What to do and not to do in a good group

Hi everyone,
After being in a group with so many people going afk and letting me and a couple of others do a mission i decided to write a guide on what you should and shouldnt do in a good group.

Gaining a group

When looking for a group you should say what class or build you are and LFP/LFG
A whisper also helps but accepting blind invites is often bad.
Blind inviting usually shows the leader is in a rush to do the mission/quest etc and the people invited blindly could be using a very bad build that is useless to that mission.
Leaders before entering always ask if the other members are ready and members should politely respond with ready or 1 or else you could start the mission with a caster with crap skills or similar.

Outside Outpost

When in the mission/quest do not leave without telling anyone. If you must leave say something along the lines "I am very sorry but i must go cos....."
If someone does leave do not go "oh sh*t we'll never do it now" instead ask the group wether you should leave and regroup.
You must NEVER go afk without telling the group you are, because it is harsh on the rest of the group you going afk and having them do the mission for you. I'd recomend you say "I have to go afk (say why if you want) " and ask if you can stay in group while afk and you should get a nice reply of yes.
If a party player is doing rubish do not go "you f*ckin n00b go back to ascalon"
Try to give them a tip on what there doing wrong. IF they swear at you in response just ignore it and know you did the right thing.

After Completion
After you have completed the mission/quest you could just leave but if you wanted to be nice you could say a friendly thanks and good bye and even go onto do the next mission.


I admit I dont do some of these things but this is how I'd like to be treated and how I and you should treat others,

Charqus

/congrats

Nice write up.

My motto
Treat others like you want to be treated

Now, we just need every player in GW to read this thread.......................

Amen to the OP

The thing that baffles me is that the OP's suggestions are basic common sense and manners expected of humans these days.

I don't like when people say: "LFG INVITE ME". People go to the bother of making a party, at least sell yourself a little. Naming your profession and tactics also helps, e.g. 'Ele fire nuker lfp', i mean, the few extra letters don't cause an RSI in your fingers.

I don't mind someone leaving because, after all, its a game but it isn't hard to tell people why you're leaving. Again, that's basic manners but some people are either too lazy, ignorant and/or selfish to do so.

I'd like to add that you should let the actual game-related conversation take precedence over the other chatter and pay attention to what people are saying/asking.

Also, your group should always have a basic functional strategy worked out. This is especially important in missions such as Gyala Hatchery, where you should be deciding who is going to be in charge of the crates and where they should be placed. If you have no plan, it makes it ten times harder to accomplish anything requiring coordination.

What to do in a group: Don't suck.

What not to do in a group: Suck.

Very simple.

I'd also like to add that you should have decent armor. In Factions, I suggest you should buy armor at Seitung Harbor. It is 15AL from your max and is quite cheap. Then, when you get to the mainland, you should get max armor.

I've seen people in Vizunah Square taking tons of damage and when asked about their armor, they said they still had starter armor because they were saving for 15k... People like this are a detriment to any team.

Nice basic write up

One other thing that is good for fyi....don't be mad as soon as you join a group if the leader says "type me your build" -- odds are this person not only knows what the hell they are doing but knows what EVERY build should be doing and is making sure that the mission/quest goes smoothly...take it as fortunate and the opportunity to learn the max build for what you are about to do...so DO bother to type up all your skills, I don't know about the rest of you team leaders out there but if i get a refusal; i iterate my good intentions and then boot the guy after he refuses to not show his noobness a few times...don't care you don't know, hate the player too stuck on his pride to say "my build could use improvement or be way off."

Also don't be afraid to say "this is my first time here and you can tell me whatever I should bring" and hopefully you've already took a quick look on wiki or somewhere so you are not entirely clueless. Mostly emphasize that you intend to listen well....I would be happier telling new people ahead of time what to expect in the Deep than deal with another jerk who won't admit they don't have a clue what to do and cause oni to blast off in all directions on casters >.< If the team kicks you faster than you can say "wtf" - odds are they are not confident in their abilities and you are better off elsewhere in a competent team.

"hopefully you've already took a quick look on wiki or somewhere so you are not entirely clueless. "

Why can't people just play the game?

I never looked at wiki or any spoilers before completing the game. If I know what's coming around every corner, why even play the game?

When in a group, I always ASSUME it is someone's first time. Therefore, I always discuss what is needed and I'm always the last person to skip cutscenes (unless, of course, we agreed to skip ahead of time).

I agree with everything here except when the leader asks me for my build, I leave.....if we're down to all having the same build just to make it into a group, than that's a problem.....

Last thing I want is having to explain why I like Skill A over Skill B. Its my build, my character and as long as I play it as best as I can, that should be enough. I am okay with the leader saying can you bring Skill A,B,C and D because they know the mission or they know other people's build within the group however, asking for all 8 skills is utterly ridiculous and IMHO direspectful.

There are a lot of times I wish I'd asked for someone's build before starting. Yes, it could result in discussion over certain skills, but if the leader is too "Do exactly what I say and nothing else", you can always leave. Asking can mean greater synergy (for example, removal of duplicates if they aren't needed), the removal of counter-functional skills (if two party members bring skills that end up backfiring on each other), and the ability for certain skills to be altered ("Could you please swap Frenzy for Flurry?")

Thanks and yes it is basic common sense
And thanks for the other people who are using common sense and putting forward possitive guide lines for people to use

Seems kind of contradictory to me... You wonder why you should play the game if you know about it ahead of time, but once you know, you tell others and take away their enjoyment ?

I don't know... Personally, I think in Prophecies it is ok to do things blind, as the bonuses can be fun to find and figure out what to do. Realistically, however, you will have to specifically choose your group, as nearly every PUG is going to share how the mission works ahead of time. You may find it necessary to do it with henches to avoid this.

But in Factions, this aspect isn't really present. For the most part, it is just slaughtering the mobs as quickly and efficiently as possible. Certain missions require certain strategies, such as Unwaking Waters - you need interrupts and degen ( oops, I'm sorry if this spoils it for anyone ), and to attempt these missions without some knowledge ahead of time is "usually" doomed to failure.

You can pretty much forget about getting a PUG for the elite missions if you don't want to know ahead of time what is in the mission. First, every PUG is looking for specific people to do specific things, but moreover, nobody is going to want to join a group that isn't well organized for the mission at hand, since it is a several-hour time investment.

gotta toot in...

I object to the part about blind invites.... more times than not they are not "blind" invites.. when you get later on in the game and especially for leaders that are wanting to build "masters" groups in factions or "bonus" groups in profecies they are looking for certain builds... more times than not a leader has more controll over his group by NOT advertising and then looking over the available players in that area and inviting the class/lvl players he/she wants to invite...

and let me tell you folks if you do NOT have versatility in your build and are not already willing upon entering a group to modify your build to fit the group then you are being rather ignorant... leaders that invite and ask your build are smart leaders and you want a smart leader... a leader that asks usually know the mission and usually know the party he/she is building... so the leader knows what combination of skills builds will compliment the party for the best victory of the missions...

as a player all of you should experiment with different builds of your prefered profession... as a rituallist i am prepaired always to be a restoration rit or a channeling rit this allows me to fit well into any party and to fill the position of the second healer if i need to... by doing so you provide yourself with being able to join almost any group of players...

if you are not the leader of a group then by all means you really have no say or control of the group remember this... otherwise why didn't you start your own group if you feel you are the leader...

it is better in general to cooperate with the group not contest it... again if you have this problem then perhaps the problem is actually you or you need to form your own group so you can set the rulls an strategy...

I rarely get into non-guild PUGs except for FoW and UW. Since I am usually running my necro, and I want to join a PuG, I wait for LFG message.

I then get off a whisper to the leader and tell them what I can do "Echo SS here". If I get invited, I tell them what I will be doing and as I am usually the only necro, I tell them I have Blood Ritual and that they need to ping their energy if they want a recharge.

This usually takes care of my needs and seems to make everyone happy.

Generally when i am the party leader, I ask for what each player is going to be doing in the mission, i.e. damage, shutdpwn, healing, etc. Then I ask for the skills that they will be using to accomplish that. As long as it will work out, I just let it go.

Sometimes you need everyone's skillbar, but not very often.

I'm not trying to start a fight, but remember you're not the Party Leader. Your build, your character, but HIS/HER Party.

A build discussion is a healthy thing before a mission! Certainly there are extremists on BOTH sides. I've seen players /ragequit as soon as you ask what their build is, and I've seen Leaders toss people as soon as people list their build.

But there are times when you absolutely NEED someone to perform a specific task.

Here's a real example from many months ago. This was in a 5 man SF squad, 4/5 assembled. Looking for SS Necro or an interrupter.

Leader: Hi, welcome.
SS Necro: Hi, lets go!
SS Necro: gogogogogo
Leader: I need you to interrupt Mark of Prot, ok?
SS Necro: I don't have any interrupts.
Leader: Would you consider adding Spinal Shivers or Rend?
SS Necro: NO! DAMMIT MY BUILD IS MY BUILD, TAKE IT OR LEAVE IT.
Leader: Um, ok. Well, what is your build then?
SS Necro: (ragequits and bad mouths us on local channel)

Ok I never want to spoil my experience with the game either, But I don't know any soldier that enters battle without a clue...that's not fun, that's um...well just look at the name of my Guild ...

I am so happy to see peeps like Sinican, Swinging Fist, 9th Requiem and Carinae Dragonblood get what I really meant.

Agreement points : Well Said Guys

I so agree! Modify and be open to learn ...pwning will fall right into place - isn't a smooth running team more fun? I like a challenge but not by behaving like a Master Aspect of Noob.

I am all for supporting someone to use a build they like. I just want to know that they know what they are doing lol.

Ya coordinating FTW right? I really don't think that spoils the game...sheesh if i want a extra unusual or "add something different" challenge then I do something like Abbadon's Mouth without infused armor

Now I usually spam what i am looking for w specifics and in that spam say "please be prepared to rattle off your build and be open to swap for maximizing team benefit" so hopefully I don't deal with hilarious but annoying guys like your example


Anyways, all in all sinican, my comments were not at all in the intent to make people feel you must cheat to win but that you should plan how to win and maybe better enjoy the game. I am not into being a control freak nor shouting noob when someone screws up, but if I myself or another player acts like an idiot - I sure want to know how to fix it and i would rather that be found out sooner than later...

peace.

I have been in some Pug's where the leader insisted on my SS Necro bringing a specific skill, and when I asked why, she told me that her "guildie" had told her it was a must. I asked if she knew what said skill did and the anwser was NO, but my "guildie" said............. . Later on in mission leader called for a break to consult guildie on how to do the next part.
Too many ppl are trying to lead groups and change ppl's builds without knowing why or how.
I don't mind changing out 1 skill if given a good reason for it, but "do not tell me that your "guildie" told you, I had allready done mission on another Toon and had my SS Necro set for this specific mission.

Don't lead a group if you don't know the mission and what is needed first hand.

Id like to add a couple class specific things...


Assasssins. PLEASE look at your AL rating. Reliaze what that number means. Play accordingly. Failure to do so makes my boon/prot cry.


Warriors. 90% of you are fine. The other 10% please lookup the term "over extending" and play accordingly. Failure to do so makes all monks cry.

Necro's. PLEASE take note of one thing. Your secondary makes the diffrence betwen SS/MM... If your N/Me be a SS, If your N/Mo be a MM.

Good write up btw

This is a nother thing you should not do. Do not try to force ppl to use cookie cutter builds if they have found a build that works. Some ppl don't even use there secondary, but it's there.

<-- Attempts not to use the Stupid N word. (the one that ryhmes with TUBE)


Ok, soooo

An SS Necro with a mes secondary wont have Arcane Echo.... Tell me if you would how thats anywhere near as effective as a N/Me with arcane echo... oh and thats 2 skills out of 8. Go, play, have fun building something with the other 6 slots.

And N/Mo's as MM's... I suppose you dont HAVE to have monk as a secondary though it helps a WHOLE lot. Ranger, Warrior (tactics), rit's, hell even mes's have self heals.



Further more. I wasnt compressing them into a cookie cutter build. I mentioned 2 cookie cutter builds. Both MM / SS are cookie cutters. Its just that alot of necro's run around claiming to be SS with a monk secondary, and it drives me nuts. (mostly since my necro has full gear for SS / MM or solo 55hp SS farming, and I switch out secondaries as needed. Me/Mo depending)


Now MM does have variants... Minion Bomber for example. But the basic MM build is already a cookie cutter. (The give away is the virtually guildwars world known abbreviations of MM)

I find that an SS with

SS+Reckless Haste+mark of Pain+Defile Enchantments ( in a combo is very effective) Shivers, Rend enchatments, Light of Dwayna, Awaken the Blood.

is very effectiv with att's in only 2 classes, this way I can max out 2 and still have a good HP. Call it noob if you want, but it works and I don't run out of energy with 16 in soul reaping


srry for of topic

I agree with everything in this thread if majority of the players who aren't on boards would do this however I don't agree on this.

I will not type my build if the leader has no confidence in me go find someone else especially if they never played it if they did I still don't care have faith.What bothers me is those who run around to much.

Wrong. Not because of the "cookie-cutter" reason, but because Necros don't HAVE to use their secondary for those builds. (N/Me for Arcane Echo would be the exception. But I don't use Arcane Echo unless in end-game PvE...energy cost and recharge are too extensive)

similar build to mine, works well and no need for that over rated echo skill..

ive always insisted ppl use a build they are happy with..i dont do cookie cutter groups (boring)

to the OP thankyou for posting these, I hope this board gets 2 mil views, also the telling them your build is damn good idea especially in a pug in PUGS you can NOT have confidence in someones abilities becuase you do not know them... Also a good idea is,
Plan out mission strategy before entering the fight, if you know what to do and when and the entire group does, things should run smoothly, better than everyone running around like a chicken with their head cut off.

Patience is golding, don't start saying gogogogog as soon as you join a group, or ebver for that matter, pushing only pisses the leader off, pissed off leader=boot for the pisser(lol). Also when people are annoyed they don't perform at their max level.(except for me when I am pissed I start focusing more, as long as it is a "I'm really angry right now" type of pissed, not like "Ima sit here and flame you and show you how much you pissed me off" type of anger.

good topic...

EVERY gw player shoudl read this...

I agree with Kylista... big time. I might be proud and noobish, but I really get irritated if someone wants to know my build skill by skill... isn't enough if my necro is MM, SS or Order, for example? Or my monk is Boon Prot, 55 or healing? I really think that's what you really need, general build, not a build skill by skill.

that's fine, methinks a general well-known cookie cutter build is fine with just going like this
Leader: What's your build?
Jas: MM
Leader should say: ok cool

different story if it goes like this
Leader: What's your build
Noob: Owning Sin build
Leader should say: what are the skills
Noob: Its my build I don't care what you think
Leader should then say: Ok....*two seconds later noob is kicked*


Does that clarify it better for ya?

i've pretty much given up hopes of finding decent players in pve pugs, and expect most pugs to fail in the more difficult missions. its just sad when guild or ranked groups are required for a smooth pve experience.

i used to ask for skill bars, but recently gave that up. turns out, its usually better to not ask since it leads to a even bigger nightmare where you come to the realization that 3/4 of your team are using power shot and they're not a ranger primary; and bane signet seems to make its way into every skill bar.

whenever i form or join a group, i just close my eyes and pray really really hard.

should be renamed to Ethics of Grouping IMHO
but it's good to know someone like the OP is posting this

<-----I use a build description to have faith in them...PUG<---how do u know them and have auto confidence ??? >.< And I guess I should have said "Don't be offended if.." because the inquiry is not meant to offend a person's capability. I never play leader if I haven't been through a mission that I cannot lead, I just spam that I am LFG and a type of build.

<--------zomg my reason exactly :P

<-----------------lmao I so am the same "Ima gonna show you how it's done" and to those in a hurry I just tell them I plan on making a killer team and if they want to leave then no worries...that tends to quiet them up heh heh, either cuz they left or they don't want to get kicked

<-----------------ya that is more what i meant by "rattle off your build" it is easy to tell that someone know's what they have if they use a cookie cutter answer...If I am not familiar with what build they are talking about I would probably say "sorry not familiar w that" and ask them to list it... again, inquiry
not meant to be a jerk. just a plan for success. I don't expect anyone to say "ok what ever u say" I welcome interjection...again, all for the benefit of the team


<----------------Wha ha hahaha ahhaha ha -----yes this is what i do and then see the whole team respond with "lol" in the chat log...(course I usually say please elaborate or I have to let ya go - at that pt which they jump ship or type

<-----------EEK! really??? I don't have that luxury, --->one girl guild...but I rarely have problems or have failed missions...sheesh I assume you join a balenced team or make sure that you make one ....I look at the type of spam a team leader puts out to get a feel if they know what they are doing...the more specified the better kinda thing... >.< sorry its been tuff for you....


* Last night fighting in the Deep reinforced why it is so good to use this style of PUG protocol...I made a balenced team outta what few people were online in the middle of the night....3 warr, 4 mo, 1 necro, 3 elem, 1 ranger...not my favorite set up but anyway off we go...had waited like an hour to accrue enough people and maintain a decent team so sure enough we get outside the initail rooms and necro gets err 7...hw was the only necro there and been disconnected 3 times while just waiting for the team to assemble I wasn't surprised and we all agree to push on...because we had truely coordinated our builds and communicated well we pwned Kanaxai in 2 hrs and had a great time. Everyone kept saying how it was going smoother than some full teams they had been in and what fun they were having...so to all u guys who get miffed when someone asks u your build, take it as a sign of "I'm good / You're good - let's show each other how good we are gonna be at this"

I think the best advice I can give is: Know Thyself.

Know what you're good at, and be honest about what you don't know. I'll take an honest noob, if they are willing to learn.

Just tell the group, I can do *this* well, and I *have* those skills you're asking for, but I'm not sure what to do with them. Often you'll get really good advice doing this.

Sometimes people feel embarrassed by saying "I don't know that". Don't sweat it, be open to learning (that goes for everyone)

I play N/Mo all the time, and I have NEVER used healing prayers with my MM build. The only time I use my secondary is when I'm playing BiP, and then I use Protection (mend ailment, reversal, prot spirit, aegis) as a pure support character. It also gives me a nice res too. However, I agree that N/Me is almost always for Arcane Echo & SS. I don't think I've ever seen an N/Me that wasn't SS.

I have an addition:

Dont do a "Leeroy" just because you dislike a member of the group or someone got a drop you want.

This happens to me way to often