Has HoH PvP died, or is it just me

I found that with the way things are, the higher I climb in rank, the easier it is to join a HoH pug, but even then, there aren't many non-FoTM builds that aren't r9+ (which I'm currently not) (or FoTY builds for that matter ). Aside from having ranked friends, or a good guild, it's incredibly hard for new people to join a team that will make it past the first match without someone ragequitting (now there are very few random pugs, so when someone makes one, they end up facing good groups at the beginning and then the team falls apart). People are more concerned with fame farming than having fun. I sometimes invite unranked people that I know are good, but mostly, there are so few people that rank discrimination is the only "fast" way to put together a decent group, and in turn, more unranked people give up on pvp...I'd love for HoH to get to the point where anyone can have a limited amount of time, pick any build that they feel like playing, and join a successful group, but if nothing changes, your options are 1. Have a good guild that likes to do HoH 2. Spend 30 minutes to an hour putting together an organized group, only to have it fall apart the minute someone quits (every build has a counter, no exceptions...sometimes you don't have good luck to start with) 3. Spend 5-10 minutes putting together a FoTM build...sure you get fame that way, but is it fun?

I dunno why your sad.
HoH was a waste of time imo~
GvG is 1000x better.

I quit hitting up the HoH because I can never get on a team. I even wanted to join a group of players who were asking for a WoH Monk, when that's exactly what I normally play (PvE and other PvP), but because I didn't have the fame, they didn't want me.

In fact, that's been my problem the whole time: Not enough fame, we don't want you. And there aren't enough other people to get with. Maybe I should just go henchies, although I'll die instantly if I meet a real group, and it won't be much fun -- no planning, no strategizing, no anything.

Proud owner of 7 fame.

I'd rather play with an experienced pve monk then some of the ranked guys who obviously ebayed their account, or played 1 build to get to where they are and suddenly decide to change. I recently had a guy on my team who was from a very respected guild, had silver trim and everything (not one of the guilds that sells memberships), but he was terrible. We just assumed that he would know what he was doing, but it turns out he was just friends with some of the real members of the guild. Try to find a good guild that is willing to teach people and let them play. That way, even if you aren't winning as much as you'd like to, you'll probably be playing with people you like, and it will be a lot more fun

as always the pve scrubs come here "OMG you iwayed or ebayed your rank!!"


youre just jealous

Just because you're proud doesn't mean others are jealous when they are unimpressed.

how to get rid of fotms:

1) adapt skills every 1-2 weeks, just play with the numbers... who cares for the skills being balanced before people found out the overpowered build the next change is happening already....
2) skillfull players will adapt in stead of keeping on playing the same builds as we have now.

or: simply make all pvp random.

So in conclusion the point being make hoh random.

HA died of elitism, rank farming and FotM builds. And the number of teams nerf.
I did get rank 4 before the first FotM teams came around (no, not IWAY, remember the first (ranger) spirit spams and minion factories?). People would run balanced builds, sometimes crazy builds, but each battle was unique and you had to adapt very quickly.
Now a year later, I am still rank 4, because I cant put up with the boredom that HA has become. Yes we all hated the waiting matches when it came down to 3 teams left, but at least in those days 2 inferior teams could go on one FotM team together, thus keeping them in check. Now all maps are the same boring 8vs8 against always the same builds. I wont even begin to talk about the people who got Rank 9 with IWAY and now wont turn their head to notice anyone below that. GvG is *much* better, AB are much better, even RA is more fun for me.

- Xeeron

I agree with that poster who said most players without an emote/rank are jealous of those with. If getting a tiger with IWAY is so "easy" then why do most of the people who bash IWAY not have one? It's because they are incapable of getting one even if by using IWAY themselves. Most likely they were using a horrible build that lost to IWAY bazillions of times (not because IWAY was ever overpowered; just because most players are not very good) and that caused them to become jealous and resentful of successful IWAY players.

If those players were given an option to have a tiger emote on a silver platter - they'd definitely say "Yes". But deep down they know there have never been silver platters for rank (other than spirit spamming, which truly was overpowered) and that none are ever coming, which just compounds their jealously in my view.

I'm jealous of you for beating the same 3 FotM builds for hours on end in HA.

I am so jealous.No.Really.

Not to mention that naming your char "iway ftw" speaks so for itself.

Yea i agree that HA has died due to elitism, i got my r3 ages ago jst because then i could get in a group much more easily. However, how AB has come in, i usually jst miss out HA due to the fact its better, and there are so many pompus HA'ers with their r9 etc calling me a r3 pve noob when i offer to join their group..GvG is jst way more fun anyway .

But sometimes getting into a good gvg guild means you have to be high ranked, so keep on grinding

If you're referring to my post, I'm talking about ranked guys who are terrible players. I doubt I'd ever ask you to monk for my team. There are people who do that to get rank, and either the majority of people are retarded, or it's a lot more common than you seem to think, which is why guild groups are usually the way to go. I gaurantee that there are probably some iwayers who really are good pvp'ers in general, but I know a lot of people that have 1 pvp character: a w/r, whose sole purpose is to farm fame. I doubt anyone is jealous of you, although in general, r9>r6>r3 etc, it certainly isn't a rule that you must live by, I'm just saying there are some ranked players that suck horribly. I saw some r9 korean guy saying he was looking for a r3+ group, was it a joke? maybe, but then why was he still there an hour later when I came back?

So, the new players can't get rank because all the elitist ranked players. The elitist ranked players are eventually leaving because they are finding other stuff/getting bored of it. Therefore, the people in HA just slowly dies out, and it becomes pointless.

Eventually there's gonna be barely 1 district of HA, and it's basically only going to be people who are joking around.

No good GvG guild will ever require rank...

QFT. I started Ha'ing around March, with a few mates. One of them at the time being R7 (half way to R9 now) willing to show us the ropes. It took about 2-3 monthes to even see Rank 3 but we all stuck at it, running balanced builds mainly and a build we came up with (never got big, as it wasn't fame farming material lol)

Now were in a Pvp alliance, all heading towards R6 (I'm at 758 fame atm) and I think about 3 of thats from IWAY. It's annoying how people can view players who just play IWAY for hours upon hours a day to farm fame and get their emote are considered better more experienced players.

Hmm...maybe it's just a coincidence that top guilds are ranked then. I don't know how else top guilds recruit, (or that the even do for that matter), but I do know that there are a lot of guilds recruiting ranked players for the upcoming season, simply for the purpose of quality control. I doubt any of these guilds have the patience to make sure that random people are good. I would agree that it's not an accurate reflection of your gvg "skills", but it's a good way to ensure that if they give you a build to play, you can play it pretty well. I know certain guilds require that you have participated in a certain amount of matches (sometimes 500 or more), or maybe called some of those matches with good results, but just because they may not recruit based on rank doesn't mean you have a better chance to get in. BTW, offtopic question, is that the guild that Leeloof is in? I can't ever remember if it's that or ugly ducklings because he's not always in a guild group. (I just remember the tag )

yes they do

After reading all the posts in this thread I have a question. Why don't the UNhappy people from this thread with little or no rank meet in game and run as a group? Finding a group problem solved! Now when the first rank3 group slaughters you please try not to get discouraged. The difference between winners and whiners is ... winners learn from the loss and continue forward.

The whine about FOTMs makes anyone that has played hoh laugh ... FOTMS have been around almost as long as hoh. Adapt modify overcome ... welcome to the winners circle. To those saying they get "tired of beating the same 3 FOTMS" I cry BS. Winning is winning I have never met anyone that was upset they beat a fotm. If you are honest it is LOSING to them that makes you mad not beating them.

HoH is on its deathbed because MANY of us rank 9 and up got bored. When you have 8k of fame and need 12k more for your next emote ... takes true nerd genes to dedicate that kind of time to getting it.

Tombs is dead because people like leprekan have rank 9 and people like myself prefer to GvG.

Most of your serious tombs PvPers and fame farmers already have rank. Even your "gvg only" types have a deer at this point. If you are an unranked (or low ranked) serious player, you really don't have many options:
1)PuG balanced, good luck finding a mediocre team that brings in more than 10 fame a night.

2)PuG FotM, you may get a bit more fame but groups will still take forever to form and easily fall apart.

3)Build a friends list-- until you have some sort of rank see 1,2.

4)Join a normal guild. Odds are you'll be GvGing more than doing tombs, mostly because you are playing teams of similar ability instead of the same 3 FotM over and over.

5)Join a tombs guild. Good luck doing that without any rank.

Its easy to say "learn from your mistakes", but there isn't anything fun about fame farming to 180 and 1000.

The excessive use of FotM builds is a result of the tombs environment. Almost every tombs map is won by strong 8v8 play and the ability to hold a location. 8v8 play is only marginally interesting. Holding is less interesting. Sure I could practice whatever todays most exploitive spike is and win in HA with good target calling, but 1...2...3...bored isn't smart or fun. HA plays like 8 guys in a tank... everyone works together but in a machine like fashion. GvG allows everyone to get out of the tank allowing individual efforts to shine instead of just mistakes.

Remove altars from HA and you've goet half of your solution. Add more multiple control point maps (relics are a good example) and you will make HA a battle worth fighting. AB is the ultimate multiple contol point arena, which makes it one of the most interesting areas to PvP. TA is a nice example of what HA would be without altars: while you would fight 8v8 you would have more flexiblity since the overemphasis on "holding" would be gone.

You hit the nail on the head. I remember being an unranked noob LFG. With time I was able to build a friend list of other people in the same boat. We rose up through the ranks together. Now it is easier, people can show their title when in between emotes. Then you HAD to have that emote to show you were at least that rank ... since nobody would believe you were any higher than your emote. Those "elitest pvpers" went through the same thing the whiners cry about.

I think in order to solve this!!!!!! reset the ladder in tombs, so you don't need to be a rank 6 iway.

And those that have spent MONTHS to gain their fame/rank just lose it? Sad that people are too lazy to do the work to get what they want. EVERY ranked person started off with ZERO fame.

hey all,

I think it is very sad that a lot of people here are slagging off pvp in hero's ascent. Just because you have not put the time into developing a friends list of people to play HA with and not worked at your rank does not mean that the rest of us that work hard at it should suffer.
The rank system is a very good way of organizing pvp groups and to be honest if you have not put the time and effort into getting a rank over the rime you have played guild wars why should you be able to join a high ranking group? You will not have developed a knowledge of maps, how different builds interact with each other or reconizing the oposition and their prefered builds.
So please stop whining about not being able to get into high ranking groups and put some effort in. As you get higher ranks it gets easier to get fame trust me.

It was much easier for low ranked players 6 months ago, let alone a year ago. It is harder to build a friends list with fewer people. It is harder to find serious players of lower rank. The groups playing are playing at a higher level since they've been playing for a long time.

hey all

no-one ever said attaining rank is easy. You have to work at it rather than have everything handed to you. How could you ever truely value your rank if you didn't put time and effort into it.
I suppose the guild wars game mentality has changed lately, with the ebay money readily available many players may have got used to being able to have perfect items, fow armour etc without having to put the time or effort into aquiring them.

Its a shame that the whiners would prefer complaining or buying fame than actually putting effort in, whether its hard or not

Guild wars mentality has always been like this, otherwise fotms, ebaygold,... would never surface. Nor the amount of farmingguides, and farmingzones, etc...

in any case though, we are playing a game and not working... so stating that you have to work to accomplish something is bullshit. You have to have fun and have some form of success.

It is however a bigger shame that the iwayers, spiritspammers, elesmiters, bloodpsikers, touchrangers, 1 2 3 spikers (ranger, air) dare to complain about someone elses way of playing and consider it as a lack of effort...

good gvg guild are on Invite friend only.

normally those friend are made in HA group

Getting to Rank 9 is indeed work, because it is not fun. Anything that is not fun, is work.

Indeed people who got to Rank 9 with FOTM did put in way more time. skill and effort getting to Rank 9 than those who are unranked did. Regardless of it being a FOTM build, consistently making or joining a party of good players still takes considerable time and effort. Especially since people always have to leave every round which just starts the party-making process over and greatly hinders time used for actually earning fame. Then even with FOTM builds, top tier Guilds will always cream you (not top tiered on Guild ladder because most of them suck in Tombs, I mean top tiered Tombs Guilds) if you are using a FOTM. Rank 9 takes blood, sweat and tears, period. One and only exception to this is spirit spammers which could hold HoH for 6 hours at time. None of the other FOTM builds you listed there were ever anywhere close to being as overpowered as that, hence they should not be lumped together or used in the same sentence with spirit spammers.

Betcha if all the unranked or low-ranked IWAY bashers went and tried to earn Rank 9 with IWAY, they'd be in for a rude awakening. Some of them think they'll get it in a month, which would require a consistent 156 fame a day. Even before the nerfing, that was not the least bit realistic for anything other than a professional IWAY Guild who always had top players available on a Guild roster to get a party together quickly. No darn way that an IWAY pugger would consistently get 156 fame per day and get Rank 9 in a month. Clearly from comments like that, most players who complain about things like IWAY do not do so out of education, and do not understand that it's not a cakewalk to IWAY to Rank 9 like they think it is.

Navaros. I played balanced and iway back in the day. From my experience you could easily win a lot of games with IWAY even if you have a few recognisably horrible players on your teams. The same cannot be said for balanced.

High ranked people ruined HA. When the unrankeds tried to get a group they said f--k off, if you dont like that we discriminate for rank, make your own team. So the unrankeds came about fotms like iway and now the higher ranked people are facing 50%(probably more)iway, blood spike that stuff, and they complain that no one runs any different builds. If the higher ranks hadnt shunned them, there would be no need for iway and other fotms, you could play for fun without grinding for months. All iway players are grinding so they can get to the fun part.

Average IWAY PUG would generally cream and be much more successful than an average balanced PUG, no doubt.

Even so, the point I was trying to make is that there was always much strong resistance (huge party making waiting around and spamming timesink + headache - compounded by leavers after every round; bad players who do not have a pet or bow or only have crappy weapons, who place their spirits wrong, do not replace spirits when they die, aggro in the wrong way, res too slow or not at all, hold the res orb but never use it to res the Ghost even when direly needed, only have a bow and one vampiric weapon which means they get slaughtered if they need to retreat or run for an orb or relic, stay too far back to be ressed etc. etc; and coming up against expert Guilds) on the road to Rank 9, even for IWAYERS. Hence any Rank 9 that was not earned by spirit spamming should be respected for the great achievement that it is.

I disagree that r9 players should be respected. They have to earn respect with people, not with the game. If some r9 came and cussed me out and flashed his tiger, i wouldnt go oh, hes rank 9 i should let this go, i would treat him/her just like they treated me.

I normally charm my way into a high rank party, of course you need to show them you have the right build

True.I have a friend which lives in korea who joined EvIL which had NO skill in GvG and had no rank whatsoever.
But now he's a GvG master and rank 9 !

Yeah, it's totally not fair for you that people do not work their ass off to fit in with a group of players that fight them every step of the way.

How dare they kill your fun with their selfishness.

What he said.

I don't hate people who are Ranked.

I hate people who constantly use their Rank as a launching pad for acting like a dick to other people.

"So you spammed IWAY, amirite?" is a great way to knock a little wind of said people's sails. As perfectly demonstrated in this thread by huffy and overdefensive "OH YEAH YOU'RE JUST JEALOUS" posts.

I noticed that there were much less players doing HoH ever since It got moved from Tombs->Hero's Ascent.