How to avoid bad parties

I would appreciate some advice from more experienced players regarding finding good parties, avoiding bad parties, and the correct etiquette when the party turns out to be totally opposite to my style of play.

Guild Wars is my first on-line gaming experience, and am enjoying it immensely, either alone or teaming up with my wife. We have had several good experiences in forming smaller groups with one to two other players rather than using the AI henchmen.

Unfortunately, the number of bad experiences seem to be greater than the number of good. We like teamwork and tactical play, with a bit of humorous chat along the way while doing a mission or quest. But we have been in many parties where at least one or two of the party members took little regard for teamwork and just ran off from one group of enemies to the next, leaving little time for energy recharge or collecting creature drops. These same party members also seem the ones who complain the most when the monks in the group did not keep them alive or resurrect them quickly enough.

We like to play with a certain sense for etiquette, and therefore, so far, have tried to stick it out with such a party as long as possible. But this is really a waste of our playing time and little enjoyment, so I think in the future we will simply just hit that "leave" button and disappear from the group in such cases.

But what do the rest of you do? I notice that when a group is formed, there is very little chat before starting the mission/quest to make sure the playing style of all the party members is about the same. It seems that the group is just formed, someone says ok, ready, and out they go. Is this normally the case?

hmmmm yust take henchies they dont complain and dont start when your not ready

Hi Undead,

yes, I am playing quite a lot with just henchies. But, hey, when it clicks, it is extreme fun to play in a (partly) human party. So comment concerning what other people do in finding/forming parties is welcome.

I dont find many bad groups at all. Sure, its pretty average for one person to leave, but that doesnt make a group bad. If you are suck with morons who do things like draw penises on the map, then what I would do is: Say once, stop it or I (we) will leave. If they dont stop, follow through. That is just one type of bad group, maybe if you told me what exactly the problem is I could offer more.

Yes, its normal to form and go with little conversation. Most people play to play, and play to advance rather than play to socalize. Finding players to chat with is difficult, personally, I chat with my guild and not much with groups. Groups get me further in the game, but you are able to form relationships with guildies.

As to your ettiquette, this is online gaming. Be selfish, everyone else is. Im not saying be an ass, but if someone is making the game not fun, leave. If people get mad at you for it, screw em. Its a game, its about fun and to have fun the most important thing to consider is yourself.

On a side note: If you state your reason for leaving, then leave, your party wont blame you, they will blame the idiot. "Sorry guys, I cant handle any more of Random Named Dork's idiocy, Im out." They will proceed to flame Random Named Dork and most likely all leave (like they were probably thinking of doing anyhow) and just find another group.

you can't avoid them, they're everywhere
best thing to do is find a guild with the "spirit" you are hoping for and make the quests/missions with guildmates

I always run the group. Within a few minutes you can normaly weed them out. Hit the eject button, find another.

We sisters just took henchies from Doknors to Lomar, that was a fun trek.
Still havnt found the boss Im looking for.

If you're going to kick someone just because their a ranger, I think you're probably not the best person to be taking advice from.

Paine, im not going to flame your idiotic ranger comments here, please list your name and guild abbriviation, so I can ignore you.

my ranger could prolly kill u 1:1 while running

I think that the suggestions you're getting, Coolsti, are good ones (except for Paine's, though I'm sure you already knew that). The best things to do:

1. Try to get your group to talk before the mission begins. You can tell a lot about the mentality of the party's players if they talk a bit beforehand. If you don't like what you're hearing, hit the 'leave' button.

You might ask questions such as: Has anyone done this mission/quest before? Will we be running or fighting? Who is the leader? Who will call targets?

You might also tell them what is on your 'skill' belt and ask for suggestions or requests for skills they'd like you to carry. Take those suggestions/requests with a grain of salt, however, as you must play your character to your best advantage.

2. Try, as someone else said, to find a guild (probably a large-ish) one that shares your ideas on gaming, fun, PvP/PvE, etc. You might look in the guild hall part of these forums for ideas and/or ask posters on the forums about their guilds.

3. Build a list of players that you HAVE liked playing with. I usually ask first if I can include them on my friends list and have yet to have anyone turn me down.

4. If someone's being a real jerk on a mission/quest, tell them you're annoyed and why and ask them to stop. Give the warning that you will leave (along with your wife) if they persist. If they do keep going or if they flame you, leave. Plain and simple. You're in the game to have fun and when it stops being fun because of some immature idiot, then it's time to go.

Just like some of the others said.

1) Use guild mates when possible

2) Find a good leader

3) Or use the henchies.



Sorena Mascar

Do not know if this is a valid point for you to consider but usually when I join a group or gather a group, I ensure that everyone in the group is communicating. If one doesnt respond at all, then its best to kick that person out and get someone else.

Of course, a window of time is allowed.

I disagree with leaving because someone is being immature (ie drawing penises or cursing at someone for a perceived mistake). Remember, you aren't punishing only the idiot, you're punishing everyone else in the group. Frankly, if the mission has been going on for a while and someone abandons it because of being offended by an idiot's behavior, they aren't being a much better of a group member than the idiot himself. It's better etiquette to tough it out and suffer through a little childishness and get the mission done, IMO.

The foolproof solution to the problem is joining a good guild.

A key thing I've noticed is not to go with a group with a leader who click enter mission as soon as enter the group and people who say GO GO GO right when u enter. Experienced players give people a bit of room to adjust skills and other things.

Being clicked-on without asking for an invite for whatever (mission, bonus, both, etc) is a red flag as well.

I see a lot of good suggestions, yet unfortunately there's never a guarantee for a nice or successfull party. There are missions that can be skipped and missions needed to complete to get to another map. Especially that kind of missions are continually causing pain in the @$$. Because there are allways people who allready tried them a few times and failed. For them its no longer fun. Understand those players wont like a cozy chat or hanging around for someone who tells the telephone is ringing. They spent enough time allready on the mission and they will leave as soon as they get the impression that its going to be a waste of time... again (I think that if there was a 'after 3 tries restart the mission at the latest point with henchmen only'-button they would never cause trouble again ).

For the rest, there are players who are not so fast. They simply dont respond in the middle of action because they cant. Just accept that. Being the first person to leave a party is never a good idea. I would not recommend that since it makes the good partymembers feel bad.

Joining a guild is a good option. Problem is getting information about the guild. And I myself find it hard to find one I really like (no obligations, friendly responses on questions, allowing everyone to play his/her own game).

A conversation and/or a teamleader who asks questions and tells what to do before the game starts is no guarantee for success either. I played the game with such a teamleader (and he guided well), but after a few deaths and a discussion about healing he considered this team would not make it (after half the mission was done) and left himself.

Probably its simply the nature of those missions 'that cannot be skipped' that makes it impossible to just start and have fun. Most players in those missions have NO fun! They are allready stressed at the start and hope to pass the mission as fast as possible...

Lots of replies, and thanks for all of them.

I think it would be great if the online gaming community would invent some informative acronyms for the type of group being looked for. I mean, now there is the acronym LFG for "looking for group". Would be nice if there would be something like LFG/HS for looking for a "hack slash" only group, or LFG/RP for looking for a group with a relaxed pace.

Emphasis on this point.

You'll soon find out if they're likely to act up in the middle of a mission.

I've also learnt to be wary of those who don't say anything at all. Sure, they could be afk, but a lot of people who do not speak before the mission starts often pay no attention to tactics that have been discussed before hand. (Likely due to being afk). Or, enjoy leading every mob on the map back to your monk..

- V

If you accept an invitation and see lots of names of people waiting to be accepted, leave. This means the leader is probably just clicking at random.

If you accept an invitation and there are 6 of one class and 2 monks, leave. Balance is the key to a sucessful trip.

Let me stress the communication thing. As soon as I get in a group, I say "hi", if I get no response for several minutes, I leave. I refuse to play this game without any skill, speed, or mission talk.

If you ever need help running missions or quests, look me up. I'd be happy to help. I'm usually on with Alora Chimera. I know the issues with finding a good group to run with. I am also with a good, mature guild. So if you see me online, whisper me and I'll help you out.

Guilds or friends are by far the best way to ensure a good team experience.

Pick Up Groups are a real lottery, altho Chev posted some good tips on how to spot a disaster in the making here. Signs of a good group are being asked if you want to join, communication on tactics and classes to fill the group BEFORE starting the mission, and a general level of good natured banter etc.

I would say, nearly impos. to know if good or bad.

For : Underworld ( as W ), FoW

U need 2 Monks,better 3. If u join a Team/Party for Uw and the Fissure, and they dont have any Monks or just 1, then u should know :

Bad PArty, leave !

So thats the only advice i can give u.

And btw. USA plz stop playing HoH

The major problem I have with finding parties, it getting into these parties that insist on having to have 2 monks. Some people just don't realize that if you have enough damage, and AOE and good control of mobs you can be successfull in any mission with 1 monk, or in some missions with none.

The fun thing of a good party is that not all players have to be good at all. It is the combination that can make a party good or bad. Once we were down in the underworld and one guy took the lead and we all thought he was pretty good. Though when some guys died and we only had one living member left (not him :P) the guy left.
We all pretty much thought that the whole group would fall appart after this though when everyone was ressurected we lived longer then I ever bin in the underworld. So this might point out that the group first was statiscly stronger, though we were not realy getting allong well and when the guy left we were statisticly weaker, though we cooperated much better and making us the group we needed to be.

Last night I joined a party to do the bonus mission to "The Great Northern Wall" quest. I was under the impression that since we were gathering solely for the bonus mission that my comrades-in-arms had completed the main quest. It became readily apparent that my Carranthia was the only one who had been through the place before, and they abandoned her because they insisted I was going the wrong way. Happily, this was at the onset of the quest, so no love lost. Besides, the magician who invited me apologized for the mission's failure because she "honestly didn't know where she was going."

Unfortunately, there was little communication before we entered the map, we just "went for it," as it were. I'd rather hang back and take my time in a mission and draw out two or three monsters at a time.

However, my typing skills are not the greatest. When I'm in a mission, I find it next to impossible to "chat" while trying to concentrate on the game screen and the party's health. Sometimes the game camera spins wildly around me and I get disoriented. Sometimes I enter the wrong keystrokes and I get all sorts of game stat screens opening up and distorting my view. But now I tell people my chat skills ain't the best...so if they want a reply from Carranthia, it'll have to wait until everyone's out of harm's way. I can't fight Charr and answer people at the same time.

taking the henchies is an option...though I think it takes away from the fun of the game.

The best way to get good parties is to be the leader of the party...take your time putting the party together. If you KNOW the mission is going to have alot of mobs that are susceptable to fire AND generally stay in one place and use ranged attacks(Like borlis pass & frostgate)...advertise that you are looking for a Nuker....if you know your primary healer is setup for smite/dmg and can only take on half the healing load advertise that you need a Blood Necro with Well of Blood to alleviate the load...or that you are looking for a Smite/Support Healer Monk(don't even waste your time looking for a primary healer..I'm convinced they don't exist and the ones that do just want your money)...know what you need to get through the mission, what classes are gonna benefit your party the most and conduct mini interviews.

Don't be in a rush. Let everyone in the group know as they join that you have no intention on leaving for the mission for x amount of time...rushing through the selection process makes everyone unclear of their role...everyone MUST have a role. Without purpose you have chaos. Anyone that says things like "lets go HURRY HURRY HURRY"...or "You don't need a [insert class here] you noob" should be immediately kicked and replaced. The people rushing through the mission are the ones that are gonna make you fail.

lastly, be weary of the warrior...most of them suffer from serious comprehension difficulties and believe they are invincible because they are labeled "WARRIOR" and history tells of LEGENDARY WARRIORS! If you find a warrior that is interested in talking tactics and strategy...and interested in letting the group know how to protect him and what he's going to be doing to protect you...then you've found a smart warrior and should add them to friends list immediately.

Click Here for a thread full of team players who are looking for good PUGs!

I personally partied with a bunch of these folks and have had very pleasant experiences!

Argh, things I hate:

"rushers" who just charge any mobs they see and don't wait for the rest of the group.
"doomsayers" who demand a personal monk, and think that every group needs at least 2, I've done well enough with just one, granted I was playing my necro with well of blood ...
"leaders" who don't lead, and invite everybody in the mission area then expect to be just walked through the mission. If your forming a group, have an idea what to do.

But one thing that really stunned me the other day, "pvp quitters" - I was in a half decent group, but no monk, and the EL just quit before the match even started.
The funny thing was, the opposition was in the same boat, and two of them left just as we got to the start point, and we easy flattened the two remaining guys, felt sorry for them actually

To beat the horse to death - obviously guildies are your best bet (or finding a guild with similar interests in the game) but you can also take advantage of your "short" list of good experiences. If you find players that work well together and understand game mechanics/play than I would suggest that you ask them and then add them to your friends/PM list for future reference/ adventures.

Its not a fantastic way to gage the player - but rank is another one I use for determining if a player is worth partying with or not. Generally the high ranking folks understand the value of teamwork and I find I have a better success rate when partying with them.

The best thing I can say is - find your own personal "short" list because in the long run - there are way too many chiefs and not enough indians to have decent success with PUG's.


elk

You can tell a lot by the group leader, since he/she's the one who assembles the team.
When you enter the group open with a greeting - "Hi!" or "Are we doing mission + bonus?" etc. - a good leader will answer politely with a welcome.
If several members greet you then IMO that's a very good sign that it'll be a good party.
Also look at the team chat - Is it friendly small talk and/or advice? (good sign) Or is someone talking about how much the last team "sucked" (bad sign).

Also, if you happen to find some people you like - add them to your buddy list and tell them you'll keep in touch. One of you might PM the other in the future when working a quest. Many people don't mind helping out a friend - even in a quest they've already done.

Its been several weeks of playing since I started this thread, and I can say that we have had several good experiences, and several bad. But in the least we sort of have learned the ropes a bit.

The few people we really like to team up with are of course now on our friends list.

We have also started the tactic of forming our own party by starting off with us two plus two henchies (for a party size of 6) giving at most 2 slots left for human players. I find that this helps a lot. Firstly, I find communication and coordination a lot better with 4 rather than 6 humans, and perhaps there is a lesser chance of chaos occurring and including an egoist. Secondly, if the other humans complain about the presence of henchies in the group, then this may be a sign that they are not our style of players.

We still get our bummer experiences, like a few days ago when we let someone "LFG'ing" into our group (to find he already had a group of 4). At least two of the party rushed from one enemy group to the next, through several portals, leaving no time for recovery or picking up drops. What ticked me off was the guy who rushed all the way back, picking up all the unclaimed drops for himself (now that they no longer were reserved for a player). We at least learned what to do about this: as soon as we got to the middle of a multipart quest, we excused ourselves and left the group.

Thanks of course for all the advise and responses!

Join a guild... usually you have a LOT more communication and similar play styles.... and if not join a different guild

What mostly works for me is typing "LFG mission + bonus + teamwork."

I usually get several whispers asking to join me very quickly. There are several players that want to game just like myself and the original poster. Be in control of the group. Make sure everyone is on the same page as you before starting the mission or quest. If someone doesn't fit in you have the power to cut them loose. Just do it politely.

Now here is an EXCELLENT QUESTION:

I can answer this one. If you have been in the mission before and know the layout and feel comfortable about leading. I'll tell you what to do. I do this myself (when I dont take henchys as other suggest because aside from what the 'experts' say, henchys with a controlled 'called' target WORK).
I started doing this especially in the ascension areas because people started trying to charge to do a team mission. I found that repressive. Anyway, you post out "Looking to build a team for people willing to listen, I dont need leaders I need followers and teamates".
Now when you first read that sentence it sounds bold BUT believe it or not their are people out there that want to follow and not lead. These people with message you and ask if they can join. This helps you find out who you need. Next you DO NOT jump right out in mission when you have your team set. Here is the hard part, first you identify to the group what is necessary to complete the mission ie.. if there are undead on this mission remind people that elemental damage is going to be needed and poison doesnt work here. Second try and establish whos going to do what. Get them to get there AOE spells organized and who the healers are going to be.
Whats great about this is three things happen, one you get organized and two... your leaders who jumped in because they wanted a group will start to surface. They will start trying to designate and jump in. And lastly the impatinents that will run off and get pulled monsters will start saying "GO" ... "start the mission". Then you get to KICK them. They will start messenging you saying what happen. Explain to them briefly that a leader is already established and they are 'fired'. Cold .. yes .. effective.. yes.
This will save you from coming back to the same spot after 30 minutes on a mission and 'joblo' decided he didnt like how slow paced the mission was going and decides to take on the boss himself.
When your on a mission talk to the people, be brief and use the map. X on map means we ignore that target. () on map means that is the identified target and you use the ctl-spacebar to set the target. Encourage people to all attack the same target. This puts the monsters down faster rather than being separated. Healers are the first target, Casters second, Brusiers nxt. If you have a boss that is a caster or a healer designate a Mez or a Ranger before the mission to identify when we come to that target their job is to disrupt the boss or healer. This helps the team. If the team starts failing their tasks, dont cuss them out. Ask to pull back and re-identify what we could do to work better. Sometimes in the mix of things people get excited and forget their job. It happens.

One feature Id love to see is a kick feature in the mission that lets you votekick a player out and auto pull a choice henchy. Now that would be nice.
Basically this is what I started doing. Now if you get someone in the group that has a good suggestion Im not saying kick them, suggestions are good. As long as the understand their position within the team.
Good luck.

That's awesome advice. I've also had trouble with people running off or trying to take charge if I am leading a group. Good advice.

If you join a team and find them all almost naked and dancing.....it MAY be time to look for another team.

I just noticed a few more responses to my original post. Thanks!

To GhostPoet, well, it depends on what you are looking for. We play with a lot of teamwork, communication, and tactics. But we also like to add a bit of humor to the game, and do take a few dancing breaks now and then. Its kind of funny, and breaks up the monotony of just killing.

To wbaldwin67: Great Advice! Thx! Already started doing a little of what you suggest. Lately when looking for a team I have been specifying teamwork needed, etc.

BTW we had a great experience recently doing the Riverside mission. Shortly after start one of the group disappeared (maybe do to lag?). Then almost halfway through the mission another said sorry guys, gotta go, and then disappeared. A few seconds after that a third left the group without a word. Guess he figured the mission was not doable without a full party. So now we were 3 left. We decided to try to finish the mission anyway, and we did it! With teamwork and good communication we could do it on our own.

The problem with pugs is really the overenthused panicmongers. Okay so this is your first time playing a computer game and maybe you haven't quite learend that death here isn't final yet - doesn't mean you need to quite whenever your health drops below 50% though. Doesn't mean you need to spam your entire energys worth of healing breeze on an E/Mo smiter running Ether. And it doesn't mean everyone else wants to take 8 hours doing the most trivially easy run of PvE tedium ever invented.

Those are really the most painfully common groups. Highly deluded, overly serious and convinced that there can only be one way to finish a mission, and this one way has to be slower than watching paint dry. Get over it, you're a crappy monk and you wasted your energy - your heals werent needed 10 seconds ago, and they're still not needed for the next mob I'm going to kill for the xth time. Because while you're trying to cast healing seed on yourself yet again, I'm moving on and aware of not just how my skills function but exactly what those mobs can possibly do and what action (or weapon type) triggers what AI response.

Everyone has differences in playing styles and moods. That is precisely why I find it difficult to find a party of 6 that functions well. And one of the things that I really find annoying (and will make me hit that leave button faster than anything else) is the impatient warrior-type that runs off to the next fight without waiting for the rest of the party to heal and regain energy.

The rhetorical point of the quoted sentence was that healing seed cannot be cast on oneself, and that I have limited patience when playing a game to deal with the slow-witted that have trouble managing their energy.

Its not like I hunt them out in a PvE pug, make them post their skillbar and tell them to go play in a sandbox instead like I would if they tried to HoH with me - I deal, let them do their thing. But when they start yapping like yaks because I don't adhere to their pedestrian pace and instead bring results - ie a mission finished in under 10 minutes, thats when I start ignoring them for the rest of the mission, let them yammer and leave if they like to. Most of the time I end up finishing those missions regardless and still faster than if I had put up with their crap.