That is all.
A quick word of advice to anyone just starting an Assassin
Crim_Vos_Telvannis
That is all.
Male Gigolo
lol 
i guess i really wont try this when i get factions...
i have played with a couple of assassins in prophecy missions and they really seem to take a beating. I have to keep healing them...anyways that could be coz the guy isn't playing his role well.
i guess i really wont try this when i get factions...
i have played with a couple of assassins in prophecy missions and they really seem to take a beating. I have to keep healing them...anyways that could be coz the guy isn't playing his role well.
WildmouseX
yup, that's what happens when you try to tank with assassin's. play the class like a moron, end up eating dirt.
Zecarn
aye, i have an assasin, and i play it right. in and out. but i see plenty of retards who just go in....and dont come out. well...they do come out...but only from rebirth ><
Pick Me
Lol, I love that picture.
However, I think the Assassin is one of the best characters in the game, purely for the learning experience.
People run in an think they can tank. Warriors had that same problem at the beginning too (until they realized how good tactics can be). Assassins fight hand-to-hand, but lack defense (both armor and skills). So they fall just like squishies. So what can be learnd from the Assassin (everyone should learn this), when you are getting pounded (even a Warrior) and no one is able to heal you, do whatever you can to escape your current situation. Defense (skill or spell) and run. Warriors still don't see that they are going to die until its too late. Some warriors say "My health is 100 of 535", they should get the picture, that your health will continue to drop until you do something about it. Monks are in the back of the line, as are ritualists, but monsters can actually walk around, attack from range, or even come from behind the group and attack the monks. So don't always expect that no one is attacking your healers, even if you are surrounded.
Basically, everyone should be always on the move. If you are taking more than 50% damage without any healing, its time for you to switch gears. Change your tactics and get yourself into a better position. Otherwise you too will end up dead.
This is why I like the Assassin, it has weak armor, good damaging skills (which forces you to go head-to-head with monsters) and 2 ways of escape. The defense spell is weak, so you can run or you can teleport away. While everyone thinks the Assassin sucks, it is a good way to learn when to flee. Thats the only thing the Assassin has going for it, the learning experience.
However, I think the Assassin is one of the best characters in the game, purely for the learning experience.
People run in an think they can tank. Warriors had that same problem at the beginning too (until they realized how good tactics can be). Assassins fight hand-to-hand, but lack defense (both armor and skills). So they fall just like squishies. So what can be learnd from the Assassin (everyone should learn this), when you are getting pounded (even a Warrior) and no one is able to heal you, do whatever you can to escape your current situation. Defense (skill or spell) and run. Warriors still don't see that they are going to die until its too late. Some warriors say "My health is 100 of 535", they should get the picture, that your health will continue to drop until you do something about it. Monks are in the back of the line, as are ritualists, but monsters can actually walk around, attack from range, or even come from behind the group and attack the monks. So don't always expect that no one is attacking your healers, even if you are surrounded.
Basically, everyone should be always on the move. If you are taking more than 50% damage without any healing, its time for you to switch gears. Change your tactics and get yourself into a better position. Otherwise you too will end up dead.
This is why I like the Assassin, it has weak armor, good damaging skills (which forces you to go head-to-head with monsters) and 2 ways of escape. The defense spell is weak, so you can run or you can teleport away. While everyone thinks the Assassin sucks, it is a good way to learn when to flee. Thats the only thing the Assassin has going for it, the learning experience.
Splatter Mcnasty
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crim_Vos_Telvannis
That is all.
You sir, are a moron. With the right build, an assassin can do just as well as any other class.I solo farm with assassin...in Cantha and Tyria
People like you just add to the Assassin-hate that has taken over most PUGs these days. Stop bashing on assassins and start posting builds that help people play better.
Male Gigolo
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zecarn
aye, i have an assasin, and i play it right. in and out. but i see plenty of retards who just go in....and dont come out. well...they do come out...but only from rebirth ><
@ Crim_Vos_Telvannis nice printscreen lol.
lol. ya i think that's the way that class is supposed to be played.
I still see those "SUPERMAN" warriors alot. I think most of the time the problem is they wait for the monks to heal. They have ways of healing themselves but absolutely refuse to use it until they have 50 health left. And 2 weeks ago I was doing THK mission and there was this ranger who waited til his health was below 100 before he decided to use Troll Unguent. that was soo hilarious.
Anyway guys I totally have no clue about the assassin class. my question is if they have a self heal skill like Heal Signet like the warriors?
lol. ya i think that's the way that class is supposed to be played.
I still see those "SUPERMAN" warriors alot.
I think most of the time the problem is they wait for the monks to heal. They have ways of healing themselves but absolutely refuse to use it until they have 50 health left. And 2 weeks ago I was doing THK mission and there was this ranger who waited til his health was below 100 before he decided to use Troll Unguent. that was soo hilarious. Anyway guys I totally have no clue about the assassin class. my question is if they have a self heal skill like Heal Signet like the warriors?
Crim_Vos_Telvannis
Quote:
Originally Posted by Splatter Mcnasty
You sir, are a moron. With the right build, an assassin can do just as well as any other class.
I solo farm with assassin...in Cantha and Tyria
People like you just add to the Assassin-hate that has taken over most PUGs these days. Stop bashing on assassins and start posting builds that help people play better.
Oh calm down, I didn't say they sucked.
I said if you're starting an Assassin, you will die. A lot.
Just take a pill and enjoy the funny picture.
I solo farm with assassin...in Cantha and Tyria
People like you just add to the Assassin-hate that has taken over most PUGs these days. Stop bashing on assassins and start posting builds that help people play better.
Oh calm down, I didn't say they sucked.
I said if you're starting an Assassin, you will die. A lot.
Just take a pill and enjoy the funny picture.
wilebill
Many assassins do die a lot. I did at first. The assassin has a steep learning curve. The most important lesson is get in, do what you can, get out at the first sign of trouble.
uncleBen
I went for the survivor title ... died once at lvl 19 on a quest that would've made me lvl 20 and a survivor... *sigh* that hurts, was hoping people would let me group if I had that lol. Still 1 death at lvl 20 is still pretty rockin! haha
isamu kurosawa
Quote:
Originally Posted by uncleBen
I went for the survivor title ... died once at lvl 19 on a quest that would've made me lvl 20 and a survivor... *sigh* that hurts, was hoping people would let me group if I had that lol. Still 1 death at lvl 20 is still pretty rockin! haha
I was going for suvivor for the same reason, then died to lag 
GloryFox
Quote:
I solo farm with assassin...in Cantha and Tyria
People like you just add to the Assassin-hate that has taken over most PUGs these days. Stop bashing on assassins and start posting builds that help people play better. I must agree with the above post. I have found my Assassin build to be far more effective in PvE then my double echo Ele nuker because of an assassin’s ability to surgically strike. This kind of post just adds to assassin hate.
SparhawkJC
What adds to assassin hate are unskilled assassins.
Claymore
Basically Assassins are wildcards, when the battle starts turn then loose, if the assassin is good he/she knows how to stay alive. If they have even grasped this concept they also know that standing toe to toe with a tank is a bad Idea.
We just have to be tolerant and wait it out, just like the rangers when Prophecies first came out, nobody knew how to play them and there was ranger hate. The unskilled assassins will grow tired of eating dirt and quit the class, eventually those that remain will be quality assassins, and the class will have its day.
We just have to be tolerant and wait it out, just like the rangers when Prophecies first came out, nobody knew how to play them and there was ranger hate. The unskilled assassins will grow tired of eating dirt and quit the class, eventually those that remain will be quality assassins, and the class will have its day.
Killmur
Quote:
Originally Posted by Claymore
Basically Assassins are wildcards, when the battle starts turn then loose, if the assassin is good he/she knows how to stay alive. If they have even grasped this concept they also know that standing toe to toe with a tank is a bad Idea.
We just have to be tolerant and wait it out, just like the rangers when Prophecies first came out, nobody knew how to play them and there was ranger hate. The unskilled assassins will grow tired of eating dirt and quit the class, eventually those that remain will be quality assassins, and the class will have its day. Good advice my man. I want to hate the assasin class but yet I want to keep playing it. I have chosen to give the class another try. Now my only beef is daggers. I have noticed that you gotta be uber rich to afford a good pair of greens or a good pair of zealous daggers.
We just have to be tolerant and wait it out, just like the rangers when Prophecies first came out, nobody knew how to play them and there was ranger hate. The unskilled assassins will grow tired of eating dirt and quit the class, eventually those that remain will be quality assassins, and the class will have its day. Good advice my man. I want to hate the assasin class but yet I want to keep playing it. I have chosen to give the class another try. Now my only beef is daggers. I have noticed that you gotta be uber rich to afford a good pair of greens or a good pair of zealous daggers.
Vecte
Quote:
Originally Posted by Killmur
Good advice my man. I want to hate the assasin class but yet I want to keep playing it. I have chosen to give the class another try. Now my only beef is daggers. I have noticed that you gotta be uber rich to afford a good pair of greens or a good pair of zealous daggers.
i picked up a pair of gold req8 golden talons 15^50 7-17 for 40k, and i bought a zealous mod and a +30 fortitude mod from a person for 25k. In essence, that really is not that bad of a price. just look around, you just need to find the right people willing to sell.
as for the picture posted, i don't really see it as a bad thing. if you read the title, it says, a word of advice for those making an assassin. that means this picture is aiming towards players new to the class. it is warning them that they will die a lot when they first start playing the class. Once they have played it enough, they will learn how to stay alive and become very useful.
*word of advice to any new assassins. if and when you do die a good bit, its not the class, it is the player. just keep going at it until you can get the proper skills and skill caps, and you will be able to play the class like it is meant to be played. Also, watch the assassin henchmen, for some reason they seem to play the assassin how its meant to be played*
as for the picture posted, i don't really see it as a bad thing. if you read the title, it says, a word of advice for those making an assassin. that means this picture is aiming towards players new to the class. it is warning them that they will die a lot when they first start playing the class. Once they have played it enough, they will learn how to stay alive and become very useful.
*word of advice to any new assassins. if and when you do die a good bit, its not the class, it is the player. just keep going at it until you can get the proper skills and skill caps, and you will be able to play the class like it is meant to be played. Also, watch the assassin henchmen, for some reason they seem to play the assassin how its meant to be played
*
wsmcasey
All professions are good. Only "PEOPLE" can give a certain profession a bad name by not understanding how to play their class with a group of other real people.
Example: I was doing the "Unwelcomed Guest" 15 point attribute quest last night. Here's the party line up:
ME....lvl15 Ranger Trapper (group leader)
lvl14 healer monk
lvl17 assasin
lvl20 Ranger Trapper (my guildie came to help)
lvl20 air elementalist
lvl14 ritualist
Now....you might be thinking that this would be a piece of cake because we have level 20's in our group and we are doing a quest on the starter island, but it was a nightmare!
My basic plan, since I was group leader:
1)Rangers set traps and pull on the front lines.
2)monk stays on the back line and heals.
3)ritualist and elementalist stay on the back line and help clean up the monsters that didn't die and also focus on enemy casters.
4)assasin stays on the back line to protect our casters from enemies that break thru our front line.
Seemed like a good plan..............guess what..........the assasin was awesome and did his job! Everyone on the team was doing an awesome job, except for one, and it only takes one......
The lvl20 elementalist screwed over our team the entire quest and insisted on pulling and or running in to mobs and getting her self killed.
After the elementalist died her 5th time, we just gave up on her and left her dead for the rest of the quest. I'm sure she still got her 15 attribute points after the quest was over by speaking with the npc in town, but she really didn't deserve it.
Example: I was doing the "Unwelcomed Guest" 15 point attribute quest last night. Here's the party line up:
ME....lvl15 Ranger Trapper (group leader)
lvl14 healer monk
lvl17 assasin
lvl20 Ranger Trapper (my guildie came to help)
lvl20 air elementalist
lvl14 ritualist
Now....you might be thinking that this would be a piece of cake because we have level 20's in our group and we are doing a quest on the starter island, but it was a nightmare!
My basic plan, since I was group leader:
1)Rangers set traps and pull on the front lines.
2)monk stays on the back line and heals.
3)ritualist and elementalist stay on the back line and help clean up the monsters that didn't die and also focus on enemy casters.
4)assasin stays on the back line to protect our casters from enemies that break thru our front line.
Seemed like a good plan..............guess what..........the assasin was awesome and did his job! Everyone on the team was doing an awesome job, except for one, and it only takes one......
The lvl20 elementalist screwed over our team the entire quest and insisted on pulling and or running in to mobs and getting her self killed.
After the elementalist died her 5th time, we just gave up on her and left her dead for the rest of the quest.
I'm sure she still got her 15 attribute points after the quest was over by speaking with the npc in town, but she really didn't deserve it.
GloryFox
Quote:
posted by KillmurGood advice my man. I want to hate the assasin class but yet I want to keep playing it. I have chosen to give the class another try. Now my only beef is daggers. I have noticed that you gotta be uber rich to afford a good pair of greens or a good pair of zealous daggers. Do what I did.
Make your assassin for now and grab the zealous daggers with one of your other characters when you get your green option at the end of factions. It makes all the difference in the world.
Killmur
Vecte you might be able to afford 65K but I can't. I have noticed that really good mods and daggers for assasins are well over 30-40K+. I am not rich at all. I only have about 50K in storage. I can't afford to waste all my hard earned gold on items that will drain me of my funds. I have 6 characters to maintain. Aint easy getting gear for a assasin. All I have are SHiro's Blades(Nice skin, icky requirement) and Daggers of Xuekao(nice stats but not worth using).
Gloryfox: I might do that.
Sidenote: I just snagged at the last 29 seconds of the auction a sweet pair of Celestial Daggers for 5K. Skin aint all that great but meh so what. 7-16, Requires 8 in Dagger, 15^50 and +7 Vs Physical. Stats are not bad. Just need to add a zealous mod for now.
Gloryfox: I might do that.
Sidenote: I just snagged at the last 29 seconds of the auction a sweet pair of Celestial Daggers for 5K. Skin aint all that great but meh so what. 7-16, Requires 8 in Dagger, 15^50 and +7 Vs Physical. Stats are not bad. Just need to add a zealous mod for now.
Vecte
well killmur, i realise your distress in not being able to afford a nice pair of daggers, imo, any assassin should have a good pair of daggers. let me know what mods you like, and ill get you a pair.
Claymore
Now talk about assassins sticking together, Good form Vecte.
Killmur
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vecte
well killmur, i realise your distress in not being able to afford a nice pair of daggers, imo, any assassin should have a good pair of daggers. let me know what mods you like, and ill get you a pair.
Thanx for the offer Vecte. Through trial and error I will hopefuly make a stellar assasin out of my A/Mo. Never give up on a class. If it looks too hard to play then don't play that class. However if it does seem like a fun class then try playing it again. Same way with the assasin class.
Vecte
well mate, the offer still stands. be cool to see some of you in game. my assassins name is Sektor Xiang. maybe ill see you sometime.
Human1
I just started one and I'll admit that I've died quite a few times. It's tough, even the lvl6 Kappas can own you forever. But I enjoy playing the class and am getting better at it.
namkey
Hmm, just checked the statistics of my assasin.
Age: 25 hours
Deaths: 243
Age: 25 hours
Deaths: 243
Tartarus1040
Age: 102 Hours 51 minutes
Deaths: 591
Result: I rarely die now.
I haven't finished the game yet because of the damned error 007's I keep getting. But I know how to survive in PvE, and I've been PvPing a lot with my Assassin/PvP Assassin. So I've been learning quite a bit about the class, and lemme tell ya, it's got some serious potential.
Deaths: 591
Result: I rarely die now.
I haven't finished the game yet because of the damned error 007's I keep getting. But I know how to survive in PvE, and I've been PvPing a lot with my Assassin/PvP Assassin. So I've been learning quite a bit about the class, and lemme tell ya, it's got some serious potential.
Xaero Gouki Kriegor
completed the game on my assassin, gotta say i am still glad to be alive and not be dead from a furious heart attack from the pain and anguish i had to go through to get groups. i ended up teaming up with 1 mm from my guild and rest henchies just to get raisu palace done, and yes it can be henched fully, mm just makes it alot easier, make sure you take danika and talon
dfscott
Quote:
Originally Posted by GloryFox
Do what I did.
Make your assassin for now and grab the zealous daggers with one of your other characters when you get your green option at the end of factions. It makes all the difference in the world. I did the same thing. My mesmer finished the game and didn't see anything she was interested in, so I picked up the Ceremonials for my 'sin. In fact, I still have an unused amulet since my rit wasn't interested in anything either. I was thinking about getting Shiro's Blades just because they look cool.
Make your assassin for now and grab the zealous daggers with one of your other characters when you get your green option at the end of factions. It makes all the difference in the world. I did the same thing. My mesmer finished the game and didn't see anything she was interested in, so I picked up the Ceremonials for my 'sin. In fact, I still have an unused amulet since my rit wasn't interested in anything either. I was thinking about getting Shiro's Blades just because they look cool.
Spura
Quote:
Originally Posted by wilebill
Many assassins do die a lot. I did at first. The assassin has a steep learning curve. The most important lesson is get in, do what you can, get out at the first sign of trouble.
You end up doing way less damage than a tank. I don't see how people can't figure this out. If you just port in and out and most of the time don't fight, then your impact on fight is gonna be small. You can't outdps a tank if you keep avoiding fight. And in the end that tank will do more damage than your constantly retreating assassin AND at the same time keep enemies away from casters. So any tank > assassin in pve. The only pve builds worth anything are AP builds, because they have higher DPS than tanks.
WildmouseX
why can't people comprehend that assassins and wars play compleately different roles. there is no point in continueing to compare apples to oranges.
tanks, by definition stand there in the front lines like idiots and get pounded on by other tanks and enemy casters. assassins stay back by your casters and mop up any foes that the tank lets run past him (*which they all do, in every fitght), then chases down the foes casters 1 at a time.
if a slow as hell war goes running around his back lines to defend his casters, or going after the enemy casters - all he does is open up his casters to being slaughtered by the other sides wars. just as if an assassin tries to take on a group of war's he dies.
tanks take the least ammout of intelgence to play, and due to this the majority of people playing them tend to believe that they can win a fight all by themselves, and don't give a rats arse about group stragity with the exception of haveing a monk to keep them alive.
the ability of the assassin to drop single targets faster then anyone (with maybe the exception of the mes), combined with a stragity of defending their casters, and takeing out enemy casters, makes quick work for the party as a whole.
an assassin defending the back line keeps monks alive to heal the tanks... an assassin teleporting into the enemy back lines and droping casters 1 at a time, keeps the tank from being hexed to death and stops their monks from healing the guys the tank is pounding on.
in short, the tank stands there takeing hits while the rest of the group kills the enemy, the assassin runs around defending the group and helping them take out the enemy. - two compleately different roles.
and yes, assassins drop enemies 1 on 1 faster then any war tank - even when takeing on wars... in the short time an assassin is attacking, he can do 200 - 300 hp of damage in 3 hits, something that takes the tank about 60 seconds of low dmg auto swinging to build adrenlyn for... in that same dmg spike, the assassin also add's 12-18 seconds of bleading, posion, deap wound, and with the right teleport even cripple. thussly imobiliseing and increaseing his dmg after he has disengaged his target. - the majority of the guys i kill with my ass fall over well after i've teleported away and started after someone else. in fact the only time i even get hit by the death nova from an afflicted i kill, is when i sacrifice myself on a monk to ensure that he drops, and i tend to kill twice as many afflicted as my teams tanks do.
bottom line is, if your only smart enough to sit there and watch your character auto swing for a min untill you can use a skill - stick with a tank. -if your smart enough to be able to watch the fight, pick stratigic targets, and exicute an actual well thought out attack patern, then you can do more for the group then any tank could posibly achive.
tanks, by definition stand there in the front lines like idiots and get pounded on by other tanks and enemy casters. assassins stay back by your casters and mop up any foes that the tank lets run past him (*which they all do, in every fitght), then chases down the foes casters 1 at a time.
if a slow as hell war goes running around his back lines to defend his casters, or going after the enemy casters - all he does is open up his casters to being slaughtered by the other sides wars. just as if an assassin tries to take on a group of war's he dies.
tanks take the least ammout of intelgence to play, and due to this the majority of people playing them tend to believe that they can win a fight all by themselves, and don't give a rats arse about group stragity with the exception of haveing a monk to keep them alive.
the ability of the assassin to drop single targets faster then anyone (with maybe the exception of the mes), combined with a stragity of defending their casters, and takeing out enemy casters, makes quick work for the party as a whole.
an assassin defending the back line keeps monks alive to heal the tanks... an assassin teleporting into the enemy back lines and droping casters 1 at a time, keeps the tank from being hexed to death and stops their monks from healing the guys the tank is pounding on.
in short, the tank stands there takeing hits while the rest of the group kills the enemy, the assassin runs around defending the group and helping them take out the enemy. - two compleately different roles.
and yes, assassins drop enemies 1 on 1 faster then any war tank - even when takeing on wars... in the short time an assassin is attacking, he can do 200 - 300 hp of damage in 3 hits, something that takes the tank about 60 seconds of low dmg auto swinging to build adrenlyn for... in that same dmg spike, the assassin also add's 12-18 seconds of bleading, posion, deap wound, and with the right teleport even cripple. thussly imobiliseing and increaseing his dmg after he has disengaged his target. - the majority of the guys i kill with my ass fall over well after i've teleported away and started after someone else. in fact the only time i even get hit by the death nova from an afflicted i kill, is when i sacrifice myself on a monk to ensure that he drops, and i tend to kill twice as many afflicted as my teams tanks do.
bottom line is, if your only smart enough to sit there and watch your character auto swing for a min untill you can use a skill - stick with a tank. -if your smart enough to be able to watch the fight, pick stratigic targets, and exicute an actual well thought out attack patern, then you can do more for the group then any tank could posibly achive.
DieInBasra
Quote:
Spura
Quote:
Originally Posted by WildmouseX
why can't people comprehend that assassins and wars play compleately different roles. there is no point in continueing to compare apples to oranges.
tanks, by definition stand there in the front lines like idiots and get pounded on by other tanks and enemy casters. assassins stay back by your casters and mop up any foes that the tank lets run past him (*which they all do, in every fitght), then chases down the foes casters 1 at a time.
if a slow as hell war goes running around his back lines to defend his casters, or going after the enemy casters - all he does is open up his casters to being slaughtered by the other sides wars. just as if an assassin tries to take on a group of war's he dies.
tanks take the least ammout of intelgence to play, and due to this the majority of people playing them tend to believe that they can win a fight all by themselves, and don't give a rats arse about group stragity with the exception of haveing a monk to keep them alive.
the ability of the assassin to drop single targets faster then anyone (with maybe the exception of the mes), combined with a stragity of defending their casters, and takeing out enemy casters, makes quick work for the party as a whole.
an assassin defending the back line keeps monks alive to heal the tanks... an assassin teleporting into the enemy back lines and droping casters 1 at a time, keeps the tank from being hexed to death and stops their monks from healing the guys the tank is pounding on.
in short, the tank stands there takeing hits while the rest of the group kills the enemy, the assassin runs around defending the group and helping them take out the enemy. - two compleately different roles.
and yes, assassins drop enemies 1 on 1 faster then any war tank - even when takeing on wars... in the short time an assassin is attacking, he can do 200 - 300 hp of damage in 3 hits, something that takes the tank about 60 seconds of low dmg auto swinging to build adrenlyn for... in that same dmg spike, the assassin also add's 12-18 seconds of bleading, posion, deap wound, and with the right teleport even cripple. thussly imobiliseing and increaseing his dmg after he has disengaged his target. - the majority of the guys i kill with my ass fall over well after i've teleported away and started after someone else. in fact the only time i even get hit by the death nova from an afflicted i kill, is when i sacrifice myself on a monk to ensure that he drops, and i tend to kill twice as many afflicted as my teams tanks do.
bottom line is, if your only smart enough to sit there and watch your character auto swing for a min untill you can use a skill - stick with a tank. -if your smart enough to be able to watch the fight, pick stratigic targets, and exicute an actual well thought out attack patern, then you can do more for the group then any tank could posibly achive. As dieinbasra pointed out, you numbers are mostly bull. I play assassin practically all the time, ever since factions got out, so I am not bashing something I don't know. And oh, I don't just autoattack and tank with assassin. It is also the reason why I don't buy this "different roles" crap. You are desperate to find a role, a reason for other players to take you along. And your reason is some kind of surgical strikes or something.
The whole reasoning is flawed, because you claim you take out opposing casters, something slow warrior can't.
- Well a warrior can sprint just as easily and do that, not to mention warrior with assassin secondary can easily use AoD.
- Also unless they are healers it usually doesn;t make much difference in pve who you kill first in a group.
- The problem of adrenaline is easily adressed by Auspicious Parry or Dragon Slash.
- Precision strikes can be carried out by casters. A simple Backfire will work on monk monsters just as well as your attacks.
Also when you teleport a lot in and out, you do less damage. It makes you like Air Elementalist that puts his ass in melee range.
The only build that does serious damage is AP one with black lotus strike and twising fangs. Being able to inflict deep wound on every target so rapidly is impressive. But you need to attack attack attack to be useful to the group, no teleporting around.
You see, there are dumb assassins, that die alot because they tank without proper skills. And then there are slightly smarter assholes who think they are godlike because they don't die because of teleports. None of them realise it takes more than staying alive to be useful party addition. And all the various parts of this supposed "role" of assassin are easily performed by various other classes. As much as I love assassin class, I am not blind to it's faults, which are too many(melee spiker with low armor ftl, low crit % on lvl 28 enemies, too many slots spent just to ass around the battlefield with teleports, vulnerable to warrior hate AND energy denial, attack skill chains are conditional, warrior's aren't).
If you wanna play pve with assassin get some kind of evasion on him, AP combo and some necro to give you OoV and no teleport skills.
tanks, by definition stand there in the front lines like idiots and get pounded on by other tanks and enemy casters. assassins stay back by your casters and mop up any foes that the tank lets run past him (*which they all do, in every fitght), then chases down the foes casters 1 at a time.
if a slow as hell war goes running around his back lines to defend his casters, or going after the enemy casters - all he does is open up his casters to being slaughtered by the other sides wars. just as if an assassin tries to take on a group of war's he dies.
tanks take the least ammout of intelgence to play, and due to this the majority of people playing them tend to believe that they can win a fight all by themselves, and don't give a rats arse about group stragity with the exception of haveing a monk to keep them alive.
the ability of the assassin to drop single targets faster then anyone (with maybe the exception of the mes), combined with a stragity of defending their casters, and takeing out enemy casters, makes quick work for the party as a whole.
an assassin defending the back line keeps monks alive to heal the tanks... an assassin teleporting into the enemy back lines and droping casters 1 at a time, keeps the tank from being hexed to death and stops their monks from healing the guys the tank is pounding on.
in short, the tank stands there takeing hits while the rest of the group kills the enemy, the assassin runs around defending the group and helping them take out the enemy. - two compleately different roles.
and yes, assassins drop enemies 1 on 1 faster then any war tank - even when takeing on wars... in the short time an assassin is attacking, he can do 200 - 300 hp of damage in 3 hits, something that takes the tank about 60 seconds of low dmg auto swinging to build adrenlyn for... in that same dmg spike, the assassin also add's 12-18 seconds of bleading, posion, deap wound, and with the right teleport even cripple. thussly imobiliseing and increaseing his dmg after he has disengaged his target. - the majority of the guys i kill with my ass fall over well after i've teleported away and started after someone else. in fact the only time i even get hit by the death nova from an afflicted i kill, is when i sacrifice myself on a monk to ensure that he drops, and i tend to kill twice as many afflicted as my teams tanks do.
bottom line is, if your only smart enough to sit there and watch your character auto swing for a min untill you can use a skill - stick with a tank. -if your smart enough to be able to watch the fight, pick stratigic targets, and exicute an actual well thought out attack patern, then you can do more for the group then any tank could posibly achive. As dieinbasra pointed out, you numbers are mostly bull. I play assassin practically all the time, ever since factions got out, so I am not bashing something I don't know. And oh, I don't just autoattack and tank with assassin. It is also the reason why I don't buy this "different roles" crap. You are desperate to find a role, a reason for other players to take you along. And your reason is some kind of surgical strikes or something.
The whole reasoning is flawed, because you claim you take out opposing casters, something slow warrior can't.
- Well a warrior can sprint just as easily and do that, not to mention warrior with assassin secondary can easily use AoD.
- Also unless they are healers it usually doesn;t make much difference in pve who you kill first in a group.
- The problem of adrenaline is easily adressed by Auspicious Parry or Dragon Slash.
- Precision strikes can be carried out by casters. A simple Backfire will work on monk monsters just as well as your attacks.
Also when you teleport a lot in and out, you do less damage. It makes you like Air Elementalist that puts his ass in melee range.
The only build that does serious damage is AP one with black lotus strike and twising fangs. Being able to inflict deep wound on every target so rapidly is impressive. But you need to attack attack attack to be useful to the group, no teleporting around.
You see, there are dumb assassins, that die alot because they tank without proper skills. And then there are slightly smarter assholes who think they are godlike because they don't die because of teleports. None of them realise it takes more than staying alive to be useful party addition. And all the various parts of this supposed "role" of assassin are easily performed by various other classes. As much as I love assassin class, I am not blind to it's faults, which are too many(melee spiker with low armor ftl, low crit % on lvl 28 enemies, too many slots spent just to ass around the battlefield with teleports, vulnerable to warrior hate AND energy denial, attack skill chains are conditional, warrior's aren't).
If you wanna play pve with assassin get some kind of evasion on him, AP combo and some necro to give you OoV and no teleport skills.
WildmouseX
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Originally Posted by DieInBasra
An eviscerate war can do 250-300 damage in two hits, and that takes 10.5 second to build the adren for that, shorter then the recharge on almost all assassin combos. Don't post crap like that. If people played tanks well, that is, with one or two tanking skills and then damageing skills, they would completely outclass the assassin damage-wise as well as being harder to kill.
and there in lies the problem, most people don't play tanks well, but they get away with it cuz they can soak up dmg. then when they go try to play the ass the same as they play their tank they get burned for it.
and again - the war's job is to stand around fighting large groups of mele fighters.. a well balenced team generaly has 3 foes on each war. so if it takes 10.5 seconds to put that kind of dmg on 1 foe.. the war idealy needs at least 31.5 seconds to deal with his combat responsibilities (provided he only has to use it once on each foe)
now if there's no assassin stoping the rusher that's killing the wars monk, it's going to take him longer, cuz he'll have to be healing himself more..... and if there's no assassin spikeing the hell out of the enemy monk so the rest of the team can finish him off, the guy the war is trying to eviscerate is going to be getting healed more, takeing the war longer to kill him....... and if there's no assassin spikeing the other enemy casters for the rest of the team to finish off, the war takes a ton of armor ignoreing dmg for longer peroids of time.
so what do we see here? without assassins, the war takes more dmg for longer peroids of time, and has to fight for longer peroids of time, and has to worry about his casters getting bum rushed by someone he let run past him.
wars fight groups of wars, casters fight with casters, monks and rits heal and fight when they can, rangers set up ambush's and spread conditions around...and assassins defend their casters from way-word melee fighters and acts as quick spike support for the rest of team (be it helping the casters or helping the war). - everyone has a role they all need to play to be an efective group, be design.
and again - the war's job is to stand around fighting large groups of mele fighters.. a well balenced team generaly has 3 foes on each war. so if it takes 10.5 seconds to put that kind of dmg on 1 foe.. the war idealy needs at least 31.5 seconds to deal with his combat responsibilities (provided he only has to use it once on each foe)
now if there's no assassin stoping the rusher that's killing the wars monk, it's going to take him longer, cuz he'll have to be healing himself more..... and if there's no assassin spikeing the hell out of the enemy monk so the rest of the team can finish him off, the guy the war is trying to eviscerate is going to be getting healed more, takeing the war longer to kill him....... and if there's no assassin spikeing the other enemy casters for the rest of the team to finish off, the war takes a ton of armor ignoreing dmg for longer peroids of time.
so what do we see here? without assassins, the war takes more dmg for longer peroids of time, and has to fight for longer peroids of time, and has to worry about his casters getting bum rushed by someone he let run past him.
wars fight groups of wars, casters fight with casters, monks and rits heal and fight when they can, rangers set up ambush's and spread conditions around...and assassins defend their casters from way-word melee fighters and acts as quick spike support for the rest of team (be it helping the casters or helping the war). - everyone has a role they all need to play to be an efective group, be design.
WildmouseX
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Originally Posted by Spura
when you play your assassin, do you stand in the front line auto-fighting the large group he's fighting? if not, then you are filling a different role then he is. - (and if you are, you are dyeing alot)
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- Well a warrior can sprint just as easily and do that, not to mention warrior with assassin secondary can easily use AoD.
- Also unless they are healers it usually doesn;t make much difference in pve who you kill first in a group.
- The problem of adrenaline is easily adressed by Auspicious Parry or Dragon Slash.
- Precision strikes can be carried out by casters. A simple Backfire will work on monk monsters just as well as your attacks.
and yes it does make a difference with who you kill first in PvE.... when your war runs up and colects agro, but that one foe war decides to rush the back line, he best be the first taget the team takes out, or ya'll are gunna end up hurting big ( unless of course your team has a smart sin, then the sin has to take him out while the others pick out a juicey squishy)......if your teams got a MM, and is dependent on those minnions to fight front line (team with only 1 war and no ass for example), you best be dropping the necros that blow up the corpses faster then your team can raise....... more then 2 mez's on the other side is going to drop any tank, peroid. - why? cuz they deal dmg through armor, and alternate draining him (just sit and watch them sometime)
just because PvE is easy compared to PvP, doesn't mean that you don't need any stragity, or teamwork.
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The only build that does serious damage is AP one with black lotus strike and twising fangs. Being able to inflict deep wound on every target so rapidly is impressive. But you need to attack attack attack to be useful to the group, no teleporting around. well, if you've got a picture in your mind of the ass teleporting away with every hit, then yes your idea of what will happen will become reality, too bad no-one ever has a consistantly clear picture of reality.
fact of the matter is, you fire off your 1st combo fast, then wait for them to recharge for a couple of seconds b4 you can fire them off again.
now you can either:
A: stay there auto attacking, while trying to compensate for dmg you do take by useing alot of secondary healing spells; and hopeing they don't decide to attack you back.
most of the time that's not going to be the case - most of the time they turn and smack you upside the head for half your life bar (provied your not useing runes, and have max armor). and then one or more of his buddies say " hey that looked fun, give me a turn". and then your heals fail to cover the added dmg - Bam - you die. (like most assassins i group with do)
Note: since daggers max at 19ish (17 + posibible +15% dmg mod) the attacks are mostly null anyway.
B: stand there and fire off a second combo, or paird up attacks. but since you hit him with a huge spike already, you are now a glowing threat to him, and those around him. so unless you've used your last 2-3 skill slots for dodgeing. guess what you may drop the guy you doubled combo'd, but you will get pounded by his buddies b4 your skills recharge, (like most assassins i've veiwed useing this stragity). - with caster level armor and health, you get to see how luckey of a punk you are.
furthermore in the generaly large fights, it often times requires at least 3 or 4 stances and steps + the heal - to keep from getting hurt-- with only the 2-3 slots this stragity allows, you can only realy count on your build for small fights only.
(and yes you are correct that there are attacks that charge very quickly, but they do ass for DMG (not refering to a sin this time). and the more attacks you throw, the more foes decide to attack you - takeing max dmg, long recharge; or week dmg, fast recharge combo's doesn't matter, you're still screwed the same way, eitherway)
C: use the remaining skill slots for dodgeing stances and shadowsteps, throw your combo, stand there dodgeing around untill it recharges.. -- this is avoiding dmg, which is what you HAVE to do to keep your assassin alive.
note: unless you are a real lone wolf and are somewhat isolated from your group, its often the case where a caster on your team will finish off your target while your dodgeing around, leaveing you walking around looking for another target anyway.
D: (my choice) run in and throw a spike combo + max conditions. - teleport out b4 anyone decides to agro you as a target, pick another target and watch your last one drop from all the conditions, pluss the rest of your team finishing him off.
A: never works, and is why most people trying to play assassins die - B: only works when you get lucky or use a teleport to leave after dealing 5 or so hits; and is why the rest of them die. - C: works nearly everytime, provided you brought enough stances and shadowsteps to stay dodgeing attacks untill you can use your combo again. - D: works nearly everytime, unless you decide to stick around and make sure you have finished off a monk who has death nova. --- speaking of which, if an ass is standing around fighting the afflicted untill they are on the ground, he will die from death nova's, it's only a matter of time.
Quote: Originally Posted by Spura
You see, there are dumb assassins, that die alot because they tank without proper skills. And then there are slightly smarter assholes who think they are godlike because they don't die because of teleports. None of them realise it takes more than staying alive to be useful party addition.
correct, it does take more then staying alive, it takes the assassin playing his role. -- and his role is to defend his casters from the enemy mele fighters, then work in conjunction with them to take out the enemy casters; while the tank stands around getting pounded on untill all the guys hitting him are dead. - however, in order to fullfill your job as an assassin, you must stay alive. (an assassin laying face down in the dirt because he died while trying to double combo an enemy all the way dead is worthless to everyone.)
- an effective team manages their health and plays all of the roles that their individul class's are designed to play.
- an effective team manages their health and plays all of the roles that their individul class's are designed to play.
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Originally Posted by Spura
And all the various parts of this supposed "role" of assassin are easily performed by various other classes. As much as I love assassin class, I am not blind to it's faults, which are too many(melee spiker with low armor ftl, low crit % on lvl 28 enemies, too many slots spent just to ass around the battlefield with teleports, vulnerable to warrior hate AND energy denial, attack skill chains are conditional, warrior's aren't).
name any other class besides the war, that can immobilise, spike, and drop enemy mele fighters that get behind the front line, with eficent speed and with enough skills to still be useible for their regular combat dueties? -- (and i'll add that while the war is capible of defending his casters from the 1-2 guys that rush past him with his normal skill set, in doing so he breaks the agro of the ones that did decide to attack him and unleash's more evil into his suport line then if he would have just stayed put, and again makeing this a suicide move) sure el's have whirl wind, inferno, wards and so on... but those take space's away from his AOE abilities, and wards do eventually end.----and sure mes's can drop them as fast.... but they don't have anything but interupts to prevent the rusher from severly hurting a teammate or two, leaveing your team's caster line healing each other; instead of healing the tank and attacking the enemy group----and sure the monk has sheild (or sig) of judgement, +their smiteing spells... but again more skills space dedicated to dealing with rusher's means less for healing.----- and sure the ranger can set up traps to do the job, but traps take time to set, and how often does a team sit around waiting for a mine feild to be deployed? (aside from in UW or FoW). for every skill the other casters have to dedicate to protecting themselves from the rushers, means less elemental AoE dmg: less healing: less mesmer mesmering: and less mass condition arrow barages. the assassin's normal skill line up, makes him ideal for dealing with the rushers, and ideal for inital strike's on the enemy squishies.-- like everyone else in the group, the assassin isn't a winning machine all by himself. and while yes, the assassin can drop individuals all by himself, at the risk of takeing dmg - he truely shines when he maximises his dmg on a target in conjunction with the rest of the casters, and then bugs out (teleport, dodge, run away whatever) while they finish it off - they all share in a realy quick kill and everyone stays alive enough to work together on the next target imediately. Quote:
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