As the title states i have a growing concern over the condition of the price checking system here. For the most part. as far as i can tell..
most of the old price checkers have moved on and no longer price check very often..
and the odds of getting a guru price checker to pc your item these days is really slim.
i realize that these are people with lives and they cannot go pcing every item that comes across.. but what i have noticed is the ones that are doing most of the price checks are only price checking what they have a personal interest in. and even those they pc just to try to jack the price down so they can either wait till the seller posts it in sell for wayy cheap out of desperation.
or pm the seller and offer 5k-10k below the already low forum pc. these price checkers are bidding on items they lowball in the pc forum. now in the end its the sellers own decision to sell. but the pc's from this site are a huge determining factor..
i have heard alota stories. of pc's on items actually selling for about twice what they were pc'ed out to.
dont get me wrong. there are many good price checkers out there who price check items every day just right withought any thought of personal profit.. but the ammount of price checkers just out for personal gain is starting to rise..
Now as you can imagine the ammount of repriasal i will recieve from this post is gonna be ginormous. but i felt i needed to at least warn some people of what is happing.
If the mods feel this thread needs to be closed then please do so.. but realize that this is not a flame against the price checkers or the site.. its just a warning so people can be more alert for it when they have it happen to them
Concerns over price checking.
Narutoscryed
The Dirrtiest
I made a thread in here not to long ago and posted examples of what was wrong, and I suggest you do the same very soon.
Yes the 6 Guru's all have lives outside of this forum and I would never ask them to be on here 24/7. The fact is that if I'm correct two are on vacation.
The problem before was random people lowballing items and then offering to buy them. I am yet to see a single case in which myself or the 6 Guru's have done something like this. Like I said before, please post at least two examples of what you mean.
Inde
You bring up some interesting points, no a price checker really can't just sit here and price check hundreds of items constantly every day. Besides what I see right now (with it being early morning in the states) I see good coverage of the Price check forum with people. Maybe the problem lies in the difficulty of the job.
You talk about people low-balling these price checks. I really really want to point out that if you go to other fansites, guilds, etc. Guru is known for people selling their items for unheard of high prices. It only goes with reason that some of these people may indeed be giving any accurate price that an item would go for in game or another site... and then when it's sold on Guru it would go for more.
Also, another problem probably stems from the fact that people don't like to read the information we all ready have for them. We have guides on price checking, we have multiple stickied threads on the current prices of items... people just do not want to read through information when it's so much easier to post a thread and ask. This is laziness on the part of the user and not something that can be controlled. If each user would take just 10 minutes to try and read through and find this information in any of the stickied threads, and then would format their request as we have asked to speed up the process... then you would most likely see a decrease in the posting in this forum and more knowledgeable users that can contribute back to the community.
You talk about people low-balling these price checks. I really really want to point out that if you go to other fansites, guilds, etc. Guru is known for people selling their items for unheard of high prices. It only goes with reason that some of these people may indeed be giving any accurate price that an item would go for in game or another site... and then when it's sold on Guru it would go for more.
Also, another problem probably stems from the fact that people don't like to read the information we all ready have for them. We have guides on price checking, we have multiple stickied threads on the current prices of items... people just do not want to read through information when it's so much easier to post a thread and ask. This is laziness on the part of the user and not something that can be controlled. If each user would take just 10 minutes to try and read through and find this information in any of the stickied threads, and then would format their request as we have asked to speed up the process... then you would most likely see a decrease in the posting in this forum and more knowledgeable users that can contribute back to the community.
The Herbalizer
who lowballing? who sending messages? who making price checks which turn out to be way wrong? Links please.
Yeah stuff can sell for more than its price check usually people who ebay or desperate or kinda dumb pay stupid amounts. E.g. mursaat horn bows 15>50 sell for 500k ish but people have paid 1 million. It does not make them worth 1 million it is a fluke result.
i can assure you that i dont lowball stuff i want, anything i want i wont pc to ensure stuff like that is not said.
you make alot of claims and have no proof. im not saying your lying but it is hard to respond to claims when there is nothing to back it up.
and as inde said why price check items or mods which are covered in the sticky?
this is a free service done out of the kindness of people's hearts. if you expect people to price check stuff 24/7 when they have other commitments then you are wrong. i dont see why anyone or group of people should slave away all the time. i help when i can and try my hardest.
Yeah stuff can sell for more than its price check usually people who ebay or desperate or kinda dumb pay stupid amounts. E.g. mursaat horn bows 15>50 sell for 500k ish but people have paid 1 million. It does not make them worth 1 million it is a fluke result.
i can assure you that i dont lowball stuff i want, anything i want i wont pc to ensure stuff like that is not said.
you make alot of claims and have no proof. im not saying your lying but it is hard to respond to claims when there is nothing to back it up.
and as inde said why price check items or mods which are covered in the sticky?
this is a free service done out of the kindness of people's hearts. if you expect people to price check stuff 24/7 when they have other commitments then you are wrong. i dont see why anyone or group of people should slave away all the time. i help when i can and try my hardest.
Argen
Hey Herbalizer and Inde, I think maybe this should be moved to a private discussion between you guys and the OP for resolution. Leave this here so that people who think there is a problem can see that it is being resolved. The reason for this to become more private is that as members we are not supposed to repost PMs from the site. Maybe that will make the OP feel more comfy in talking about it.
Other than that, my PCs that I have asked about have been quickly and fairly answered.
Other than that, my PCs that I have asked about have been quickly and fairly answered.
Komerad
'Give a man a fish and he has dinner for a day, teach a man to fish and he has dinner for life'
What I'm wondering is :
All parameters of items are somehow comon.
They are also all known.
Cant we make a model that calculates a 'advise' price according all the parameters it has?
People doing these checks also have a sort of system to evaluate items and determ prices again.. according to its known parameters.
I think this can be done.
If people want to help thinking use the forum or pm.
What I'm wondering is :
All parameters of items are somehow comon.
They are also all known.
Cant we make a model that calculates a 'advise' price according all the parameters it has?
People doing these checks also have a sort of system to evaluate items and determ prices again.. according to its known parameters.
I think this can be done.
If people want to help thinking use the forum or pm.
Narutoscryed
I really didnt intend to point fingers at any guru.. and in my post i stated that the price check guru's are not the ones responsable for the lowballing.
its that the guru is being missrepresented by alota people that are not guru's who just wanna make a quick buck..
by no means did i intend to point any fingers at guru.. or any fingers at all for that matter..
I respect the guru title and have only seen fair price checks from them.. but the problem lies in the fact that a few gurus can only price check 5 outa 5 million items.
but the lowballers just browse for items they want and lowball them. this is a huge problem cause most of the item pc's only get one responce due to the massive need for pc's today.
I dont think there is anything that can be done about this problem.. due to the ammount of people that need pc's that is why i just said it as a warning and not a "do somthing now" kinda thread
as for providing examples.. i will not give out names.. cuase that is against forum rules.. but just go and find a thread with 1 responce.. and you have a good chance of finding a lowballed item..
This thread was concieved over a growing concern. not a personal problem.
its that the guru is being missrepresented by alota people that are not guru's who just wanna make a quick buck..
by no means did i intend to point any fingers at guru.. or any fingers at all for that matter..
I respect the guru title and have only seen fair price checks from them.. but the problem lies in the fact that a few gurus can only price check 5 outa 5 million items.
but the lowballers just browse for items they want and lowball them. this is a huge problem cause most of the item pc's only get one responce due to the massive need for pc's today.
I dont think there is anything that can be done about this problem.. due to the ammount of people that need pc's that is why i just said it as a warning and not a "do somthing now" kinda thread
as for providing examples.. i will not give out names.. cuase that is against forum rules.. but just go and find a thread with 1 responce.. and you have a good chance of finding a lowballed item..
This thread was concieved over a growing concern. not a personal problem.
Inde
Yeah, I really didn't interpret this as a personal problem but a growing concern. As I said, there's some really good points... I don't see it any easy solutions right now.
Narutoscryed
it could be a good idea to imply 2 new rules to the forums. the first rule could be only guru's can price check. or some kinda warning about only guru's being a viable source for price checks. and the second could be that every forum account is only allotted 2 price checks a week. that would seem kinda strick but
that would take alota the strain off the gurus. and really give people the oprotunity to either search for an item that is simalar to theres to get a general pc idea... or to read a sticky on it to find the proper price.
Just an idea.
that would take alota the strain off the gurus. and really give people the oprotunity to either search for an item that is simalar to theres to get a general pc idea... or to read a sticky on it to find the proper price.
Just an idea.
Arya Nibelrund
Quote:
the first rule could be only guru's can price check. or some kinda warning about only guru's being a viable source for price checks
Such a warning already exists and it's stickied on top of Price Check Section:A Must Read For People Wanting Price Checks
Of course, being a sticky there's a good chance noone will care about that. /endsarcasm
About second idea, i am sorry but i don't think it's viable. We're already overloaded with work thanks to regular violators, and believe me I don't have the time to even try to do something like a pinpoint check on every account to check how many threads they posted in Price Check section.
To sum up, we have warned users that the Guru checkers are the only 100% reliable ones when it comes about price-checking. If someone doesn't wait for one of them to give an opinion, or doesn't take 5 minutes to browse on the section to check for similar items (99,9% of the times the same exact items has already been checked or is in a sticky thread, the remaining 0,01% happens when the item is a unique so will surely get loads of price checks), what can we do?
We do everything we can to provide a fair environment; and the Guru checkers to me seem like the best possible option. We just ask some co-operation from the user and if he does so, then he will get a correct price check. If the user posts an item that has already been checked 100 times, doesn't look at similar items on the section, doesn't wait for a Guru p-checker to post in his thread (after he's been warned in the sticky), and then believes the first unknown guy which will PM him later with an even lower offer, then I feel like there are not many things we can do to solve that situation.
I'll be very happy to hear any suggestion to further improve the Price check service of course.
Arya
Sir Mad
I'm quite surprised by this topic as I belived (and I still do actually) items were overpriced, not underpriced... I don't have the knowledge to PC myself all the items on guru, but I've noticed the few items I could have PCed had a price quoted that was definitely too high. I haven't spent enough time in the PC forum to generalize, but that was the feeling I had...
Malice Black
Quote:
Originally Posted by Narutoscryed
it could be a good idea to imply 2 new rules to the forums. the first rule could be only guru's can price check. or some kinda warning about only guru's being a viable source for price checks. and the second could be that every forum account is only allotted 2 price checks a week. that would seem kinda strick but
that would take alota the strain off the gurus. and really give people the oprotunity to either search for an item that is simalar to theres to get a general pc idea... or to read a sticky on it to find the proper price.
Just an idea. a very bad idea, many of the older site users are far better then most the current guru's this is nothing personnal towards the guru's just a plain fact.
restricting ppl to 2 threads a week sounds like a good idea on paper but in theory this would be hard task to the mods of the sell section..arya/dirrrty have their work cut out as it is
that would take alota the strain off the gurus. and really give people the oprotunity to either search for an item that is simalar to theres to get a general pc idea... or to read a sticky on it to find the proper price.
Just an idea. a very bad idea, many of the older site users are far better then most the current guru's this is nothing personnal towards the guru's just a plain fact.
restricting ppl to 2 threads a week sounds like a good idea on paper but in theory this would be hard task to the mods of the sell section..arya/dirrrty have their work cut out as it is
Wrath Of Dragons
Quote:
Originally Posted by Malice Black
a very bad idea, many of the older site users are far better then most the current guru's this is nothing personnal towards the guru's just a plain fact.
restricting ppl to 2 threads a week sounds like a good idea on paper but in theory this would be hard task to the mods of the sell section..arya/dirrrty have their work cut out as it is agreed.
and to avoid this "lowballing" and such, make sure you get more then 1 pricecheck. as far as i have seen, when someone wants to buy an item, they very rarely pricecheck it. instead, they say something like "free bump...i might be interested"<---i have seen this a lot, from the gurus and normal peasnts alike
restricting ppl to 2 threads a week sounds like a good idea on paper but in theory this would be hard task to the mods of the sell section..arya/dirrrty have their work cut out as it is agreed.
and to avoid this "lowballing" and such, make sure you get more then 1 pricecheck. as far as i have seen, when someone wants to buy an item, they very rarely pricecheck it. instead, they say something like "free bump...i might be interested"<---i have seen this a lot, from the gurus and normal peasnts alike
Ristaron
I might have missed it, but if I didn't then perhaps you should add it in:
"Price check at your own risk", or something to that effect. 'Guru can't ensure the accuracy of every price check that occurs, please take caution in screening the prices you get.'
"Price check at your own risk", or something to that effect. 'Guru can't ensure the accuracy of every price check that occurs, please take caution in screening the prices you get.'
Feminist Terrorist
Well, I had to wait 24 hours and one bump before I even got someone to look at my items. Then I felt that the advice given was wrong on one item, which was proven when I sold it very quickly instead of merchanting said item.
I looked through all the price check sticky threads and none of them are much help with one-handed caster items. But I did look. lol
I looked through all the price check sticky threads and none of them are much help with one-handed caster items. But I did look. lol
Vilaptca
Actually...thats the only problem I have with the PC forum. If its a high-end, sword, axe, shield or bow, it will receive a decent PC almost immediately. Whereas trying to get a PC on a wand or offhand can sometimes take a day or two. We have too many know-it-alls about warrior and ranger weapons, but apparently very few who know the caster market.
Malice Black
Quote:
Originally Posted by Feminist Terrorist
Well, I had to wait 24 hours and one bump before I even got someone to look at my items. Then I felt that the advice given was wrong on one item, which was proven when I sold it very quickly instead of merchanting said item.
I looked through all the price check sticky threads and none of them are much help with one-handed caster items. But I did look. lol just because you post doesnt mean ppl have to PC it...ppl PC because they want to not because they have to.
half the time the items that ppl want to be PC'd have been PC'd many times before hand, try reading through the first couple of pages instead of making a thread without doing any kind of research.
many PCers including myself cant be bothered anymore...getting abuse from ppl because they overpaid or w/e (just an example) is not acceptable also the amount of PMing ingame is getting beyond belief..as soon as i log on up comes a PM from a random stranger demanding a PC
EDIT: another annoying thing...you all complain about slow PC's but do any of you contribute any knowledge of prices? i'll answer for you...and thats a no
I looked through all the price check sticky threads and none of them are much help with one-handed caster items. But I did look. lol just because you post doesnt mean ppl have to PC it...ppl PC because they want to not because they have to.
half the time the items that ppl want to be PC'd have been PC'd many times before hand, try reading through the first couple of pages instead of making a thread without doing any kind of research.
many PCers including myself cant be bothered anymore...getting abuse from ppl because they overpaid or w/e (just an example) is not acceptable also the amount of PMing ingame is getting beyond belief..as soon as i log on up comes a PM from a random stranger demanding a PC
EDIT: another annoying thing...you all complain about slow PC's but do any of you contribute any knowledge of prices? i'll answer for you...and thats a no
Feminist Terrorist
Quote:
Originally Posted by Malice Black
half the time the items that ppl want to be PC'd have been PC'd many times before hand, try reading through the first couple of pages instead of making a thread without doing any kind of research.
I did look, and frankly, I'm a little offended to get such a blast on this. However, I can understand your frustration, and I might have blasted the first person in my line of sight as well.
As far as contributing, I don't because I don't know jack about pricing. That's why I post in that forum. Twice. Ever. lol I play my game, merchant my stuff, and when I come across something such as a scepter that gives 13 energy, I try to get a pc on it 'cause even I know that something like that has its uses.
As far as contributing, I don't because I don't know jack about pricing. That's why I post in that forum. Twice. Ever. lol I play my game, merchant my stuff, and when I come across something such as a scepter that gives 13 energy, I try to get a pc on it 'cause even I know that something like that has its uses.
Malice Black
wasnt aimed at you as such more a general comment about the average poster in the PC forum
milias
Thanks for voicing your concerns Narutoscryed! Personally I'm not sure what can be done about these problems you mentioned. Lowballers are always going to exist, whether it be here or in-game, that's just a fact of life. Furthermore, lowballing is subjective, meaning that lowballing to one person may not be so for the next person. Mods can't really make that value judgment for you, but the good thing is, there're always honest people around, and most people will get an honest answer. And as you mentioned, it's ultimately the seller's decision whether to sell or not. Personally, when I'm price checking, if I'm interested in an item, I will make a conscious effort not to price check it, just to avoid the inherent conflict of interest.
As for people not getting price checks, there're still quite a few regular price checkers in addition to the Price Check Gurus, with Malice and Wrath being two of them. The Price Check Gurus try to price check as many of them as possible, but there're only so many of us, and we do require some minimum amount of sleep in addition to real-life responsibilities. It's unfortunate that some items will go unchecked, but you can always bump it up so that one of the price checkers will see it.
Hope this helps!
As for people not getting price checks, there're still quite a few regular price checkers in addition to the Price Check Gurus, with Malice and Wrath being two of them. The Price Check Gurus try to price check as many of them as possible, but there're only so many of us, and we do require some minimum amount of sleep in addition to real-life responsibilities. It's unfortunate that some items will go unchecked, but you can always bump it up so that one of the price checkers will see it.
Hope this helps!
Alya
Just a small note. Maybe some regular forum readers will be able to help Price Check Gurus a bit, posting, when necessary, in very obvious cases, links to the stickies (as I've been trying to do lately -- I don't have enough knowledge to give any price checks, but I can show the people where they can find info). This may help to cut down the number of unanswered posts and give the gurus more time for checking the borderline and more difficult cases.