simple fix for the elite mission problem

instead of having people set up an unofficial "ferry" system, and have the right to deny people (which i believe is completely fair, dont get me wrong, they earned it with the faction), in order to calm down the complainers, this is my proposed idea

they introduce another npc in hzh and cavalon, in which the alliance leader's officers can set a price ranging from 1 gold to a maximum of 5k in which one person can pay to get into the elite mission, the money in turn goes into a guild coffer, and when the guild loses control of the city, the money is split between the guilds in the alliance and deposited in the guild storage*


(* soon to come hopefully ;-\)

no thoughts or anything? is it really that bad of an idea?

Elite missions are supposed to be earned from skillful play. I think they should set up a system that allows skillful players to go to it rather than just faction grinders. This idea just allows the faction grinding alliances to keep it. They can still allow guilds to control cities but they should nerf their control of elite missions. Have elite missions totally separated from the control of cavalon and House Zu Heltzer. Have some Differant way to get to them that actually rewards skillful players. Like a smaller missions or a PvP battle. If you had to do those to enter an elite mission then I think they would actually be rewarding skillful players.

/notsigned
I don't think it should be under control of a guild in the first place, let alone haveing the guild charge gold.

Brother Gilburt

How would something that shows "skill" be instituted? I mean in way in which you could actually judge their skill, almost always people will figure out ways to do break through these obstacles with simple tactics. I am doubtful that it will ever work out in this way.

As it stands, I see no problem with the current system. Anyone who is whining about not getting into the elite missions needs to pipe down. You didn't farm the hours of faction it took to control the city, and as such you don't deserve a say in what goes on. Thats like me msging your guild leader and telling him what to do, and expecting something to happen.

If you want into the elites that bad, then join one of the main guilds or their alliances. Most have a simple introduction process, which just consist of each member farming a small amount of faction per day. Which isn't much if you really want the missions.

Anet has stated they are going to give alternate access to the elite mission (yet to be determined).

What I would do is have a difficult mission after paying 1k to get access to the area to do the elite mission. That way you would have to pay money, and have some skill in order to get there.

I love reading responses like Lurids. They make me remember how truly sad some people are. Your right, we didn't farm the hours of faction it took to control the cities. Incase you didn't realise, you haven't earned the right to get into an elite mission either. Please, leave your alliance, start up your own. If you can succesfully earn, how much is it? 2million faction? (i have no idea) and get access to the elite mission alone, then i will remove my arguments about this. Its funny though how the majority of people in these alliances see no problems.
Remember the Favour of the Gods? You know, the thing to allow entrance to FoW/UW? The last i heard half of the players on the UW server were constantly bitching about it been unfair because they never had it. Just like before that Europe did the same when they never had it. Those things have changed, last time i checked the favour actually changed hands. It seems that only 2 alliances will ever get chance to enter this mission, each becoming stronger and stronger as people who 'leave there guilds/alliances to join the big ones' do so.

As for an unnofficial ferry... the guild leaders would just set it at 5k a trip, you know they will. The max it should ever be is 1k on par with FoW/UW. If these elite missions are truly reserved for the elite only, then surely anyone who isn't in this so called 'elite alliance' should fail the moment they appear having no chance to get any of the precious greens.

Hmm okay let's see, one we shouldn't give whiners "exactly" what they want, they need to learn somehow they don't get what they want by whining, BUT I understand the thing with the deep/ urgoz's warren. I am fine if they open it up to more people BUT they then need to do something to cavalon/HzH in order to make it nicer to control them again, more than just "cheaper" prices, screw that, they need to make it nice again to hold the major cities other than elite missions if they want to give crybabies what they want. Considering I am in one of the "big boy" alliances I know that alot of people will flame me for this but those with insight will see that I am not completely biased in this, give the people the elite missions, but make it worth something to hold cav/HzH, and please, if you want something to change, WORK for it, don't just whine.

We don't need a "fix" for the elite missions; there are no real problems with them...

If you have a conceptual problem with elite missions being, well, elite, then I think that's your own issue.

Something along those lines is probably what will be instated. Though i'm curious how this leaves those players who actually earned the right to enter these missions. Sounds to me as though we're screwing them out of their play time, what happens if they stand up and bitch like you all are?

Considering the fact that you don't have a clue who I am, who are you to say that I haven't earned the right to do so through my faction farming? I have not, though you have no clue whether or not I have, I suggest you leave such irrelevant points to yourself. Irrelevant as in you don't have any idea what i've done, at all.

You ask me to start my own alliance, which would imply that I would be with various other guilds. Thus, I would not be alone, and as such your point is moot, as its impossible for me to do this. Though most of the reining alliances require an amount of faction around, 500k to join them. Which coming from a relatively large guild is not that much to ask for, at all.

I don't really see how this is an applicable point coming from someone who is defending this. Your saying that they whine because they didn't get favor as much as they wanted. Though this is not about your point at all, these people are whining that they can't get into an "Elite" mission, hence the title. Its not supposed to be easy to get into, otherwise it would be called a "hey pay money and whine like a little child and you get in" mission. Which is what your asking it to be.

Why not? Whats the point of controlling a town and farming all that faction if you get nothing for it? Sounds to me like your trying to have your cake and eat it to, you don't want to farm for faction 24 / 7? Fine, then don't bitch when you don't get your way about the rewards.

the sheer fame of controlling that town should be reward enough. The exclusive access to a little extra zone within the town you controll, the cheaper prices at these merchants and the option to see fireworks are in my view reward enough.

But access to a zone that could be considered as real 'content' should never have been dependent on a farmingactivity in a game that poses itself as the pineacle of skill over time.

See? I have no problems with someone who actually makes a point, kudos to you sir / madam. That makes actual sense, instead of "zomg we want it the way we want it, /rage, gimme gimme gimme" I do agree with you. If the game is truly "skill over time" then this should have never been instituted (sp?) in the first place. If this was truly the case then an alliance should have never been able to control the town at all. As one might complain that it shows favor for those who want to grind all that time. Which in some aspects it does.

If we keep the missions its going against a main selling point of the game. Though dumbing down the missions to suit the people who don't want to farm is not the way to do so. Especially since it appears as though these people will never be satisfied. Changing them defeats the point of having them at all, just get rid of them if you are going to change them.

Personally I think you shoyuld earn an elite mission without grinding all day. This isn't rewarding skillful players. Its rewarding alliances with people that grind 24/7. Not everyone can do that. I very experianced player that can only be on a a few hours a week can't be rewarded with the elite missions because he can't grind faction.... But those people that can get on 7 hours a day to grind faction are allowed in those top faction grind alliances that control HzH and cavalon. Also only rewarding 10 guilds(1 alliance) with this elite mission is not fair to everyone else as that limits it to a few people... Why not make the elite missions like dragons layer and have people earn there way into from a series of challengeing PvP battles? Or have a challenging mission to do to earn your way into it? This would reward skillful players and not just those people that grind faction all day....

The point of controling an city is for the fame of your guild/alliance.... The point of controling cavalon and HzH is for the fame and the elite mission....

Brother Gilburt

Don't even go there, no more PvE dependency on PvP.

Yes make it as a reward to get in to "elite missions" but keep PvP out of the equation, as seen in a lot of resent threads a lot of ppl do not have any intresst in PvP, and if you try to force ppl to do something they don't like you get AFK like Jade Query and Fort Aspenwood.

thats why i said or . Yes earnign your way into elite missions via a PvE mission or something similar that you can't afk would be best.

Brother Gilburt

The fame is, trivial at best. I can't imagine anyone wanting to farm for that amount of time simply so that their guild name can be displayed, which means next to nothing to...almost everyone.

Oh yeah, thats kinda what we were talking about, you know that the elite missions are rewards, for a guild / alliance that worked for the amount of time necessary to control the town. Meaning that the people who did all the work to achieve this should erm..gee I don't know...allow who they want in. Thats how it was designed, does that mean it was a good idea? Thats opinion, the fact still remains that the controlling alliance decides, so stop complaining.

We don't need a toll booth, or some other bull. The system is fine the way it is, yes it limits the number of people who can get in. Though if you change it then controlling a town is next to meaningless, and have none of you ever heard of this moto? "Anything worth having is worth working for" if you want the elites so much, then either:

A) Make friends with someone in the alliance
B) Join the alliances

I posted this idea in a diffrent thred before.


Reset the amount of faction needed to control a town or outpost once a week.
XXX K (set amount) amount of faction gives an alliance controll of an outpost or town, then when all outpost's and towns are ownd the controlling alliances fight in alliance battles for controll of the capitol, winning alliance gets to own the capitol for 1 week and get the income(pay X amount of faction for acces) from acces to elit missions.
alliances get something for there work and everyone can go to the missions.


Just an idea that needs more work, but would make alliance battles mean something, and would make owning a capitol worth something. Say they get XXX faction for everyone entering the mission witch means they get 1 week whithout farming factions and will still be able to defend there ownership in the next "Capitol battle".

And the PvE part of an alliance can do there part and the PvP part gets to do there part, would give both sides more to do.

Not a bad idea, though I don't see why Anet would want to change the way things are now. This was designed for a reason, that reason is to be difficult to get into. Changing it defeats the purpose of having it, so you might aswell do away with Elite missions as a whole. Which would work in your idea.

Watch, if something like that is instituted these people will be complaining still. "ZOMG THEY ARE TEH REWARDIN FARMERS!?!?!?!" /bitchwhinecomplain

..... If it means nothing then why do alliances fight for control over cities other than cavalon and HzH????

Sure I'm sure that everyone would do this. Alliances don't control cities for long. You'd end up haveing to make alot of friends.

Useless, alliances don't keep control for more than a few days usually before someone else is able to steal it. Also those allainces only take people who grind 10k faction or more a week. Not all of us like grinding lurid...

Elite missions and control of cities are supposed to award skillful players in the first place... Grinders aren't always skillful. They can just get on GW way to much... Elite missions are not fine the way they are...

Brother Gilburt

I see your point. But as it is now they are rewarding farmers with exclusive rights to elit missions ( we do thank the alliances that ferry) this would not change that ( just how much an alliance have to farm), it would stop the need for ferrying and make the alliance battles a weekly thing to watch + plus it's a money sink, use factions to get in to elite missions then they have to buy amber and jade for armour.

Just an idea for alternate access to "elite" missions

Lol do you think it matters who you are? Your an elitest arsehole who thinks grinding makes you elite. There is no elite method of gaining Faction. You can get Faction by simply going AFK in missions. Dont try and say that just because you don't do that it somehow makes your faction elite.

Zomg... i forgot that alliances are more than 1 person. Ok, how about make an alliance or the minimum number and get it yourself? Come on, i'd like to see you farm that much Faction on your own and prove to me its not impossible. Proving (that you have no life...) that anyone can do it.

Its quite applicable. People whined because they couldn't get the favour. People whine because they can't get into elite missions. Why are people whining? Because the favour is related to PvP, many people hate that it affects PvE. What about the elite missions? It requires no skill at all, it requires you to be in a big alliance.

There was me thinking you got discount at merchants and things... Sounds fair to me, jack shit to do once you complete the normal missions (what if i don't like Alliance Battles or Fort Aspenwood?) all because like 1000s of people who play this game, they have lives. If your sad enough to farm Faction 24/7, be my guest, just stop trying to prove its anything you deserve a reward for.

Perhaps my interpretation of the word 'difficult' is different to you and Anet. Mine means hard, but possible. Yours and Anets means impossible. People don't want to be in 1 huge alliance where they must farm faction at least once a week to get access to 'elite' missions. If you pay for the content, i wanna know why we don't get it?

Please, leave your alliance. I would like to see if you can bullshit your way into every single controlling alliances friend list just to get access. Most people would call this using people. But you call it 'making friends'.

I allready have a job.(thats how I can afford to buy games like GW)
A) Friends=using ppl to get what I want? not in my book.
B) and leave my friends? what kind of friend would that make me?


I paid $50 that gives me the right to have a say. Who gave you the right to tell anyone what they can or can not say?
You need to sit back and realax, this is an open forum so anyone has a right to speak.


and plz they are not really "elit" missions

I think I like the idea of elite missions, but perhaps not the implementation and/or requirements for entering.

I agree that the fame, the name of your alliance on the town, the discounts at merchants ought to be enough. Maybe also, like the world champs did, while in YOUR town, a gold trim to your cape, a new aura, or whatever.

The favor issue, while bothersome at times when you have been planning a UW/FoW trip: you are relying on people who are playing for fun, playing to win, who are trying for their entire region to have access.

This is very different than 1,000 players having whimsical "yay or nay" say over whether you are allowed to play a game you paid for.

Making elite missions access on the level of Tombs - would get old quickly. Make it difficult in one way or another to get in. Make the requirement, the fulfillment of one of the titles in your list.

OR, maybe implement some sort of "overall" title, which combines elements from all the other titles to form a balanced, experienced character who has at least accomplished a little bit of everything to deserve access. Like, capped so many skills, finished so many bonuses, hit level 20 so many times, drank so many beers, etc, which would guarantee at least a certain amount of play time if none of the other titles are quite fulfilled yet.

I don't know if this has been proposed as an alternative means of access, but here goes:

After you defeat Shiro, therefore completing the storyline, you gain access to the elite missions. That's it. Place an NPC in Cavalon and House zu Heltzer (not in the restricted area) where only those who have completed the final mission will be transported to the elite mission area. No ferrying by this method. It would be like the previously inaccessible missions - restricted for non-qualifying people. This method of access would be on a character by character basis, not by account.

In addition, the current method of permitting the controlling alliance access, whether they have finished the game or not, could continue via the existing NPC in the restricted area. Also, the current practice of ferrying could continue under this method, as the controlling alliance has earned the right to form parties and bring in anyone they wish.

I think this would keep the current reward for the controlling alliance intact, while also providing non-faction farmers access by a demonstration of skill. I think the ability to complete the storyline missions should suffice to demonstrate the skill requirement.

I think this would also help reduce another problem with the PvE side. There are simply not enough people in the last few mission areas to form PUGs to continue the storyline. On the Luxon side at least, from Gyala Hatchery on, it is very very difficult to put a group together, mainly because of the lack of monks, but also there is a serious lack of players at all in these areas. Giving more incentive to get through the storyline, I think, would generate more traffic in these mission locations.

Completing the storyline is fine by me. Completing every mission and bonus (or master rank or whatever it is) just no way in hell. Then your going down the path of grinding again. I have 1 character out of 6 with a maxed title, not a f*cking chance i'm gonna go for 100% exploration on the rest of them, probably won't go for 25/25 on the rest of them either. I don't want to have to do somet like that just to get access to something.

Reading carefully over the past few posts--including my own--no one is suggesting you should have to complete all the missions and bonuses.

Let me make my half-baked idea clearer.

For admission to the elite missions, you can either fulfill the requirements for one of the existing titles (e.g. Protector of Tyria), or, fulfill the requirements for this new nonexistant title:

Title: Renaissance Player
Requirements for this title: 5 elite skills capped; completed x amount of mission bonuses; explored 45% of map; drank 10 ale; earned 100 Balthazar Faction.

Even a casual player, by the time they would even think about wanting to explore the elite missions, would have probably fulfilled all of these reqs easily. It just guarantees you a certain level of player without guaranteeing the grind. IMHO, as always.

EDIT: Oh, and I almost forgot! Yes, I would also support Fist's idea of access granted just by finishing storyline too.

I'm not even the one who made the damn missions called "elite missions", how I see things is these aren't for the "elitist" to get into, but rather to be a place in which one can not easily enter, for example...the way it is now? Mine and Anet's definition of "difficult" isn't impossible. It is very possible depending upon what a player wishes to do, if it was impossible then the controlling alliance wouldn't change hands nearly as often. Saying that gaining faction is difficult is obviously wrong, then again saying that anything you can obtain through treachery is easily done is also wrong. If I recall correctly one of your sides main points on how toenter these "elite missions" was to do the other co-ops...hm...what stops someone from going afk inthose? See the thing here you obviously aren't understanding is, where did I say an alliance was elite?Point out one place in my posts where I said that, oh wait I didn't? Thanks for putting words in my mouth, even if I had wanted to, theres no need, Anet did that already.

I love these little blatent personal attacks, instead of coming up with valid points you simply toss out a comment about me when you really have no idea about me...at all? If I choose not to faction farm, which I do, thats none of your damn business. Simply because you don't want to do something, does not mean it is not possible. That logic is flawed on so many levels, I don't want to work on a car, does that mean that noone does? Does that mean that it isn't possible for people to work on automobiles? Of course not.


Indeed, people do whine alot, and so to do you whine. I simply cannot fathom how gaining, what two missions? Somehow enriches your PvE experience to the point in which you feel so compelled to bitch about it. What happens when you complete all of the missions in Prophecies? Oh whats that? Oh yeah, jack shit. As i've said, oh I don't know three or four times, I dont' faction farm. This like almost everything else in life can be interpreted as "not fair", and your point? If you are so worried about a video game being fair to every single person who plays it, then you really shouldn't ever leave your house, trust me real life is alot worse. Ever hear the saying "you can't please everyone?"

Perhaps your interpretation of difficult is correct, and your limited views on everything force you to only see it in one light. Impossible, hardly. Paying for content that you'll never see? Probably, then again why can't I say I payed for the content of say...a Crystaline? Would you not tell me to stop bitching, and to either earn it or find one? Same principal applies here, if you want it enough then you work for it. Thats how it was designed, but instead of playing the game you'd rather bitch about it, in the hopes that someone cares, I for one do not.


See thats the thing, i'm with the same alliance that i've been with since I picked the game back up about...four or five months ago. I don't give a rats ass about a couple of missions, I do actually have these things called "friends" who invite me to join them occasionaly when they do the "elite missions" I didn't mean for you to bullshit your way into every single alliance, thats ridiculous.

I'm done with this, it is as pointless as arguing about religion. Instead of simply debating why something should or should not be changed you resort to blatent personal attacks, in the hopes that I might do the same only to get myself banned so that you can somehow "win" an internet argument. Have fun with that. Oh, and by the way, I don't care what you think about me, stop msging me in game, whoever you are, I suggest you get a life and stop taking the internet so seriously.

/signed for general idea

I would settle on 1k flat rate (fow/uw-like) npc, which transfers gold to the town owning guild.

Does that stop you defending them like they are? The name 'elite' is utterly stupid, but that doesn't change to fact the method of entry to them is lame. The lame method of entry your defending because of your precious grinding going to waste.

That was blatant? I thought the 'elitist arsehole' comment in the reply just before it was blatant. This was more non-existant. Those analogies don't even make sense, not to mention been completely out of proportion.

Really? Ok you go do the missions over and over again. All the challenges they involve and such (like finding a good/full team?). Jack shit? Have you played Prophecies in the last year? You know, Fissure of Woe, Underworld, Sorrows Furnace, Tombs, ring any bells? Or perhaps the Titan Quests? Any of this coming back to you? Oh right so you DON'T faction farm now? Oh thats ok, you don't deserve access to the elite missions either.

Lol, a crystalline? Is that your best comparison? Your comparing an extremely rare weapon skin to entrance to the high-end areas of PvE? Well done. Could you of picked things quite so far apart? Even your comparison of Faction farming to Cars was closer!

You don't give a rats ass about them yet your arguing for them to be restricted to about 1% of the GW community. I think your the one bullshitting here.

Your right, why argue about something you don't care about when your about as stubborn as that rats ass you speak of. Blatant Personal Attacks? Strange, i didn't think you could recognise them. Messaging you in game? Are you hallucinating? Imaginary friends maybe? My money pays for my gaming and my internet (ok the 2nd parts a lie), so i want my moneys worth if you don't mind.

Lol, i'm posting here to clear something up, I didn't say you were messaging me. I said someone is, i'm not sure who though.