GW Race Expansion Idea

I've posted this in other forums, so if you've read this, bear with me...

So, I was thinking the other day. What classes could A.Net possibly put in that would be unique to the other 6 classes? The other 6 pretty much seem to cover everything.

Then I also started thinking, how can A.Net put in multiple races without upsetting the balance they've created?

Then it hit me...make 'races' new primary classes. Here's my thought process behind it...

1. Primary classes are already like races anywho. They determine appearance and armor and such, which is what races in other games do. This way developers don't have to worry about 12 character appearances each time they had a race.

2. This would allow players to add some new race-specific abilities to the mix, without abandoning the already pre-set classes. One would still choose one of the six classes as a secondary.

In thinking that, I also thought they needed to be limited, to keep interest in the traditional system alive.

1. 'Races' can only be primary classes. Thus not receiving bonuses from Fast Casting, Divine Favor, etc...

2. Races will be limited in which secondary classes they can choose. (e.g. A wood elf can only be Monk, Ranger, Warrior).

3. They won't have access to as many types of armor. One type that give bonuses to physical defense, one type that give energy (magical) bonuses/defense.

4. They don't have as many unique attributes as normal primary classes.

So, here's what I scribbled up to kind of show what I'm talking about. Due to the format I found it best to write it in .doc and convert it to HTML. So here's the link:

http://members.cox.net/azrael1415/gwraces.htm

And for those who can't abide the 'traditional' races, don't worry. I just used traditional for ease of understanding. They're there just to communicate the idea.

Read it and tell me what you think!

I don't know...I'm actually kind of glad that they kept it all human. IDK why, but it's just too normal for an MMORPG to have multiple races...we're focusing on skill sets, not race, etc. It would most likely ruin the storyline, too, to have multiple races.

imo, i think gw should wait for the race expansion till the after couple month, possibly 4-6 months after the release, i want to see the balance in the retail such as item price, build, better ui, and fixxes of most glitches/map bugs.

Well, I was thinking in starting a thread on races. First I did a search to read what someone else might have been written already. And now, as I think this thread is the more extense on the subject I have decided to post here my ideas.

In my view the concept of race does not imply introducing new professions. A different race would be, mainly, a different type of appearance and might be a little different type of basic stats in amount of health, amount of energy, and, or may be some few race bounded skills. But, a race may take one of the present professions with its atributes and skills. So that introducing a new race, would not be the same as introducing a new profesion necessarily. Thus a race is rather like sex, which does not imply different stats, but just a different appearance. By the way, I do not remember to have seen female dwarfs in the game... are all dwarfs male?

There are many monster races in Guild Wars, and those which are more alike humans may be: charr, elementals, dwarfs, undead, forgotten and mursaat.
Of all these the most pertinent candidate to become a playable race within arenas and guild fights is, it seems to be, dwarfs, and forgotten. I am able to figure these two fighting in the arenas
Charr and mursaat are all enemies of humans, but, they might do well with several professions; elementals and undead are inmune to some skills and that -I think- might be a problem (as well as the problem of being all enemies of humans), but this could be changed so that they lose their inmunity.

I do not see the point to introduce elves or orcs in Guild Wars, but, I see that it could be introduced a yet unknow race, in some new chapter of the story. Nevertheless, in my view, a new chapter would not be necessary to introduce races. Because, new races would not imply new professions, but just new appearances, and these are choosen in the character creation screens, introducing a new race could be done by means of a patch or actualization, without having to make the change with a chapter.

I like the idea of where keep the race as an additional attribute with its own skills and bonues, depend on how much points you assign (but not a class)

So a Human warrior can be very differnt for a Orc Warrior, depend on if he put points in his "Heritage" attribute and if he carry any of the heritage skills.

Of couse, the alternative way would just be new race > new core class.

/signed

I think there should be new races even if there isn't any special stats...it adds more color to the game

/notsigned

The game doesn't need races, the players don't need races. Guild Wars is not supposed to be another generic online RPG, it's supposed to be different. Infesting it with stupid orcs and trolls and elves and fairies and goblins and whatever else you want will ruin that.

/notsigned

I think races as new professions is a good idea.

I think that's good Idea but...elves somehow do not fit in my thoughts about GW...dwarves yes...I want to play Charr or Grawl =P

Ya I don't think races would fit at the moment; after a few chapters are released, and we learn more about the GW universe... y'never know...

If Anet put races, fine, but I dont want each race has is own attribute. For an example, Dwarf, if we say....... +1 Hammer mastery. Players who play Dwarf feel they must put the points in Hammer mastery only (got lvl 18 with dwarven helm and sup hammer mastery). What it dones? Unbalanced characters.

And for those who said GW is not Fantasy (From others thread like this one), Im sorry but fighting a Dragon, Gods Avatar who pop up when you kneel before a Statue of a God, invasion of Beast race, Meteor falling from the sky by a elemantalist..... And you say its not fantasy! Find something else.

In the End

/signed to put races

/not signed if races has Attribute bonus

Well, I have to agree that new races would be cool, but there is just no way they could have any different stats. As far as I'm concerned, that would require a complete re-vamping of the game's internal structure. They would have to program all that extra stuff into the game. I would really like to play as a new race, but they would have to find races that work well with the humans.

I would also think that Anet would have to re-write some of the back story stuff. I mean, why would a dwarf be in pre-searing ascalon. They would be in pre-searing Yak's Bend, or Droks. I also can't for the life of me remember what forgotten are.

I also like the comparison of race to gender. If race had no actual effect on the game other that asthetic, then I give it a thumbs-up.

Perhaps the races should be the ones in game

Ascalonians (Always hated that they pronounce is Ascalons)
Krytans
Cathans
Luxon
Kurzick

I wouldn't mind tiny tweaks in abilities based on what "race" you choose, but it would need to be rediculously balenced.

Dwarves?
I would like if it only change skins.. as someone pointed out if dwarves gave +1 hammer mastery, most would be obliged to be a hammer dwarf warrior, which I'd rather not.
You should also have the option to switching your older character's races...otherwise I would be angry.

It would be a good idea, they should add drwarves, or something. But, remeber, the dwarves have necros and everything, the dwarf should have a base AL increase or something. not much, maybe 1/2 per lvl in it.

Also, my cousin and I came up with a new class idea. Chuck Norris. We are actually serious too. The class could be a melee fighter, wpns could be bronze knuckles and stuff, and he could have a projectile magic of sorts. Think about it. It's a good idea.

if want new races, it can only be just a different skin,
please no different stats.

If they put in new races, I'd want to play a scale and a tengu/avacoria.

Don't give the races different stats, but you might want to give them some different skills or elites. For instance the tengu sword elite might be different from the scale, which is different from the human one. One or two different skills within the skillsets would keep them pretty much the same but add in a few options for flavor.

New Races should be entirely visual, with no change in gameplay. A Dwarf should play like a human should play like a...whatever. The idea of some players having inherent bonuses is not a good one, IMO.

I totally agree with swordfisher. IF they feel they have to add races, I'm ok with that. But I do NOT like the idea of choosing a race and then be pretty much forced to use a set type of skills; I can't even stand how we aren't allowed to use runes of our secondary professions.

Guildwars is all about originallity and freedom; addind orcs and elves ruins originallity and adding specific skills ruins freedom. I say add NEW races and toss away the idea of specific skills out the window, or don't add any new races at all.

Also a good idea I still like my new class idea.
Chuck Norris class FTW!!

I have always wanted (in the back of my head, without realy thinking about it) more races for guild wars.
Your idea may be a valid one, HOWEVER, the system you outlined for adding them is extreamly constricting, and quite frankly, retarded. Further, how you have them set now is EXTREAMLY underpowered.
I am not shure how arena net could effectivly implement new races, if they even decide to, but I will leave it to them to figure out how, as they have already made a great game, and Factions looks like it is going to be just as good, with a few small modifications (to help balance owning prophecies or factions - how they have it setup now, factions only players have an extream advantage over prophecies only players).
My reasoning for letting them decide how to implement it is simple:
as you have demonstrated, most people who come up with ideas for such have no idea of balancing a game, while maintaining the playability and fun aspects of such.
It is possable that someone has a good idea for such an addition, or that one may develope from something such as this, but I find it extreamly unlikely and a waist of most peoples time.

For recomendations to arenanet on how to balance prophecies and factions, and on a (yes, another, but hopefuly more effective) argument on whether it is better to merge accounts or leave them seperate, visit

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...=136963&page=9

Ninth page of this thread, one of the most effective posts are here, as all others are full of anolygies that do not work.

hmmm other races wouldnt really be needed if they just added alot more variation when custimizing your character, such as more height difference, different muscle builds, more hair variations, and so on.... if they did this you could pretty much make your own race... and about the whole certain race with certain skills, i agree this would make the game very unbalenced. and i dont think it would work, because say if you where an elf, then youd pretty much have to be a ranger cuz thats what there good at, and dwarf to hammer, ect. but just more variation like i said would work well i think...

Make them normal primary classes with any available secondary.

Like: Ogre
primary: tuff'-ness (gives 13 health per point.)
blunt mastery
ber-zerk-ery
huge-ness

Sure they would look different but they would be close enough to normal classes to be easily implemented and not give the players using them a disadvantage.

I agree that presearing Ascalon does not fit with dwarfs, nor with forgotten.

The Forgotten are those serpent like characters who inhabit the desert, ... don't you remember them? They are casters: monk, mesmer, necromancer and elementalist, and are friendly in the first of the two quests which has as reward 15 extra atribute points.

Another race of Guild Wars are the thieves of presearing Ascalon of which race might be Vanyi and Sanyi of the Hero's challenge quest. But, the look of these have some similarity with the coming Ritualist, I think.

Tengu, or Avicara, are presented as enemies of humans, -this should be changed if they were made a race.

I agree that there should be newer races to play, in coming expansions.

The races that we should be able to play(only going from the Prophecies campaign):

Dwarves - Can start out in Pre-Sear at Yak's Bend and kind of be welcomed by humans for a quest where you aided them.

Tengu - Can start out in the village just north of Bergen Hot Springs. Same series of quests brings you into contact and friendship with humans.

Forgotten - Can start out in the ruins in the Arid Sea. Maybe be mentored by Sariss Yassith into help the humans fulfill the Flameseeker Prophecy by journeying to Ascalon from the south.

Avicara - Start in the village to the east at the start of Thunderhead Keep.

All the new races would just be skins - no attribute or skill differences.

Can't see how they would be able to incorporate the Charr, Grawl, or Mursaat into the lore to be able to be played.

Ok I am for new races, but no stats. For dwarves a storyline is simple, and you dont have to add much or change much to cutscenes and story plot.

Opening Cutscene: The voice does the same thing except you are a dwarf that came over the mountains with your caravans to trade with the Ascalonian Kingdom.

Done. Thats it. And I thought about that while reading this thread. The rest of the missions all you ahve to do is change wherever it says humans to humanoids or Tyrians.

On another note..no racial stats unless they are *very* small. Such as dwarves having +5 armor but move 5% slower. Even that might be too much.

And NO un-friendly races please. Having tengu/avicara (which are of the same race I believe, just different tribes) is quite stupid. Why would you be killing them in all missions but have them in your party? It would make no sense.

For future races that aren't in Tyria, start them off in the expansion, even if you roll a prophecies character. How this would work is you start in x, x being the new "pre-sear" in the new continent. You do the quests and level. Then there is a different cutscene (compared to the one that would take you to the non-Prophecies world) that shows how you got to Tyria, and finally how you got to Ascalon. Perhaps a Tyrian came to your continent seeking help in the Guild Wars, or whatever else.

IMO this is the best way to work it.

If they have a race expansion it should only be for looks.

It would ruin the quickly customizable option when selecting skills for PvP

Each race would prefer one or two classes at best, so it would be a permanent imbalance in your character.

Like I said in my example about Dwarves with +1 hammer mastery. For the look, Its good but not with stats please!

They already have a tengu henchie, if you will. I doubt lpayer races will change due to balance, but maybe a druid class will be able to shapeshift???

Playing too much D2 with a druid lol
I was thinking too for a Shifters for a profession

Yes Talon the tengu is in the Beta (He was a boss in Kryta anyway).