When running Factions missions...
...wait five seconds for my ranger to throw up a Favorable Winds? No can do.
...allow the healer to recharge after a hard fight? No can do.
...give the ritualist time to set-up a killing zone? No can do.
I wouldn't mind if *some* of the missions were timed -- but almost all of them have a ticking clock that makes groups rush and minimizes the value and participation of anything but Wammos.
Why I don't like Timed Missions in Factions
ChaoticCoyote
Slainster
I dislike timed missions full stop! I prefer to take things in my stride.. and as you say re-charge
AxeMe
I've ended up - several times - using henchies when real people were available just because (besides all the other reasons listed above) it's more fun for me to take my time, especially when I'm playing a caster. And - because of the time limit - people zoom along. It's been especially difficult when playing a MM since I'm standing back there creating minions while everyone is running to the next area, then I stop a time or two - when needed - to zap a little health into the minions.
So I agree that rushing doesn't allow time for some skills.
But it also just takes away from the fun of a mission for me.
By the way, I can also see why some people might like the excitement of trying to finish as soon as possible. Makes sense and that's great. But my personal preference is enjoy the mission and not rush.
So I agree that rushing doesn't allow time for some skills.
But it also just takes away from the fun of a mission for me.
By the way, I can also see why some people might like the excitement of trying to finish as soon as possible. Makes sense and that's great. But my personal preference is enjoy the mission and not rush.
SilentAssassin
YES, yes yes
I agree on this one, but do you need to start another topic about this?
many ppl have said this and you are right, its more fun when you can take your time for stuff, but pls I am 100% sure the devs know it already
I agree on this one, but do you need to start another topic about this?
many ppl have said this and you are right, its more fun when you can take your time for stuff, but pls I am 100% sure the devs know it already
Mr_eX
I like the timed missions because it means that the mission will be less of a time commitment. For example, if you know the Master reward for Arborstone is 30 minutes, then you know that if you have a halfwa-decent party it won't take you too much longer than that to complete the mission.
I wouldn't worry about it too much--I'm sure they're going to come up with a brand-new system for Chapter 3 that's unlike both the Prophecies and Factions reward systems.
I wouldn't worry about it too much--I'm sure they're going to come up with a brand-new system for Chapter 3 that's unlike both the Prophecies and Factions reward systems.
ChaoticCoyote
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Originally Posted by SilentAssassin
YES, yes yes
I agree on this one, but do you need to start another topic about this? many ppl have said this and you are right, its more fun when you can take your time for stuff, but pls I am 100% sure the devs know it already |
Factions is not a bad game; it just isn't my cup of tea. I'm glad it works well for PvP folk and Wammos.
What I would like is for ArenaNet to make the next expansion more PvE-focused, to balance out Factions. So I hope they *are* listening...
MistressLust
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Originally Posted by Slainster
I dislike timed missions full stop! I prefer to take things in my stride.. and as you say re-charge
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Russell.Crowe
...
Most of the groups I have been with don't care about time, and I have had more than plenty of time to recharge as a caster. I see no point to bitching about it, the time is just for those who want a challenge, you know... beat that very difficult mission in the shortest time possible. It is a great idea, I see no downside because you can still take it at whatever pace you want.
Most of the groups I have been with don't care about time, and I have had more than plenty of time to recharge as a caster. I see no point to bitching about it, the time is just for those who want a challenge, you know... beat that very difficult mission in the shortest time possible. It is a great idea, I see no downside because you can still take it at whatever pace you want.
bele
.... On the other side, it makes you rethink your strategies.
When failed for 3rd time with my Monk in Naphui quarter i knew sth was wrong with it.
I was using a low cost heal/prot build, that needs (i know it now) a recharge time, a quite decent one.
W/Mo-s where rushing in the mission but as long i had > 35-40 energy everything was going, more or less (hench was doing her job too). Until they rushed against the last Mesmer boss, surrounded with all the pletora of mobs, and i had only 20 energy.
ok, that ended quite painfully
So i'm now looking a more robust build that can handle that.
When failed for 3rd time with my Monk in Naphui quarter i knew sth was wrong with it.
I was using a low cost heal/prot build, that needs (i know it now) a recharge time, a quite decent one.
W/Mo-s where rushing in the mission but as long i had > 35-40 energy everything was going, more or less (hench was doing her job too). Until they rushed against the last Mesmer boss, surrounded with all the pletora of mobs, and i had only 20 energy.
ok, that ended quite painfully
So i'm now looking a more robust build that can handle that.
FalconDance
Timed missions are okay IF played smartly---but I agree it does not allow for casters to regen at all. It will be interesting when my elementalist minion mistress gets to Naphui.........will she have enough time to pull her little babies to help the team and to maintain them? We'll see.
mqstout
Another thing to look forward to that will probably further ruin my Factions experience: timed missions. Check.
Mimi Miyagi
Technically, ALL of the missions are timed, if you want the masters reward for it.
ChaoticCoyote
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Originally Posted by Mimi Miyagi
Technically, ALL of the missions are timed, if you want the masters reward for it.
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The Gayla Hatchery mission bases your level of success on the number of baby turtles that survive. Time is not a factor.
1 turtle = regular win
3 turtles = expert
5 turtles = master
Cador
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Originally Posted by bele
.... On the other side, it makes you rethink your strategies.
When failed for 3rd time with my Monk in Naphui quarter i knew sth was wrong with it. I was using a low cost heal/prot build, that needs (i know it now) a recharge time, a quite decent one. W/Mo-s where rushing in the mission but as long i had > 35-40 energy everything was going, more or less (hench was doing her job too). Until they rushed against the last Mesmer boss, surrounded with all the pletora of mobs, and i had only 20 energy. ok, that ended quite painfully So i'm now looking a more robust build that can handle that. |
MMSDome
o God why challenege us with timed missions and make the game hard. Let the game be easy so any ****tard can beat it.
WHY DO YOU COMPLAIN?!?!
Missions are tough for a reason, their are challeneges in game just like their are in life. So you may have to do the mission again after failing it, lets ***** and moan about it. Guys cmon im serious now, games werent meant to be entirely easy so you can get through it and farm your heart it. Play the game and beat it without making A-Net changing something to make it easier so the 'lesser fotunate' can beat the game easier.
Guild wars has challenges in it, try to overcome them without crying to much. If you cant beat it, you werent meant to and you should do what the bottom of a pepsi cap says to do 'Try again'
*In no way shape or form was this meant to be a flame
*
WHY DO YOU COMPLAIN?!?!
Missions are tough for a reason, their are challeneges in game just like their are in life. So you may have to do the mission again after failing it, lets ***** and moan about it. Guys cmon im serious now, games werent meant to be entirely easy so you can get through it and farm your heart it. Play the game and beat it without making A-Net changing something to make it easier so the 'lesser fotunate' can beat the game easier.
Guild wars has challenges in it, try to overcome them without crying to much. If you cant beat it, you werent meant to and you should do what the bottom of a pepsi cap says to do 'Try again'
*In no way shape or form was this meant to be a flame
*
Cacheelma
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Originally Posted by Cador
Nahpui tip dont kill the celestials until last, Trust me if u need help ill show u send me a pm my ign is in my prof.
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Just go with Kirin first. And don't stand around at one spot for too long for energy regen/whatever, and bring some good energy managements instead.
That, or take the longer route above if you're desperate enough.
Ristaron
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Originally Posted by MMSDome
o God why challenege us with timed missions and make the game hard. Let the game be easy so any ****tard can beat it.
WHY DO YOU COMPLAIN?!?! Missions are tough for a reason, their are challeneges in game just like their are in life. So you may have to do the mission again after failing it, lets ***** and moan about it. Guys cmon im serious now, games werent meant to be entirely easy so you can get through it and farm your heart it. Play the game and beat it without making A-Net changing something to make it easier so the 'lesser fotunate' can beat the game easier. Guild wars has challenges in it, try to overcome them without crying to much. If you cant beat it, you werent meant to and you should do what the bottom of a pepsi cap says to do 'Try again' *In no way shape or form was this meant to be a flame * |
ChaoticCoyote
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Originally Posted by MMSDome
o God why challenege us with timed missions and make the game hard. Let the game be easy so any ****tard can beat it.
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In fact, I said that I like to see some timed missions thrown in for variety's sake.
My problem is that the timed missions enforce poor behavior by Wammos, who insist on running like mad rabbits when a few seconds of patience would make the experience better for everyone.
MMSDome
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Originally Posted by ChaoticCoyote
No, that was not my point at all.
In fact, I said that I like to see some timed missions thrown in for variety's sake. My problem is that the timed missions enforce poor behavior by Wammos, who insist on running like mad rabbits when a few seconds of patience would make the experience better for everyone. |
Lurid
The thing we should also realize is this, most class combinations do not really need a cool down period, when the build is thought out and proper energy managment precautions are put into place. The only real reason this is necessary is if the previous mob was part of a huge over aggro. This is coming from the point of view from a Monk though, and opinons vary.
I persoanlly don't have an issue with them, until like the other night when I miss the Expert by a very small margin
I persoanlly don't have an issue with them, until like the other night when I miss the Expert by a very small margin
Avarre
Only one mission has a time limit, and it's quite high. The rest should be taken at your own pace, you can go back to do the master reward.
Generally, I'd prefer a team that moves fast to one that moves slow since most characters should be maintainable in long battle anyway. And rushing through hordes of mobs, smashing them in the charge is fun
Generally, I'd prefer a team that moves fast to one that moves slow since most characters should be maintainable in long battle anyway. And rushing through hordes of mobs, smashing them in the charge is fun
bele
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Originally Posted by Cador
Nahpui tip dont kill the celestials until last, Trust me if u need help ill show u send me a pm my ign is in my prof.
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Was helping a guildmate doing it. The important thing is that i learned a lesson there and it was a good one. The bad thing is that i couldn't help him.
The problem in that one was that it was a PUG , no comunication and , if i remember good, not even target calling. So in a Guild Team i'd tell them to go slower to recharge. If you do that in a PUG you just get yelled (not important) and create a bad atmosphere (very, very bad).
Avarre: "you can go back to do the master reward. " I'm afraid some of the ppl in PUG-s are doing the master reward, always. If you want it, just ask for "Master reward", like ppl ask for "Bonus" in Prophecies. The constant rushing, pointless rushing many times , makes the life of the rest of the team very hard. That + No comunication can lead to desaster.
Avarre : "most characters should be maintainable in long battle anyway" quoted for truth
Swinging Fists
If you don't want to rush the mission, make your intentions clear while in the outpost that you are NOT going for the master's, as you want to take your time. You should have no problem finding a group of like-minded people to take as long as you want to enjoy the mission.
If you want to go for the Master's, make your intentions clear while you are in the outpost that you want the Master's and intend to rush. Again, you should have no problem finding a group of like-minded people.
If part of the group wants to rush and part wants to take their time whether it's for the enjoyment or thinking they need to regen all day, your group is going to have problems even completing the mission at all. Just make your intentions clear in group formation, whatever they may be.
The argument that the timed missions are only for wammos is bogus. I have gotten the Protector of Cantha title on my Ranger, Monk, Necro (often as MM), and Warrior. When I put teams together for missions, I usually only take one warrior (except the last two), and we have little problem getting the job done.
If your group has good leadership, including putting the team together, going over skills, plans laid out before starting, knowing where to go and who to fight in the mission, target calling, and skill coordination, getting the Master's is not that hard.
People write in this thread about Nahpui Quarter. It's simple, really. Take the left portal. Use the map on Guildwiki for your path. Don't aggro unnecessarily. Have someone, preferably a ranger, but I've even done it as a monk, go ahead slightly and pull the next mob while the rest of the group is finishing off the previous. I emphasize "finishing off" because I don't mean just pull additional mobs, I mean get a head start on the pull by doing it while the group is "almost done" with the previous. And finally, when you get to the group with the final boss, pull only the final boss and kill it. Mission done. I don't even know if the advance pulling is required for the Master's, but I've been doing it and have had success.
If you want to go for the Master's, make your intentions clear while you are in the outpost that you want the Master's and intend to rush. Again, you should have no problem finding a group of like-minded people.
If part of the group wants to rush and part wants to take their time whether it's for the enjoyment or thinking they need to regen all day, your group is going to have problems even completing the mission at all. Just make your intentions clear in group formation, whatever they may be.
The argument that the timed missions are only for wammos is bogus. I have gotten the Protector of Cantha title on my Ranger, Monk, Necro (often as MM), and Warrior. When I put teams together for missions, I usually only take one warrior (except the last two), and we have little problem getting the job done.
If your group has good leadership, including putting the team together, going over skills, plans laid out before starting, knowing where to go and who to fight in the mission, target calling, and skill coordination, getting the Master's is not that hard.
People write in this thread about Nahpui Quarter. It's simple, really. Take the left portal. Use the map on Guildwiki for your path. Don't aggro unnecessarily. Have someone, preferably a ranger, but I've even done it as a monk, go ahead slightly and pull the next mob while the rest of the group is finishing off the previous. I emphasize "finishing off" because I don't mean just pull additional mobs, I mean get a head start on the pull by doing it while the group is "almost done" with the previous. And finally, when you get to the group with the final boss, pull only the final boss and kill it. Mission done. I don't even know if the advance pulling is required for the Master's, but I've been doing it and have had success.
CorstedPirate
My primary character is a monk, I enjoy prooving that I can keep up. I am only 1 sword away from Protector of Cantha. Raisu Palace of course, I am avoiding that place until my guildies get there. Tired of people lying about getting masters just to get a monk in the group.
Tijger
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Originally Posted by ChaoticCoyote
No, that was not my point at all.
In fact, I said that I like to see some timed missions thrown in for variety's sake. My problem is that the timed missions enforce poor behavior by Wammos, who insist on running like mad rabbits when a few seconds of patience would make the experience better for everyone. |
Getting Masters takes teamwork, decent players and smart play, not rushing ahead like a brainless git.
In all fairness, I like the Cantha style missions, getting Masters feels much more like an accomplishment then the Tyria bonus'.
Finally getting Eternal Grove really made me go "YEH", never had that feeling in Prophecies.
Rhedd
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Originally Posted by MMSDome
yes and sadly enough A-Net cannot change a wammo's attitude.
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The thing is, if there's a timer running, then suddenly the idiot rushing wammos are doing the correct thing.
It's all fine and dandy to say, "Do the mission at a leisurely pace, then come back later to get the masters." That will work beautifully... if you're playing with nothing but friends and guildmates.
What if you aren't? What if (and I'm speaking on behalf of other people here, since I don't do this) you play with PUGs? What are the chances that you'll get eight people together who all can stand to know there's a timer running in the background, but will ignore it? I'll let you make up your own answer, but it's still zero.
I hate timers, for all the reasons stated above, plus one: I think it's lame. I want a mission to be hard to complete at masters, but I want it to be interesting, too, and maybe even (GASP) add a bit of extra plot to the RP side of the game. Adding a timer is the lamest way to make a mission... or anything... hard.
Kern Wolf
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Originally Posted by AxeMe
I've ended up - several times - using henchies when real people were available just because (besides all the other reasons listed above) it's more fun for me to take my time, especially when I'm playing a caster. And - because of the time limit - people zoom along. It's been especially difficult when playing a MM since I'm standing back there creating minions while everyone is running to the next area, then I stop a time or two - when needed - to zap a little health into the minions.
So I agree that rushing doesn't allow time for some skills. But it also just takes away from the fun of a mission for me. By the way, I can also see why some people might like the excitement of trying to finish as soon as possible. Makes sense and that's great. But my personal preference is enjoy the mission and not rush. |
remmeh
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Originally Posted by Avarre
Only one mission has a time limit, and it's quite high. The rest should be taken at your own pace, you can go back to do the master reward.
Generally, I'd prefer a team that moves fast to one that moves slow since most characters should be maintainable in long battle anyway. And rushing through hordes of mobs, smashing them in the charge is fun |
and my Ritualist did it in around 17min but that was because we bumrushed.
ChaoticCoyote
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Originally Posted by MMSDome
yes and sadly enough A-Net cannot change a wammo's attitude.
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SilentAssassin
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Originally Posted by ChaoticCoyote
I've recently run a number of Warrior-free groups, and am finding them both fun *and* successful. I think we all need to get out of the mentality that wammos are essential to a group's ability to win.
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Alodarn
I don't mind the timed missions, but I'd like a indicator for factions detailing time left for master/expert because as far as I can tell it does vary from mission to mission.
ChaoticCoyote
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Originally Posted by Tijger
In all fairness, I like the Cantha style missions, getting Masters feels much more like an accomplishment then the Tyria bonus'.
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For me, the Cantha campaign feels like "grind, grind, gring RUSH, grind, grind grind, RUSH, RUSH." I don't feel like I'm accomplishing anything in the Cantha Missions; there's no time to discuss strategy, or try new ideas -- just blow through, fast as you can, so you get to the next grind.
If you wonder why I'm even playing through the Cantha campaign: I find some parts of the game fascinating enough to keep the explorer in me from blowing a gasket over the gringing rush. And I have a 17yo daughter who is desperate to get a Phoenix, so I'm helping her monk through it all...
SirShadowrunner
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Originally Posted by ChaoticCoyote
I have the opposite opinion. I feel much mroe accomplishment from winning "Defender of Tyria" than I do from trying to get "Defender of Cantha". Getting the bonus in Cantha is about being fast, and that's it.
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bonus to, not to many the first time thru, and had 25 missions to actually complete game. Factions comes up way short of this, 13 total for
both sides together, so they added the "time-bonus" to get more re-play
out it, I really do like some of the missions in Factions, just wish they
had put more in the Kurzick and Luxon areas, I have hope we will see some
stuff added shortly, there is alot of map covered by fog.
MMSDome
If you are having trouble with energy management and have mesmer primary or secondary this will sound crazy but it works for me. Use Ethereal Burden! I have 16 illusion when i use it so that makes a huge difference but cast it right before an enemy is gonna die and its a quick 8 energy.
Warriors arent needed at all either. Was doing UW last night and my guild leader was the only warrior in the group, he caught all aggro everytime and we probably got to the smites and cleared them all in less then a half hour, maybe quicker. I know it was quick!
Timed missions are a break from the average boring mission when your monk says "brb afk". Try to enjoy them, not hate them.
Warriors arent needed at all either. Was doing UW last night and my guild leader was the only warrior in the group, he caught all aggro everytime and we probably got to the smites and cleared them all in less then a half hour, maybe quicker. I know it was quick!
Timed missions are a break from the average boring mission when your monk says "brb afk". Try to enjoy them, not hate them.