Monk/Warriors being stereotyed as 55 monks only which is not the case.They can and are regular Monks like mine that happen to be a Mo/W.I refer you to thsi thread here.This has got to change as when I was in a mission a Ritualist player said no about getting a Mo/w in our party and the W/Mo said say there is nothing wrong with them but he didn't want the Mo/W in our party I was thinking this could be the reason.The thread is here.
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s....php?t=3047208
Mo/W Stereotyping as 55s only
Age
Master Kimchee
As long as you're not 55-ing in the quest or mission I don't see the big deal... but I agree that this stereotype could be true, and I also agree that it isn't really fair. On the other hand, you have to remember that there are some people who actually DO try to 55 in a mission, pointless as it sounds. I've gotten Mo/W who join a group and when the mission starts, say "I tank real good!" then go die. It's these players that can cause the anti-Mo/W feelings, but I don't think much can be done unfortunately...
Vermilion
What do you expect? I'm not really disagreeing, but after you've been to Elona's in the last month or more you may start to think Mo/w=55. If I see one, its either a 55 or a bonder..so stereotypes will come up. Plus, if you watch any Gvgs, (ANY) chances are the only monks will be Mo/me..and to some people, whats not FotM, is not good. *shrug*
The Real Roy Keane
Well I suppose they're assuming you're a 55'er since a Warrior secondary isn't very useful to a Monk whos primary task it is to keep the party alive.
Tsunami Rain
just to remind you, theres a nice farming section. just hit campfire and you'll see it. moved.
talk about mo/w being stereotyped as farmers here.
talk about mo/w being stereotyped as farmers here.
exodite
I use Mo/W in PvP on a regualar basis, Wary Stance helps against a warrior spike as well as Bonnetis defense, and when you have balanced stance Assassin's can't touch you as it has become one of my new fav skills!
Balanced Stance
For 8-18 seconds, you cannot be knocked down and you do not suffer extra damage from a critical attack
Balanced Stance
For 8-18 seconds, you cannot be knocked down and you do not suffer extra damage from a critical attack
Age
Yeah I know as I use Balance Stance as well and Mo/W was in use a lot longer in beta and in PvP way before the 55 farmer build came along.I was told bysome in the Treachous Empire it is good build.I just hate being stereotyped seeing as I play Mo/W sure i can change but I perfer not to and I did cap OoB and it was waste.I am not doing the same with MoR.
Bloodied Blade
I tend to allow Mo/W players into my party, but I worry about their energy management (I understand those that are using Blessed Signet for E management and the like) because as a Mo/W their secondary is next to useless for energy management.
Arkantos
The reason Mo/W's are sterotyped as 55's aer because:
Lots of 55's are Mo/W
Theres not really any warrior skills that aid a monk
Lots of 55's are Mo/W
Theres not really any warrior skills that aid a monk
Age
There sure are a lot of skills that aid a Monk in any game play situation as it is not just a farming build.I guess when you see more Assassins going for the Monk like I did on observer mode that may change.
Imp
even as a mo/w (I 55, but I don't use any warrior skills when just being a normal monk.) I don't really see many people complaining that a monk is joining their party. But if it starts, will just hit the corner and turn into a me or something, to please peoples nerves.
Age
I guess if ppl played it with all the skills you got in quests they would know as in fact it makes the best protection build early in the game and as a bonder.I use a combo or watchyourself and bonetti's defence as it is good for normal monking and gives enrgy back as well not compined with boon.When in the deset I used balance stance as well.
Nkah Sennyt
I play my 55 monk as a Mo/Me or Mo/E, just to mess with my necro's head. I usually go into parties as Mo/Me though, just because I <3 Mantra of REcall, not because I don't want to play as a Mo/W / get stereotyped as such.
Tijger
Quote:
Originally Posted by Age
I guess if ppl played it with all the skills you got in quests they would know as in fact it makes the best protection build early in the game and as a bonder.I use a combo or watchyourself and bonetti's defence as it is good for normal monking and gives enrgy back as well not compined with boon.When in the deset I used balance stance as well.
Unfortunately, most Mo/W's who join parties are 55'ers or smiters and rarely announce this fact before the mission. We had this happen at Tahnnakai Temple last night and if hadnt been for the fact the other monk was pretty good and everyone had res sigs we wouldnt have made it.
I've only once encountered a Mo/W who was not a 55'er in a mission and yes, unfortunately, that does lead to stereotyping and makes me (and others) shie away from Mo/W's.
I've only once encountered a Mo/W who was not a 55'er in a mission and yes, unfortunately, that does lead to stereotyping and makes me (and others) shie away from Mo/W's.
jummeth
Mo/W can also be used as AB smiters, for the added mobility
Sacho
I don't really understand your point Age. Are you talking from a pve, or a pvp perspective? In PvE, mobs shouldn't be attacking you anyway - their aggro is so easy to shake off. As such, you'd want to focus all your energy into healing your team, and mainly your tanks, who will take most of the damage.
Using the stances you mention in pvp is pretty limited - your attacks will just ignore you while you have the stance on(or even worse, remove it or hit right through it with unblockable/magic attacks), and since you've hampered your energy management and ability to heal your allies, you'd have problems keeping them alive.
There are quite few monk builds that can run with no secondary(ie the WoH monk), so I don't think Mo/W's should just be discarded. It only takes a few minutes to ask someone what they are running - I already ask everyone in a pug what they run before we jump in. A few minutes of preparation will save you much more time than the "gogogogogogo" mentality, really.
Using the stances you mention in pvp is pretty limited - your attacks will just ignore you while you have the stance on(or even worse, remove it or hit right through it with unblockable/magic attacks), and since you've hampered your energy management and ability to heal your allies, you'd have problems keeping them alive.
There are quite few monk builds that can run with no secondary(ie the WoH monk), so I don't think Mo/W's should just be discarded. It only takes a few minutes to ask someone what they are running - I already ask everyone in a pug what they run before we jump in. A few minutes of preparation will save you much more time than the "gogogogogogo" mentality, really.
elektra_lucia
"Monk/Warriors being stereotyed as 55 monks only which is not the case.They can and are regular Monks like mine that happen to be a Mo/W.I refer you to thsi thread here.This has got to change as when I was in a mission a Ritualist player said no about getting a Mo/w in our party and the W/Mo said say there is nothing wrong with them but he didn't want the Mo/W in our party I was thinking this could be the reason.The thread is here.
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s....php?t=3047208"
Didn't click the link, but to me a monk should be monk mesmer for the obvious reasons :
Channeling, Drain enchant, Inspired Hex, Revealed Hex, Revealed Enchant etc...
Monk/Warrior? What are you gonna do, frenzy spam him with a fiery dragon sword? :x.
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s....php?t=3047208"
Didn't click the link, but to me a monk should be monk mesmer for the obvious reasons :
Channeling, Drain enchant, Inspired Hex, Revealed Hex, Revealed Enchant etc...
Monk/Warrior? What are you gonna do, frenzy spam him with a fiery dragon sword? :x.
Age
Then you would see mo/mes everywhere and get very bored of it and what defences does a mesmer have?I don't use frenzy on my Warrior even as i don't reallt like the skill.I guess most don't the benifit of being mo/w at say level 4 when the charr are on you and are still in presearing armor that is the good thing about watchyourself it provides 20 armor more and I used it.I see mo/r with pet how good is that and the same with /n at level 4 no good skills there.The only other one is /e for glyph of lesser energy.Mo/W is a very practical protection build either for bonding or active protect and can work just as good as a mesmer not a boon/protect.I am talking about both parts more to point of pve I am talking at the lower levels and if a warrior in pvp in right on top of you.
To Tijger did you see what armor they were wearing if it is full tats they could be 55ers and when you went into mission did you look at their off hands if they had crim cesta and a smiting rod if so they were a 55 and asked to read out their health.
There were players useing the Mo/W back in beta in pvp in halls of heros and I even used back then it wasn't just full of Mo/Mes.
To Tijger did you see what armor they were wearing if it is full tats they could be 55ers and when you went into mission did you look at their off hands if they had crim cesta and a smiting rod if so they were a 55 and asked to read out their health.
There were players useing the Mo/W back in beta in pvp in halls of heros and I even used back then it wasn't just full of Mo/Mes.
Blkout
Quote:
Originally Posted by Age
Monk/Warriors being stereotyed as 55 monks only which is not the case.They can and are regular Monks like mine that happen to be a Mo/W.I refer you to thsi thread here.This has got to change as when I was in a mission a Ritualist player said no about getting a Mo/w in our party and the W/Mo said say there is nothing wrong with them but he didn't want the Mo/W in our party I was thinking this could be the reason.The thread is here.
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s....php?t=3047208 The majority of Mo/W's are 55's nowadays. It irritates me to no end to see one try to PUG. Many of them will even lie just to get in a group when you ask them if they are 55's.
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s....php?t=3047208 The majority of Mo/W's are 55's nowadays. It irritates me to no end to see one try to PUG. Many of them will even lie just to get in a group when you ask them if they are 55's.
TheWatcher
I am not sure who is the *troll* of this story, the 55 MoWa trying to get to a mission with 55 settings or the people asking a MoWa whether they are 55 or not.
There are always reasons for MoWa, full stop.
Confronted with the question whether I am a 55 or not I will simply leave the group (applies to any kind of question like Are you XXXX-Nuker, YYY-Spiker) and if I lead a group and get a MoWa in my group, they are welcomed even to 55 if they want because it is a random group, full stop.
There are always reasons for MoWa, full stop.
Confronted with the question whether I am a 55 or not I will simply leave the group (applies to any kind of question like Are you XXXX-Nuker, YYY-Spiker) and if I lead a group and get a MoWa in my group, they are welcomed even to 55 if they want because it is a random group, full stop.
JR
The problem is there simply is no good reason to go Mo/W in PvE, unless you are 55ing.
Balanced Stance is great in PvP; where it is likely you will be getting Galed/Shocked or attacked by Hammer Warriors and Assassins that you can't always just kite. In PvE the opposition is so dumb that just simple kiting will do the same job. With this as the case, why not simply take /Me or /N secondary for energy management to help keep your team alive?
Warrior secondary is also very limited in GvG to Word Of Healing monks or Healing Light monks; who both make use of the only real passive energy management available to Monks; economical skills.
So in short; yes you can run a Balanced Stance Word healer in PvE, but you are quite honestly just wasting your secondary proffesion with making up for sloppy play and putting your party at risk by not doing the job you should be doing with an optimal skill bar.
Regards,
-JR
Balanced Stance is great in PvP; where it is likely you will be getting Galed/Shocked or attacked by Hammer Warriors and Assassins that you can't always just kite. In PvE the opposition is so dumb that just simple kiting will do the same job. With this as the case, why not simply take /Me or /N secondary for energy management to help keep your team alive?
Warrior secondary is also very limited in GvG to Word Of Healing monks or Healing Light monks; who both make use of the only real passive energy management available to Monks; economical skills.
So in short; yes you can run a Balanced Stance Word healer in PvE, but you are quite honestly just wasting your secondary proffesion with making up for sloppy play and putting your party at risk by not doing the job you should be doing with an optimal skill bar.
Regards,
-JR
Age
I do use an optimal skill bar though and what about /Ele or even /R I have seen some use pets.I don't really see /N as a good secondary untill you reach the Southern Shiverpeaks and cap OoB but now that skill is nerfed its only use is in PvE not PvP.What can you do or put on your skill bar as Mo/N in say around post Ascalon there isn't many skill you can use unless you want to smite but in the line of /W there are defences that you can use like I said watchyourself and if you have you can use weapon.I never played a 55 build untill after I beat the game.
Jetdoc
It's the same reason that a W/Mo is stereotyped as a Whammo.
Mo/W actually has some decent uses in PvE, especially if you go down the smiting route instead of healing and protection.
But even as a healer, I can see how you might carry an evasive stance to help yourself stay alive if the aggro bubble bursts. Again, not the best use of a secondary (because energy management generally plays a greater need), but it's definitely feasible.
Mo/W actually has some decent uses in PvE, especially if you go down the smiting route instead of healing and protection.
But even as a healer, I can see how you might carry an evasive stance to help yourself stay alive if the aggro bubble bursts. Again, not the best use of a secondary (because energy management generally plays a greater need), but it's definitely feasible.
Evilsod
When a Ranger or Warrior /Mesmer joins a chest run. 9/10 times they are heading to the Forest or the Spider Cave to farm. 9/10 times when a Monk/Warrior joins your team, they are a moronic 55er who dies at the first Shatter Enchantment.
For this reason i'm always cautious of a Mo/W. Besides.... if you wanna tank things just bring Bonder, other why the hell are you standing still? At least 4 times now i've had 2 Abyssals converge on me just as i started casting Sig of Dev. Would bring Balanced Stance help? Possibly... but my healing would suck. Bonettis Defence is always a possiblity, but surely cancelling the skill (i learnt that after the 2nd time in 1 trip) and simpling running off works just as well.
I've only had 1 55er join my FoW team that had brains. They stayed at the back during Mes groups (dunno why... Spellbreaker...) and helped out with Healing Breeze/Prot Spirit while tanking the rest of the groups we encountered. There is just no viable reason to go /Warrior. Although i must admit i am tempted to see is "None Shall Pass" is a viable method of stopping agro.
For this reason i'm always cautious of a Mo/W. Besides.... if you wanna tank things just bring Bonder, other why the hell are you standing still? At least 4 times now i've had 2 Abyssals converge on me just as i started casting Sig of Dev. Would bring Balanced Stance help? Possibly... but my healing would suck. Bonettis Defence is always a possiblity, but surely cancelling the skill (i learnt that after the 2nd time in 1 trip) and simpling running off works just as well.
I've only had 1 55er join my FoW team that had brains. They stayed at the back during Mes groups (dunno why... Spellbreaker...) and helped out with Healing Breeze/Prot Spirit while tanking the rest of the groups we encountered. There is just no viable reason to go /Warrior. Although i must admit i am tempted to see is "None Shall Pass" is a viable method of stopping agro.
NinjaKai
There is actually a build in the PvP creation area for a Mo/W which isn't a 55 monk. Anyone who thinks every Mo/W is a 55 is a bit stupid. Its only when they wield a sword and that ugly skinned offhand that it becomes obvious.
jesh
There are/used to be plenty of monk builds that didn't make much use of a secondary. With those kind of builds you can choose whatever suits your needs best. If you're playing with in incompetant party, you can use Weary Stance to have an almost fool-proof res. You can use sprint or rush to run away, or Bonetti's to get some energy back. Team mates can benefit as much from Shields Up! as protection spells. There are always strengths that a certain class combo has, and to say that Mo/W is useless is a little short sighted.
Though they may be expensive, a Mo/N can use wells. Area effect indispellable healing breeze anyone? No one thinks in those terms, though. No one looks at enfeebling blood and sees a skill that decreases your party's damage taken by 80% for X seconds. There is more to chosing a secondary than energy management, and there is definetely nothing wrong with wanting to be a little bit different than everyone else.
Though they may be expensive, a Mo/N can use wells. Area effect indispellable healing breeze anyone? No one thinks in those terms, though. No one looks at enfeebling blood and sees a skill that decreases your party's damage taken by 80% for X seconds. There is more to chosing a secondary than energy management, and there is definetely nothing wrong with wanting to be a little bit different than everyone else.
Dark Helmet
Quote:
Originally Posted by Age
Then you would see mo/mes everywhere and get very bored of it and what defences does a mesmer have?
Distortion is somewhat handy at times, like in FoW when you're getting mobbed...
Sacho
Quote:
Originally Posted by NinjaKai
There is actually a build in the PvP creation area for a Mo/W which isn't a 55 monk. Anyone who thinks every Mo/W is a 55 is a bit stupid. Its only when they wield a sword and that ugly skinned offhand that it becomes obvious.
.....+-5 energy swords are a staple to many monk equipment sets
JR
Quote:
Originally Posted by Age
Quote: Originally Posted by Age though and what about /Ele or even /R I have seen some use pets. Thats garbage, how does a pet help you do your job as a Monk? Elementalist could at least be Glyph of Renewal and Divine Spirit I suppose...
Quote:
I don't really see /N as a good secondary untill you reach the Southern Shiverpeaks and cap OoB but now that skill is nerfed its only use is in PvE not PvP.
Watch more observer mode, OoB is still decent and in use in high level PvP.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Age
What can you do or put on your skill bar as Mo/N in say around post Ascalon there isn't many skill you can use unless you want to smite but in the line of /W there are defences that you can use like I said watchyourself and if you have you can use weapon.
If we are going to discuss skills, please let's put it in the context of a 'finished' character.
elektra_lucia
Quote:
Originally Posted by Age
Then you would see mo/mes everywhere and get very bored of it and what defences does a mesmer have?I don't use frenzy on my Warrior even as i don't reallt like the skill.I guess most don't the benifit of being mo/w at say level 4 when the charr are on you and are still in presearing armor that is the good thing about watchyourself it provides 20 armor more and I used it.I see mo/r with pet how good is that and the same with /n at level 4 no good skills there.The only other one is /e for glyph of lesser energy.Mo/W is a very practical protection build either for bonding or active protect and can work just as good as a mesmer not a boon/protect.I am talking about both parts more to point of pve I am talking at the lower levels and if a warrior in pvp in right on top of you.
To Tijger did you see what armor they were wearing if it is full tats they could be 55ers and when you went into mission did you look at their off hands if they had crim cesta and a smiting rod if so they were a 55 and asked to read out their health. There were players useing the Mo/W back in beta in pvp in halls of heros and I even used back then it wasn't just full of Mo/Mes. "There were players useing the Mo/W back in beta in pvp in halls of heros and I even used back then it wasn't just full of Mo/Mes." ROFL! People play IWAY with no monks at all, so your point about the hall of heroes, absolute rubbish! I was talking about energy management. "Then you would see mo/mes everywhere and get very bored of it" You do see monk/mesmers everywhere... On an average build... "I don't use frenzy on my Warrior even as i don't reallt like the skill." Zealous (with a stance to cancle) frenzy'd or, prot spirit frenzy'd. FTW... "and what defences does a mesmer have" You don't have to bring a secondary for defenses... If you haven't noiced, you don't have to agro everything as a monk, in PVE... We were talking about a team game, yes? You can have two monks, or since you mention halls, you usually run rc prot sb/infuse woh/hp "I am talking at the lower levels and if a warrior in pvp in right on top of you. " If a warrior in PVP is right ontop of you, you go in a ward, yes? Or another monk prot spirits you, yes? "OoB is still decent and in use in high level PvP. " Yap, although since he mentioned HoH, I'd rather have monk/mes. "Its only when they wield a sword and that ugly skinned offhand that it becomes obvious." E-denial / -5 energy sword ftw? ;x.
Dark Helmet
Off-topic, but rawr... hey Kansas.
 (It's teh Lady Eilsys person ^_^) elektra_lucia
Hey to you too^^
jesh
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sacho
.....+-5 energy swords are a staple to many monk equipment sets
I use both.
 Haven't played Mo/W in a while, but people still like to pick on me cause I'm not wearing a staff. "Mo/N with a sword, interesting choice of equipment there. o.o" NinjaKai
Easiest way to tell is the first time the monk gets hit. You'll see their health bar shoot up and down rapidly.
elektra_lucia
wow I never knew, thanks^^
.
JR
Quote:
Originally Posted by NinjaKai
Easiest way to tell is the first time the monk gets hit. You'll see their health bar shoot up and down rapidly.
Or just watch for them casting the standard 55hp Monk enchantments?
Age
The Mo/W is not just a 55 I monk as there are other I see in game out there.Therre are Mo/W in PvP as well I have seen as infusers and I asked a good Monk play from Treacherous Empire[TE] obout the build as they used it and said it isn't bad build.The Mo/W is a good for those who want to play in PvE.I don't really think that most of you played a Mo/W but I played a Mo/N,Mo/E and a Mo/Mes in PvP mostly but tried it in PvE.I do have 2 Monks a Mo/W and Mo/E.
Male Gigolo
I think the real culprit for this stereotyping is ELONA'S REACH I went there one time with my wammo to farm and there were 2 districts of these guys...lol
I have a 55 monk. I use Mo/N so that Anet will not think of me as bot coz I regularly have lag. I usually play Mo/Me. The real advantage these guys have are they can be any kind of monk and primarily energy management. Whether Boon Healing, Boon Protecting, and even Bonder. I'm having so much fun with my monk coz I can be any of those. So mesmer secondary really helps alot. Well that's what I think at least. So dont flame me.
Age
Quote:
Originally Posted by Male Gigolo
I think the real culprit for this stereotyping is ELONA'S REACH I went there one time with my wammo to farm and there were 2 districts of these guys...lol
I have a 55 monk. I use Mo/N so that Anet will not think of me as bot coz I regularly have lag. I usually play Mo/Me. The real advantage these guys have are they can be any kind of monk and primarily energy management. Whether Boon Healing, Boon Protecting, and even Bonder. I'm having so much fun with my monk coz I can be any of those. So mesmer secondary really helps alot. Well that's what I think at least. So dont flame me.
I just wanted ppl to understand that there are real Mo/W from presearing on out there doing there jops aren't we all Monks despite are secoundary.
Matsumi
Quote:
Originally Posted by NinjaKai
Easiest way to tell is the first time the monk gets hit. You'll see their health bar shoot up and down rapidly.
Hmm, I had somebody think I was 55ing one time during the THK mission, while playing as a Mo/Me. Because I was getting hit alot at one point, so I cast Healing Breaze on myself and waited for the tanks to get done killing their target. The Ranger in the group stood there and stared at me, then quit the group.
 I had 476 health, so not sure what the problem was. I wasn't casting Protective Spirit on myself or the other enchants.  Rangers usually seem to have attitude problems anyway though.
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