Monk Charging Service - How much? (If your against charging - Dont come here) - Guild Wars Guru archive powered by Guild Wars Legacy

Mithie

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jul 2005

Rest En Pieces [RIP]

Me/W

19 Jul 2005 at 14:36 - 41

Quote:

so its in-appropriate for me to call people stupid/annoying/sad, but NOT inappropriate for you to call me a snubnose (what IS a snubnose?).

A snubnose paladin is the matronized name of analyximus maripausis, a marsupial living here in the swamps of Niger. Commonly associated with the platypus, its primary diet consists of worms, river prawns, and other small swamp dwelling animals. But that's beside the point.

Quote:

two-facedness is not a good quality

Quote:

Any monk charging for "services" is pathetic in my books. If you want to get a bad rep though its up to you. Good luck.

This is the post you referred to as inappropriate and inflammatory. I honestly can't see how this can be construed as such. Anyway, this thread's been derailed. I won't contribute to the derailment any further.

Paladin_Adoni

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2005

Cult of the Sacred Axe

W/Mo

19 Jul 2005 at 14:45 - 42

first thing to do IMO would be to join a group, tell them that you charge for your services, your good, but the payment is not up front. tell them you will continue playing in there group till the mission is done, they give up, or its simply hopeless. also explain to them that no matter how good monk is, if the rest of the group doesnt work as one, its likely to fail.

tell them that after about half way through the mission, that they should pay you then. this way, they should know if your serious or not. dont lead rush them to the middle of the mission, this would look fishy, let them lead (draw directions if they dont know) and do whatever it is a monk should do in a certain situation.

also, another good point to lay down would be "The Energy Rule" to those groups who accept your initial terms.

whats the "Energy Rule" you say? after a battle, the group waits until at least YOU are happy with your energy levels and the current health level of the group" before moving on. tell them that should they continually ignore this rule, then you will leave.

a great monk who is not only great, but nice, patient and all round friendly is a really rare thing these days (too much monk abuse by noob idiots), this type of monk (this is what you should try and become, if your not already) will impress poeple, ask them if they are a member of this or any other guild-wars forum your a member of, if they are, ask them if they wouldnt mind righting up a quick forum reply to your topic. get there forum name, and send them a IM with a link to the thread.

this will get you exposure, and also help to set your place as a legit deal.

but again for the third time, make sure YOU KNOW YOUR SH1T!

hmmmmm, swamp dwelling animals *drool*

Algren Cole

Banned

Join Date: Jun 2005

19 Jul 2005 at 14:46 - 43

-----Trapper Ranger-----

All 4 traps, QZ and Energizing Winds....I'm an asinine prick that hasn't figured out the fact that gold is useless and a solid community of people helping eachother without any expectations of gold transfer is what this game really needs. if you require my services I run all mission for 500plat...and I'm usually a dick about it. I'll call you a noob and harass you while I set traps and pull mobs. If you want my services email me: [email protected]

Paladin_Adoni

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2005

Cult of the Sacred Axe

W/Mo

19 Jul 2005 at 14:48 - 44

^ your email address doesnt work...

Calimar

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2005

Silver Limon

E/Me

19 Jul 2005 at 14:53 - 45

Ok, don't get me wrong and read to the end please

1) "a job only no other one could do" - well, yes but so is just about any other profession. The only reale difference is that it is a profession that is less appealing than others, so that out of 8 players, it's less than 2 that take the profession. Also, Alesia works good enough for most missions up to Moladune - bar the ascension tests, I didn't try those with henchies (yet).

2) Imperfect information: You have to build a reputation. The best monk I've seen so far is an Italian called "Eroe di Dio" - I instantly added him to my list. I later discovered just about everyone in italy knows him. Why? Well, you remember those players that are *good*. And you tell your friends "hey get him, he's great". Then you "perfect" the imperfect information - rumors travels fast in these communities, especially between people that play at the same time that you do.

Sure tho, I'm not going to accept a charger in my group unless he pays. I'll always have a group from my guild, so I'm rarely in NEED of a monk. One that charges might be, at times. That's the other side of the coin.

Pick your number, take your chances

DiAnna

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jul 2005

19 Jul 2005 at 15:00 - 46

"Charge for services." Bah. This is one reason why I had to be dragged kicking and screaming back into another MMORPH after having seen how some folks in EverQuest would abuse other gamers by charging hefty fees, and using underhanded methods like coaxing low-level characters into dangerous areas, then demanding payment to get them safely out since they knew these poor newbies would never be able to safely return for their corpses.

I chose Guild Wars because it was possible to solo much of the game using henchies... who do not, BTW, have an over-inflated sense of their own self-worth and who do not lay awake nights contemplating ways to make money off of their fellow gamers. Clearly, however, there will always be ways to rip people off and there will always be people anxious to line their own pockets by doing so.

Now we have discussions of how much Monks should charge to keep their teammates alive. Unbelievable. Color me bitter, but threads like this leave a foul taste in my mouth.

(Yes, I saw your demand that those who don't agree with charging for services not post, but guess what? I don't take orders from bossy, greedy monks about what I can and cannot say on a public forum. Unless said bossy, greedy monk is also a forum Mod...

)

Lorelei

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Apr 2005

Somewhere unexpected

19 Jul 2005 at 15:01 - 47

I would pay you 1 gold for your service

I have nothing against beggars, but I despise beggars who asked for a set price

Darksci

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Apr 2005

London

Lords Of The Immortal [Loti]

R/W

19 Jul 2005 at 15:23 - 48

Thanks (Most of you) for some constructive comments. I'll try to do use those ideas.

As for those people who are against charging:
I don't care what you think to be honest. I'll leave you with something i heard being shouted out at thunderhead keep where my ranger was trying to get into group.
"NEED A F***** MONK TO FINISH THIS ****** MISSION"
"Group of 6 looking for 2 monks"
"We just need ONE monk to enter mission"
"Will give 1K to a monk to help us complete this mission"
etc

Also i'll say that this to me, is just the same as running people to forge. Your either with it or against it. But no one cares either way, since theirs always people out there who are willing to pay to get rushed.

And in regards to those who KEEP CHANGING THE SUBJECT and say:
"OMG! CHARGING SUCKS! U SUCKS!!!!1111" (gross exaggeration).
Well do i goto your thread about "Selling Super pownage 10-20 purple sword"
And reply "No it sucks"
OR a thread:
"Where can i find Prince Rurik?"
and reply
"Up ur nose"

No i wouldn't do that. So next time, read the damm thread before you post. Because I was asking a question there, and some suggestions. Why should I (the thread creator, who wants some suggestions) have to deal with the load of crap which some people write.

(Sigh) next time, if i want a question answered or some suggestions i'll just call the thread title "NEED SUGGESTIONS OF IDEA, DON'T REPLY IF YOU DON'T HAVE SUGGESTIONS OR CANNOT READ A THREAD TITLE"

Algren Cole

Banned

Join Date: Jun 2005

19 Jul 2005 at 15:26 - 49

you're contributing to the downfall of the Guild Wars community...you're charging gold simply because you chose to be a monk...you CHOSE to play that class...asking for a monetary return for your "services" is a joke.

Epinephrine

Master of Beasts

Join Date: Mar 2005

Ottawa, Canada

Servants of Fortuna [SoF]

19 Jul 2005 at 15:31 - 50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darksci

(Sigh) next time, if i want a question answered or some suggestions i'll just call the thread title "NEED SUGGESTIONS OF IDEA, DON'T REPLY IF YOU DON'T HAVE SUGGESTIONS OR CANNOT READ A THREAD TITLE"

Won't work. A forum is for discussion and even criticism. Asking for only encouragement is naive - there are people who are opposed to the idea, and want to communicate that feeling. If it were simply a discourse between you and a few others that's one thing, but if a topic such as this were to grow to 30 pages in length, all positive comments etc. it would give the world the impression that it was approved by the majority of people; since the devs at ANet read these threads, it is important to voice displeasure with some ideas so that they don't look in and get the wrong idea.

If I see a thread entitled: "Petition to make GW a WOW clone - don't post if you disagree" you can bet I'll post telling them off - if I don't it will seem that people aren't opposed to it - the fact is that if you want to have a pro-only discussion, say "PM me and we can chat in PMs or emails" and then only respond to those who don't flame you.

Stev0

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Apr 2005

Halifax, NS, Canada

19 Jul 2005 at 15:31 - 51

I want cash to cast Spells as an Elementalist/Monk.

What about my friends who have to play in a group? What kind of fees should they be asking for?

Ranger/Monk
Warrior/Necro
Lawyer/Carsalesman

I mean come on 'We Got's To Get Paid' too...

Also ... if I shell out $3000 for a monk. Can I just sit back and let monsters beat on me knowing that I am fully covered by this payment to my 'group policy'.

ingame...

*a dozen monsters beat on me like a drum kit at a metal concert while I stand admiring a tree*

Stevo: 'Whew this kinda hurts, hey Monk you seem to be slacking I'm down 4 health.'

Monk: 'Ugh! Dammit fight, I don't feel so good'

Stevo: 'Come on what am I paying you for?'

Epinephrine

Master of Beasts

Join Date: Mar 2005

Ottawa, Canada

Servants of Fortuna [SoF]

19 Jul 2005 at 15:32 - 52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stev0

I want cash to cast Spells as an Elementalist/Monk.

Hmm. I wonder what a good memser can charge?

mrpo

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jul 2005

19 Jul 2005 at 15:34 - 53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Epinephrine

Hmm. I wonder what a good memser can charge?

LOL, from what I experienced I have to pay to play if I am not a monk trying to join a non-guild group

Po

Darksci

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Apr 2005

London

Lords Of The Immortal [Loti]

R/W

19 Jul 2005 at 15:41 - 54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Epinephrine

Won't work. A forum is for discussion and even criticism. Asking for only encouragement is naive - there are people who are opposed to the idea, and want to communicate that feeling. If it were simply a discourse btween you and a few others that's one thing, but if a topic such as this were to grow to 30 poages in length, all positive comments etc. it would give the world the impression that it was approved by the majority of people; since the devs at ANet read these threads, it is important to voice displeasure with some ideas so that they don't look in and get the wrong idea.

If I see a thread entitled: "Petition to make GW a WOW clone - don't post if you disagree" you can bet I'll post telling them off - if I don't it will seem that people aren't opposed to it - the fact is that if you want to have a pro-only discussion, say "PM me and we can chat in PMs or emails" and then only respond to those who don't flame you.

i'm just annoyed by the fact that i'm just asking a question here, NOT
whether its right or wrong. I guess I have to deal with it

But anyway i got the knowledge i need.

So anyone whos against it and replies to this thread, i'll just say
"ha ha - don't care - vent out your anger, let it out"

Funny though, speaking in real life.
In some parts of the world, going to hospital is free (volunteers)
And in other parts of the world, going to hospital will cost you.
Yet people accept going to a hospital which charges, since they have the money. One could argue that a being a doctor is a profession and takes years of learning. Well the same goes for being a monk, getting to level 20 takes some time, and has a learning curve as well to be a good monk. Interesting.
I'll start a new thread, this is quite interesting actually.

MuKen

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2005

19 Jul 2005 at 15:42 - 55

Consider this hypothetical situation. You are in a large group of people. You all want to go to an amusement park, but the park has a rule that for every 5 of you that go in as a group, one of you has to also listen to some stupid 1hr sales pitch of theirs. Nobody wants to be that guy. So obviously, out of the very large group, less than 1/5 of the people are willing to be the 'listener'. Maybe 1/10 of them are. Thus, half of you are going to have to wait 'til tomorrow to go in.

Now, some of the people who happen to want to listen to this sales pitch offer to join random groups of people for a small fee. Is this unfair? No, because they are taking up the position that nobody else wants. If you don't like it, you can wait 'til tomorrow, that's your choice.

Monks are doing the class that is obviously less palatable to the community as a whole (as evidenced by the lack of monks). This is a service they provide to the community (providing a supply where there is a lack). Anybody that begrudges them asking something in return, all the while not making monks themselves so as to help out the community, is a prick, plain and simple.

Algren Cole

Banned

Join Date: Jun 2005

19 Jul 2005 at 15:42 - 56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darksci

i'm just annoyed by the fact that i'm just asking a question here, NOT
whether its right or wrong. I guess I have to deal with it

But anyway i got the knowledge i need.

So anyone whos against it and replies to this thread, i'll just say
"ha ha - don't care - vent out your anger, let it out"

Funny though, speaking in real life.
In some parts of the world, going to hospital is free (volunteers)
And in other parts of the world, going to hospital will cost you.
Yet people accept going to a hospital which charges, since they have the money. One could argue that a being a doctor is a profession and takes years of learning. Well the same goes for being a monk, getting to level 20 takes some time, and has a learning curve as well to be a good monk. Interesting.
I'll start a new thread, this is quite interesting actually.

but if that doctor(in the real world) wanted someone to keep the mobs from kicking his tiny little ass into oblivion...he'd need to pay a warrior to protect him....

MuKen: your theory doesn't hold water....Pre-Sear through Trials of Ascension there are a plethora of monks looking to join parties simply to play...it's AFTER ascension that there aren't enough Monks...there are plenty of people that are playing monks they just know they can charge others for their "services" and so they sit around town and wait instead of playing.

bstripp

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Apr 2005

19 Jul 2005 at 15:44 - 57

How much can you charge, well if you ask me, 0 gc. Not that I am against it, just that there are two henchmen monks that are as good as most monks that seem to run around.

I don't know you from a hole in a wall, but in my opinion there is little market for this kind of service. Sure, you'll hit here and there, but not for much and not consistently.

Additionally, if you let someone die, they will likely ask for a refund whether or not its your fault or not.

DiAnna

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jul 2005

19 Jul 2005 at 15:46 - 58

My, my! I told you that I don't respond well to sullen demands by bossy, greedy monks! This is a public forum, read by experienced and newbie, developer and civilian! Just because you demand only positive, agreeable responses doesn't mean you are entitled to get them.

What you are doing, charging for basic character services, is a blight on the community. I do not want new players believing that legitimate monks charge for services, or that GW is supposed to be played that way. So I express my disapproval. I do not want ANet presuming that the main player base likes the idea of paying monks to do exactly what ANet created monks to do in the first place. So I express my disapproval.

I do not want those reading this unpleasant thread to get the impression that the selling of services is a legitimate activity, because in my opinion it most certainly is not. And I shall continue to say so!

You just don't seem to get the fact that stomping your feet, screaming in all caps and demanding that everyone acquiesce to your wishes will not work in a public forum... and will not work in real life either, for that matter. I respectfully suggest that if you are intent upon controlling the content of every thread you start, you create your own public forum and limit participants to those who will nod in agreement with your every whim. Be sure to charge them a hefty fee when they sign up, too. Money is money, after all.

Calimar

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2005

Silver Limon

E/Me

19 Jul 2005 at 15:47 - 59

Come on.

No flames is a good rule, but did you really expect people to jump in only for positive comments? The very title you set explains very clearly that you expected people to comment on both sides. Know what to do with a flamer? Ignore him.
And what do you do with a thousand flamers? Ignore them.

It doesn't matter what they think - in this particular case you were looking for something, and you got something. Simple. What they think is of no importance for you. You flame back? Pathetic.

Mind you, I might well be one of those flamers. It's just that I do not care... why getting angry? If all the monks did charge, I'd adventure only with henchies and guildmates. I'm one of those that believe you take the reponsibility of your choices. Meaning I'd start having every *player* that has a paid monk that I remember or recognize pay to enter my groups. My guild has good monks, it never happened to me to be in NEED of one. Hell, I *am* a monk when it suits me too. If the community changes, I'll change accordingly.

Is there a need to insult people? nah. Insults only serve one's own righteousness. I'm better than you nyah-nyah and you're a jerk/ joke/ dishonest/ dimwit/ snubnose/ whatever (just quoting some things I heard here). I don't think any insult offered or perceived from someone I know nothing about will ever change my life or my opinion of myself

I'd rather pay a good mesmer, btw. Good mesmers are extremely rare, extremely difficult to play, and while one just needs some common sense to be a decent monk, even a bad monk can still save you most of the times. A bad mesmer is less than useless, it takes up a space with no added value.

JMNERHO

Mithie

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jul 2005

Rest En Pieces [RIP]

Me/W

19 Jul 2005 at 15:47 - 60

Quote:

Originally Posted by MuKen

Monks are doing the class that is obviously less palatable to the community as a whole (as evidenced by the lack of monks). This is a service they provide to the community (providing a supply where there is a lack). Anybody that begrudges them asking something in return, all the while not making monks themselves so as to help out the community, is a prick, plain and simple.

That's what henchmen are for. Guild Wars is a GAME, it's a product for ENTERTAINMENT. For every monk that charges, there are 60 monks that are all too happy just to get in a group and PLAY for FUN without having to worry about some imaginary economic responsiblity.

To the person that compared playing a monk in Guild Wars to a doctor working in a hospital: yeah, because playing Guild Wars is a real life and death situation.

Drakron

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2005

19 Jul 2005 at 15:52 - 61

Quote:

Originally Posted by MuKen

...
Monks are doing the class that is obviously less palatable to the community as a whole (as evidenced by the lack of monks). This is a service they provide to the community (providing a supply where there is a lack). Anybody that begrudges them asking something in return, all the while not making monks themselves so as to help out the community, is a prick, plain and simple.

Thats crap.

EVERY single class have something to offer, monks dont make a mission.

Saying "oh monks are uncommon in later missions" ... guess what?

So is mesmers, rangers, necros and a lot of classes depending on what people are there at that time, I seen 6 monks in a mission area with 2 W/Mo ... sould they pay the first Elementarist that shown up?

Monks want to get played because they think they are special ... well I have a W/Mo and so I can Sprint out and Rebirth the team ... sould I get payed for it?

Heck in that logic anyone with the monk as 2nd class sould get payed since they can heal and res, E/Mo can spawn more healing [even if they heal less) that a Mo/? ... sould they get payed?

Your entire argument is "monks can heal so they sould get payed" ... so what? they cannot cast AoE spells or have the armor to block mobs from reaching casters.

Every class have something to offer.

Drakenbow

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: May 2005

US, MS

The Brotherwood

R/E

19 Jul 2005 at 15:57 - 62

Okay, didn't see this on here....

I have mixed feelings about this topic, but I will put the negative on the shelf

It is possible that I would pay for an *excellent* monk, but when a henchie wouldn't work or I was only finding fodder. That being said, I would prefer the monk "prove" themselves first. Possibly have a set price and deduct from it based on how many times party members die. That way, if you don't perform well... you don't get paid well. (Hmmm, malpractice comes to mind hehe...) If you are *excellent* then you get paid well and possibly a bonus if you're with me

...
just my 2 gold

MuKen

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2005

19 Jul 2005 at 16:02 - 63

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithie

That's what henchmen are for. Guild Wars is a GAME, it's a product for ENTERTAINMENT. For every monk that charges, there are 60 monks that are all too happy just to get in a group and PLAY for FUN without having to worry about some imaginary economic responsiblity.

Yeah, the henchmen are there for those of you that don't want to worry about acquiring a real monk (or whatever class), so if you don't like the economic impact of the supply/demand situation for monks, then use the henchmen. Don't go trying to stop other people from charging for their services. Just because a lot of people do something for free, does not mean that the remainder loses their right to charge for it, it just means they have competitition.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Algren Cole

MuKen: your theory doesn't hold water....Pre-Sear through Trials of Ascension there are a plethora of monks looking to join parties simply to play...it's AFTER ascension that there aren't enough Monks...there are plenty of people that are playing monks they just know they can charge others for their "services" and so they sit around town and wait instead of playing.

And that's why people attempting to charge Pre-Sear through Trials of Ascension generally don't get anywhere. If people are capable of charging after that, that shows that their is a lack of people who want to play monks past that. If people are capable of charging and getting away with it, that shows they are providing a rare enough service to justify it, otherwise the chargers would never make any money. There's no point in trying to argue against it, economics will drive out the people who are not doing anything worth charging for.

Mithie

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jul 2005

Rest En Pieces [RIP]

Me/W

19 Jul 2005 at 16:05 - 64

Quote:

Originally Posted by MuKen

Yeah, the henchmen are there for those of you that don't want to worry about acquiring a real monk (or whatever class), so if you don't like the economic impact of the supply/demand situation for monks, then use the henchmen. Don't go trying to stop other people from charging for their services. Just because a lot of people do something for free, does not mean that the remainder loses their right to charge for it, it just means they have competitition.

WRONG. We're not actively STOPPING him from charging, we're simply noting our opinion that the act of charging demonstrates a moral point of view that differs from those shared by the majority of the community, which is certainly a valid opinion and an even more valid criticism.

Chev of Hardass

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Mar 2005

Under a rock

zP

Me/

19 Jul 2005 at 16:14 - 65

Well, I charge a heavy fee for my services. I think what I do is worth a ton so I require that I be presented payment.

As a Warrior, I tend to be the group leader, I pull, call targets, and direct the team through the mission. Note I only "charge" fees for the missions that I know well and can honestly say I have beaten till I am blue in the face.

*For services renedered I require healing, experiance, my fair share of the drops, and that damage dealers follow my targets.

As a Necro, I continually juice the healers with energy (as in 100% of the time in battle), juice the Eles when I have time and the healers are keeping up with my life and I don't have to, and call targets.

*For services renedered I require healing, experiance, my fair share of the drops, and that damage dealers follow my targets.

As a ranger, I primarily shut down casters and healers, as well as do some pretty dacent damage. I again, call targets and pull and lead the way.

*For services renedered I require healing, experiance, my fair share of the drops, and that damage dealers follow my targets and that these same damage dealers don't follow me if I am going to shut down some pesky caster or healer while they kill one that I have already shutdown.

I run missions repeatedly, one in mind is Thunderhead Keep. I'm looking for a nice Hornbow there. I inform the group of this when we start the mission, and one day I hope someone will let me buy the one that drops, or one they have. For a fair price.

So, charge, you will have competition. Players that get burned by monks charging will go create a monk along with the entire rest of the guild wars community, and put you completely out of business.

On the other hand, I have seen groups pitch in and pay a well playing monk, at the end of a mission out of pure donation.

Fair share-set by Guild Wars.

MuKen

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2005

19 Jul 2005 at 16:16 - 66

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithie

WRONG. We're not actively STOPPING him from charging, we're simply noting our opinion that the act of charging demonstrates a moral point of view that differs from those shared by the majority of the community, which is certainly a valid opinion and an even more valid criticism.

No, you're not actively stopping him, but I think that's more because of your inability to do so than out of respect for his rights. That's demonstrated by your coming in to his thread, which was intended to ask advice from like-minded people about how to do it, and derailing it by shoving your opinion all over.

I am entitled to my opinion that my neighbor's smoking habit is filthy, but I'm not gonna go with him to the store and remind him of that to his face while he's trying to buy cigarettes.

Xonic

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jul 2005

Mo/Me

19 Jul 2005 at 16:20 - 67

I did a lot of "charged runs" by using henchmen. yeah, go go no skill players...

Divinus

Academy Page

Join Date: May 2005

Mississippi

19 Jul 2005 at 16:29 - 68

I doubt this will ever entirely work. There will always be people like me, who when see someone spamming "Monk - Charging X Amount for X Mission", will go get their monk and spam right under them "Monk - Free!".

hydrak

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2005

19 Jul 2005 at 16:39 - 69

All truely devoted monk players don't charge anything. Same thing goes for other classes: you won't see a warrior asking for gold to tank for the group, or an elementalist charging gold to be a nuker for the group.

The monks who charge for their services belong to the class of MORONIC GW players. It's unfortunate that these morons only play monks, thus giving the other monks a bad name.

Mithie

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jul 2005

Rest En Pieces [RIP]

Me/W

19 Jul 2005 at 16:41 - 70

Quote:

Originally Posted by MuKen

No, you're not actively stopping him, but I think that's more because of your inability to do so than out of respect for his rights. That's demonstrated by your coming in to his thread, which was intended to ask advice from like-minded people about how to do it, and derailing it by shoving your opinion all over.

The question of the viability of charging as a monk was part of the original post, and the negative opinions and critcisms, though against the wishes of the original poster, are nonetheless very valid and overshadows much of the issues being thrown on the table. This is a forum. It's an open environment where everyone can express their opinions, to the extent of the limits imposed by the person who pays the bandwidth fees. The negative criticisms were made by mostly long time posters here who knows not to derail threads, yet such was their reaction to the OP, so obviously, not only is it relavent to the OP, the criticisms were CRITICAL to the OP, or at least thought to be such by their posters.

Quote:

I am entitled to my opinion that my neighbor's smoking habit is filthy, but I'm not gonna go with him to the store and remind him of that to his face while he's trying to buy cigarettes.

There are thousands of billboards invested across the world doing just that: reminding people of the health risks of smoking. If, in your heart, you truly believe smoking is an unhealthy thing, then by telling him such, you're making a morally correct decision. But that's irrelevant, as a supermarket is not an international public forum.

Scaphism

Elite Guru

Join Date: Jan 2005

Idiot Savants [iQ]

19 Jul 2005 at 16:52 - 71

Welcome to a community forum.
When you post, you subject yourself to the whims of the community. You can ask for something nicely, rudely, with caps lock on, in german, or even typing with your hands reversed- and guess what? You are still subject to criticism by the community.
While I'm on the subject, let me point out that criticism is not by nature a destructive or disparaging activity. Criticis should ask hard, analytical, crucial or "critical" questions about what they read.

You don't have the right to call each other names or any other kind of personal attacks. That's a line we've drawn and we enforce.

When you post about a controversial topic, expect controversy. To expect otherwise would be naive. Do your best to keep the boards civil and constructive, but that doesn't mean we constantly pat each other on the backs.

hydrak

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2005

19 Jul 2005 at 16:52 - 72

The issues or arguments of the original poster are completely invalid. He compares monks to real life doctors, thus giving them the right to charge fees. What he doesn't understand is that in guildwars, everyone in the group has his or her own profession, not just the monk. So if everyone is doing his or her job in the group, why are the monks asking for fees while others don't? (answers: because fee-asking monks belong to the class of moronic guildwars players).

Aalric

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: May 2005

W/N

19 Jul 2005 at 16:58 - 73

All I can say is WOW

I'm on the European servers & I've not yet seen a monk charging for services - worse I've seen is not wanting to pay 125 for UW/Fissure.

Is this what's going on in the good old USA? Makes an expat sad to see - we've become to materialistic.

Aalric Rhynwood
Proud W/N (who doesn't charge)

The Destroyer

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2005

19 Jul 2005 at 17:31 - 74

I see monks charging 1 k for their services all the time. I really dont get this. A mission lasts at least 30-60 minutes and you get 1 k up front maybe another 500 in loot right? I can take my monk and go farm undead in several different map areas and make 2500-3500 gold in 30 minutes. Thats 2 to 3 times what you are making charging so whats the point? Why charge when you can make more money solo-ing high level undead? It must be a viable makrket as I see so many monks charging but I laugh when I see it realizing I make a much higher profit with far less hassle and my rep as a monk doesnt get tarnished with the "hes a mercenary" ideal. Is it the fact that these monks are so inexpereinced they dont know they can make tons of cash solo and then go and help people through missions when they feel like being nice? Please monks of the realm learn how to use your attribute refunds go heal/smite and go earn some real money on your own!

sleazeh

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2005

good from far, far from good

Gaming Continuum

Mo/Me

19 Jul 2005 at 17:34 - 75

In direct answer to the question posed in the thread topic, you "should" charge nothing. The "service" you provide, regardless of your skill, or lack thereof, is unnecessary.

No single player, character, or class is specifically required for the completion of any quest or mission in the game. Further, for PvE in particular, the supplied AI henchmen are more than adequate to either completely create, or complement, any party, group build, or team you can conceive of.

Nothing personal, but I hope that so-called "service ventures" end up in utter failure and disappear from the community. I actually find the whole notion rather sad.

Algren Cole

Banned

Join Date: Jun 2005

19 Jul 2005 at 17:39 - 76

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Destroyer

I see monks charging 1 k for their services all the time. I really dont get this. A mission lasts at least 30-60 minutes and you get 1 k up front maybe another 500 in loot right? I can take my monk and go farm undead in several different map areas and make 2500-3500 gold in 30 minutes. Thats 2 to 3 times what you are making charging so whats the point? Why charge when you can make more money solo-ing high level undead? It must be a viable makrket as I see so many monks charging but I laugh when I see it realizing I make a much higher profit with far less hassle and my rep as a monk doesnt get tarnished with the "hes a mercenary" ideal. Is it the fact that these monks are so inexpereinced they dont know they can make tons of cash solo and then go and help people through missions when they feel like being nice? Please monks of the realm learn how to use your attribute refunds go heal/smite and go earn some real money on your own!

while my experience with a monk is limited...(I have a lvl11 currently farming char in pre-sear)...I can honestly say that the entire idea of charging for missions was probably based on the fact that these monks CAN'T* farm properly...and thus need a way to make money. Healing a party is easy...it doesn't take a brain..or though...or even much attention. Stand back and watch the meters..when they're low hit em with a heal. A good monk brings far more to a group than healing....but healing is all you NEED to play a monk. A bad monk can keep you alive...those are the monks charging to run missions with you. A GOOD monk teams up with you for thunderhead keep and makes you think "why was this mission so tough the first 5 times I did it??"

Stev0

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Apr 2005

Halifax, NS, Canada

19 Jul 2005 at 17:40 - 77

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darksci

Funny though, speaking in real life.
In some parts of the world, going to hospital is free (volunteers)
And in other parts of the world, going to hospital will cost you.
Yet people accept going to a hospital which charges, since they have the money. One could argue that a being a doctor is a profession and takes years of learning. Well the same goes for being a monk, getting to level 20 takes some time, and has a learning curve as well to be a good monk. Interesting.
I'll start a new thread, this is quite interesting actually.

Don't compare this with real life because you can't.

It's wholey unreasonable for one class to benefit monetarily for efforts that should be provided normally. In real life if you don't have cash you die.

In this game every class gives in their own way. Without Warriors to block heavy hitters the lighter armored players would get stomped. Without Rangers the group would be picked off tactically by unreachable opponents. Without Mesmers incoming heavey hitting spells would always get through. Without Elementalists you would be missing the heavy artillery pounding on creatures in groups and getting through the defences Rangers and Warriors cannot. Without Necros you cannot gain the benefits of the fallen to swell your ranks and weigh down strong enemies and finally; Without Monks to help prop up the wounded and provide defensive aid to the group. Remove anyone of those ESTABLISHED positions in the party and the whole thing comes down like a house of cards.

Should anyone gain more than another? No. If people give freely for good play then yes go ahead give a reward to a fellow player that does a superb job. Asking for cash for something that comes naturally is ridiculous because a Monk is NOTHING without the rest of the party.

hydrak

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2005

19 Jul 2005 at 17:43 - 78

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Destroyer

I see monks charging 1 k for their services all the time. I really dont get this. A mission lasts at least 30-60 minutes and you get 1 k up front maybe another 500 in loot right? I can take my monk and go farm undead in several different map areas and make 2500-3500 gold in 30 minutes. Thats 2 to 3 times what you are making charging so whats the point? Why charge when you can make more money solo-ing high level undead? It must be a viable makrket as I see so many monks charging but I laugh when I see it realizing I make a much higher profit with far less hassle and my rep as a monk doesnt get tarnished with the "hes a mercenary" ideal. Is it the fact that these monks are so inexpereinced they dont know they can make tons of cash solo and then go and help people through missions when they feel like being nice? Please monks of the realm learn how to use your attribute refunds go heal/smite and go earn some real money on your own!

Well said. A true monk doesn't need to charge and will never charge a fee in a group. Making 1-3k for a 30-60 mins mission is the worst possible way to earn gold.

MuKen

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2005

19 Jul 2005 at 17:51 - 79

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scaphism

Welcome to a community forum.
When you post, you subject yourself to the whims of the community. You can ask for something nicely, rudely, with caps lock on, in german, or even typing with your hands reversed- and guess what? You are still subject to criticism by the community.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithie

The question of the viability of charging as a monk was part of the original post, and the negative opinions and critcisms, though against the wishes of the original poster, are nonetheless very valid and overshadows much of the issues being thrown on the table.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MuKen

No, there's no rule requiring you to show him common courtesy by making your posts align with the intended topic of the thread. Doesn't change the fact that doing otherwise makes you a jerk.

The non-jerk way to discuss your opinions is to start another thread "should monks charge for their services"

I'm not debating what you are and are not ALLOWED to do, since there is clearly no rule against inserting your opinion into a thread in a manner that will clearly lead to its derailment. I'm just stating my opinion: this is a jerktastic way of doing things.

He didn't put out an opinion on this subject and ask for discussion, he asked for like-minded people to give him advice on how to go about his business. Coming in and telling him that this whole process is disgusting, rather than simply making your own thread for the purpose of that discussion, is rude.

Kiiron

Academy Page

Join Date: Jul 2005

La Jolla

Mo/R

19 Jul 2005 at 17:52 - 80

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darksci

Funny though, speaking in real life.
In some parts of the world, going to hospital is free (volunteers)
And in other parts of the world, going to hospital will cost you.
Yet people accept going to a hospital which charges, since they have the money. One could argue that a being a doctor is a profession and takes years of learning. Well the same goes for being a monk, getting to level 20 takes some time, and has a learning curve as well to be a good monk. Interesting.
I'll start a new thread, this is quite interesting actually.

I'd just like to point out that this isn't quite true. In most non-agricultural countries where there is free health care (for instance, Canada), the doctors are not volunteers. They are paid by the Canadian government for services rendered, and are thus compensated for their work in that way.

People accept going to a hospital that charges, usually, because they have no choice. Tell me - if you've broken your arm and have a choice of going to a state-run hospital that will not charge you for anything or going to a private hospital that will charge you $200 for the x-ray, $100 for the cast and $800 for the time it took? And if you're not rich and don't have health insurance (for instance, Wal-mart's costly premiums and limited coverage mean that only about 2/5 employees buy it) good luck if you have a heart attack and require rehab and care (overwhelming medical debt is the number one reason for bankrupcy in the US).

Also, I don't think you can compare our capitalistic system with the Guild Wars economy, especially considering that ANet has gone to great lengths to make this game decidedly un-capitalistic. For instance, the rune traders seem to be nothing less than a direct government subsidy: why pay another player 10k for that superior blood rune when you can buy it from the trader for 120 gold? They have made trading with other players completely optional for all intents and purposes.

Anyway, on the OP's point, I would say that a monk (my primary character is a pure healer) is worth anywhere from a few hundred to a few k, depending on experience, dedication and survivability. But don't oversell yourself. You might think you're the greatest thing to happen to healing since Edward Jenner, but if 4 party members end up biting the dust, you'll sure look silly. Also, I'd think that most people would be wary of paying in full up front. But anyway, good luck on your experiment!