slightest. Maybe 1 skill disable for more than 1 minute. AL affects the Energy, not the skills. Exhausted is nothing. But double or even triple exhaust can be a problem. It will not take 2 seconds to cure this. Reducing the Energy of -20/-30 in a row I say winner. Of course, all comes from the target how they use the spells. It depends on how you see it. Like Hella said: I want it last longer too.
Son of Urza
Another way to use it in the larger battles is to have TWO mesmers using it; that way, they can use Arcane Mimicry on each other to keep it up constantly. This way, you have one copy on a monk, and the other copy on the person with hex removal, forcing either shutdown or exhaustion, neither of which is good.
*NOTE: This will only work for the 20 second duration of AE/AM, and during that time you will have serious energy problems, but it is still possible.
Themis
Thinking it over again, i suppose that AL+Diversion should efficiently shutdown Ritualists, Necros and Mesmers too. These classes have plenty of skills costing between 10 and 15 energy. Repeated exhaustion and diversion can rend them pretty useless (exhhaustion means no Soul Reaping...).
Francis Demeules
Quote:
Originally Posted by Themis
(exhhaustion means no Soul Reaping...)
A good point here. You can't get exhausted energy from SR or any E-management. Even the elite in Ele that gives you energy when you're exhausted.
Evilsod
Quote:
Originally Posted by Francis Demeules
Maybe 1 skill disable for more than 1 minute. AL affects the Energy, not the skills. Exhausted is nothing. But double or even triple exhaust can be a problem. It will not take 2 seconds to cure this. Reducing the Energy of -20/-30 in a row I say winner. Of course, all comes from the target how they use the spells. It depends on how you see it. Like Hella said: I want it last longer too.
FFS i wrote a long reply and the web crashes and i lose the whole RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing thing!
The chance of 1 skill been disabled for a minute is a hell of a lot more troubling than the chance of 10 energy you will never miss. Losing out on something like Infuse Health or WoH can cripple a monk. Losing 10 max energy for a short period of time is only gonna effect him if he has full energy. And as most monks works with very little, no monk is going to care at all. To make this skill even remotely useful it really needs to have its duration boosted. That or its cast time increased on par with Wastrels Worry. As an elite it deserves that, an interrupt style hex so you can quickly cast it before a spell is cast so you will definatly make it useful rather than been the worst shut down you could ever bring.
Themis
Well, if my skillbar had only 1 slot, i would certainly put on it Diversion rather than AL.
But fortunately it has 8 slots. So i can bring both Diversion AND Arcane Languor. On another thread i stated that AL should be brought to 6 sec on 11-12 FC. But now i think that if it was the case, then the Diversion+AL combo would leave no chance whatsoever to a Monk. With its actual duration, there's still a 3 sec window for casting. If it was brought to 6 sec, there would be NO window at all. And Diversion or AL would need nerfing. And i agree that a Monk can work with 10 exhaustion. Can he work with 35 exhaustion and half his skills diverted ? Certainly not.
JR
Quote:
Originally Posted by Themis
And i agree that a Monk can work with 10 exhaustion. Can he work with 35 exhaustion and half his skills diverted ? Certainly not.
Or he could just not cast untill the hexes wear off or are removed?
Eaimirth Etaivella
And 10 exhuastion isn't really as good as diversion in the first place if you sit back and think about it.
Themis
Well, if AL had a 6sec duration (like Diversion), then they would never wear off, they would indéfinately replace each other.
And no, you can't remove a hex every 6 seconds. That's why short-duration hexes are never removed. Moreover, Mo couldn't remove them themselves (it's diversion or exhaustion, remember ?), another Mo should do it.
Banebow
If, instead of causing exhaustion, it locked spells cast through it for, say, 5...30 seconds, it could be usable.
Exhaustion isn't a huge deal unless it gets stacked to a massive degree. Even if you bring a monk from a max of 40 to a max of 10, he can still cast most of his healing spells. He will be hindered sure, but nothing like what would happen if he got diverted.
Terra Xin
Use your wits about you. I'm going to try this myself, but AL works best in situations when:
Monks have under 50 HP, or are being targeted. Elementalists have full energy, they generally start of spamming with full energy. Necromancers "during" casting. Of course, I would consider this as more of a support spell, than using it as your main offense.
Evilsod
Quote:
Originally Posted by Themis
Well, if AL had a 6sec duration (like Diversion), then they would never wear off, they would indéfinately replace each other.
And no, you can't remove a hex every 6 seconds. That's why short-duration hexes are never removed. Moreover, Mo couldn't remove them themselves (it's diversion or exhaustion, remember ?), another Mo should do it. Well if your using Holy Veil and are pretty much expecting to get a hex on you, thats another question. If your thinking about sticking AL onto a flashturret, your really not gonna cause many problems. Ether Prodigy gives them exhaustion anyway, and to prevent it from hurting them severely its best to end up with as little energy as possible, so aslong as you don't manage to get there exhaustion anywhere below 30 i don't think they'll care. Necros are about the only thing you could use it for imo. Cast it on them while they're using SS (Pressure build sorta thing) and they either suffer even more from covering it with Parasitic or stop letting it get removed. Exhaustion just isn't a big enough problem, considering that with its recharge at 15 seconds, you've only got 5 exhaustion left. It would take a hell of a long time at 1 spell per AL to even begin to affect you. Eaimirth Etaivella
Personally if I was a monk and I had this hex on me, I would wonder why the heck it isn't diversion...then if it was diversion I would wonder why the heck it isn't blackout...but thats another story.
Oooo lookie lookie a mesmer reduced my Max enegy by 10...it will be back to norm in 30 seconds; not like I care really I will never reach that much energy for a while...wonder what he is doing? Isn't he supposed to be denying me that energy? Well he could be spamming Power Return...but wait...that skill sucks as well...and exhaustion is way too short duration for that to matter...I mean I might even TRY to cast under it so I can have 5 regen instead of 4 so the OTHER mesmer's edenial won't hurt me as much... Just imo
Evilsod
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eaimirth Etaivella
Personally if I was a monk and I had this hex on me, I would wonder why the heck it isn't diversion...then if it was diversion I would wonder why the heck it isn't blackout...but thats another story.
I mean I might even TRY to cast under it so I can have 5 regen instead of 4 so the OTHER mesmer's edenial won't hurt me as much... That last sentence doesn't make sense... do you know what exhaustion is?  As for Diversion, if i got that on me i'd know why the heck it wasn't blackout, because the mesmer hasn't reached me yet 
Eaimirth Etaivella
It makes perfect sence.
If you lose energy due to exhaustion; that energy will come back in the form that it was lost. IE if you lost 10 energy that was "used" then it will come back "used" However if you got exhaustion on 10 energy that was "unused" then it will come back henceforth in the same style-thus giving the illusion that you have 5 energy regeneration. You arn't gaining any energy in the process; just temporarly giving yourself a self e denial in order to protect yourself against denial in the future.
Hella Good
Diversion is still better than AL, impo. I don't plan on making room for this skill on my skill bar. It's a total waste of an elite slot.
Lord Dark Genie
Diversion > CoP > Arcane Languor.
and Diversion isn't elite. Eaimirth Etaivella
CoP is...really good.
Evilsod
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eaimirth Etaivella
It makes perfect sence.
If you lose energy due to exhaustion; that energy will come back in the form that it was lost. IE if you lost 10 energy that was "used" then it will come back "used" However if you got exhaustion on 10 energy that was "unused" then it will come back henceforth in the same style-thus giving the illusion that you have 5 energy regeneration. You arn't gaining any energy in the process; just temporarly giving yourself a self e denial in order to protect yourself against denial in the future. Unless i'm interpretting that wrongly, i would say you don't know what exhaustion does... It doesn't do a damn thing to your current energy and/or energy regen. All exhaustion does is lower your max energy (and your current i guess if you use a 5 energy skill at full energy). Exhaustion does not give you additional regen, it just raises your max energy again slowly at a rate of 1 energy per 3 seconds (or 1 regen), it doesn't affect your current energy in the slightest, exhauston recovery is completely independant. If i am infact wrong (its not like i've timed it...) then that would make AL even more useless. Eaimirth Etaivella
I never said it did; it only gives the illusion of additional regen.
Exhaustion gives back the energy lost due to exhaustion in the form it was taken away. Thus if I use meteor at full energy; I will regain those 5 extra energy lost to exhaustion ready to be used. However if I used meteor at max energy -5, I would suffer from "regular" exhaustion without the energy regen illusion. |
