Henchmen In The Temple Of Ages

I don't know if this has been coverd before. If it has I couldn't find it.

This is just a post to say that I wish that you could go into uw/fow with lvl 20 henchmen. Sometimes I just want to solo in there because, for instance, I can only stay on the computer for another half hour by the time my country gets favor and I want to go in but don't want to get stuck in there with a team for an hour+ (and I hate people who leave teams). Maby there could be a way to have lvl 20 henchmen that could only be used in the uw/fow. Anybody else ever feel the need for something like this?

Nope.

If you only have a half hour to go in UW/FoW, why bother going?

It use to be this way but one of the more recent patches removed henchmen and non-ascended player from Fow/Uw.

I do not object to having lvl 20 henchmen go with you. If you can make it work more power to you. If your not good at it, acts as a gold sink. I do think it would be nice to fill in one or two slots if you are having trouble getting a full party.

No.

Level 20 henchies would be pretty worthless in UW anyway (and in FoW too, I guess) and low level players could hire them to complete Krytan quests more easily (The Villainy Galrath, for example).

No for lvl 20 Henchmen in Temple of Ages. Yes for lvl 20 Henchmen in FOW/UW. ANet should make an option to take lvl 20 Henchmen into FOW/UW, after all, they gave you an option to complete everything in this game on your ow. Of course, if you really want to do FOW/UW on your own, you can always solo it.

I don't think Anet still means UW and FoW to be "part of the game". It's a time and gold sink for people waiting for the expansion.

So no.

Heck, as far as I'm concerned they should even beef up the difficulty a notch. Level 30 Bladed Aatxes everywhere! (no, not invincible Vengeful ones, just more powerful ones)

I havent been in FOW/UW because henchies are not allowed in there. I gave up all hope with PuGs back in the Desert and finished the game with another friend and henchies. So depending on a guy that will most likely zone out once he dies or gets that piece of armor he always wanted to get is only setting yourself up for disappointment. Unless you already have a good group ready for the FOW/UW or very active guild members this will not always be possible.

I realize that ArenaNet can not change the behavior of the PuGs but if they add the ability to allow henchies to the FOW/UW then this game will go from borderline boring to something worth playing. At least from a PvE standpoint.

I am not complaining just that i wont get to see all of the hard work that these developers put into the game.

My apologies for posting excessively in this topic, but I would beg you to differ.

GW is a multiplayer game, first and foremost. Sure, it might not be an MMORPG, but if you've come this far and you've not yet met any real people to play with, something is amiss.

Sure, you might just have met copious amounts of jackasses all along the way, but I don't believe you've not at least met one reasonable person.

Unless you shun all human contact.

No, I didn't mean this disparagingly.

Heck, I'll even be your friend.

Though I do smell slightly of cabbage.

And dolyak.

I don't see why people are so strongly against this. Sure henchies aren't as good as a good player but many players aren't good and I'd rather go into uw/fow with henchies that i know are ok than a group suddenly to find out that most of them suck. And i don't think ive ever been in either for more than half an hour without at least 1 person and usually 2-3 people leaving. I would much rather go in with henchies than i group i don't know.

Through extensive (and painful) trial and error I have found it do be unfortunately true, that henchmen really are better than the "average" player/PUG. I used to not believe this. How could lousy AI be better than a human being? Well... the kind of human beings that make up half of the player community are not exactly the deep end of the gene pool.

That being said, I agree that lvl 20 henchmen should be available to take into the UW/FoW. Not all of us have large, active guilds that can put together 8-man FoW groups on a moments notice.

In fact i have started to shun all human contact in GW. That may sound sad but it is better than the alternative. If people arent scamming you then they are outright pissing you off.

You have a much more optimist view on the Guild War community than i have. Please venture into the arena. If the players arent logging off the minute they die then they are standing at the spawn leeching xp. While i dont take the random arenas remotely serious. I do use it as a gauge of the community. You should also check out the rest of this forum and the complaints against other players. Sure some are them are the player's own fault or them just being a crybaby but the some of the others aren't. The bottom line is that i play this game to have fun not deal with 'copious amounts of jackasses' whose parents are unable to instill some type of respect in them.

If i had to spend the next 6-9 months in hopes of finding 7-8 players that weren't jackasses then i would rather just spend it in Ember Light Camp farming Flesh Golems for XP (or wherever i farm for xp). I personally know of no other way to gain XP fast besides going to the UW/FOW. If ArenaNet didnt want people to venture into the UW/FOW after completing the game then they would have made getting skill points very easy.

I was in a large, active guild and getting an 8-man team together for the Tombs, GvG, or even possibly the FoW/UW was nearly impossible at the drop of a hat. Which is why i doubt small guilds (<20) would have the ability to go in there without bringing a few random players in there to deal with. Having henchies to fill 1 or 2 spots would be great for small guilds who want to take runs in the FoW/UW. Hell, they allow henchies to play GvG and in the Tombs the last time i did that. I would think the Tombs and GvG would be much harder than the FoW/UW.

Anyways, i dont mean to complain as i doubt they will allow henchies in the FoW/UW. I am sure they wil put in cooler things like skillcrafting or houses. :P

I'd love to go into FoW with henchies!

They can't leave when they find out I'm not the worlds greatest player

I'm all for the hench idea. While I love the game, I'm just more antisocial than others on this forum.

Actually, there are lots of good reasons for it:
1) Prince Ayreon brings up one: practice.
2) It would also help to fill vacant slots for teams.
3) And for those of us who are sometimes feeling antisocial or can't get on a team, we can go in alone.

The can't-get-on-a-team" issue is the biggest problem facing GW, IMHO, and GW needs to address it if they want players to stay interested in the game. (In fact, I might post a thread on this.)

I know there are good reasons to not let the henchmen in UW/FoW but I have to selfishly agree that it would be nice. On my one and only foray into the Underworld, I teamed with a bunch of people who were completely impatient and nasty to me, though I said up front that I had never done it. I am more than willing to listen to directions from people who can help, but it seems that if you are new to it, people don't want to help. Having henchmen would let people get used to it before trying it with real people.

But I digress. I know this is not going to happen. So if any other people around would like to try one of these places and you are as clueless as I am, feel free to whisper me in-game and we'll flounder together.
(IGN: Alana Crystalbreeze)

And that's another problem with pick-up teams.

Unfortunately, what Alana mentions is all too common. Since my guild isn't very active, I've done the UW and Fissure w/ a lot of pick up teams, and, in my experience, a lot of people are nasty and immature. It's all too common for ppl to start griping and going on about n00bs when the party starts getting killed.

Isn't it funny how the person who starts shouting about n00b often can shoulder more than their share of the blame?

The UW can be tough, particularly for ppl who haven't played together before, but here's the deal with team work (I'm channeling my high school coach, now.): No ONE is to blame; you live and die as a TEAM. If you don't get that simple concept, you're not going to get too far in the UW.

One of the cool things about GW is that it almost forces people to learn how to work as a team through the game. Kind of cool when you think about it.

Alana, I'll team w/ you anytime. Whisper me, anytime.

Heck, I can't even GET into the UW or FoW! I have a Me/Mo that is just itching to get in and I can't even beg my way onto a team. Not only is my character class hated, so is the fact that I -honestly- and up front tell them that I have never done it before. I have had two opportunities to get 'picked' for a team but once I tell them I've never been down before, I get booted. I have an active guild but NEVER 8 at a time and I do not want to be in a larger guild.

I swear, trying to get a PUG for the UW or FoW is impossible and reminds me eerily of grade school and trying to get chosen to play soccer or baseball. NO ONE wanted to be the last kid picked.

And selling yourself to a PUG is humiliating and a LOT like writing a personal ad. "Me/Mo Domination specialist LFG for UW or FoW. I take directions well and can be a healer's assistant." I HATE that...though I do get a lot of *nudge nudges* because of the Domination thing.

/signed over and over and over again

At lease with henchies I'd get a chance to practice and SEE the friggin' place before I keel over. Not allowing henchies for single players wanting to play there or for teams needing to fill out their group is punative.

And just as a -where- logistical thing: Put the henchmen for the UW or FoW down...perhaps make a small, enemy-less area where the henchies are waiting. Fill up your team and off you go! Leave the level 15 henchies up top for the Black Curtain questers.

The following classes need not apply for ToA or HoH missions:
Mesmers
Necros
Rangers

The only reason I get to play so much is I usually only bring my monk to these areas. Though, I love to play my ranger it can take too long for him to find a team, so I've given up playing him outside my guild. I don't think this is what ArenaNet intended for the game, but it's how things have worked out.

Sad that 1/2 the available professions are anathema to most gamers. I hope that ANet addressed this problem. If I had any experience in FoW or UW, I would start my own groups of ONLY Mesmers, Necros and Rangers with (if we could) Stefan, Little Thom and Lina to round it out.

I think you can shorten that list to just Mesmers and Necros. Rangers seem to do just fine because of trapping groups. Oddly enough ToA is the only place they are wanted at all. :P But this is yet one more example of the rampant "classism" in PvE. If you aren't one of the "trinity" classes (War, Monk, Ele) you may as well not even dress out for the game tonight kid. You ain't getting off the bench. Very, VERY frustrating for those of us who want to play something a little different now and then.

I haven't made it as far as UW/FoW and if I can't go in there with henchies or a combo of a couple guys + henchies then I might as well not even look forward to that part of the game. Meh. :/

No. Hell no. Hell <bleep!> no!

You will interact with your fellow players. This is Guild Wars. If you only want to play with computer-controlled teammates against computer-controlled opponents, I'd like to take this opportunity to explain to you: you bought the wrong game. You might consider a single-player, non-networked game like Morrowind. You'll probably be happier for it.

Of course there are jerks. There are jerks everywhere. And since we're living in countries where we're well-fed and feel safe and are RICH enough to waste hour after hour playing a computer game, we also can't drag the stupid people into the street and shoot them in the head. It's a trade-off. Some parts of modern Western civilization defy understanding, anyway.

Communicate! When you find people you get along with, who have the same game goals as you - Friend them. Go out of your way to keep track of them, what they're doing, how they're progressing. It's a social game.

Does it get on your nerves to say "hi" 100 times a day when guildies or friends greet you or the guild channel? Wrong answer. Does it really annoy you to be farming solo and have to drop what you're doing to help a guildie get through a PvE mission you've beaten 8 times before, the last time only 20 minutes ago? Wrong answer. Do you turn down requests to join the Tombs squad forming with your guildmates to continue a PvE map of PuGs that you have a good feeling isn't going to make it anyway? Wrong answer.

See where this is going?

You really need to put some time and effort into this, and find friends and/or a guild that plays the way you want to. Don't like helping? Don't! But don't join a guild that is based on helping others! Don't PvP ever? (Well you suck and I hate you.) Then don't join a PvP/GvG heavy guild.

I for one would love hench for UW, and not because I can't get a team. (I turn down join requests every day as every class. Am I that good? No. I communicate.) No, the reason I would love hench for UW is I could clear it a few times and be done with it. Even if you have good people, rarely does anyone have the time to do it all. I mean everything. If you can do it in under 5 hours you must be devs. With hench, I could leave the game running and depart. Come back and pick up where I left off. Try that with 7 human teammates. (you can actually, it is done with those that play on a schedule.)

But no. I'll forego this because in the end, it will hurt us all. More anti-social types. More "STFU NOOB JUST DO IT WIT DA HENCH!" attitude that GW really really doesn't need.

NO HENCH IN THE UNDERWORLD!!
(I'd make up e-bumperstickers if we could .sig)

PS: Any team that doesn't want a Necro or a Mesmer on it for UW is probably not a team worth being on. If they want to field the "noob blueplate special" 3E / 2W / 2Mo / 1R they're going to be moving pretty slowly anyway. In 3 hours they probably won't make the Bone Pit. All that standing around waiting to regen, all that beating down mobs when they're at full strength and ability. But again this post is about how to avoid stupid people. Plenty of us love Mes and N on the team.

Hey, don't forget about me! I have given up on FoW until I can find a group who won't start trashing me for my inexperience

I don't know how people expect you to get any better when they leave the moment things get hairy -sigh-

It'd be a nice thing to have available, but I don't see it happening... even if they could make it so that level 20 henchmen are only available to go into the UW and FoW.

I'd think that you would be better off just finding some people who are willing to go with you, rather than hoping for a change that will probably never be implemented. There are a few people right here in this thread, and if you'd like I'd happily go with you all regardless of your classes or how much experience you have there. If anyone is on at the same time as me and America has favor, give me a yell. It would be my pleasure to show you around

My problem with all this, and believe me, I've LONG since given up ever seeing the UW or FoW, is that I have fairly limited playing time. With a fulltime job, a house to maintain, meals to cook AND a 3 year old to keep safe, I don't have the luxury to sit around for 2 hours hoping someone will deign to invite me into their group. When I have 2-3 hours to play, I -need- to be able to hop into a group (as I can anywhere else in the bloody game) and get going! I am not a group ditcher and if I stand topside for an hour and a half that only leaves me a half hour down under. I won't do it to a group.

The FoW and UW should NOT be punative to those with limited game time nor should it be dependent on favor. Probably a lot of the elitist attitudes out there would be erased if it just remained open all the time.

And GW_Monkey? I have a lot of friends, friendly folk with whom I game all the time. I talk incessantly but our game times do not always mesh. I am friendly and open when I'm trying to get into a PUG but I NEVER, and I do mean NEVER, get chosen. Why is that MY fault? You make it sound as if people who don't play the Holy Trinity of classes (M,W,E) need to get out and make friends. Got news for you: I have lots but schedules don't always coincide.

Well, first of all, realms of the gods are not place for henchmen, heroes maybe, but not henchmen.

Second, it is true that all Prophecies Henchmen are deleveled compared to the other two campaings.

In Cantha the level of henchmen matches the enemies in explorable areas, in nightfall it's the same. But in prophecies you get a lvl 17 hench party when fighting with groups of more than 6 over level 20 enemies in cristal desert.

If you make all the quest (as you should do) and missions, you get there always at level 20.

Henchmen in the temple of Ages are ok, you can take them all, or 5 plus 3 lvl 20 heroes.

But not in many other places, they are most of the time 1-3 levesl under the level they should have compared to the other campaings.

Why don't you just come out and say it: Make Guild Wars a single player game.

Every single suggestion these days is to remove interaction and favour doing everything by yourself with the AI.

Btw, my last 10 trips to FoW all had a mesmer in the party. And forming a group took around 5 mins. The reason mesmers don't get in a party? They are all moping around complaing "ohhhhh I'll never get in a party". Have you ever tried? I've seen people saying "lf 1 mesmer to complete forgemaster group". There were no mesmers around.

Necro alert...this is a pointles thread res'd for no reason - close please

No here as well as it is best to learn how to party together and some of the pvp guilds come here for a break from pvping.It is the only real place pvp guild goes to anyway parting is better and I have been down to the UW since the ascended patch came out.I did go down there at lvl16 and did a good jop of healing.You can do 20 min runs down there although you don't get much drop rate would be better for glops and shards.I would go even further and say no to heros.

I like the idea, but i say no, because 1 hench can ruin everything with a suicidal agro (even with a flag enabled)

can heroes come to UW or FoW?



Also, do warriors still get rejected from ToPK parties?

So after reading all this gibberish, I still cant understand why you are RIGHT and the OP is WRONG. What is it that proves that you have a better perspective on these things than he does? All that you just said is just YOUR opinion, and each of us is entitled to it. However, the way you put it, it is like your point of view is the ONLY point of view. And that, pisses me off.

Yes, this IS Guild Wars, but I believe that the name applies to PvP mainly, and NOT PvE. In PvE, there's no reason why someone can hench every single place in the game. Sure it should be harder, and playing in a team should be incouraged, but loners shouldnt be left out, especially out of PvE. They should at least have a CHANCE, and that chance is the leveled henchies.


It is clear, that you really don't give a damn about people who don't have good friends in GW and are not members of a good, prominent guild. It seems that your reply to those people would be a "Go Cry".
Well, Anet is not you. They care, and they showed it on many occasions. This is why people like OP and me, will continue to ask Anet to give loners a chance to hench UW, FoW, and Hard Mode.

You don't like our idea? Don't hench anything! Play the game with your leet guild/friends, and have a good life. (My two cents)


Oh, and /SIGNED off course.

Just do UW/FoW from Chantry of Secrets or Zin Ku instead, theres much better hench to choose from there.

/signed

It would be a great idea even for guild groups, because you hardly ever have enough together, at the same time, to do UW/FoW. It would give them the option, if they want to do all of FoW, to not have a PuG cop out after getting his 1337 drops 30 min into the game.

The good thing Anet did with the game is it appeals to a variety of people. If they listened to ppl like GW_Monkey all the time, they would be a one-share. They appeal to the socialite, the grinder and the loner, and do a good job of balancing the three. Giving a lvl20 hench option in UW/FoW would just be giving another part of the game what they always strive for: balance.

Aw... henchmen in tyria should have been at level 20 from there, and level 15 from Lion's Arch...

It's never too late to make some changes.

This would cause rift between those that are ascended and those that aren't as their argument is if you can take Henchies down who in fact aren't ascended why can't I go down.That is what the argument will be as I made the same one when the ascension patch was applied.Most of the players there are forming farming parties anyway 2man -4 man 1/2 an hour doesn't give you enough time to spent down there as smite run is about the same.

I don't think making the henchies at ToA level 20 would be game-breaking for Krytan quests or anything. No moreso than leaving the place with a full 8-man party in a six-man party area already is, anyway...

Yes to this, simply because I want to go FOW/UW with heroes and henchmen and not with other players.

Well.

There are two palces you usually go to from there:
Galrath's Quests.
Kryta Titan quest.

Both of them are a pain with the level 15 henchmen.